camel spiders in the middle of the night when in flip flops (cause our showers were outside) - nope, not doing spiders unless they are of the Man, Gwen, or other comic variety
oh, someone used Dick, meaning something beside Orwell, in reference to SE (company) that's refreshing....except they used the movie not the book.......
Minority Report the book is lightyears better than the movie
lol...my wife hates when I watch that and it is one of my favorite things on Netflix (after Stranger Things....or Seven Deadly Sins....depends on my mood)
is there a meta post somewhere that has a detailed timeline of the whole situation with Monica? I vaguely remember a MSE post with a detailed timeline. but my search fu is failing me
yeah, I kinda meant that in the "its sad that we need to keep putting this point forward" (WB lost a lot) but to save my sanity I'm focusing on some of the best World building books I have (for at least a bit) - or in Dick's case "world building then tearing down then re-building then...wait? where am I?!"
This recent PSA video by a certain gaming YouTube channel was eerily familiar: titled "Be. Nice. Our Philosophy on Elitism & Toxicity" youtube.com/watch?v=bSO-EC4hT2E
The gist is: Our purpose is to put out accurate information. We don't want anyone to force certain ways of doing things. We object to the view that we are the cause of unwelcomeness: as the larger community grows, there are bound to be new people who bring different mentalities and cause cultural clash. (By the way, we aren't saying all of our community is behaving in an unwelcoming way; just that there's a vocal minority among us)
@JourneymanGeek and it's wrong. Meta is supposed for discussing the software, by its own labels. CoC should be discussed out of Meta. Out of SE. --> Downvoting every further bit.
Yes, it's been escalating and seems unsustainable - in a very broad sense. I've been trying to write a summary in my native (non-english) language and it's been hard trying to keep it short.
@ento There's literally 2-3 long running issues, 4-5 current ones....
its in no way simple
Lets say SE reinstated Monica - that and the new framework for moderator removal covers much of our issues on that side
The new Ad system has very bad optics and ironically - is probably going to need a fair bit of effort to fix for what could have been a low effort way to add ads
The pronoun thing? I'm pretty sure that some folks are mainly here because of the controversy, and when it dies down I'm sure we can try to hammer out a much more nuanced way of looking at things. We'll be bothering the CMs with the painpoints all we can ;p
We did also fail a few people
that... needs work
that's actually the really important thing
We also have had a bit of a adverserial relationship with the company and some benign neglect
@JourneymanGeek reinstating Monica at this point seems pointless. Also, were I Monica, I would certainly not be an unpaid moderator. In fact, I resigned.
You have to understand that SE was once a company with zero turnover, then starting in 2017-ish turn over went up, both because of the layoffs and because of the restructuring
first there was SO with a SaaS model; then Careers; then Stack Exchange; then localized SO; then SO with Enterprise (plus docs/jobs/developer pages); now SO with Enterprise/teams/jobs
@JourneymanGeek Given the current leadership, there's a distinct possibility. The new CEO seems to be a "technical" CEO focused on profitability, not a "product" CEO focused on market fit, IMO
It's telling though that the CEO has not said anything to the community yet (not even introduced himself when Joel blogged about him). Yet he talked to BI already.
@JourneymanGeek let the users and moderators together elect community-selected teachers/companions who could best teach staff members about how the site works and what users want, and let them work together for a couple weeks or as long as needed until they are sufficiently in tune with the community values. Quite easy. Staff just has to want to do it.
not a lot of (visible) features are being added to the Stack Exchange sites
Do you have many suggestions for "Visible" features? Or any in mind? Are there pros / cons to these ideas, are they really needed, is the network broken without?
On the other hand a few long-standing problems are...
There are a couple personality traits that unite all elected moderators, which make all of this work. They want to learn and improve. Staff doesn't share this desire, so we are unable to move in the right direction.
have you seen reddit? facebook? yahoo answers? (rhethorical question) -- what we have here definitely is friendly, yes because I'm comparing it to the other bad examples, we can't evaluate such things in a vacuum
we can all improve together, but (dear staff) please understand this is not a special place on the internet where you are 100% guaranteed nothing will hurt you
leaders among any corporation have to be able to face their customers/clients. If they are unable to do so, I don't know how to react. Usually such businesses bankrupt and dissolve rather quickly or nobody heard about them if they're able to survive quietly under the radar.
Personally, I don't have a goal to stay on this specific site, under this specific leadership. My goal is to have my personal contributions and contributions of other users to remain out there in the worldwide internet, and to have the same or better tools to do what we have been doing for 10+ years. It does not have to be here.
@JourneymanGeek I don't have the particular skills gears towards fixing broken corporate leaderships, sorry. Maybe try your luck with shog or other CMs
@StephanS I don't see my activity as working for free, I'm working for the good of the humankind. It just happens so that my work is being hosted by one particular for-profit business entity. That is all there is to it.
you know how you publish something on github and a couple years later you see some cool app or script that uses your past contributions, especially as a critical portion of its code?
I don't trust just google to have my files, I also sync my cloud folder on other platforms that provide the same free cloud space. If there were other sites like SE, I would cross-post all my contributions across all of them so that the knowledge would not disappear forever is one site shuts down.
discussing how we can fix the leadership of SE is like discussing how we can fix leadership of say Github or Gitlab or SourceForge. I don't think it's in our powers to do such things. But there are more platforms such as Github to which we can go if we disagree with one of those sites' leadership. With SE there aren't any alternatives on par with its outreach and functionality. If anything needs to be changed, it's this.
other than slowly educating staff, what other routes exist, theoretically? hostile takeover? buying out the corporation and firing everyone, replacing all staff? that's not realistic at all.