Go Ukraine style: reveal the true villain via social media, and let the world nuke that villain. I prefer to see SE shut down in disgrace than watch it being rotten to the core like now. — Shadow Wizard Strikes Back7 mins ago
@SPArcheon well, I consider SE the company to be villain. And effective way to fight them is getting support via social media. Show what the villain doing wrong, convince people, and you might just win. (This is not related to the strike or what the mods want. I'm not a mod, and can't see any way out when CEO directly attack all mods.)
heh some people who signed aren't really on a strike.
@M.A.R. You know those pathetic mobile games ads "only 0,000001% of the players can solve this"? Apparently those are the reference material Stack uses too.
I totally expect them to add other pearls like "500 IQ move", "10 things experts don't want you to know" and "IT Advisory companies HATE this trick" to their repertory by the end of the year
@M.A.R. my work always advocates to be mindful that the last 20 percent may not be worth the time/effort/money. So think carefully about those last 15 percent ;)
@Starship-OnStrike I meant that in normal circumstances you would just vote to close that post as off-topic, but currently it is your decision if you want to work for the site or not.
Personally, I currently ignore any form of spam or bad post unless it is really offensive or straight illegal.
@PeterKolosov One of them has stated they're not interested in striking. Others are temporarily inactive for one reason or another, but a good many of them are on strike.
Do you have the guts to create the impossible?
Dear developers and AI enthusiasts,
It's time to leave your comfort zone! We, at All-In-Line, are looking for developers who are not just skilled, but also dreamers, creators, and disruptors. We are offering a unique opportunity that is not for the f...
Upvoting spam is a misuse of the upvote privilege. The strike is just about ceasing moderation and curation duties. The goal is not to make the site worse, it's to raise awareness and solicit response from the company.
Making the step from "We're not moderating" to "We're actively going to make the platform worse" is moving from collective action to collective vandalism.
@Mithical I wouldn't go that far to actually do that but to play the devil advocate when the highway toll booth employees went on a strike last year, I was the one waiting on a CLOSED booth under the sun last year... Apparently some think that the only way for a strike to work is to make users angry so that THEY will revolt against the company.
You're giving the spammer tools to further spam. The strike is only about taking away the tools and work spent at preventing spam in the first place; not giving tools to spammers to succeed.
You do not help our case by providing spam, or facilitating spamming, yourself. SE does not realize how valuable we are at preventing spam; they will only realize that if they see how much spam flows in naturally, without being handled by us, not if you boost it.
For this followup post, we spoke with two Stack Overflow software engineers with ADHD about their experiences being diagnosed as adults, taking medication, and communicating about their ADHD at work.
@Starship-OnStrike that is not quite it. I am just saying that I can see where the sentiment comes about and would love for some more mods to join (especially some that I have noted tend to be pretty "apathetic" about these kind of issues), yet I would not go upvote spam.
That said, I would be honest and say that given the chance I would probably point out to spammers that if they have to spam, this is the best moment.
@Starship-OnStrike Because you were the only person posting such a link. In here. Immediately after saying you were going to support spammers spamming the site. It had close to 0 views, and when we pointed out just now that it's not beneficial, you self-deleted those posts, and are now calling us out as not assuming good faith...
Um...reality check. I never said I would support spammers, just that I would counteract downvotes. It has 70 views. Also, the post is not deleted. In addition, i am not the only one posting a liink. As to calling out on the coc, thats bc you arent
@Starship-OnStrike The r/programming one leads to this, and the one on the user profile leads to this, so they are deleted, not sure why you're trying to assert otherwise.
@Starship-OnStrike This is actively harmful to the perception of everyone striking. We cannot be taking actions to make things worse. Striking does not involve actions that are deliberately harmfull, it is ceasing to take other actions.
@Starship-OnStrike Last warning. If I see one more message advocating sabotage, you're going on a mod-enforced strike (a suspension). You DO NOT willfully upvote spam
We want SE Inc to understand that it needs us good guys to prevent bad guys wrecking the sites and destroying the quality of the content we create and curate. If we do vandalism, then we become the bad guys, and undermine our own integrity.
@Tinkeringbell Not like that. It's not a feature request, or a bug request, or a support quesiton. It's quite big, and spans multiple posts, and the entire network.
Still quite ironically correct me if I am wrong the site actually never made any official rule about what how you are allowed to vote, and therefore the only rule we have is to not purposely harm the site. Which means that technically you can vote at random by flipping a coin in most cases, as evidenced by the inability to do anything against for example people downvoting every WB related post out of spite.
@Tinkeringbell Did you had any indication from the staff that they are indeed reviewing that issue? So far it looks like they are ignoring every related post on meta...
@Tinkeringbell If that is your job, go ahead. But from the outside it would look like they are reviewing something and personally I would avoid that if they actually aren't
@Starship-OnStrike yep, but most voting irregularities are about trying to gain advantages with voting rings and similar things. Past efforts about requiring users to not "vote out of spite" have meet utter opposition based on the a) impossibility to proof anything (reasonable in MOST cases) and b) user claiming that they are entitled to vote as they wish and if they want to downvote based on users avatars they can do so.
@SPArcheon the point of the status-review tag is that it escalates a post to the SE staff for review. So it's perfectly appropriate for Tink to apply it. meta.stackexchange.com/q/348642
@PM2Ring would anyone take offense if I changed the description from this
> Indicates that the circumstances behind a bug report are set to be internally reviewed, or that the feature request contains merit to consider but the decision on its approval or decline requires more investigation.
to this?
> Indicates that the circumstances behind a bug report were escalated to be internally reviewed, or that the feature request contains merit to consider but the decision on its approval or decline requires more investigation.
To me, the new policy virtually says "Mods can still suspend a user for posting GenAI content, but they can't use automatic tools or their own judgement to determine that the post was created using GenAI". So that means they can only act if the user admits that the post was created using GenAI, or if the post text contains blatant indicators like "Regenerate response". That's frankly ridiculous.
They might as well say "You can suspend ChatGPT posters, but don't do it during the day, or during the night".
Catch-22 is a satirical war novel by American author Joseph Heller. He began writing it in 1953; the novel was first published in 1961. Often cited as one of the most significant novels of the twentieth century, it uses a distinctive non-chronological third-person omniscient narration, describing events from the points of view of different characters. The separate storylines are out of sequence so the timeline develops along with the plot.
The novel is set during World War II, from 1942 to 1944. It mainly follows the life of antihero Captain John Yossarian, a U.S. Army Air Forces B-25 bombardier...
@Tinkeringbell Use the limited moderation tools that I have, and if not, bring it to the attention of the other people behind the strike. I'm one of the writers of that MSE post, so I have my channels, even though my opinions and stance are an outlier amongst the inner group of people behind the strike organization. :)
> There was only one catch and that was Catch-22, which specified that a concern for one's safety in the face of dangers that were real and immediate was the process of a rational mind. Orr was crazy and could be grounded. All he had to do was ask; and as soon as he did, he would no longer be crazy and would have to fly more missions.
You can ask to be grounded if you are mad but if you ask to be grounded you aren't mad
Speaking of the press, it'd be nice if someone reached out to them asking that an op-ed be published regarding the moderators' perspective on the policy
@Tinkeringbell No, I already mentioned it there. None of us seem to take any issue with it. It was noted that it adds it to SE's internal bug-tracking system, which can be both bad and good.
As for treatment of the community, I'm getting a bit of 'mixed signals'. Compared to a previous times, Philippe and part of the CM team at least seems more present, reactive, responsive and at least doing stuff. As for whatever is above them, like a CEO with his head in an AI-cloud... I don't think anything I will do or say will influence anything like that, so... Yeah. Mixed feelings/signals.
Although the staff made accusations of "geographical bias" in the ChatGPT suspensions, they haven't pushed that point to create a division in the community, unlike the "Divide & Conquer" strategy employed by "Fission Chipps" during Monica-gate.
a sample from Kaya3 here:https://meta.stackexchange.com/questions/389653/blog-post-ceo-update-paving-the-road-forward-with-ai-and-community-at-the-cent/389680#389680 perhaps what SE means is that the trust has been put into a blender. my reply:no, a blender involves it still exists taken down for no reason @KevinB
another:Quite simply, you have done things that are destroying the site and that no one wants. You listen to no one. As a result we are (successfully) drawing your attention to it. Now you get all upset.
@Starship-OnStrike and exactly how much useful information does such a comment convey? Everyone, including SE, knows what's going on, and what's the voice of the community is. I have to plead again: please, everyone, just... chill a little.
more examples:I know, we are free too, and if this continues should, go on strike. A community driven site need be somewhat of a democracy to retain trust
if anything, they (such comments), unfortunately, signal to the company that we can't be reasoned with and are just angry. A CM already expressed this concern today on Discord. Please, it really needs to stop, I agree with @KevinB
Well by now I'm beyond angry, it's the depressing emptiness that comes afterwards.
That non-apology posted few hours ago is exactly what we got in 2019. They just don't learn, sadly.
Though it was nice surprise to see any response at all.
One last advice before going to sleep and have sour dreams... @Starship please at least try to hold back from posting personal insults, even though being angry. Not only it can lead to suspension, it really has no point and isn't helping. "Lost direction" is fine. "Stupid" is not. Night!
one other thing I want to add to @ShadowWizardStrikesBack's note is that "why downvotes?" is also not a constructive form of communication (your posts or not yours nonwithstanding). It's well-established they are pretty much deleted on sight.
Just keep in mind this: most mods partaking in the strike will still be keeping a journal of what actions they would have taken had they not been on strike, and will proceed to then perform those actions (to the best of their ability) once the strike is over. So the strike is not a free license to violate rules without getting sanctioned - you will still get sanctioned but it will be deferred.