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[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Bad keyword with email in body: Requesting interviews with bitcoin entrepreneurs by Oskar Kader on bitcoin.SE
@user1271772 :D
Link?
please no
le sigh
20:03
yknow what, no. I had a nice friday evening so far. Peace out.
@user1271772 looks like he's trying to be sensitive to your concerns. Good for him.
@SmokeDetector f
Yes I was not complaining
I was happy that he finally did that
Good, and I hope we can end this discussion since now...
since now?
20:06
I'm not a native English speaker. And it's 3am right now.
Oh okay, good night!
@SomewhatMemorableName at that time, I usually start considering just staying awake ;)
@Loong well, here is exists... but not very common yet. (so far restricted mainly to premium brands which also costs a LOT, e.g. Lindt)
It's 3am in Thailand
20:09
I'd like to personally flag my account as, "Will not make an attempt to sugar coat anything." And allow other users to filter out my content based on that setting... and allow me to filter out users based on whether they'll accept that kind of engagement.
@canon it's not flag, it's categorize. And... interesting idea! :D
@user1271772 Saw a mistake. Needed correction. Forgot I have to make at least a 6 character edit here...
/shrug
@canon just set your country of origin to Netherlands :P... Honestly though, interesting thought
Not very workable I guess... But interesting
@Fabby: i don't understand your last comment, which you tagged me in
Sorry.
20:11
@canon that just sets up bad expectations
@Tinkeringbell don't give away all secrets ..
stuff probably scrolled up while I was replying
Nobody should be punished for dead-pan delivery. If it's such a problem, make it opt-in.
it's the same problem with adding a "newbie" flag to profiles. How do you ensure that everyone who needs it sets it?
20:12
Too late!
@Shog9 It's the default setting - those who are not new, know how to change it
@Catija if you want, feel free to hop into this room, user1271772 wants to hear your opinions as well I think, and don't know how to invite you directly.
@AnneDaunted that's a "new to the site" flag then.
@ShadowWizard I'm in there already.
@Catija oh
you kept silent so I didn't notice.
20:16
Nothing to say.
@Shog9 Not necessarily. There could be long-time users who prefer to discard brass tacks help. For new users, a little banner or tooltip for, "You may be missing input from experts due to your settings." Could be helpful. Still...
@rene What? You mean the stroopwafels, the cheese or the tulips should've been kept secret? What about hagelslag en belgenmoppen?
Yes, and the wooden clogs we walk on ...
@canon y'know there are... hundreds of thousands of people on Stack Overflow...
without an account? yeah :P
20:18
folks post answers without even creating accounts, yes
@rene archaeologist me still owns a pair of those XD
I've only used the ones from my grand-dad
They also quantify as a certain category of working shoes with reinforced noses... Safe enough for digging. And the profile-less sole means you don't leave very nasty footprints on a flat surface ;)
@Shog9 treat those with the same type of kid-gloves or avoidance.
@Tinkeringbell Didn't even have to look where you're from... ;-)
20:19
@Fabby It's not exactly secret XD
I didn't know, is all, but profile confirmed my suspicion... :D
@canon so I sign up to SO, and decide I want only carefully-worded feedback... And so I check the
what'd you call it?
sugar box
that's not right
adult gloves
I check the "only carefully-worded feedback please" box
and... someone finds my question on Google and posts an answer that's brusque
@Shog9 That'll mean you'll never get an answer from me is all...
20:21
"well, that checkbox was useless" I think
@Shog9 They can't: Only people who have the kids gloves attribute can answer.
@Fabby oh, so we're disabling unregistered answers too?
@Shog9 On those users?
what about all the people who signed up before today
Yes!
20:22
essentially, we turn this feature on and it's an opt-in hell-ban
@Shog9 You make'em take a mandatory test
that's like... the worst kind of superficial solution
@Shog9 which is exactly why people don't like the NCoC
"This way to see the Egress and also polite responses"
I would be happy to be in the "rude and obnoxious" category just to ensure I don't offend anyone through sheer stupidity imperfect knowledge of the English language...
20:23
@Fabby you know the worst ways to be rude are when you know what's considered polite :P.
same here
So a test... Is easily faked and makes it easier to be even more rude
@Tinkeringbell Being so polite it's rude?
Most people don't get that... (Been there, did that, worked in the UK)
@Fabby I know I'm going to offend people anyway, so messing around with categories is just pointless
What about "nicety" audits - you see a "new" badly worded question and get the chance to write a comment
20:25
either I learn to handle situations where I've offended someone, or I learn to live with people being offended.
@Shog9 Good idea! If you take "rude and obnoxious" you don't have tu take the test!!!
:-) :-) :-)
@Fabby so what happens when you check the box and find that folks are upset with you anyway?
Leave it up to the users how they want to be treated.
@Fabby That's another thing... And yeah, I get that people being too polite is annoying
@Shog9 That ups your troll score...
Everyone has 2 kinds of reps:
Knowledge rep, troll rep.
20:26
so we've essentially designed Reddit
🚽
Problem solved!
reddit.se
I still maintain that the problem SE is oh so eagerly trying to solve ... isn't actually a problem
20:27
@Shog9 Believe me or not, I've never used Reddit, but I believe you...
i mean... maybe the problem they are trying to solve isn't actually the one that they appear to be trying to solve.
@JohnDvorak You've never been to the US, have you???
Stack Exchange: where we collect the best content from Wikipedia, Quora, Reddit, and sometimes Twitter.
I haven't, and I probably never will
20:28
Thank you!!!
@Shog9 You could add a similar field for anonymous users posting answers. That doesn't necessarily have to be bound to an account... it could be hoisted up to the Post itself
@Shog9 It's been weekend for wa while now...
Where Post.SugarCoated is null, refer to User.SugarCoated
@canon right. I'm posting anonymously because I like filling in forms, eh?
otherwise use what's stored with the post
@Shog9 It's a checkbox, for pity's sake. Still, I'll make a meta post about it at some point unless someone beats me to it. We can argue its merits there.
20:31
...why do folks always say "it's just a checkbox" when discussing these options, as if the objection was that checkboxes are hard.
I mean... If it was radio buttons you'd have a point, because damn I never get those right the first time.
The particular objection I was referencing was, roughly, "As an anonymous user, I don't like filling in forms."
You're already filling in a form when asking
You're asked for a name & email, and both can be fake
Damn! Shog beat me to my point!
the entire point of unregistered posting is to entice folks to answer stuff they know without committing to anything
as soon as you make it complicated, that goes away
20:33
Also useful on sites that are more ... personal.
I don't know that answers are really the target here anyway
it's comments
@Shog9 nope, it doesn't
and anonymous users can't comment anyhow
the goal should always be, "what's the least information we can get away with asking for here?"
@Shog9 They can only answer to thick-skinned ugly Vorlons like me!
20:34
name is displayed on the post, so gotta ask for that. email is in case you ever want to own your post, so gotta ask for that. But neither one needs to be verified.
If we want to be a happier place to be, we need a troll score...
If they're scared at the prospect of someone knowing their fake ID, we can also assume they only want to see nice comments.
independent from rep score
now imagine a "tone of your answer" checkbox. How do you expect folks to even know what that means?
"happy answer" checkbox
20:35
[ x ] Mildly combatitive.
KISS: 4 options.
1. I'm a troll
2. I'm a bad person
3. I'm a good person
4. I'm a unicorn
@Shog9 Like that job posting sentiment analysis thing?
@Shog9 cool! With those emoticons used in the Comment Evaluator 5000?
I forget what it's called. :/
Like... We got folks from all over the world participating here. It's a crapshoot as to whether the full CoC can adequately convey the idea of constructive participation in a way that's gonna make sense to folks from the US, France, Germany, that weird place with the sprinkle sandwiches that half this room comes from, etc.
20:37
:D :D :D
@Fabby remind me what the extra "S" is for? (apart of being catchy term)
Keep It Simply Stupid
Keep It Simple [???]
@ShadowWizard "Smart"
20:37
( ) Direct and informative
(o) Informative, but also reassuring of good intentions.
@ShadowWizard ... depends on who you ask... silly/stupid.
This goes back to a conversation we had years ago about compound content qualification.
Keep It Simple Smart??
Keep It Simple, Stuart
20:38
hehehee
Allowing people to specify multiple qualities/deficiencies of a post or comment
@JohnDvorak Not enough radio buttons... I still like mine better...
I don't know who Stuart is, or why they keep making everything hard, but... Dammit, Stuart...
Nah, that's Murphy, not Stuart!
20:39
Great. Now we can't even explain common acronyms without risking flags.
and over time building profiles such that you could say, "90% people from Ecuador find you terse. 99% of those users find you helpful."
but, you know... time... engagement
pipe dream
@JohnDvorak Huh? did you get flagged?
I don't know what's the result of this competition by SO...
20:40
@ShadowWizard :D :D :D (which you've seen like 5 times and heard... 15 times already???)-
@Fabby he usually does
@Fabby actually no... my kids didn't want to see that movie. :/
They did watch Minions though. :D
@SomewhatMemorableName that overview is severely outdated
@ShadowWizard Shog9 is actually a nice guy. It's the community managers who tell him what to do and how to do it that need a management course...
0:-) 0:-) 0:-)
@Fabby no, but here on tavern messages about kissing out of context can be flagged.
Djeez, louise!
20:42
@TelKitty became famous for ranting here after being chat banned on other sites when posting "pussy" word, referring, well, to her pussycats.
To this day can't really tell if she really meant that, or trolled on purpose....lol
yes
So she indeed was Troll Queen. Nice.
@SomewhatMemorableName everyone lost, because we still couldn't predict closed questions accurately
Yeah, but puszy in Hungarian is "kiss on cheek" (Sounds exactly the same as the English word though)
IIRC, we kinda didn't provide a good dataset either
20:44
@Fabby cough.. he's a Community Manager and nobody tells him what to do.... ;)
...y'all are constantly telling me what to do
Shog9 is a strong and independent community manager
@ShadowWizard Shog is The Man?
Telling or asking?
is there a difference?
20:45
@Shog9 Never let anyone tell you what to do unless they pay you!
I should hope so.
We're just spewing ideas...
@Catija neither, begging
@AnneDaunted no, he's The Floating Head
@Fabby we better collect money then ....
20:46
It's a male head though
@rene kickstarter?
@JohnDvorak so?
Head is a head.
@ShadowWizard good idea
@rene project name?
@AnneDaunted imploring?
@JohnDvorak was that a reference to a certain Ninja game?
20:47
@ShadowWizard Well, I still owe Joel Spolsky a bottle of Champagne, so next time when I'm in New York, I'm going to drop it on his desk together with my rep chart...
Seems he's in China right now?
@Catija if it helps - did it ever?
@ShadowWizard "Make StackExchange a happy place!" CC @rene
Sometimes groveling helps...
But sometimes it's just annoying.
@Fabby Swag for everyone!!!
20:49
@Fabby you.... what??!
@Catija Good one!!!
Positive Thinking: Stack Exchange - The Happiest Place on Earth
@Fabby already taken. Alternative?
@ShadowWizard I have to dig up the question: my first post on mmeta.
@AnneDaunted Isn't that already copyrighted/trademarked?
20:50
(got downvoted into oblivion)
@Catija :-)
-1
Q: Increase close reasons from 400 to 512 characters?

FabbyThe what is clear: To allow the entire StackExchange network to be inherently a little bit more polite while remaining helpful. The how is clear: To extend the Off-Topic Close Reasons by 112 characters. The simple question is: What does it take to make this happen? The long question: At the ...

^^What anne said:
Stack Exchange - The 74th Happiest Place on Earth
@ShadowWizard Djeez, you're good.
20:50
Still better than 75th...
I thought I deleted it...
> me flying into NY and banging a magnum bottle of Champagne on Joel Spolsky's desk?
LOL
@ShadowWizard Yup... One day I'll do it!
@Fabby some say I'm good with search... meta.stackexchange.com/… :D
Being a digital environment, does it still count as "on Earth"?
20:52
So let's make it: The Happiest Place on the Internet
But to make Stack Exchange a happy place, the participants should not have any problems in the first place... including the asker
@ShadowWizard man I get sick of these people showing up and demanding the site be more polite. Who's this guy think he is to suggest those close reasons aren't polite?
(maybe add as a qualifier: according to quora question (still to be asked))
@Catija sure, all the wires and data are on Earth.
@Shog9 was anyone any good at determining what should have been closed?
20:53
I thought it was a cloud. :P
@ShadowWizard And 2500$ in cash for a management course for whoever wants to reverse this
@canon I honestly don't remember
@Catija still part of Earth!
aww
20:53
... "on" implies "on the surface" I don't think clouds are on the surface. :P
@Fabby you're too slow! Next time copy the link before posting the first message. :D
because there are all sorts of questions that should be closed but the close vote never reaches critical mass
@ShadowWizard I need to post it before I can copy the link...
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Smoke! BRB...
@Fabby 2500 is... nothing. Start with 250000 and you might have a chance. :P
@canon Yeah, but the problem with deciding this based on only the text of the question itself is... There are an awful lot of questions that look kinda lousy, but are really useful. So it's like trying to pick high-quality Wikipedia pages based on what the stub looks like.
20:56
@Fabby: You say your first meta post was downvoted to oblivion, but it only has a net vote of -2. How many downvotes did it get?
So it's possible to recover? Mine's at -27 right now
@Shog9 ah
Somewhat, I thought you were going to sleep because it's 3am in Thailand
@user1271772 "recover" isn't really correct word. And no.. can't see a -27 question getting to 0. But it doesn't really mean anything.
20:59
A -32 bcome a +30, so maybe it's possible for a -27 to become -25
it's tough to fight momentum like that
Can you help me?
@user1271772 no.... it was never pure -32.
We can't convince people to support the idea of kicking out pro-tems after a year.
@user1271772 That depends. Will you accept help if we're vaguely condescending about it?
21:01
@JohnDvorak: this is the problem !! I was never trying to do that! Rene and Glorfindel just made it look like I did and that's how the downvote momentum started!
Disagreed big time
@user1271772 you can see it in the timeline: meta.stackexchange.com/posts/247169/timeline
@ShadowWizard 2500$ is enough for a one-day management course...
On its first day, @Fabby's first question had +17/-15
@user1271772 I didn't know what I was doing and I don't have anough rep yet to see down/upvotes...
21:03
@user1271772 Your question is a feature request specifically saying that pro-tems should be changed every x months/years.
I remember starting with 100 rep and ending up negative...
I'll make a better offer. For $2599 you'll get a half hour management course and a free beer.
@ShadowWizard Ah... Thanks...
Didn't know...
@ShadowWizard: I don't know what I'm looking for in the timeline
21:04
@Tinkeringbell Really? :(
Are you saying it started out with a lot of + votes then became -32 later?
Well, 25.000 is a long way away...
@user1271772 No, I got a lot of downvotes is all.
It started with +17/-15, and ending with +30/-32
Can't remember the upvotes: I was young and only had 100 rep...
never had -15 since I joined on anything...
I'm young and only have 100 rep
21:05
A textboox example of "controversial post"
@Fabby yep :P. Consider all the free time you don't have to spend on a boring management class, but can spend on drinking another beer (at your own costs, of course! :P)
i don't recall getting a lot of negative votes on my questions initially
but now look at them
I remember bitching and moaning whining and complaining about it in AU chat...
... I think I got a lot of sympathy votes from there...
uhm... my "questions" tab shows one of my questions from 2013 as my newest question, with a date in 2017
under the "newest" sorted tab
I was actually surprised I got a lot of upvotes on the "anyone can ping anyone in chat"
21:07
@user1271772 the " daily summary" parts.
Ah, the dates it is listing is last activity... that's really misleading
i'd expect the "newest" tab to show the date posted!
@Shog9 What decade are you in then? >:-) Only after half a century are you officially an old fart old...
(well: in my book anyway)
Web definition of "old" means anyone over 18.
Remember giving dad a BD card for his 50th birthday: Congratulations with your half century!
(he was not amused)
(also gave him a congratulations for your 2^6 for his 64th)
6
Q: Confusion about Date/Time shown on profile's activity questions tab (sorted by newest)

HackerKarmaWhen I go to the questions tab (sorted by newest) under my profile's activity page and look through all the questions that I have asked so far, I noticed that my very first asked question's relative-time shows "11 hours ago" and the timestamp (hover over) displays "2015-07-16 03:17:39Z" (Please n...

21:12
seems wrong, but meh, is the way it is
Meh indeed...
To this day many "weird" user experience decisions made by Jeff exist, most likely they would do it in a different day if done today, but... as @Fabby said.. "meh". :)
If it's documented, it's a feature!
- Bill Gates -
21:15
I'm old enough to remember being able to call Bill Gates...
Anyway, I need a smoke and a drink! It's way past Beer O' Clock.
You called Bill Gates?
I accidentally called Bill Gates, yes...
In which year did that happen?
@user1271772 Early 90s (90? 91?)
21:28
Is there a query that tells one how many posts need reviewing for close votes (as all the posts I've reviewed get omitted
More recent than I thought!
I thought maybe 80s
@user1271772 Nah...
@Narusan It shows in the "all queues" without a query...
@Fabby "as early as 1981 an industry executive complained in public that "Gates is notorious for not being reachable by phone and for not returning phone calls."[57]"
@user1271772 Ah, but I did a group call.
So here's the story:
I was still a dev back then and my company was the only one outside of the US that was a beta-tester for something called "Microsoft Mail" (the predecessor of Exchange and Outlook)
And as we spoke like 7 languages amongst 3 devs, we were given a lot of support and one of them was to be able to call the dev group...
so on a FR-night local time, I called the dev group and could hear the phone system switching to another group and another and another...
and finally after >40 rings, this guy picks up and I told him what my problem was and if he could help me...
He told me: "I'm the last one in the building"
I apologised, asked him how it was being a security guard in the Microsoft HQ and got a chuckle and a response:
"I'm not a security guard, I'm Bill Gates"
Me "Yeah, sure you sound a lot like Bill Gates, but anyway, I wish you a fantastic evening and a great week-end"
Next Monday, I called one of the devs and told him the story...
His response: well, you called our group number and if you let that number ring long enough, all the phones in the entire building start ringing
So it's possible it was him, because he's mostly the last person to leave on a Friday...
@user1271772 ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
21:45
I'm surprised there's no one working all night!
It is an awesome story!
But I usually work until 3am at least, and it doesn't matter if it's Friday or Saturday or Christmas, I just work when I am not asleep, and a lot of people in the software industry are similar right?
@user1271772 It was about 3 AM local time, but much earlier in WA...
Yea, so people in WA should have still been working!
My personal record is 45h straight... (includes 2.5h travel to the Data Centre in Amsterdam and 2.5h back)
You have a very large AskUbuntu score for a guy that's been on the phone with William Gates :)
@user1271772 Look at my profile...
As my experience with Linux is not as extensive as the other OSes I know, I'm trying to find interesting questions which I know quite a bit about under other OSes and try to wrap my head around looking at it from the Linux side.
21:48
I guess that's what I was doing in order to see that you have such a large AskUbuntu score
Oh I see !!
@user1271772 Yeah, but you missed the bold above...
Back when Micro$oft still gave individuals credit for posting something in their KB, I had quite a few KB arrticles in my name... (without being a Microsofft employee!)
I just opened a ticket and then immediately posted the answer (like Q&A here nowadays) and closed the ticket...
If someone thought it was a good one for the KB, it got transferred, first name and last name and all
I don't even know what KB is, Knowledge Base ?
@user1271772 yup.
I looked at your AskUbuntu profile and saw that one of the links was a different color from the rest, turns out I had clicked on "What's a good back-up strategy for 1 desktop PC?" before !!
(sorry, in another chat as that story just killed the room here... Everyone's afraid to talk to me because I once called Bill Gates...)
21:59
So KB was like their version of a UserNet or Stack Exchange, in the early 90s?
:D ;-) :D
@user1271772 Lemme see if the site still exists
@user1271772 :D :D :D
That's one of my better ones...
The best I like this one:
this one especially looking at the question and my edits
That's the one I'm mostly proud of.
22:14
That's a good one! I upvoted !!!
Wow! I now looked at the edits! Basically, the OP should not be getting the points for all the upvotes since the edits. There should come a point at which "any new upvotes going to the question go to Fabby"
Since you basically repaired the question
@user1271772 It even spawned a meta question
lemme look that one up...
35
Q: How to responsibly direct users with serious mental health issues?

OliI am not talking about people with borderline personality or spectrum disorder issues (like rudeness), rather behaviours like paranoia and depression. A recent question on Ask Ubuntu highlighted that I just don't know how to safely deal with some personality traits. It was a long and extremely...

Nice that you got it un-deleted!
22:31
:-)
You're a physicist???
Quantum optics is a dead give-away...
I'm a chemist, but never worked as one. (excluding summer jobs)
The programming (use of stack overflow) is mainly for when I'm doing calculations
@user1271772 Except for simulators, are there any Quantum computers nowadays?
Who's furthest ahead?
Which TZ are you in? (Just to know when you'll stop responding)
CET or GMT apparently...
I'm currently in London, England. The biggest "quantum calculator" which can do some calculations but is not Turing universal has 2048 qubits (it's called the D-Wave 2000Q and is their 4th commercial quantum computer). The biggest "quantum computer" which can do universal quantum computation, is IBM's 50-qubit quantum computer. Google claims to have a 72-qubit universal quantum computer, which they announced at the APS conference, but there is no evidence that it exists.
22:51
@Fabby no, it doesn't
Or at least that number's zero and the red dot is still there
How is Happy Hour starting at like 1am on Friday?!
7 minutes from now is 5PM where I'm at
Mountain Time == Real Time
Shog standard time... though, in the winter it's 6 pm...
You should contact your public officials, and request that they adjust your local timezone to reflect Real Time
Then you, like me, could be preparing to crack open an ice-cold can of Busch and Enjoy Summer Right
We reflect Univeral Time though
unless it's winter where you're at. In which case, you should talk to your officials about that too.
22:56
I already have signed the petition for the abolishment of winter (apart for skiing business), but so far my local legislation hasn't reacted. 0/10 would not vote again
16
Q: Refocusing from Health to Medical Sciences

Jon EricsonI've talked with the moderators (as foreshadowed), consulted the rest of the community team and listened to users on meta about the difficulties faced by a site called "Health". The general consensus is that we would be better off with a site like the proposed Medical Sciences site. Unfortunately...

Shamelessly asking for an update about this (wrote an email to Jon a few days ago as well, with no response). Just a little "haven't forgot about it, this is where we're at" would be nice
Jon's on vacation
so... gonna be a few weeks probably
ah, okay. Thanks for the info
Happy Happy Hour, I'll retire
cheers!

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