Tavern on the Meta

12:00 PM

@Raedwald Sadly, no :P It's bit like MSE though, it can be used as it's own meta if needed. I'm expecting every team that has a Team uses it as such..

M.A.R.

@rene OH YOU DIDN'T . . . just bring up a site everyone forgot about

Shadow

> moderators.se’s server IP address could not be found.

:(

M.A.R.

I occasionally see +1. An answer I hated at the time just got deleted. Yippeeee, except I dunno which one was that.

Should I feel good, or

Shadow

bad

rene

yes

M.A.R.

12:05 PM

I'd feel gad to make up for everything

Shadow

Feb 5 '14 at 19:50, by Manishearth

Moderators.SE is in commitment

@M.A.R. gad is Hebrew name

M.A.R.

Manishearth, people of an ancient time

Shadow

Might be back too, many got back to feel the drama...

M.A.R.

@Shadow It also apparently means a lot of things that each give a different meaning to that sentence O_O

Shadow

No meaning I like

M.A.R.

12:07 PM

That's not fair, your preferences only have to do with toilets

Shadow

Not only!

goes to toilets to protest

M.A.R.

🚽

As Kevin would beautifully sing.

Shadow

Too many icons, without real actions!

:D

M.A.R.

@Shadow Here, have a rep cap you protesting fellow

Journeyman Geek

@M.A.R. Eastern or Western?

M.A.R.

12:15 PM

@JourneymanGeek @Sha is the center of all things

Shadow

It all boils down to me then? Hmm... I like it.

:P

@JourneymanGeek Middle Eastern actually so it fits. ;)

Robert Columbia

שדו הוא מישראל.

M.A.R.

MY GOD, IT"S FULL OF ROBERTS

sSD 2K

Ugh.

@Shadow . . . We're so doomed

I imagine your capital punishment would also involve toilets

This CRM yeti guy is on fire

Fire isn't good for yetis

Robert Columbia

12:31 PM

/me buys the yeti a ticket to Kathmandu

M.A.R.

We need more urgent solutions

Reaches out for the gun

user351483

Sets phaser to 'stun'

Shadow

@RobertColumbia Google Translate? ;)

@M.A.R. nothing more urgent than pee, you know.

Robert Columbia

@Shadow לא, אני כתבתי את זה

user351483

12:47 PM

What's with the Hebrew?

Robert Columbia

Shadow speaks Hebrew and I am trying to learn it.

user58

What'd you write? Context?

(As in, what's your message referring to?)

Shadow

@RobertColumbia nice! So why didn't you also translate my name to צל? ;)

Robert Columbia

I had just mentioned that Shadow was from Israel. He asked if I had used Google Translate, and I responded "No, I wrote it".

Shadow

I changed my name at some point to קוסם הצללים on one site. :)

Robert Columbia

12:50 PM

@Shadow would you prefer that? I usually transliterate proper names.

Shadow

@RobertColumbia trying? Well you do a good job, no mistakes so far.

Robert Columbia

@Shadow תודה

user58

@RobertColumbia hevanti

Shadow

@RobertColumbia @user58 knows, he's also from Israel. ;)

Mgetz

holy crap some users are paranoid to the point of harassing others

Shadow

12:51 PM

@Mgetz hmm? Where?

@RobertColumbia :)

Mgetz

I've flagged it, the mods can deal with it

I don't want to give their paranoia substance

Shadow

meh

muru

Does the mortarboard ignore downvotes?

Mgetz

given that their paranoia involves this chat

Shadow

Teaser ;)

@muru think so

muru

12:52 PM

Oh, yeah, nvm

13

A: If I hit the daily rep cap and then get downvoted, does it still count towards badges?

Many years ago, we simplified the logic for the daily reputation badges. They only consider positive reputation changes. That means the script that awards the badge doesn't even look at downvotes, and in that regard doesn't actually pay attention to how much net reputation you earned at all. It ...

Mgetz

regardless it's harassment at this point and blatantly so

Shadow

@Mgetz it's about targeted voting/closing?

Mgetz

@Shadow comment flagging

Shadow

oh

Mgetz

usually R/A

Shadow

12:53 PM

Well yes this is a thing, people ask other people to flag comments in chat. So what?

Raedwald

@Mgetz I thought "the feedback on the new FAQ is much better than before, maybe things are getting less toxic around here". Then I saw this and this. Oh dear.

Shadow

If the comments are really rude, at some point the person posting them will be warned then suspended.

Robert Columbia

@muru yes, it ignores downvotes : meta.stackexchange.com/q/70158/336163

Mgetz

a user is now targeting others because of it accusing them of creating a 'flagging squad'

Robert Columbia

@Shadow אתה מדבר ספרדית?

M.A.R.

12:54 PM

@RobertColumbia well, GT translated your message to "Demo is from Israel."

Shadow

@RobertColumbia שלילי

@M.A.R. rofl!!

M.A.R.

@Shadow No, Demo

Shadow

@M.A.R. well "שדו" has no meaning, so Google used AI to find some best match.

Robert Columbia

@Raedwald ok np

user58

"his demon"

Shadow

12:55 PM

hmm

Not common

M.A.R.

"500 Server Error is from Israel"

user58

not common, but that's how you'd conjugate the word demon for male possessive

Shadow

"הילד הלך אל שדו בלילה" --> "The boy went to his demon at night"

Maybe in poems/stories then. @user58 :)

M.A.R.

Oh, this is the moment where you two go full certified-linguist mode

Shadow

@user58 since you brought it up... it can also mean "his breast". :D

user58

12:58 PM

I prefer discussing demons, though

M.A.R.

I dunno, whenever someone asks me a question about Persian or Turkish on the internet, I feel so weird like I need to prove to them I'm a native speaker

@Shadow That is so poetic

user58

@M.A.R. I'm not a native speaker of Hebrew. So I don't try to convince people. ;)

In fact, in person, I stumble all over my words and have a hard time expressing myself. I much prefer English.

mag

I prefer english over german too, but for a different reason

my inner monologue is in english, so there's a translation step to talk normally in german

Shadow

@M.A.R. it is!

@user58 when did you learn Hebrew? Thought that as a kid (e.g. 4-5) so at such stage it's considered native. Or not?

M.A.R.

Meh, it's weird

Shadow

1:01 PM

@M.A.R. no, u

:D

M.A.R.

Mother tongue and native tongue are identical for some and not for others.

I'm an edge case so I'd rather it not be for me.

Shadow

@mag but how did it start?

M.A.R.

@Shadow Ur face

user58

Yeah, but... I never really got the necessary immersion that you need to pick it up well. I'm still learning it now, because I never went to school or anything so I wasn't surrounded by the language.

Shadow

@M.A.R. always a pleasure

@user58 oh, this indeed can explain

M.A.R.

1:03 PM

For me, you're a native speaker in your mother tongue but not necessarily a . . . mother speaker in your native tongue

Shadow

@M.A.R. you weren't born in Iran?

mag

@Shadow by talking so much english online and in my free time that my inner monologue switched to it

Shadow

@mag that's... amazing. :)

terdon

@M.A.R. what's the distinction you're making between mother tongue and native language?

M.A.R.

@Shadow I was

Shadow

1:08 PM

@M.A.R. so what's the edge case?

M.A.R.

@terdon My parents' L1 is Azeri Turkish, and it's the first language I was exposed to. Iran's official language is Persian, and it's mandatory that we learn it, not just because it's in the curriculum, but also that a significant portion of the population speaks Persian. I consider my mother tongue to be Azeri Turkish (and can also call myself a native speaker), but I'm a native speaker of Persian

Hope it makes sense. I've probably used the terms to replace more technical ones. Might as well called it "strawberry tongue" and "what your tongue looks like after having spicy food with cucumber"

Shadow

@M.A.R. banana

M.A.R.

I'm a fluent (-ish? You be the judge) English speaker, but never been to somewhere it's spoken on a daily routine, so not a native speaker.

My "inner voice" is English though

Although I can switch pretty easily

Mgetz

@M.A.R. I doubt there is anyone actually truly 'fluent' in english, we're all just 'fluent' enough

M.A.R.

Meh, my everyday "prole" definition of "fluent" just involves how easy it is to communicate daily stuff in a language without preparing beforehand

Mgetz

1:16 PM

as someone (likely) on the spectrum, I'm always preparing beforehand. Failing to do so results in some really bad interactions.

Shadow

@M.A.R. same here. I consider myself good at reading/writing English, but I'm terrible at speaking it and find it hard to understand English just from hearing, e.g. TV show without subtitles.

user58

That could also be an auditory processing issue, which is really common. I like subtitles and I'm a native speaker.

M.A.R.

@Mgetz Uh, that explains some of mine

@Shadow I read somewhere (probably an unbacked urban legend guideline thing though) that if you get eighty percent of it, you're doing alright. That's not getting one word out of five, roughly

I get close to 100 percent of some movie and 30 of another

Shadow

@M.A.R. you're also on the spectrum?

@user58 hmm, interesting.

M.A.R.

Like, Tommy Lee Jones's heavy accent and grumpy white noise made it really hard to decipher No Country for Old Men's initial dialog.

And don't get me started on that wheelchair guy in the end

Shadow

1:20 PM

@M.A.R. makes sense, depends what language they use

M.A.R.

@Shadow I don't think so, but I think the standards for these vary heavily from industrialized countries to developing nations

Shadow

@M.A.R. good point

M.A.R.

It's not something I can opine on, anyway. What constitutes being on the spectrum versus some (eccentric) personality trait, etc.

Shadow

Now I feel weird for thinking in my native language. lol :D

M.A.R.

And it's probably evolving in a really fast pace

@Shadow If you're swearing at me, then no u

Shadow

1:22 PM

@M.A.R. surprising but no, not this time! ;)

M.A.R.

I don't even know what Hebrew swearing sounds like

Shadow

@M.A.R. I can teach you

user58

Like English, only mispronounced.

Shadow

I'll be gentle

M.A.R.

@user58 Martin Scorsese accent

Mgetz

1:24 PM

@user58 this is what happens when you construct a language... you have to borrow someone else's curses

M.A.R.

@Shadow we can start from the early evolution of swear words, from childhood. What's "meanie" in Hebrew?

terdon

@M.A.R. I hear you. My dad's American and my mother's Greek, but I just call both of those my mother tongue. Or call English my father tongue if I'm being cute. But I'm certainly a native speaker of both. I just consider "mother tongue" to mean "language I speak as a native speaker". So I was curious about how you were separating them.

Raedwald

Hmm meta.stackexchange.com/questions/336339/… is getting a bit hot. It's not quite an edit war yet, but the subject of the edits is hot, and one of the editors is a former site moderator who should know what they are doing.

Cerbrus

That former moderator is also the OP of that question...

rene

@Raedwald if it is just moderation that your concern is about, please raise a flag. This room can't and shouldn't handle edit wars.

Cerbrus

1:35 PM

Something something ten-foot poles

Raedwald

@rene If I didn't know that the editor was a former mod I'd just have flagged it edit war/not nice. I'm raising it here so someone more experienced could intervene if necessary.

@Cerbrus a 3.048m pole, you insensitive clod

M.A.R.

in The Periodic Table on The Stack Exchange Network Chat, Oct 13 at 20:16, by Loong

Attack of the monster units:

terdon

@Raedwald IMO that question should never have been asked. But a single rollback doesn't seem like a problem.

rene

@Raedwald sure. I think Mark made a valid call. I assume he can interact in the comments if he decides to do so and share his argument with the OP where I'm sure the OP will share theirs. If that doesn't end in an agreement to disagree we will take it from there.

Shadow

@M.A.R. tough one! Well, the direct word is "רשע" which actually means "evil", so not accurate enough. Bully isn't always evil, for example. So I'm afraid there isn't accurate one word in Hebrew for that. If you mean "bully" as in someone who keep harassing you that's "ביריון".

Raedwald

1:41 PM

@rene Understood. I shall speak of it no more.

rene

@terdon there is no end to humans curiosity ...

M.A.R.

@rene Unless the Martians find and dissect it as an Earth lifeform

Matt Damon is their leader.

The whole story is a cover up to legitimize his sudden appearance on Earth.

Shadow

@Raedwald Sklivvz was never MSE moderator. He was a developer working for Stack Exchange. And think he's still a mod on Skeptics. Edit: nope, stepped down.

M.A.R.

He's recording these messages as I speak.

Shadow

@Raedwald also, the original version was indeed unkind at all, he softened the tone in response to a comment I made. I'd say it's legit.

SPArchaeologist-様

2:21 PM

Do anyone know if the old page with the animated pictures of the Stack Exchange staff still exist anywhere? To be clear, I am referring to the one with the cactus plush picture.

M.A.R.

@SPArchaeologist-様 deep in our hearts :'(

I don't think so

Not even Web Archive probably

SPArchaeologist-様

@M.A.R. do you happen to know if said info is still available somewhere else?

Shadow

@SPArchaeologist-様 pretty sure it's gone forever, i.e. they changed the contents of the page before the about us was removed.

@SPArchaeologist-様 I did archive all gif images, yes

Let me find it...

M.A.R.

@Shadow Wait, didn't this same discussion happen a while ago and you said you there isn't anything anywhere

Maybe I imagined that. I should also get a nap.

Journeyman Geek

@SPArchaeologist-様 That was gracenote wasn't it?

SPArchaeologist-様

2:27 PM

@JourneymanGeek Exactly.

M.A.R.

Do you remember Shog's?

Journeyman Geek

That's someone I've not seen around in a while :/

SPArchaeologist-様

And to be more precise, it was a Cactuar, not a generic cactus plush.

M.A.R.

And who was that guy whose head span all the way

Shadow

@M.A.R. nope

6

A: Would like to see more employee animations

Before it's closed, I wanted to stash all the past animations but alas, they changed the whole source to some dynamic picture creator and archive.org is borked when it comes to jQuery. I was able to salvage some via Google, if anyone can find more please add them as well. Thanks! Since it's goi...

@SPA ^

@M.A.R. or coffee

SPArchaeologist-様

2:31 PM

@Shadow see my reply in the other room.

Shadow

djsmiley2k - CoW

:O

David A

@Raedwald it didn't seem hotter than most of the stuff. A certain someone might have been called out, but not by name.

SPArchaeologist-様

@Shadow yep, also seems someone actually asked a question about that

David A

@SPArchaeologist-様 gone

SPArchaeologist-様

2:37 PM

@DavidA yep, I know, but Shadow should be able to see it

Feeds

Why Devs (Should) Like Estimates

Yaakov Ellis on October 23, 2019

As Principal Web Developer at Stack Overflow and a long time Tech Lead, I learnt that accurate estimates were essential in order for a company to be healthy and productive. Over the years I have spent a good deal of time developing my theories for why estimates and breakdowns are so important, and crafting my own methodology for how best to go about doing them.

Below, I attempt to distill the lessons I’ve learned so that others can experiment with and improve upon my techniques. Now, I should be clear, the advice below is what works for me. I’m sure there are different approaches that might work better for others. Feel free to share your favorite approach in the comments. …

Shadow

@SPArchaeologist-様 lol that is true. ;)