« first day (22 days earlier)      last day (5072 days later) » 

11:00 AM
trying to catch up here... is this convo all about supporting some sort of IRC / XMPP protocol deal?
What features do you think they're planning on adding at this point in the game?
Why stop with the chat? We should create a separate client for all of StackOverflow.
@Erick: That's a red herring and you know it.
@HarryGindi I don't mind you disagreeing with anything, but please watch your tone. This isn't mathoverflow.
@Harry, I have no idea, but the API can change, everything can change
The second they publish it, they're locked in
11:01 AM
The arguments against creating a client for the chat are exactly the same as the arguments against creating one for the website.
I don't want them to give up the freedom of change just yet
@Erick, not quite, the website is (I'm assuming here) more stable feature-wise and API-wise, it has matured
@balpha: In reference to what line precisely?
@LasseVKarlsen But there's still no reason to make it into a separate client.
It works fine in a browser.
@HarryGindi You know very well what I mean.
11:02 AM
And I'm not saying there is no point in creating a separate client for chat either
I'm just agreeing with them that now is not the time
@Erick: The difference is that a browser is well-suited to displaying webpages
I would very much like to have a client for iPad/iPhone of both
Rather than streams of text
seeing as the websites (chat and SO) aren't really geared towards mobile devices
@LasseVKarlsen chat has a mobile version; it will continue to be evolved
11:03 AM
yes, I know
and that's my point
it is evolving, so now is not the time to get side-tracked in order to publish a good API or spend time making a separate client
an iPad client for SO and the chat would be wicked.
but in time, if the mobile web interface isn't good enough, perhaps a more native client is the best way to go
I don't really understand why the iPad doesn't just run the full version of OS X, honestly...
@HarryGindi Which is why you're not Steve Jobs.
If it did, you wouldn't understand why it only have 15 minutes of battery time
11:04 AM
It's basically a laptop without a keyboard.
It could be a laptop without a keyboard with a different OS
But with iOS, it's only a big iPod.
By the way, I love my big iPod. :)
@LasseVKarlsen Or get side-tracked talking endlessly about it, for that matter...
11:06 AM
@Benjol, yeah yeah :)
@Benjol Why'd you come in a chat room, then?
You can't make a chat-system and then complain about being side-tracked talking about things :)
side-tracked? heh - I get paid for this
I get paid to sell drugs to the community.
Yeah, where is that checkbox btw? The one where you get payment for being here?
11:06 AM
Yeh, Marc, no fair. You and balpha are the only ones getting paid for this!
Can't remember seeing that anywhere...
I get paid for doing work that I'm not doing when I'm here. :)
@LasseVKarlsen, careful, because right next to it there is another checkbox where you pay :)
Yeah, well, I don't see that one either ;)
question, are smileys going to be added? ;)
@LasseVKarlsen buried in the T&C - we assumed you'd already agreed. We arrive on Tuesday to take your house and cat.
11:08 AM
Please don't add smilies
noooo, not my cat!!!
Question: is someone keeping track of how many stars everyone gives/gets?
The system knows...
The system should start telling us.
You'll only take Billy over my dead body!!!11
11:09 AM
by the way, why why does this keep happening: every time somebody stars a new post, it reloads the entire list and lags my browser to death
I have a 6:30 AM meeting with the CTO in 20 minutes. I don't really want to get into anything too heavy... gotta figure out what to work on
well, the stars are about the conversation, not the people. There are multiple ways of getting at the starred points from a chat.
@HarryGindi because Opera sucks?
@Erick: you suck
wow, how did I know?
11:10 AM
@Harry - at the moment, that is simply the way the RHS is implemented. We can of course tweak it. Or; don't "show 234 more"...
I'll take a note of that to investigate.
@HarryGindi watch it
Maybe there should be an option to keep the chat history trimmed to 25 messages
@ErickRobertson it starts at 100, but yes that might be a practical consideration.
so who pays you, Marc?
@ErickRobertson: How did you know, meanwhile?
I assume because somebody came in here earlier and asked the same thing, but if not, I am curious.
Anyway, I loaded the chat in firefox, and it's still lagging to death
11:16 AM
@HarryGindi That's because 600 MHz isn't fast anymore.
@MarcGravell HarryGindi - this message I replied to is where Marc stated he was paid.
For the record, I'm running the chat in Firefox 3.6.8 (Latest), and I have been for days without problems. I'm on a system that's at least a year old, and I'm also running remote desktop, SQL Server Mgmt Studio, Photoshop, and an X client.
@Erick: I'm using a laptop because I'm home for the summer. My main box is up in michigan.
Yes, it's crappy
And do you still have Opera running in the background? :)
or have you task switched out of WoW?
but why should I need something more recent than 1995 for chat?
I don't play WoW
11:20 AM
because this is web chat
and I closed opera =p
precisely my point from the beginning
I can't believe that I knew you were running Opera.
I never saw you say it. :)
I know
@ErickRobertson I work for stackoverflow...
I guess I've just gathered a flavor for the type of person that runs it.
11:21 AM
I was impressed
Probably not
@MarcGravell So when are the ads coming in here?
Opera was awesome as hell back in the day circa 2002-2003
I will agree that it has gotten pretty bloated and crappy
With all due respect, Opera was never "awesome as hell"
It sure was
11:22 AM
oh no it wasn't
mouse gestures is the one thing people tried to sell me opera on, but I never tried it that intensively
Opera 7 vs firebird vs IE vs mozilla, opera was the best at the time
I could never figure out how to turn off that damn border, or for that matter to make Opera render pages like every other browser.
Opera might be best to some users, not to everyone
@Lasse: I'm saying that at the time it was the best
the only contender there at all was firebird
11:24 AM
@wds, I've got them in firefox, and for me they've been like the scroll wheel - so natural I keep trying to use them everywhere (upvoting has the same problem :)
If you want proof that Opera was never awesome, do this. Open a question on StackOverflow "Has Opera ever been awesome?" It'll get closed in about five minutes. Just watch.
That's because that question is not appropriate for stackoverflow
I'm part of the NARQ squad on MO
And we wonder how I knew you used Opera.
11:25 AM
the enforcement arm of the NARQ society, previously known as the Old Boys' Network
Well, it's been an entertaining fifteen minutes, but I have a 6:30 AM meeting :)
@Benjol which addon?
@wds: there are plenty of mouse gesture extensions for firefox
and they're all pretty good
11:27 AM
@Benjol thanks
the only reason I still use opera anymore is that you can "allow window with no tabs"
if someone can figure out how to put that behavior in firefox
You mean like the app windows in Chrome? Just a window for a single website/page?
I would switch in an instant
@wds, there are more options in there than I know what to do with, but it's the first one I tried and it works for me, so I never looked any further.
It means that if you close the last tab you have open
the program still stays open and has a gray empty window behind it
I know how I could hack it if I could program
open up a hidden tab that displays a gray color
11:30 AM
Firefox stays open if you close all the tabs
you can't close the final tab
there's no way to close it
@HarryGindi, lifehacker.com/5306497/… (Untested, Google told me)
why would you want to, just close the browser
I think ctrl-w closes the browser if on last tab
@PiersMyers, bad question...
11:31 AM
@Benjol: thanks!
btw @HarryGindi, if you click on the little arrow next to each message, you can do an explicit reply, which links your post that message.
When you rollover an @name message, you can see which one it was replying to
I am not going to use this dinky little trackpad to move the mouse if I can help it
oh, how can I move the tab bar to the bottom of the screen in firefox?
or like, change what buttons there are in the mainbar?
@HarryGindi try the Tab Mix Plus add-on
@Pie: A further question: is it worth using the tm+ session manager? Are there any advantages?
@HarryGindi yes, it is a great extension for managing your tabs, give it a try. If you don't like it then remove it, simple
11:40 AM
No, no no. There is a session manager in addition to the extra tab options
@HarryGindi I also use the Operetta theme to make my Firefox look like Opera :)
All-in-one sidebar as well?
for downloads
@HarryGindi I use all-in-one sidebar, tm+ and Session Manager (plus about another 50 extensions)
I don't see how to drop the tab bar to the bottom through tm+
in options->Display->Tab Bar - select 'Postion' Bottom
having Multi-row option is pretty useful too
11:45 AM
Can I get rid of the google search bar in FF and replace it with the "search by first letter" thingy?
from the main address bar
you can replace what search engine is in that box.
that's not what I asked.
I didn't understand what you asked.
Opera has this awesome thing where if you want to search wikipedia, you click the address bar and type in "w foo"
or google is "g foo"
and you can add new ones and get rid of the old ones
AH! I'm not familiar with opera, but I'm fairly sure that someone has created a firefox plug-in for that. But yeah, I would have no idea where to get it. sorry man.
11:47 AM
it makes the separate search bar pointless
that's why I want to remove the search bar and the home button as well
are you running at a screen resolution of 800x600?
No, but those things bother me
have you tried Google Chrome? It has one search bar
google chrome is garbage
and it defeats the point of me changing browsers
since it doesn't support mathml
If it weren't for the fact that opera's support for mathML is dismal, I would not have decided to switch ten minutes ago
Basically, the devs at opera said that they have no intention of adding mathml support, so I'm not going to use opera anymore
@Harry you can remove the search bar and the home button.
11:54 AM
Got it.
@HarryGindi, maybe you want to check out YubNub
get rid of all your toolbars and use the Ubiquity extension
@Harry, and in firefox you can customize which search engine it uses by default in the address bar.
but you can't do the one letter thing you were describing (as far as I know)
I had an extension that did it at one point
11:57 AM
smart keywords explained here: johnbokma.com/firefox/keymarks-explained.html
@devinb, with yubnub you get close - though it's in the search box, not the address box
@benjol cool
12:10 PM
@Piers nice
@Piers: How does one add inline searching with "." and disable the idiotic superbar
@HarryGindi no idea, try searching for it in Google (or whatever you favourite search engine is)
I can't find out how to disable the dropdown on the address bar
figure out
got it
it's in the history menu of all places =\
@HarryGindi learn how to program and create your own applications ("with blackjack and hookers! In fact, forget the applications!")
Nah, I'd rather not. I've got too much else to do
12:28 PM
well, neato, it looks pretty similar to opera
@devinb no, this:
All I need now is the ability to have a "background" tab that I can hide behind everything so I can minimize tabs.
@Harry, MathML doesn't work in Chrome because it isn't supported by WebKit iirc.
12:43 PM
@PiersMyers Well, yes, obviously I recognize that they're different quotes =P
12:58 PM
What's the verb form of applying a rom to a device? e.g., I want to say, I rooted and rommed? my phone. this must be obvious...?
ah yes, thank you
1:42 PM
There's been a sudden influx of SO discussion questions being posted on Reddit, which then turn into Reddit discussions. I'm not sure if this is funny or depressing, since I generally try and get people to start those discussions on Reddit in the first place
got an example?
2:00 PM
Hey @Balpha do you have access to the raw DB?
Or... does the datadump include close votes and timestamps?
@devinb No, just the timestamp when the post actually closed
I was just curious how many 3kers routinely use their powers and how often.
I would assume that most of them have a flurry of close votes around the time they hit 3k, and then it abruptly decreases.
How would you tag a question about "Mukashi Mukashi Arutokoro ni Totetsumonaku Naka no Warui Twintail no Shimai Himesama ga Irasshaimashitatosa"?
Apparently it's a videogame
Chances are the title length was reasonable before the romanization :/
The tag for that would be: "ga"
I'll settle for mmantnnwtnshgi
I meant read access :p
by the by, I fully support that blog post, however allowing developers access to raw datadumps is also critical for bug-fixes.
agreed, but I'm not working on SO core at the moment
As a former maintenance coder, I assure you that the environments where I was allowed to look but not touch were wildly more stable than the environments where they beat us away with sticks.
@balpha it was a long shot. I just had some curiosity.
but I'm pretty sure the data dump does include close votes
I think the timestamps are rounded to a full day, but that should suffice
Yeah, it would.
I'll have to check that out.
2:20 PM
@balpha this chat is pretty amazing. I'd love to see a montage that shows how it progressed. e.g. a series of screenshots that capture the design and feature evolution -- that could make a pretty cool presentation, actually
let's just say it used to be a lot uglier :)
but thanks for kudos
ahem shouldn't chat feedback be kept in chat feedback? I'll kick you if I have to!
also. Can I have the power to kick people...?
whistles innocently
@devinb fair enough, my apologies
@MichaelHaren for what?
2:24 PM
Flag this as spam
Q: The count of flagged posts seem decreased

kiamlalunoOn english.stackexchange.com, I have access to the moderation tools, and I have noticed that the number of flagged posts was first 5, and now it's 4. How is this possible? As far I can see, it's only possible to flag a post, not to remove the flag added to a post. I tried selecting 30d, 14d, ...

we're running an experiment
@badp I'm considering taking that bet.
the meta post?
thatI linked to.
@GeorgeMarian yes
Ok, ok. It's too early in the morning. :)
2:29 PM
@devinb Do you require an additional flag?
one can flag the same post multiple times? or is it just a UI thing?
we need a spam flag on grace's post
just one will do :)
@devinb Well, then...learn to link ;)
@devinb Great, I wanted to flag that post anyways. I'm on it.
ok, done
2:30 PM
A: The count of flagged posts seem decreased

Grace NoteTo add on the other answers, diamonds actually can clear flags. Also, a post that gets rolled back will clear offensive flags. I can't flag my own post as offensive or spam. But I do need at least one revision to actual roll back from! And on a completely unrelated and spammy note, people shou...

@george it appears that you're right... shocking :p
Why is it shocking? :P
whistles innocently
Is there a way to get from "recent highlights" back to the current chat without going through Rooms List or another third place (no pun intended)?
there's an "all" button where the "highlights" button was before
@balpha Not so; I still have "recent highlights."
And yes, clicking it just reloads "recent highlights."
2:41 PM
oh, sorry
you went through the menu
yeah, that should probably change
There's another entry point?
yes, at the very top of the chat
@balpha Oh, that thing.
I always forget it's up there, hidden behind the scrollable area.
You may be happy to know those buttons do work on my machine.
yes! my life is finally complete!
@balpha What will you do now?
2:44 PM
I don't know... Politics, maybe? Paleonthology?
What, they don't have Disneylands where you live?
Not even a Disney embassy or consulate nearby?
Q: MySQL row number

cypherHi, say I have a MySQL query, for example SELECT id, name, surname FROM employees ORDER BY id the result woud be id name surname 1 Peter Smith 2 John Banjo ... 1384 Will Levenstein While this is an ordered query, I can always assume (as long as I don't change the t...

why lord why...
my brain hemorrhages
still says highlights here, that button
or maybe I'm looking at the wrong button
it should say "highlights" when you're in normal mode and "all" when you're in highlights mode
3:11 PM
@balpha Unfortunately, the datadump does not include the UserId of the close voter.
no, of course not
I thought you just wanted a general "close votes per day" count
@balpha No I was actually curious about the makeup of a 3k user. Do they continually close vote, or do they take the new feature out for a spin, and then never use it again.
Many miles to go before I sleep...
@balpha It's been pointed out (somewhere) that the information is ostensibly public, because they publish the usernames once it is closed.
does the API give "closed by"?
3:14 PM
Not sure, I'm just looking at the datadump.
this has come up on Meta a few times. Close stats are pretty much impossible.
Maybe I can bribe @waffles.
into running the query for me.
@devinb Devil's advocate: That argument doesn't take into account the votes cast on questions that are not ultimately closed.
@balpha Who would you say is the most corrupt (or corruptible) SO employee??
3:19 PM
@devinb How does one bribe waffles? Maple syrup? The promise of not being eaten? The promise that they will be enjoyed when eaten?
@Popular That's why I said "ostensibly".
People have made the argument that they are public, and I don't necessarily agree. People could commence retaliations against even failed close attempts. However, in my case (I'm special) I was insinuating that I would craft a query and then someone with DB access would choose whether or not they thought it was acceptable.
@PopularDemand True, better than a bribe would be the threat of withholding maple syrup!
@devinb I'll have to work this into my paper on SO psychology.
Which part? "I'm so special", "the rules don't apply to me", "it's not public until 4 people agree with me", "SO employees decide what information is public", "threaten to withhold maple syrup"?
@devinb Mouseover to see what I was replying to. Or click the "this is a reply to" arrow.
@devinb that's a pretty good summary of the last 50 messages..
3:24 PM
@devinb What would you call this person? A Devalued Associate?
@PopularDemand Community Liason.
@PopularDemand @Marc's ears were burning.
@PopularDemand how about "former associate"
Ah, The Tavern, wherein the great Stack Exchange questions of our time are pondered.
What happened to the link that allows me to edit a tag wiki ?
Is there a real name for the "this is a reply to" arrow? I've just been calling it the "left turn arrow" so far.
@DarrelMiller Do you no longer meet the requirements to edit a tag wiki?
"Tag wikis can be edited by users with more than 2000 reputation, provided:
They are in the top 20 answerers for this tag or
They have more than 100 answer upvotes in this tag"
I give up. That's supposed to be a blockquote.
3:31 PM
multi-line mode in chat is not as useful as it would at first seem to be
@JoePhillips Because it has little positive utility, and it gives rise to abuse like you just committed.
@JoePhillips because as soon as you add a second line, most of the markdown that would benefit from multiple lines doesn' t work
> blockquote (yay!)
I'm pretty sure I still meet the requirements. I'm top answerer and more than 400 upvotes.
> no
quote (boo)
@DarrelMiller link...
3:33 PM
> fail
> quote?
Ok, forget it.
Either I'm really dense, or it magically just reappeared
I'm going to go for, the "it magically just re-appeared" :-)
don't forget, this stuff split up a lot in the last day
Wait... how do I multi-line mode?
shift +
Oh. yeah, that did it.
3:36 PM
<kbd>shift</kbd>... HEY, BALPHA! NEED KBD SUPPORT!
you need to @ him.
you @ him
@Shog9 @balpha Shog9 requests you at this location
3:38 PM
speaking of which... @balpha: the chat FAQ is sadly lacking in anchors.
@devinb @balpha This is not a deathtrap in any way. There will be cake.
@Shog9 yes
and `id`s <-- and that regexp still sucks
I didn't get it until a month ago.
3:53 PM
@devinb Per the last panel, you are ahead of schedule. Please slow down.
@popular I didn't even realize which game the comic referred to, until right at the end.
the end of the game, not the comic.
well.... both, I suppose.
honestly? Never knew it had any connection to gaming. Awesome metaphor though.
@devinb Wow. I must have hung out in college around with people who were even geeky by programmer standards.
4:16 PM
Quiet day.
@Popular So what your saying is people are working?
@Troggy Perhaps. I wonder what that means about yesterday and Tuesday.
I'm just reading reddit
stop reading reddit and get to work dammit!
/me is going home tho
4:38 PM
stop reading reddit and go read comments on youtube, dammit!
@Shog9 And xkcd in 3... 2...
@Devin That comic was me until last week. Finally ordered a nice machine to play a few newer titles in their full glory.
Now there's a question for Gaming SE. "Wats better PC gaming or console gaming in every case ever kthxbbai"
i'd sign up to answer that
I think Grace Note might actually hunt me down and kill me if I posted that.
4:50 PM
wait, they have mouses and keyboards for consoles now don't they...
might be a tough choice
A: What to do with old laptop screens?

th3dudeIf you have the time and money, you could build a portable XBOX 360/Playstation 3, like this guy did.

i think i can trace my current lack of interest in gaming back to the first day I saw my roommates playing Halo with that horrible xbox controller.
I missed that generation.
you didn't miss anything good
When one says "gaming", is one automatically assumed to be speaking of console gaming?
4:55 PM
@shog9 I laughed hard when I logged in this morning and saw your comment about me being the 'resident nhibernate expert' :)
@mmyers I don't think one can, if for no other reason than the cross-platform nature of many games.
@Fosco HA!
wondered if you'd catch that... Was half-hoping the dude would still be around, waiting for you...
@Fosco that was me asking about it
im still waiting
4:57 PM
@JoePhillips oh Hi Joe.. Shog9 was just kidding.. I am the anti-ORM commentator.
@JoePhillips Whatever it is you're doing with it... stop and just use SQL the way it was meant to be.
@JoePhillips You don't need an abstraction layer and not everything needs to be an object.
* This is all just my [subjective] [opinion]
thats what i was going to do but it will take a lot longer
It might take longer, but it will work.
Reliably and sensibly, without any of the ORM's baggage or bugs.

« first day (22 days earlier)      last day (5072 days later) »