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00:00 - 14:0014:00 - 00:00

12:21 AM
Can someone please respond to my contact about my getting "too many requests"?
 
You're not getting enough contact about too many contacts?
 
@Catija See first section here: meta.stackexchange.com/a/164900/377214
@Shog9 Have we ever encountered a case where a user who wanted to rage-quit used sock puppets to serially downvote their posts so that they have a negative score, in order to get them automatically deleted at the time their account gets deleted?
 
12:44 AM
sigh thank god no
since their socks would need 125 rep.
@SonictheInclusiveHedgehog someone might give you a too many requests reply.
125? or something
point is that needs planning.
 
Yeah, 125 to vote down.
And then they'd need one additional rep per downvote to not lose the privilege.
 
1:24 AM
 
1:42 AM
That's clever
 
hey
to be honest...
 
@Shog9 Why do you use a strange "claw monster with arms extended" avatar on SO?
 
hey
good morning
 
hmm...
 
@SonictheInclusiveHedgehog Wha? It's a guy wearing a hat... isn't it?
 
1:52 AM
yup
 
2:14 AM
@Catija No, it's a creepy monster with eyes, a nose, a strange tusk, and extended claw arms.
 
hey
is it caching?
 
@SonictheInclusiveHedgehog I'm... not seeing it? Perhaps you could doodle on the image and show me what you mean?
 
2:30 AM
Hmm...I see the man in the hat now that you blew it up, but while it was small, I could only see the monster.
 
@SonictheInclusiveHedgehog There's a life lesson in there somewhere.
 
3:13 AM
Especially faces.
When you stare at shogs hat, shog's hat stares back at you.
 
hey
@SmokeDetector wut?
 
3:47 AM
@user3956566 I see you've restored your name on Meta...yet to propagate to chat.
 
user310756
4:15 AM
@SonictheInclusiveHedgehog hm
 
@YvetteColomb Out of curiosity, why are you hiding Meta from your network profile?
 
hey
Usually because "meta is murder" :)
 
4:31 AM
Meta is love <3 ;)
 
user310756
5:24 AM
@SonictheInclusiveHedgehog I use my SO profile for my CV and I don't have meta, IPS, or parenting attached to my network profile, as they're too personal. So I keep the attached profiles for business. I don't care if the regulars know who I am, but when using it to show my skills, better keep the personal stuff out of it
 
5:42 AM
@SmokeDetector tpu-
@SmokeDetector naa-
 
6:35 AM
@NogShine soon in the theaters! :D
Metatheatre, and the closely related term metadrama, describes the aspects of a play that draw attention to its nature as drama or theatre, or to the circumstances of its performance. These may include: the direct address of the audience (especially in soliloquies, asides, prologues, and epilogues); expression of an awareness of the presence of the audience (whether they are addressed directly or not); an acknowledgement of the fact that the people performing are actors (and not actually the characters they are playing); an element whose meaning depends on the difference between the represented...
@YvetteColomb welcome back!
Now bring @Telkitty back as well and all shall be like in the good old days in Tavern. :P
Wanted to test it with actual new user..... :D
 
6:52 AM
sd k
 
@Shadow I asked the question I said meta.stackexchange.com/q/310711/357396
Tagged it with bug and support.
 
@NogShine yup. Likely it will be closed as dupe, but I let others do it this time as I'm not 100% sure what's going on.
hehe, @Sonic is fast.
Like I said when you first asked, @NogShine, I think it's the same thing, but since you insist it's not, I stay out of it for now. /cc @Sonic
 
@ShadowWizard Yup. He is.
 
Smokey welcoming doesn't appear to work as well as I hoped. :(
 
@ShadowWizard I think it is not because that is an FR and ask for anonymizing user names. Mine is not. I ask for updating of the name. Ideally, they should be updated with the name they left the site.
I think they are different.
 
7:07 AM
@NogShine so what name should be displayed there? It's not clear from your question. (i.e. what name that user had the day their account was deleted?)
 
7:49 AM
@ShadowWizard it's only moonstar.
 
@Catija clearly a Metroid.
 
Another user Ajay was Parikshita when they left.
 
 
Shog has a Pacman ghost on his head?
 
no one knows, we can only guess. You see Blinky, I see a Metroid, other see a claw monster.
 
7:56 AM
"That solved my problem" is not diplayed to me
 
@NogShine well, see my answer.
 
@Derpy Che Guevara?
 
@NogShine because you edited
@Bart so where will you go when Stack Exchange is shut down? You got an alternative already? ;)
 
hey
8:16 AM
@Derpy cute ghost
would like to pet
 
hey
"How can I pet Foster's imaginary friends?"
 
@hey Bloo?
Also, little trivia...
 
hey
I missed this cartoon show...
 
Forster's Home for Imaginary Friends was also "made" by Lauren Faust
 
8:26 AM
@hey sounds like legit question on Pets, go ahead and ask! :P
 
@ShadowWizard shall we all move to Legend of Equestria? We could just chat in the local Sugarcube.
 
8:40 AM
@Derpy sounds good! creating account
 
@Shadow Not a duplicate; I (and apparently four other users) glossed over one sentence, which threw off my understanding of the question and made me reason the wrong way (cc @NogShine): meta.stackexchange.com/questions/310711/…
 
@SonictheInclusiveHedgehog You convinced me that it is a dupe :D
 
@NogShine I overlooked the sentence "They commented the day before the deletion with another name which is not the name on the banner.", and I thought the "other username" you were referring to was the anonymized username upon deletion
 
user310756
@ShadowWizard only when pinged. I'm still grieving Telkitty's account closure
 
@SonictheInclusiveHedgehog No, they are different. It should be moonstar but it is moonstar2001.
Their account is present on MSE too.
 
8:57 AM
@YvetteColomb I don't know why Telkitty left and, now it's happened, I don't need to know. I can say that really enjoyed the various pics that s/he posted in the Lounge and elsewhere. It sometimes seems that there is a concerted effort to remove all fun from SE/SO and replace it with pseudo-political hassle:(
 
I think she was just a victim of the BeNice Police© that was introduced in a somehow weird attempt to react to various "accusations", the last of them probably being April posts.
 
@Derpy Colour, (!) me surprised... :(
 
user310756
@MartinJames TelKitty is my friend in RL (met her in here). She's a pretty cool person. I think we do need some places on here to have fun. We're a tight knit community.. a bit like a big dysfunctional family.
 
user310756
ok shameless plug
 
user310756

 The Litter Box

General discussion for pets.stackexchange.com. Pet pictures an...
 
9:05 AM
SE is the least personal and tight knit community I've ever been a part of
 
user310756
For all pet spam, please join us.
 
user310756
Silly conversation is allowed - but keep it clean, we're a family oriented site :)
 
user310756
@Magisch compared to my RL family it is
 
Every deliberate mechanic of the site is aimed to suppress the formation of a social community
 
user310756
the active users all know each other
 
user310756
9:06 AM
except chat!
 
I know some people's usersnames, but thats about it
 
user310756
Long live chat
 
I've never met another SE user in real life
Everything on main and meta is adversarial, standoffish. You're expected to be able to justify and defend every action you take everywhere. And people won't hold back because they know you. It's really alien compared to the rest of the 'web
 
@Magisch not quite. The problem, if any, is that we oscillate between no moderation and the "Ye posted a cat picture! Blasphemy! You will be burinated in pain and disgrace" Holy Inquisition thing.
 
user310756
@Magisch fb is far worse
 
9:09 AM
I used FB briefly several years ago for sharing homework in class and never outside of that
 
hey
twitter
 
long since deleted my account
in certain ways the fact that SE is so unpersonal helps quite a bit ... you can focus more on the topic and subject of discussion
in other ways not having traditional social structures is extremely alienating to those used to them
 
user310756
I left fb and have no social media accounts. Been doing too much research about online security and privacy
 
@Magisch yet it happens
 
@YvetteColomb lol - just been there for cool pics:)
 
9:11 AM
@JourneymanGeek idk if it actually does
 
user310756
@MartinJames bookmark it! and attend daily (I will take role call)
 
outside of some chatrooms the entire site feels like a big topical amorphous mass
 
hey
yet, it's social software
14 hours ago, by Shog9
So... the thing to remember is that while SO/SE isn't a social network, it most definitely is social software - that is to say, people use it to interact with other people, there are rules and conventions about how they do so, and a lot of little bits of etiquette that aren't necessarily rules but affect how folks interact.
 
every user as interchangeable as the next
 
Quite a few of the older sites have a fairly regular steam of people who online socialize over chat or elsewhere
 
9:12 AM
@YvetteColomb OK!
 
user310756
@MartinJames :D
 
If I was looking killed by a falling pipe organ I don't think I'm replaceable to the SE community.... Unless someone else has a cute dog :p
 
hey
Anyway, I still have FB, Twitter, etc accounts. Not for social networking though, only for stalking observing recent trends.
 
user310756
@JourneymanGeek can you not walk into any cathedrals please
 
user310756
@hey lol
 
9:17 AM
yes it is
 
hey
flagged for mod attention to tell that it's spam seed
 
and gone ...
 
@JourneymanGeek To be fair, the site would probably keep on trucking
 
21 messages moved to Chimney
 
9:36 AM
[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Pattern-matching website in answer: Strange hair growth behavior by Sonu Semwal on health.SE
 
[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Username similar to website in answer: Solve this Question? -By Irving Scheib by Nicholas Constable on mathoverflow.net
 
@YvetteColomb sorry to hear... and sorry about Telkitty though no idea what happened.
@SonictheInclusiveHedgehog done
 
@YvetteColomb I struggle with tact because of my autism spectrum disorder
 
user310756
@SonictheInclusiveHedgehog I've never had a problem with you
 
user310756
@ShadowWizard it must be your fault somehow :)
 
9:57 AM
[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Manually reported question: Solve this Question? -By Irving Scheib by irving scheib on mathoverflow.net
 
And that's something I need to fix in order to help with my aspirations into education
@YvetteColomb Did you ever meet Telkitty again after she deleted her account?
 
hey
would be surprising if they don't...
 
user310756
@SonictheInclusiveHedgehog her SO account is still there and yes we talk and will catch up soon
 
@YvetteColomb maybe she didn't like my waffle?
Apr 30 at 11:35, by Shadow Wizard
//give TelKitty waffle
 
@Magisch probably
 
hey
10:08 AM
I'm sleeper
and borer
(wow, that doesn't make any sense)
 
@hey actually, it does.
> a worm, mollusk, insect, or insect larva that bores into wood, other plant material, or rock
;)
So which of those four are you? @hey
 
user310756
@ShadowWizard it's all your fault LOL (it's nothing to do with you really)
 
@YvetteColomb well, no waffles for her now! Too lazy to send them over to SO. :D
 
hey
@ShadowWizard I choose you, Molluska!
 
user310756
10:13 AM
you are *soooooooo lazy
 
@hey awesome! Now with @Norm gone, you can finally have your own, unique, name! :P
status-laziness-overflow
I'm so lazy that I'm too lazy to be lazy.
 
flags random messages in the Lounge, closes Window
 
hey
I flagged the cucumber one, too cucumbered
 
oh, thanks for reminding me
@JNat cross site spammer for your dedicated treatment: stackexchange.com/users/10315473/lindsey?tab=accounts. Spammed MSE for sure, probably other sites as well. Thanks!
@hey but it's green
We can't flag green stuff, aliens will be offended. ;)
 
hey
10:28 AM
... I just realized it's an eggplant, not cucumber >_<
 
@ShadowWizard I think you can even see me (or to be more precise, my character) in a video / review a youtuber made some time ago. Good luck trying to find out which character that would be.
I somehow also remind appearing in a picture taken during a Hide&Seek game in Canterlot Cantermore
 
hey
(confused because I have a difficulty in differentiating them in my local language, both starts with 'T': "Timun" and "Terong")
(just like some Indonesian people have a difficulty in differentiating "left" and "right" because both starts with 'K': "kiri" and "kanan")
 
@hey oh, so you can flag
@Derpy tried once already when you mentioned it
 
@ShadowWizard when I first mentioned it, only the picture taken in Canterlot existed.
 
@hey yes that's Shog
Funny, but also sad and somewhat ironic.
:D
 
10:40 AM
The actual video taken during a party in the Sugarcube came after that
 
@Derpy oh, this?
I assume you're Fluttershy there?
Also no gender specified so no "risk" for you posting it anyway. ;)
 
I was remembering another picture but it is indeed possible that "it was I", yep.
But that would be weird. Where is my rabbit then?
unless the rabbit wandered all the way to the right of the picture
which is also very possible.
 
@Derpy or behind a tree
 
11:45 AM
.... I was thinking about posting a question about Death Note. Yet I'm not really willing to create an account on anime
 
[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Manually reported answer: What is the name of this category of videos? by Shivangi Roy on graphicdesign.SE
 
The heat death of the universe is a depressing concept
 
12:03 PM
@Magisch I'm putting it firmly in the same category that the people that caused y2k did: I'll happen long after I'm dead and buried
 
12:33 PM
@Derpy use a sock
@Mgetz not really... assuming most software with y2k bugs were written between 1950 and 1999, I'd say most of their programmers were still very much alive in 2000.
 
@ShadowWizard dunno
 
@ShadowWizard That implies a lack of foresight doesn't it?
If I'm writing a program in 1990 making the date formatting break at 2000 would be a bad idea (tm)
 
@Magisch You mean like the fact that various versions of RHEL still used 32bit time_t?
 
yah
we are past the point where performance constraints make such hacks necessary
 
@Magisch Well, hindsight is 2000/20. I mean, everyone just used two digits up until now. I'd see no reason to suddenly break from established best practices ;)
 
12:45 PM
Yeah.. I'm tempted to start a consulting business going to various major companies that still rely on 16bit software and helping them migrate to software that supports 64bit time_t before 2037
 
I'll be 42 years old in 2037
sigh
 
@Magisch actually such hacks will probably slow code down now
 
hey
@Derpy ask on Movies & TV instead
 
user310756
@Shog9 can the team revisit this decline decision please
 
user310756
705
Q: Allow an edit to notify downvoters: "I think I've fixed the issue now - please check"

Jon SkeetTo me, a downvote usually indicates a problem with an answer. When I downvote it's to mark the answer as having a problem, not the person. If the answer is fixed, I want to remove that downvote - but it's tricky to keep track of all the questions I've looked at over the last few hours. I don't a...

 
12:54 PM
@YvetteColomb This seems like a good idea, but the question would be whether it has any noticeable effect. I think that boils down to the precise question: "Will people that aren't willing to explain their issue in a comment when they downvoted willing to be engaged when the author edits a post?". This feature seems useful only if the answer to that will be 'usually, yes'.
 
user310756
hm I think it's a little different, voting or reversing to vote as compared to being prepared to comment
 
Does anyone know if SE still subscribes to the vision statement?
 
@YvetteColomb It is, but the question is whether that difference is meaningful in practice. But I guess there is no way to find that out other than testing, given that notifications to all downvoters isn't a thing in any kind of form.
 
I hardly ever downvote answers anyway. I only dv them if they are totally and utterly incorrect and will not work and so I have no problem with any notification mechanism on maybe-fixed answers.
 
1:11 PM
Julia Silge on May 30, 2018

Starting today, you can access the public data release for Stack Overflow’s 2018 Developer Survey. Over 100,000 developers from around the world shared their opinions about everything from their favorite technologies to job preferences, and this data is now available for you to analyze yourself. This year, we are partnering with Kaggle to publish and highlight this dataset. This means you can access the data both here on our site and on Kaggle Datasets, and that on Kaggle, you can explore the dataset using Kernels. Kaggle is awarding two $1,000 awards over the next two weeks to authors of top Kernels on the Stack Overflow dataset. …

 
@YvetteColomb only -69 to Jeff decline post, SE probably wait for it to reach -100 before starting to re-think it. ;)
 
user310756
@ShadowWizard huh?
 
@Mgetz what do you mean by that?
It's just some old, (too) happy, blog post. No?
I doubt anyone in SE will call the last 5 years since then a "miracle" though.
Maybe a miracle it still survives...
 
@ShadowWizard It seems like SE is focusing on being all things to all people rather than an singular vision statement. In my experience and in the accumulated wisdom passed down to me that's a great way to fail at all the things.
If I look at SE through the lens of what Jeff originally proposed it's failed miserably
 
1:27 PM
-69
A: Allow an edit to notify downvoters: "I think I've fixed the issue now - please check"

Jeff AtwoodWhile this is a good idea, I think @name comment notifications gets us close enough to this. In other words, if someone leaves a comment about why your post is wrong, you can now reply to them and they'll be notified. http://blog.stackoverflow.com/2010/01/new-improved-comments-with-reply/ I th...

See the score ^
 
user310756
@ShadowWizard gotcha thanks
 
@Mgetz not really "all things to all people", more like it's trying to satisfy everyone, while still keeping high quality somehow.
Each site still has its own focus.
 
@ShadowWizard I don't think that's possible, you can't make everybody happy.
 
@Mgetz true, and that's why this whole... thing... happening these days is ought to fail.
But we can't stop them from trying, only watch.
 
I think that's what I'm trying to express. The whole focus on "Be nice" I think is well intentioned but without a vision statement to frame what that means and how it impacts the site I think it's a waste of resources.
 
1:31 PM
Bringing again my "suggestion" from yesterday, if for example SE will remove downvotes, it will make tons of people happy: all the newbies and people who seek help without being downvoted. But it will also make some people not so happy.
 
Which comes back to the question I asked before: What's the overall goal? Is the goal to be a help site that caters to every asker regardless of question quality? Or is the goal to create a set of high quality answers that are curated over time?
 
@ShadowWizard Newbies won't be happy when the site quality plummets
 
The former seems to be where SE is going, but the latter was the original vision
TBF the latter has no business case
 
@Magisch Tragedy of the commons
 
1:38 PM
@JohnDvorak The idea of a commons in general seems to have disappeared from modern economic theory to a dangerous extent. Without a societal core value of the preservation and conservation of the commons they are doomed to be inequitably exploited
 
@Mgetz We do. What we did was put off some festering problems surrounding what we weren't doing for new users, and some other stuff because we had no choice but to pursue some pretty urgent business goals. The discombobulation you've picked up on is just us getting back to where we left off (now that we achieved those urgent business goals).
 
@Magisch they won't care. They only want answer to their specific question so they can copy and paste it, and leave happily until they need more codez.
 
@ShadowWizard That is a bit like a political party saying "We're going to improve all infrastructure and increase fundings all around, etc.", which most people like. However, most people don't like the fact that it is necessary to increase taxes to do this and people can be fooled if they don't see the connection. Your suggestion is similar, in the sense that 'no downvotes' sounds like a good idea in isolation, but in practice likely leads to a loss in quality control (the ' increase in taxes').
 
@TimPost I'm glad you're aware at least, I think the disconnect needs to be worked out ASAP though. As mentioned above the 'commons' of SE is being rapidly destroyed. You're losing mindshare that feels they are being pushed out due to policy changes; and that will result in fewer users as quality declines.
 
@Mgetz It's our top priority project.
3
 
1:42 PM
@Discretelizard very true
 
hey
Minority rules~
 
@hey huh
Interesting
 
Anything has been said before, sometime, by someone.
Trick is to find it. ;)
 
Oh agreed, I just think FDR said it quite eloquently
 
1:46 PM
@ShadowWizard False, the concatenation of everything that has been said before hasn't been said before ;) Now, if you say that everything that is humanely possible to cram in a few sentences has been said before, I agree.
 
@YvetteColomb so, I looked into this a while back. For even our most active users, it'd be a reasonably small number of notifications... But still potentially enough to be, if not an annoyance, too many to reasonably review on an ongoing basis while still processing other inbox notifications.
Also... We learned from feeding edited questions into review that an awful lot of folks edit without really making substantive fixes.
Fatigue would be something to watch out for.
 
user310756
@Shog9 sure I can accept that.
 
However... The bright side of this observation is that it would be a fairly small list, if it were possible to separate it out from what's pushed into your face via the topbar/email/mobile notifications.
An idea that Robert Cartaino had waaaay back when we were designing review - which, unfortunately, we've never had the resources to implement - was the notion of personal review queues
 
@ShadowWizard It is not an "username problem". The issue I have with Anime.SE is that for a long time while I was considering creating an account the top 1 tag on the site probably was
 
1:52 PM
Essentially, a review queue filled with tasks that only you saw
This would be perfect for stuff like "you downvoted this post and then it was edited"
 
user310756
@Shog9 can we employ free labour from SO that you can integrate :)
 
user310756
yes!
 
user310756
would that be difficult to implement?
 
user310756
also while I have you here, did you get my email?
 
hey
@Derpy relax, it's now... followed with , and then ID requests...!?
 
1:53 PM
But it'd also be a great alternative for stuff like "edits in tags I follow", or "pending close votes on questions I've answered/upvoted/edited" or "new answers to my favorite questions"
@YvetteColomb I did; haven't had a chance to get to email yet this week.
 
user310756
@Shog9 I figured you've been busy
 
between the long weekend and a sick dog, been a lot of distractions for a short week :)
 
@hey HEY you want to know what OP X of Gintama is right⁉
 
@Shog9 I'd like it if you made it opt in
 
user310756
@Shog9 ah I hope you feel as healthy as a horse
 
1:56 PM
One of the frustrations that led to me personally stopping curation efforts is that I have no way to know if OP took my advice
 
hey
@Mgetz all of them are on my ignored tags~ >_>
 
@YvetteColomb unfortunately, this is one of those things that's hard to bolt on, as it requires detailed knowledge of a user's private activities
 
I'd be more motivated to make helpful / guiding comments and explain myself on closures and DVs if I had a way to "check back" on what I worked on outside of keeping a spreadsheet current
 
user310756
@Shog9 ah k
 
user310756
yes that makes sense
 
1:58 PM
...another queue I can ignore....
 
[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Manually reported answer: Hypothesis testing: by Juan Abr Ikna on math.SE
 
@Magisch The DIY way to accomplish this is to just revisit the questions on the votes tab of your profile
 
That's the same with flags and stuff, I'd like to know what happens to stuff I act on so I can follow up! but I agree that it could get distracting on a permanent basis so having it opt in could really help
 
And, honestly, a quick way to improve on the current situation would be to just add a "last modified..." indicator to those lists
 
@Shog9 I would have to write a US to check if they'd been edited though
Yeah please
 
1:59 PM
That would still have the problem of not being very discoverable, of course.
 
@hey yep, and then a mod had to step in to "friendly request" "toning down" the images posted by the Taisho chat bot... or entering a new glacial age.
 
hence my idea with opt in inbox notifications
 
But, it WOULD be relatively cheap to implement vs. an entire new review system
 
or opt out, whatever suits your fancy
 
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