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00:00 - 13:0013:00 - 00:00

12:00 AM
yeah, i'll only leave a comment on an answer if i think it is salvageable. No point in fixing a broken answer if there's another answer that already has it fixed.
or if they're asking for comments, of course. even though it never does any good.
Comments rarely work out for goods most of the time.
Even asking for clarification was flagged once too often with my experience.
So I deny ...
Zen of SE mechanics!
If SE isn't able to build up real ZEN, it's at least not my fault.
It's not about the downvotes IMO BTW. Some more simple explanations and notifications should work out well. But I've already proposed that formerly without any luck or appreciation.
i think to a far lesser extent, downvotes have the same problem that chat flags do.
Tell people, what DV's are all about in 1st place, and don't leave them in limbo state!
@KevinB Similar thing, yes.
people use them for everything from i'm unhappy to this is spam, everything inbetween
The poster deserves a conscious feedback though, whatever was posted.
There's too much guessing and wrong premise left.
12:15 AM
Take a look at most of the recent comments on my SO account
I always was at the side to guide new OPs better with asking questions, and made several proposals for improvement already.
hmm... earlier the arm didn't get lost. i'm confused
@SonictheInclusiveHedgehog Should I really?
Welcome to Stack Overflow! It would be very nice if you could tell us more about the error you're receiving, as well as the LogCat. As this question currently stands, it is subject to being put on hold for lacking a clear problem statement. — gparyani May 4 at 2:39
Welcome to Stack Overflow! Unfortunately, this question as it currently stands will be closed, because it is not an answerable question. If you want to document information for others to see, the proper way to do so is by posting your problem in the "Question" field, then posting the solution as a self-answer. Otherwise, we appreciate your adding to the overall knowledge base that is Stack Overflow! — gparyani May 4 at 2:29
Welcome to Stack Overflow! It would be very nice if you could please quote the specific step you're trying to follow. Questions that lack sufficient context in the post itself tend to be negatively received by the community. — gparyani May 4 at 2:26
For an OP eager for answers in 1st place, that's just a slap into their face. No matter whatnot. It's not what they expected, it's not inclusive, it's not a therapeutical approach as they probably might need to be it.
You're not going to win that game.
No reason to get as weird and snarky, as I used to be in comments though :-P
12:24 AM
@πάνταῥεῖ In response to the second comment of the three above: stackoverflow.com/questions/50164548/…
@YihuiXie Thanks for the positive feedback and support for a newbie. It means a lot coming from you and the SE community. — Caddisfly May 7 at 17:22
Let "lacking a clear problem statement" alone. I've seen users freaking out about such simple things.
i don't like the "Welcome to SO!" bit
that's condescending
Yeah, that sounds like fake and stinks from the head.
I only put it there because it's auto-added by the user script that allows one to put canned comments (so I copied it)
@WELZ Is your avatar related to Adobe Creative Cloud?
Maybe it boils down to: Don't try to sound nice, if you don't actually mean it. That's even more defeating and diminishing any questioner.
12:28 AM
I actually meant to be nice
Could the OP hear it?
No win!
Take the zero game!
@SonictheInclusiveHedgehog It's like the Ai logo.
@WELZ Yeah, same color as Adobe Illustrator...but similar logos with different foreground colors are used by other Adobe Creative Cloud applications
Inclusiveness is completely subjective for the individual meant to be included. If they receive critique in whatever direction, they tend to react froward (and that's good to some extend), and try to boil the critical factuals down to their overall experiences of being not accepted as being part of a minority.
This seriously defeats any factual discussion of the core problems asked for.
Just wanted to tell everyone that I'm on Freenode as Evan Carroll, sorry got suspended last time didn't mean to drop that conversation. Catch me irc.freenode.net/#hlug.
12:40 AM
@KevinB I do something similar for new users so I don't start with where someone is going wrong.
Don't welcome? You're mean. Welcome? You're condescending. There's no way to win
Like "Welcome to malbolge" 9th circle of hell ...
i mean, you can be welcoming without saying "Welcome to stackoverflow!"
Or 8th, dunno ...
@KevinB How would you "welcome" anyone facing them truth? Truth is unwelcoming and not what anyone likes to hear.
Prozac might help :-P
12:45 AM
Cause I've quite literally done that for years with no complaints.
and here's the thing.
Acceptance goes both ways
We cannot help folk who are going to go out of their way to find offence in things
@JourneymanGeek Sure!
I'm in a new place. I need to work out where the toilets are before I start rearranging the furniture.
@JourneymanGeek They'll find it believe me.
I'm probably too blunt in 1st place, maybe.
Hell, I know those patterns. Can someone give me a forgiveness or at least a forgettable potion?
Beer does't work out apparently.
@aprilwensel I'd appreciate your opinions instead of just driving by ,and leaving a mess: https://chat.meta.stackexchange.com/transcript/message/6952734#6952734 #stackexchange
oh, that was you. Never mind ;p
Left fist up!
@JourneymanGeek I am not shy ...
1:12 AM
I'd appreciate to see that person participating here further, beyond just drawing a few lines of chat completely out of context, and really bring evidence of non-inclusiveness in that very place. I'm quite disappointed of their short span of interest or willingness to join serous discussions with peers (be it at twitter or here)!
@πάνταῥεῖ I wouldn't recommend that.
Can't stop you, but...
Why so actually?
I think I know what you mean, but ...
As a kid, I once jabbed a bees nest in a rotten tree hollow, repeatedly, with a stick.
When I read it, it seems kinda... antagonistic.
1:15 AM
@Shog9 I had some similar experience with a wasp nest. Dunno if that was even worse.
I like bees. Me & bees, we get along these days. We respect each others' space, and enjoy the fruits of our respective labors.
But... Last thing you need is a whole swarm of 'em pissed at you.
heh... "weight loss" triggered spam detection.
I'm not a swarm, but I have a stance, and I have no reason to be ashamed of it!
...keep swingin' my hand through a swarm of bees...
And I am an 11ton butterfly:
No inappropriate content so far hopefully!
@Shog9 Swarms needed to be tackled if they're attacking you. Attend their queen to counter strike.
I've got a military education ...
mmm... I just avoid antagonizing swarms.
1:26 AM
It's bad enough when you get stung without even realizing they were there in the first place... like I did on Sunday... Ugh. Haven't been stung by a flying evil thing since I was in 3rd grade.
(Literally talking about a wasp, not anything figurative)
Not that I appreciated that. And yes, you're probably right. I am certainly not not begrudging you for your rare sleeping hours.
@Catija Hornets are even worse.
... I'm not actually sure what it was. Small nest in a crevasse in a sliding door...
Apparently all hornets are wasps but not all wasps are hornets.
It's a personal thing for some extend, yes. But all that foo fighting and grief left here.
I didn't ever thought that I'd leave that much impact.
@Shog9 That's why I like your stance being a CM at Stack Exchange, and why I asked you to keep it upright.
Swarms could be fought by "decapitation" , I am not yet in "fight mode" though.
Let's try to communicate sensibly in first place, instead of calling for arms!
1:43 AM
You'd end up with many bee stings and a large pile of small heads.
You don't deal with a bee swarm with a sword though
You deal with them with smoke, confusion and respecting the fact that they can hurt you.
How about electric swords?
@Catija "without even realizing they were there in the first place..." I'm learning how to use Twitter still.
an electric tennis raquet works better.
@JourneymanGeek Buzzzzzz
@JourneymanGeek Great idea
1:46 AM
@πάνταῥεῖ Twitter is hard.
Anyways, I am about those serious things.
@JohnDvorak that is literally a thing.
@JourneymanGeek you love that L word, don't you?
@JohnDvorak I mean, its not a metaphor.
You can buy a small electrical tennis raquet style fly zapper right now.
although... it can't be used to play tennis, can it?
unless you use insect bodies as the ball
Gives me an idea though
Swatting jello with a tennis racket and recording it in Slow-mo?
I've already played tennis with wasps and beer coasters. Great fun, and the wasps quickly get tired of the thing
both wasps and beer coasters are readily available at summertime water resorts.
Ugh. Morning.
1:54 AM
Yup. :D I love those videos.
(I noticed 1000 unread messages and some new starred messages...)
@JohnDvorak Looks like scientific evidence at least ;)
@Catija Hey! Read the text inbetween the lines!
2:24 AM
@SonictheInclusiveHedgehog yep - on the sites I mod I'm using my name. the rest is generic.
2:44 AM
@user3956566 less confusing I guess.
@JourneymanGeek the only main sites I'm participating on are SO and Pets. still no foal.... but she's doing well
@user3956566 jokes aside about everyone waiting for foal news and fair...
When the little one is good and ready ;)
My ability to participate is currently limited because my power's out...I'm trying to conserve any battery power I have
@SonictheInclusiveHedgehog Still? Ouch.
2:54 AM
I was using a desktop, that went out immediately once the outage struck; thankfully I keep daily backups
Estimated restoration at 12 Midnight
Okay, putting my laptop to sleep again.
3:32 AM
(just finished catching up the 1000 messages convo, I think the gist is... CoC, Chat, Cat, CM ... and Elephant)
there was a cat
11 hours ago, by John Dvorak
... I'm going to the purrgatory for that pun, aren't I?
4:05 AM
@hey special place man SPECIAL place.
4:18 AM
At last, Marshall badge on Anime.SE? Really took a while...
Nice. Those are hard to get the normal way.
@JourneymanGeek Not too hard on heavily-spammed sites for us Charcoallers :p
But that's probably not "the normal way"
Anime.SE: 20 spam, 40 R/A ... 120 comment flags! :D
Probably the next challenge is to get Marshall only from comment flags...
4:31 AM
Spam is the easiest way but took me 4 to 5 years organically
@hey could be possible with a site/strategy
... on Moderator.SE CommunityBuilding.SE
4:47 AM
@hey ask Andy about that one
5:11 AM
@hey isn't that ultra quiet?
6 spam flag so far, no R/A :S
Even spammers gave up...
@JourneymanGeek I got more than 1,500 total helpful flags mostly from flagging non-answers from the homepage
6:04 AM
@Catija Put our frozen food into a friend's freezer for food safety reasons
@Catija My dad got stung by a bee in Canada once
6:21 AM
7 messages moved to Chimney
Ugh. WIshing dupehammers were optional
I'm almost certainly going to get a bunch of flack for the one I just did.
6:37 AM
Yes, bad doggy, doggy is bad ...
You're just mad because dogs sometimes chow flowers
1. There's far too many questions over the TOS changes - they really should be answers on Tim's post so we can actually refer to them in one place
2. The drama is annoying but ugh. Damned if I do, damned if I don't
"in an ideal world,..."
At this current point of time, I think in an ideal world we'd just not all this legal and dramatic BS and stick to the fun world of solving problems of other natures
@JourneymanGeek Tim post's post
6:48 AM
@user5389107 I was trying not to do that ;)
Tim hear you like posts so Tim post posted a post you can post an answer to.
Or worse, Tim Post's Past Post. Which sounds like the prize in an episode of citation needed
Tim Past
Tim Post's past post postmarked at a past post date.
Ok I'll stop now with the awful puns
Tim Pun
6:59 AM
What Hath Dog Wrouth.
And just at the stroke of midnight, the power is back! (cc @Catija)
Isn't it midnight there? I thought not to ping Catija at night during her pregnancy...?
7:20 AM
@hey Yeah, but she seemed interested in what was going on, and she said she doesn't read old transcripts, so I thought I'd let her know that it was back. Also, to be pedantic, it's 2 AM where she lives (the U.S. mainland has four time zones).
@JourneymanGeek Is it a good idea to still restore files from a backup even though everything appears to be normal, after a power outage?
which isn't that much better ;p
@SonictheInclusiveHedgehog I wouldn't bother personally
I do most of my backups to a spare internal hard drive, though I happened to back up to an external drive a couple days ago
I do 3x backup copies...
and I don't bother restoring unless I'm simulating or having an actual drive failure
I'm aware of the U.S. Department of Defense's 3-2-1 rule for backups
7:27 AM
3 total backup copies on at least 2 different types of media, of which at least 1 should be off-site
internal hard drive, external USB drive (in case that dies) external drive (cause it was what I was doing before)
external drive's in a different room but \o/
I can't afford another house for backups ;p
Kinda got burnt too often by stuff I don't control
I might go backblaze in future but nothing I have is that important
@JourneymanGeek 1 off-site copy in case there's a fire at your house
I'd have bigger problems then
7:30 AM
@JourneymanGeek But I'm verifying system files anyway
Windows is actually amazingly robust
I'd worry more about personal files
FWIW, recently, sometimes the question list was cached too hard... at least I have faced this 3 times after approving suggestion edits, and waited until 10 minutes until bumped
8:11 AM
@Catija there's a bunch of fear, and hesitation and you lose every single time you don't try ;)
If someone else gets the job, clearly they were a better candidate ;)
8:28 AM
@SonictheInclusiveHedgehog que?
Cause I literally saw that, and if its about me, no foul. I'l happy to hear what people think of me, or things in general.
Not you, I thought you were the wrong person
Not sure it makes it any better, but whoever it was never saw it. No foul, I guess but do consider what you say?
1 hour later…
9:33 AM
sorry. regret.
too late
why can't the universe be a frozen crystal.
9:52 AM
This chat room has been frozen as cold crystal.
10:13 AM
10:25 AM
@user1114 I guess having strong emotions means you care.
10:40 AM
strong emotions really are a double edged sword
In most environments you must learn to suppress them
@user5389107 they can only be useful to some extent
Use with great care would be my advice and only so often
10:59 AM
have fun
Q: Can we please get an official statement about how the arbitration clause will hold for foreing countries like Europe?

SPArchaeologistDISCLAIMER: the arguments described in this topic have already been referenced in multiple post, yet no official comment on the issue was made that I'm aware of. This post is being made to raise awareness of the problem and to prompt a direct reply from the company. As most reader will probabl...

self parking shoes. Just what we needed ^_^'
11:26 AM
@Derpy do they self sanitize though?
11:53 AM
@Mgetz yes, when the detect that the "bad smell intensity level (©)" is above a certain threshold, they drive to the nearest bathtub / shower / washing machine to get cleaned
Did telkitty really delete her account?
@user5389107 on MSE it seems yes, or staff nuked it
also, Norm (but he was still active on other sites)
A: The Quest for the Winter Chickens of the Bash

user202362You mean those chickens? 😄

^ she posted this one, now there is just an anonymous users instead, so... yep. We lost her.
12:06 PM
But rejoice: we still have plenty of abusive users profiles advertising offensive services and products!
Does RO know if a message is self-deleted or not?
They can see the message history and it is a part of the message history
@hey we totally can
and if someone keeps doing that sorta thing, its not cool
also if you want something PROPERLYISH gone, don't delete it
get edit it, then get a mod to handle the rest
I remember it was used on Chat.SO as an abuse to replace private messaging -_-
Most of the bigger chat rooms have some flavour of out of band messaging I suspect
12:15 PM
well, I don't think that chicken image need to be properlyish gone though...
but thanks for the tips :)
Oh, it was somewhat mean spirited and you should know better
Don't make me break out my "I'm not even angry, only disappointed in you" look.
From one to another, another to one. A mark of one's destiny singled out alone, fulfilled
meh, it's someone's avatar, not mine, but alright
Apparently norm did the account deletion thing before?
12:19 PM
He was known to do that, probably the 3rd time
oh, Yvette also removed her name.
I wonder if there is any bonus scene hidden after the ending credits
@Derpy yeah, she did.
apparently its the thing to do
Ugh. No sleep last night.
Sorry to hear that.
I couldn't go to sleep until I finished my cover letter at 1:30... then woke up at 6:30.
12:27 PM
@JourneymanGeek ?
I can't justify working on that while at work, for some reason ;)
@Catija .... I'm off these few days.
(also, heh, I think I knocked mine out in about 10-15 minutes since I didn't want to overthink it)
I don't think I'm overthinking, it takes me a minute to focus in and settle.
Oh, I overthink a lot ;p
And my mom's all "don't tell dad"
I'm rooting for either of you
I can't really decide tbh
There are 5-6 people I'd root for
12:32 PM
@user5389107 Well, whoever gets it, the community gets a great CM?
I'm already rooted
You're a plant @rene A PLANT.
@rene I legit knew you'd say that
12:33 PM
I like to be predictable
@user5389107 If I don't get it, I have my current, boring job for the next ... 11 months? Then I look again. Pretty much anyone else who has expressed a serious interest seems to be pretty much the sort of person I'd like to see as a CM
Monica's well - she has an excellent track record as a moderator and is pretty active.
I was going to apply but I'm unsure by now
there are enough people I'd myself consider more qualified then me that they could never be hired
Since @Catija's applying - I think IPS is a tough gig for any mod, (even one with another site under her belt) - so its awesome.
Monica, you, art, undo, cat there are a few dozen more on that list
@user5389107 This is the second time I'm applying at SE. The first time was as an IT guy.
You lose every opportunity you don't take.
12:35 PM
Good luck to you
mumble.... those are dandelions, right?
Art, Undo? I think smoke detector is a great example of both collaborative software development and building a community.
I er... donno. Run a site, and get bugged by folk on chat to apply XD
I don't like to judge whether others are applying as a reason to apply or not. The CMs don't always see people the same way you do. I'm probably annoying and wart-covered in their minds... maybe they want someone new and fresh. You never know.
(also, some of our more illustrious CMs probably had less experience with the network than many of us do now, and they did great)
granted, that's cause there wasn't a network then... ;p
12:39 PM
@JourneymanGeek I would never be where I am as a mod without IPS. I'm really grateful for getting thrown in the deep end to learn to swim.
@Catija See from my point of view ... even if I got the job I'd be kind of unhappy with that because stack would lose out on a in my opinion better CM then me
.... all those links are broken
Kind of why I didn't run in the last workplace election too
@user5389107 I lost.... 4 elections before I won SE.
I would have loved to but I wanted a candidate to win so running or applying to vote against yourself would be pointless
12:40 PM
5 if you count the one I didn't stand cause I didn't think I was good enough.
@user5389107 but but
I only wanna give it a shot if I want to do it and believe myself to be a reasonable first choice
You could put him as your first or second or third choice.
There was 1 position available
@user5389107 I literally got a ton of great contacts with folk off each election I lost.
I was gonna vote for lilienthal regardless if I ran or not
12:42 PM
And probably contributed a little to my mod pro-tem-ship
Now I'm not active enough on twp to run in the current election
them's the breaks
You.... you can still back out when/if you get the offer though...?
ehh. Not that nice. And assumes his preferred candidate is no 2
That would just be a intentional waste of time for SE
12:43 PM
@user5389107 And that's a fair component. The question is whether you trust SE to decide that or not. When someone chooses not to apply, they're choosing to restrict the options since it's unlikely that they're going to reach out and chastise anyone for not applying.
hiring is expensive, unless I'd take the job 100% I wouldn't apply
and if you win, immediately backing out is a bit of a slap in the face for the community
@user5389107 literally I have 2 criteria for applying for this job. (usually I have 1)
I also wouldn't run in a mod election unless I wanted to be a mod
" Do I want this job?" and "Will I regret not applying?"
(usually its 1 "I need a job")
I haven't got a great track record with applying
I've literally written 4 applications in my entire life
12:45 PM
oh man
that's a quiet week.
Got 4 offers out of it :D
cause out here most applications go into some kinda black hole
Still no idea why the central bank hired me back then
I walked in there with no suit and sweaty from running because I was almost late
They clearly saw something in you ;p
(unlike my current job)
@Catija I guess that's another way to see it
gonna give it some more thought
12:47 PM
The first time I was really active was when I initially joined M&TV. They started their graduation election and I really wanted to run despite knowing nothing about being a mod... but I knew I needed to learn before I put myself out there. Now, in this situation, a year ago, I probably wouldn't be applying for this opening.
@Catija hah. As a mod, I assume you realised you make it up as you go along learn on the job?
@JourneymanGeek I don't even think I had the association bonus and hadn't discovered MSE.
tbh, you got the hang of it faster than I did
I'm a quick study. I don't like making mistakes.
And I love the system and learning about it.
I don't either that doesn't however mean that I learn quickly necessarily
Just that I get frustrated with myself alot
12:50 PM
Well, in a sense, effective meta is less doing it right or wrong than...
an odd exercise in political influence and social engineering ;p
meta is weird
you can work it and it'll work with you but how exactly is ... hard to explain
I guess a lot of it is about framing
framing is so powerful everywhere
12:52 PM
Well, I kinda focused on moderation related answers since that's something that I can answer and normal folk may not as soon.
I frequently get exactly what I want from bosses that would be completly averse to the ideas normally by framing correctly
Also, I wanted to get 10k so I could read a post about someone who complained about me XDXDXD
Also I picked up a little on policy related posts - I swear monica's better than it than I am, but its a good place to make a difference and pick up votes
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