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6:00 PM
@Hello71 What is fun?
@Diago done.
@devinb Thank you kindly
@PopularDemand: Definition: activities that are enjoyable or amusing; "I do it for the fun of it"; "he is fun to have around"
@Hello71 You know what I meant.
I sometimes wish we could group discussions and then star
They just don't make sense starred by themselves
6:02 PM
@Diago I believe you have just invented Gmail.
Q: Inline Editing for Stack Exchange Sites

jjnguyWe have inline comment editing, inline editing of questions on Area 51, and inline re-tagging. Can we please have inline Question and Answer editing on the StackExchange sites?

@PopularDemand Think I can claim royalties?
@Diago First, get in your time machine.
You have around 40 years to invent it and drive it back here.
Longer if you can get your kids on board with this project.
@PopularDemand I get where this is going :). Luckily I don't have kids :P
Well... you have a few years left for that, too, presumably.
6:05 PM
The current wife certainly hopes so.
As did the ex-wife.
Didn't turn out to well for her thought
@Diago, I edited in "a few weeks" for the disappearing question answer.
@Lance. Looking better. Still going over it in my mind.
@Lance: you were serious?
Should we invite him to chat? Or would that fail worse than the @vgv8 thing?
@Shog9 Yes he was. I thought he was sarcastic
@PopularDemand Tony? Probably vgv8 is back on SF. And trust me. Nothings changed. :(
6:11 PM
Tony just seems to have not great ideas; he's not intentionally disruptive like vgv8 is
Hum... Lance, you did such a good job of making it sound like a horrible idea. I was really hoping that was your intent.
@Shog9 Do you really think most of the computer-rec questions on SU should be around forever?
I hate posting answers to stuff I know is a dupe once I hit the post button
@LanceRoberts bad premise...
@Shog9 +1 I agree. Was going to upvote @LanceRoberts for sarcasm sake
6:12 PM
1) I don't think computer-rec question should be on SU.
2) I don't really care what happens on SU.
I was never intending to say they were similar in behavior.
@Diago Wait, you post answers to known dupes?
@Shog I agree with everything you just said for the following 18 reasons.
Q: What is with people who answer questions that are known to be dupes?

Popular DemandWhen a dupe is posted, someone usually posts a comment to that effect within minutes. That comment usually gets at least a couple of upvotes while the question is still on the front page. If it's a common dupe, you might see three or four such comments show up at once, all upvoted. Even with t...

@PopularDemand who doesn't?
6:17 PM
@Fosco Me.
Why Oh Why do I live in a country with 24hr ADSL line resets?
Dammit @popular, you just cost me 1 reputation.
@devinb I beg your pardon?
@PopularDemand if it's a 'known' dupe, I guess I don't either... but as soon as a question pops up, It's not my job to check if it's a dupe.
Your question has one less vote than it previously did. and I have one less reputation than I previously did.
6:20 PM
I think it's a funny concept, not answering a question you've been asked before.
People are constantly going to be asking the same questions, and I'm not a fan of referring them to the old question all the time.
My best comment of the day: @Tony. That there is at least a question to discuss and not a senseless rant? Like any of the other discussion tagged questions?
May as well redirect all SO questions to Google.
(Yes I can do better. But in my current state of mind that was brilliant)
@Fosco The whole idea, actually, is that Google will one day direct all searchers to us.
Redirecting SO questions to identical SO questions is completely different from redirecting them to Google results
6:22 PM
@Shog, How long do you think this question will be good for?
Q: Recommend a Tablet PC

Dour High ArchI need a tablet PC to run Flash Pro, presentation, and office software. Must have: Good stylus feedback. Keyboard Video port to connect to projector. 2GB RAM or more. SD slot Runs MS Office, Adobe Flash, Illustrator acceptably. Nice to have: Good handwriting recognition. Pressure sensitive....

@MichaelMrozek I know.. I'm exaggerating the point that most questions have already been asked. Nevermind me..
@devinb I still fail to see the connection.
@LanceRoberts A little less than -1 years
I don't have any problem with dupe answering. Not really sure why anyone does.
@LanceRoberts Thanks. That question should have been closed a while ago.
6:23 PM
Is there an incentive to find and mark new questions as dupes?
@LanceRoberts I don't like people asking questions that've already been asked, and answering those questions encourages people to keep asking them
"duplication of efforts, wasted time, dispersion of information..." -perbert
Is there a dis-incentive to users who post dupe questions?
If there's no penalty for a question being closed, and they get answers either way, what motivation do they have to bother searching for their questions before just asking them?
If it's a trivial question they tend to get upvoted, so there's actually motivation to ask dupes
@MichaelMrozek The fact that 1 out of every 3 questions they ask gets closed and they then run to MSO to complain about people closing their questions to quickly?
6:25 PM
I guess there's always the assumption that some people are actually looking for answers, and not just asking questions for the hell of it. It's a bad assumption, based on some mythical, not-utterly-lazy user, but it's built into the system.
@Fosco See here:
Q: Give an incentive for finding duplicate questions

Ian RingroseAt present if you see a question that may be a duplicate and has an easy answer you can post the answers or post a link to the duplicate question. (Or the few hi-rep users can vote to close it as duplicate, think of normal users here, not the people that read Meta) It is better for Stack Overfl...

I could go on SO right now and ask what the difference between foo.bar and foo->bar is, and I bet I'd get upvoted before it got closed
@MichaelMrozek I doubt it... let's test your theory.
@MichaelMrozek Thanks for that suggestion, I need another 1300 rep.
If anything, you should try it as a new user.. you might get the upvote just based on your rep.
6:27 PM
@Fosco Here's one from this month:
Q: How do the "->" and "." member access opperations differ in C

TheTuxedoI have looked at some resourses to tell me how "->' and "." are different but they seem to do the same thing. Does "->" act like a dot opperator into a Struct?

@MarcGravell Welcome. Why does the chat servers always slow down right before you connect :)
I think there should be a negative rep hit for posting a dupe, and a positive rep hit for marking something as a dupe.
@MichaelMrozek that's not marked as a dupe..
define "slow down"? what did I miss?
My dev diagnositcs are showing 0ms server-side...
@Fosco that feature request is a dupe. I can haz rep now?
@balpha +1 !
6:29 PM
@MarcGravell I just had whole bunch of bad request and unable to connect messages. But it could be connectivity on this side.
@Fosco That doesn't mean it isn't, people just didn't bother to mark it
@Diago It's like kids cleaning up a mess when they hear mom coming down the hall.
@MarcGravell there's this horrible wheezing, grinding noise, and everything just stops for a split second, before you fade into view
@Diago I just published, that cause those issues for a few seconds
see, blame @balpha
6:29 PM
@balpha Ah. So I wasn't that drunk yet :)
@Diago don't know about that
@Shog9 I win. It's not me who's upset about dupe posting/answering. @Popular and @MichaelMrozek are the ones who have to wait on feature-requests :)
A: Jquery - How Do I Insert a Character into an input

HappyWhy make your life complex? Just put the dollar sign into the HTML outside of the input element... <span style="border: inset 1px black; padding: 1px;"> $<input style="border: none; padding: 0;"> </span>

Chat is the best thing that could ever have happened to SO. We actually see the features like closing as a dupe in action and tested by the users themselves. Best. Test Bench. Ever.
6:31 PM
4 mins ago, by Fosco
@MichaelMrozek I doubt it... let's test your theory.
@Diago I dunno, this is eerily similar to... social networking.
@balpha: can you just delete that while you're in there?
@Shog9 are you the up-voter?
@Fosco: no
what would that prove?
I figured he was the asker
6:32 PM
@PopularDemand Have you been around long enough to remember @Jeff stating explicitly that there will never be social networking on SO, and now we have what?
I really have been surprised since day one that Jeff would implement something so social network-y, especially wh
@Diago this.
Plus we have the Twitter and Facebook publish of question on SE
@Shog9 Ok I lose that one then, if and only if it wasn't a fake up-vote by someone in on the gag.
@Jeff has been taken over by the social networking mafia. Bail out now before we start sinking :)
@Fosco well, I didn't mention it to anyone here, and it got up-voted within a minute of posting, so...
6:34 PM
@Fosco Actually, hardware-rec.
@Shog9 and 3 helpful answers too... not sure what the problem is. but yeah @MichaelMrozek wins that bet.
@Diago I kinda want to. But I still see some promise in chat being used for constructive purposes.
Is there a feature-request already for wagering reputation points?
@Fosco Well, that's the bigger issue: it got three answers within as many minutes. There are always new users willing to answer questions, even if those questions have been asked many, many times before... So dup-closing, at least for trivial questions, is a losing battle.
@Fosco Bounties? *duck*
6:36 PM
@Diago Why duck? That's what I was thinking.
@PopularDemand Actually I think there is value in chat. As has been proven.
@Diago close but no cigar... that's only making a desired answer more valuable.
@Diago Agreed, but I was thinking specifically of other use cases.
Now I know why I don't go to MSO. We could argue about anything! :)
with regard to duplicate questions, what do you do if you want to ask a question you know is a duplicate but are not happy with the answers it got?
6:39 PM
Is this a stupid question? @
Q: is there anything in javascript that can convert "August" to 8 ?

oooi need to convert Monthname to integer of that month (and want to avoid a big switch statement). any ideas?

why is it tagged jquery?
@balpha jquery can solve anything.
@balpha Because that's what you would have answered perhaps? No? :)
6:41 PM
I have to link this again:
@Fosco yes
@balpha +1 Brilliant
@balpha You must have made that up.
It looks like some of the youtube or yahoo answers posts.
@balpha Argh, doesn't anyone have the original screenshot of that question with the URL visible? I have to go upvote it!
6:44 PM
oh, great edit @balpha - now you've invalidated Nick's answer!
hahah that's hilarious
@PopularDemand I am sure by now it's been removed if it was real
guys, look at the image
jQuery diet huh?... lost 10kg in one week?... I'll have to try that!
it's a joke
the blog post says:
> I thought this image would be An Hilarious Joke-humour for SO users, but once again reality has beaten me with real questions like “How do I round a number to the nearest integer using jQuery?”.
6:45 PM
@Diago See bobince's badges.
+22 for 'use jQuery'... -4 for 'use the + sign'.. how could anyone think that was real? :)
and I'm pretty sure the related question "Where are my legs?" never existed either
It's tagged jQuery because the "August" is coming from a clicking the header of a jQuery UI datepicker widget
@balpha you lie, that question was awesome
There's probably a much eaiser way to get the month number out, though I've never looked
6:47 PM
So there isn't a user called 'fishnipples'?
@PopularDemand My goal until the end of the year is to get a pundit
I will use every means of sarcasm and wit that I can come up with and comment on everything!
@LanceRoberts Potential date perhaps :) ?
@LanceRoberts Confirmed on SO, SF, SU and MSO.
@LanceRoberts Just be careful who you meet online. It could be horrible. Just horrible.
@Diago I've been working on that for a year! Get your own dang goal!
Well at least there are some good names left.
6:49 PM
(Disclaimer. My current wife I met online, however I have had some very bad past experiences)
y'all need to learn from mmyers. He's the pundiest pundit around
@PopularDemand Nothing wrong with some good competition. Two of us, 2x votes on 10 comments. Only 8 more votes to find :)
@Shog9 Lies. He hasn't even got the Pundit badge. (On MSO, anyways.)
I want the pundit, but figure I'm not creative enough to make it happen. I just have to hope that volume will overcome.
@Shog9 The goal is solely on MSO. I don't try for badges anywhere else
6:51 PM
@PopularDemand who cares about MSO? I'm talking SO
SO is the only site that really matters
@Shog9 Actually, he does. Good to know that you don't verify things.
(I actually forgot it was silver, I was looking for a gold dot.)
@Shog9 See another reason not to try on SO. With you around no one else can have their way on SO. SO is not big enough for you and all of us, so we accept that MSO is our only choice :)
@PopularDemand use firefox & just 'search for pundit...
@Shog9 Well, duh, that's why my rep is all on Meta.
@Diago Er, you do realize that the Shogster is second only to @Jeff in Meta rep?
@PopularDemand mine too, embarrassingly
6:54 PM
@diago you have five comments with a score of 10+ on MSO -- stil some way to go
received in an email from someone higher up: "Long story... but <other department> actually prefers if we don't e-mail back thank yous to stuff like this. It's a nice gesture but they've indicated it fills up their inboxes."
@balpha Wow. More then I thought. I am at least halfway there.
@PopularDemand I can remember a time the TheTXI had more rep then Jeff
> [20] Impressive - 6000 rep and using a screen reader. My hat off to you Sir!
> [16] I find it extremely sad that I keep hitting my rep cap on Meta, but can barely get a vote on any of the other sites. I should seriously get a hobby.
> [12] Can I mention your last line totally contradicts your reason for not accepting answers? If you like giving reputation to the correct answer why not do so by accepting it?
My. Best. Comment. Ever.
Meta is easy to get rep on.
6:55 PM
> [10] *waits for the required moderator intervention*
> [10] For completeness. The OP's current acceptance rate on SO is 6%.
@devinb The second one @balpha Posted
@balpha Show off :) Thanks thought
what do you mean, show off? that's public data
@Diago TheTXI also disappeared at around the same time I showed up. Hm... has anyone ever seen him and Chetwood in the same place at the same time?
@balpha True. I must really take some time during my Christmas break to play with the API
> @Michael Petrotta: One of my earlier comments says I don't remember. Trust me.. it has happened. I posted over 200 questions. – Tony_Henrich 9 mins ago
ouch... 200 questions...
7:00 PM
@Shog9 ?
's a lotta questions
Psh. I could eclipse that in no time.
(In this case, windmills are chat replies)
@PopularDemand yeah, but I had thought this guy was new; now I think he's just nuts
@MichaelMrozek Broken image icon on my end.
7:02 PM
@Shog9 I just read that. He contradicts his own over a 100 questions count in the question itself. And also someone actually mentioned he posted 125 questions. He is definitely an expert. Don't let you be fooled by people that have 3K or more rep, he knows more then them all. We are merely pawns in his world
@PopularDemand Well that's disappointing :). I misunderstood what he was doing anyway, I thought he was trying to reply to Michael Petrotta in-chat and ended up pinging me by mistake, but he was just quoting a comment
as so often happens, Aarobot sez it better:
> I hardly think that asking an assload of questions really counts as experience when it comes to understanding how the community and the engine work. Basically, you're bitching that you've had some bad experiences, but refuse to identify any of them so that we can actually help you solve your problem (because the problem obviously can't possibly be you). – Aarobot 54 secs ago
It appears that he only answers his own questoins.
@devinb wow... that's... pathetic...
Sometimes, I wish the "self-accept" feature had never been implemented (the rest of the time i just wonder why it was implemented)
At least it forces you to delay a couple days
7:13 PM
@Shog9 Because sometimes you don't get an answer from another SO user, and you eventually solve the problem yourself, of course.
@Shog9 I have to disagree. I just wish people weren't such.... (can't think of a way to make this polite)
I think it is wildly and very often misused. But it is a good feature.
yeah, but... It doesn't do anything interesting, other than mark the question answered. Why would you want that?
@Shog9 Point.
@Shog. Start a feature request, so I can reply to you and get uber rep
muchos rep?
lots of reps?
I've mentioned before that Accepted Answer is for the OP to indicate what actually solved the issue.
mass EXP
7:20 PM
nah, he'd get EXP from asking 200+ questions, obviously :)
Sometimes, you find the answer on your own and none of the other answers cover it. So you Answer yourself, and accept it.
ah, of course. Go propose like 20 features on MSO, @devinb. Come back when you're properly experienced.
BUT, there are people who, like this guy, pretty much just ignore the other answer for minor inconsistencies, and accept themselve.s
I've only got 5 FRs :(
@devinb Ok, but isn't the act of answering your own question in and of itself indication that this answer has solved the issue?
What does a green checkmark add to that?
Sooooo does that mean you're proposing a Narcissistic badge for > XX self-accepted answers?
@Shog9 pride Shog, pride.
7:23 PM
A green checkmark indicates on the homepage that the question has an answer. So I know when I'm like "Wow, I have the same question" that there exists an answer.
@Shog9 isaccepted:1
This, of course, is presupposing that quality exists on the site, and that people aren't raving lunatics who upvote without checking, and mark things as the answer just to get their acceptance rates up.
the SO equivalent of buying yourself a "#1 Boss" mug?
@devinb that was my first thought; but when you post your working answer, you'd think -- and I know this isn't always true -- that someone would upvote it.
7:24 PM
@Shog9 Yes, I'm also the "world's best dad" according to this mug I stole.
I find that very often a self-accepted answer is much less useful, since it tends to answer the question, but relies on many facts not in the question, making the overall question (as a google resource) much less useful later
@PopularDemand But not necessarily enough people to get it to the top. Glib "use jquery" answers will often get upvoted even if they aren't all that helpful.
@devinb oh, you mean that subtle color indicator behind the big honkin' "## ANSWERS" box?
A: Is "Don't do it" a valid answer?

devinb"Don't do it" is not a useful answer to a question of "How do I do XYZ?", unless it is embedded into a section of your response. I usually break down my "don't do that" responses like this: To answer the question Why you should not do it that way In the past, I was working a personal project...

Dear Sirs: Is there objects for EXP multiplers ing ame? Also I wish to using "hard mode' to get EXPS faster. thank you
7:25 PM
@Shog9 yes
What fraction of SO users do you think actually know what that means?
@PopularDemand There is. Find a duplicate question that hasn't been closed yet, go to the original, take the best answer. Then post it as your own.
@Shog9 lots of percent.
I do that all the time. But the best answer is already mine, so it's not really IP theft.
There should be a "Hardcore" difficulty on Stack Overflow
if you get one down-vote, you loose all reputation
@LasseVKarlsen Check the browser history, if they checked Google or Bing, then the answer doesn't count.
Since many programmers are also gamers, you could add a "Hardcore" mode on the day Diablo ]I[ releases
7:28 PM
@devinb I asked for a fraction, not a percentage! And make it a complex fraction while you're at it!
if you get a down-vote that day, you get zero rep (if you enable hardcore-mode)
Has this chat really slowed down for anyone else today?
@Shog9 33*pi/2 %
@LanceRoberts Well, it has now.
Is the edit button on questions not large enough? I understand duplicates sometimes, if the author's unaware...but the same user posting the same question in under a half hour...
7:36 PM
@NickCraver It is indeed too small, and also located too far away from the "Ask Question" button
Is there a place where we can promote our Area51 proposal? Here? Meta?
Twitter, apparently
The people here and on meta are already fairly involved. So it is likely that they already know and would consider it spam.
The best place to go would be to people that you know, via other communications methods.
Also, twitter.
Thanks. I've tried Twitter. I thought that the idea was decent, but I fear it may have got lost in the huge number of proposals.
@devinb thanks for calling that out separately, so as to avoid folks mistaking it for a communication method
7:42 PM
Unless you're searching specifically for it, I doubt you'd find it.
@Shog9 When I find good ideas, I think it's important that I take credit for them.
so as not to disappoint my fans.
Indeed. See also: my awesome Cheese proposal on A51
I don't like cheese.
How did Cheese stay open and Bikesheds get closed?
There's no justice.
@PopularDemand don't do it!
7:52 PM
@Fosco What is it that I'm not to do?
@PopularDemand nevermind me.. i was just finishing catching up on the 'is dont do it a valid answer' question
@devinb you live in a monastery, don't you. On stale bread and brackish water.
I live in Canada. We have the most fresh water in the world.
@devinb you also have tar sands.
@Fosco Very well: I shall not nevermind you.
7:57 PM
@Fosco the answer is "yes". Man, you could have saved sooo much time...
I was proud of that answer. I was confused when I got downvoted.
But I just chalked it up to "everyone else is the problem. It can't possibly be me"
if only down-votes weren't anonymous
"How best can I explain to everyone around me that their opinions are stupid and they should be ashamed?"
@devinb Migrated to Super User.
To which, ironically, I would want to reply with "Don't Do It!"
@Shog9 Yes! Actually, lets keep them anonymous. But whenever you're downvoted, a panel would pop up that says "You've been downvoted! Retaliate?"
And it then downvotes a random post of that users. Exempt from the vote fraud detectors.
8:05 PM
@devinb Isn't there a GreaseMonkey script for this?
Ask Jonathan Sampson, he's the GM guru.
There's definitely a "who downvoted me" app I saw somewhere.
It does a rep scraping, and tries to determine who lost reputation at the same time you were downvoted.
I hate it when people mark as "accepted" the only answer that agrees with them.
Q: Temporarily disable downvoting for users who have been downvoted

BozhoIt isn't rare when you downvote someone and explain your reasons that he returns a downvote on a totally unrelated question, most likely your latest or highest-scoring. Yes, this is not a big deal (at least until it becomes serial downvoting the target user), but I think something simple can be ...

@devinb Actually that brings up a point I've been meaning to ask about: what do you accept on SE sites where there isn't necessarily a provably right answer?
@Popular, assuming that it is not a subjective question.
Then you should basically go with the advice which is the most useful to you.
If they say "I agree with everything you just said" that isn't generally useful. It just feels good.
But I don't care how you feel.
@devinb I thought you wanted me to be ashamed of my stupid opinions.
@Popular I rarely want people to be ashamed of their opinions. Except the people who want the ability to ignore users.
@Popular I want you to discard your stupid opinions :p
8:14 PM
15 mins ago, by devinb
"How best can I explain to everyone around me that their opinions are stupid and they should be ashamed?"
@Popular they should be ashamed of themselves for having such tainted logic so as to cause them to believe such non-sense.
8:52 PM
has anyone received commitment back from finances proposal?
Dang it! Where's my package of tasty, tasty cigars.
anyone know of a good oracle -> visio schema/reverse engineer app?
oh nm it does work with Oracle 11 natively, driver issue
9:10 PM
So this Starbucks Via coffee ain't half-bad...for instant.
9:31 PM
Hey guys, what happens if somebody with a cookie account on SO retags 8k questions from c# to c-sharp?
retagged eight thousand questions?
@badp - an IP ban, I'd imagine
That would take a LOT of time.
Unless... grease monkey.
and we lose everything during the period it takes for people to notice?
9:33 PM
would still take a lot of time, that's a lot of requests and 10 requests in under so many seconds gets a temp ban from IIS
Well... what are we losing?
which user?
well for your example specifically c-sharp is a synonym for c#, so that can't happen :)
Thank you, somebody is using this argument to explain why we should use the first-person-shooter tag instead of fps
(the bad part is, we at gaming are actually using first-person-shooter instead of fps)
their argument is that someone may crack the system and batch rename thousands of questions?
that seems a bit....fringe
Just a teeny little bit.
Oh well.
9:46 PM
fps can mean frames-per-second in regards to shooters as well
not a good acronym if you ask me
indeed, we use the framerate tag for that
somehow the fps community never had trouble when discussing about fps
the wonders of context :P
10:07 PM
I think I'm off to bed, but I leave you with this gem:
g'night @LasseVKarlsen
10:35 PM
I'm fairly confused by this:
Q: Code won't run.

Noah RobertsI have some C++ code. It won't run. Yelling at it isn't working.

I guess it's a joke of some kind, but it's either fairly unfunny or references something I'm unfamiliar with
10:49 PM
it's pretty funny
but it's no, "how can I attract female programmers"
Why can't contact management be an easy thing?
11:21 PM
@rchern you mean, why is it hard to get in touch with management? Or why is it hard to manage contacts?
the latter
ah... I didn't realize it was
like, getting everything organized and fully filled into google contacts and having that on my phone and maybe even syncing with facebook contacts and arggggghhhhhhhhhhhhh
and having contacts grouped together and etc
my pre does that automatically. I didn't really have to do anything beyond enter credentials for the various accounts.
my main thing is entering the data. i somehow never really had contacts managed online...at all...so i'm trying to remedy that particularly in google contacts
and it's just a pain.
11:24 PM
I think I did some sort of CSV import
this could easily be solved by having less contacts.
kicks some people out of her life >_>
been a while, hard to recall... But I'm pretty sure I didn't type each one into a form
i'm also annoyed that i can't have contact groups on my iphone
yeah, that would suck
i'm in an annoyed mood right now!
11:27 PM
I have a couple of contacts with maybe 5-6 different accounts
(work, private, facebook, chat, GV alias...)
that would get messy if they weren't grouped
basically i just wish i could wiggle my ears and it'd all be done :D
you should switch to Android then - I hear ear input is going in the next beta
i don't want to have to say it all either (;
hmm. woah. the contacts page looks very different than the last time i looked
11:46 PM
Interesting, I was automatically logged into money.se when clicking a link from the feed in Basically Money chat room. New feature?
cool, that's rather useful
Though, it is worrisome at first. :)
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