Tavern on the Meta

Stormblessed

00:05

@Mithrandir24601 what’s the image in your profile picture of?

Journeyman Geek

01:18

That was fun.

I ended up tearing apart my (old) PC to get access to a wifi module that turned out to be 'standard' mini PCIe in a adaptor, then put it back. Then had to remove and downclock my ram cause apparently strange things happen when you unplug an old machine made up of random parts

Rob

03:05

Sometimes you just need to set it out to pasture and buy a new computer.

Journeyman Geek

03:32

@Rob eh, its not that old

6-7 years?

Rob

04:15

Mine's about that old, and all silver (instead of the weird white panels). Fortunately I spent a lot on my phone so it's really speedy. I plan on getting the newest everything next year so it'll be a decent upgrade.

Journeyman Geek

05:33

Mine's all black

actually pretty close to one of the old SE dev rig setups (actually my current one is a varient on what they built, with a few corners cut)

Journeyman Geek

06:23

→ 47 messages moved to Chimney

JAD

07:01

Happy hour?

Tinkeringbell

08:11

Monday morning!

Rob

08:36

@JourneymanGeek This is all black too. A cool case, for a computer fan.

Tinkeringbell

XD That reminds me... mine still needs a new fan.

JAD

@Rob does it fly?

Rob

The redundancy is a safety feature, in the event of failure.

Tinkeringbell

It's going to gather massive amounts of dust, that's what it does...

JAD

@Tinkeringbell not if all fans are pointed outwards :P

Tinkeringbell

08:42

@JAD Are they? I can only see two sides on the pictures :P

JAD

Not saying they are here, but they could be :P

Shadow The Princess Wizard

09:05

@Rob super computer??

@Tinkeringbell I'm a fan of yours! :D

Rob

@JAD No, but it makes you look sexy.

Tinkeringbell

@ShadowThePrincessWizard I'm sure my PC appreciates that... but it still needs a new fan ;)

Shadow The Princess Wizard

@Tinkeringbell I can make wind

Rob

Tinkeringbell

@ShadowThePrincessWizard You didn't like fart jokes... :/

@Rob And who is going to brush that?

Rob

09:11

I would.

Tinkeringbell

XD

Rob

I prefer to buzz cut.

Tinkeringbell

buzz cut is a bit short...

But I'm thinking of getting a pixie cut again, as the amount of brushing I have to do these days is ... taking too much time.

Hitodama

@bobobobo including some very specific references to various anime and games characters

Shadow The Princess Wizard

@Tinkeringbell hey! Not that wind! I mean with my hands, actual wind. :P

Tinkeringbell

09:14

@ShadowThePrincessWizard Yeah, right.

Mithrandir24601

@Stormblessed It's a photo I took a few years ago of some bird chicks :) No animals were harmed in the making of this photo and it was done under supervision of an expert :P

Shadow The Princess Wizard

@Tinkeringbell I how can I prove this? :D

Hitodama

@bobobobo for example:

> Dovah used to be a happy adventurer, but then he got married.

Shadow The Princess Wizard

lol

Hitodama

or this.

> No villain, no matter how long their mustache is, can ever catch Dash. All they see is a blue streak speeding by.

so, in a single character you have Sonic, a reference to Robotnick/Eggman, a smaller cat with two Tails....

and they called him "Dash" - with Rainbow Dash basically being a MLP Sonic reference herself in a way.

you also have multiple other cats with GoT references, Back to the Future ones, Full Metal Alchemist and so

JAD

09:29

hmm look at that

We've moved to W10 finally

Tinkeringbell

@ShadowThePrincessWizard I recommend not even trying ;)

Shadow The Princess Wizard

@Tinkeringbell turning off phone camera before making a vid

:P

Rob

09:46

The lobsided look.

Tinkeringbell

Ehh, that's not really my thing :P

djsmiley2k - CoW

@Rob isn't it "Lopsided"

Rob

Like chocolate milkshakes? - There's the someone chucked a milkshake on my head look.

@djsmiley2k-CoW Yeah, she's evenly proportioned.

Tinkeringbell

I'm getting the impression you don't like pixie cuts?

Hitodama

10:38

And for the monthly "let's hate someone else for a change" event....

I officially hate Amazon search feature.

Tinkeringbell

'someone'? Since when did the Amazon search feature gain personhood?

Hitodama

Juridical person

A juridical person is a non-human legal entity, in other words any organization that is not a single natural person but is authorized by law with duties and rights and is recognized as a legal person and as having a distinct identity. This includes any incorporated organizations including corporations, government agencies, and NGOs. Also known as artificial person, juridical entity, juridic person, juristic person, or legal person.The rights and responsibilities of a juridical person are distinct from those of the natural persons constituting it. == Popular culture == In Haruki Murakami's novel...

Stop Harming Monica

@Rob the Skrillex

Tinkeringbell

@Hitodama oof... I guess my classes on personhood skipped corporate personhood ;)

But I don't have time for browsing wikipedia right now :P

Hitodama

10:55

@Tinkeringbell just wait till I we start posting question about (Juridical) persons relationships on IPS

Rob

@Tinkeringbell It's really the hair dye (and tattoos) that I object to, over the pixie cut.

Tinkeringbell

@Hitodama Oh, no worries... We already have one of those users, it's the reason our help center says we're not there to settle disputes and make your arguments for you...

@Rob I don't think I'll ever dye my hair again. I did some highlights once, and it really damaged my hair. I'm still dealing with split ends and dry hair....

Rob

You'll like this. Search for "Tinkerbell haircut" - all short haircuts, and everyone is pretty.

Hitodama

@Rob we have been trying to get her to switch to a cute fairy avatar instead of a (fat) parrot for a while, she doesn't listen ;_;

Stop Harming Monica

don't avatar-shame

Rob

11:05

It one of the variations of the "bird sit and sleep" image: dreamstime.com/…

Shadow The Princess Wizard

11:27

@Hitodama they have search??

Any search engine which is not Google is doomed before it's even started.

Hitodama

@ShadowThePrincessWizard Something not quite completely unlike search

Shadow The Princess Wizard

@Hitodama wait... you mean their internal product search? Or do they have actual search engine?

The later is ought to fail because, well, nothing can ever beat Google.

Tinkeringbell

@Hitodama I'm fat, the avatar is fat... all is well in the world ;)

@Rob Oh, nice! But also way more blonde than I am :P

Shadow The Princess Wizard

@Tinkeringbell having some fat in the body makes one human, not "fat". ;)

Tinkeringbell

@ShadowThePrincessWizard Okay, then I'm morbidly obese, and the parrot is morbidly obese... all is well in the world ;)

Shadow The Princess Wizard

11:43

lol

"I weight 12.35215% above the average weight of female human beings" is even better! (Just random number for some random unknown person! ;))

Tinkeringbell

"I'm in the top 1 percent of this country's heaviest people" :P

Hitodama

@ShadowThePrincessWizard the product search. I understand that one should not use queries that are too generic but it is still funny when (not real example) "Legend" gives you some results that do not include Zelda when "Legend Zelda" do.

Shadow The Princess Wizard

@Hitodama sounds like SE search

@Tinkeringbell Weight League!

Tinkeringbell

I win ;)

Hitodama

@ShadowThePrincessWizard Sometime a less specific search do not include results that a more specific one would.

It is not Youtube level of bad but still bad

Stop Harming Monica

11:51

Term weighting fun

Shadow The Princess Wizard

@Hitodama well guess they just return Top X results

Why not site:amazon.com [search term] on Google?

Hitodama

@ShadowThePrincessWizard let me try - for fun

@ShadowThePrincessWizard oh, tried, now here is why: Because I would have to click on every single link to see the price

Shadow The Princess Wizard

@Hitodama hmm... true

@Hit what about API?

DIY

@JNat cross site spammer for you. Warning: spam might be NSFW.

Thanks!

Tinkeringbell

12:09

Oh... I already did the MSE one on that one.

Hitodama

@ShadowThePrincessWizard do I really want to assume that the api wouldn't return the same exact results the web ui does?

Shadow The Princess Wizard

12:42

@Hitodama dunno, but you can control the search results this way...

Hitodama

12:54

@ShadowThePrincessWizard on an unrelated notice, I am currently stuck trying to solve a problem related to SharePoint search when dates are involved

Shadow The Princess Wizard

@Hitodama dates are the nemesis of any programmer

Hitodama

@ShadowThePrincessWizard SharePoint is.

M.A.R.

And the dates in Sharepoint?

Shadow The Princess Wizard

Nemesis of Nemesis hence a friend.

M.A.R.

OK, the issues doubled. Who's Nemesis and whose nemesis is Nemesis?

Shadow The Princess Wizard

13:11

@M.A.R. Nemesisis of course

djsmiley2k - CoW

Nemisi?

Nemisisi ?

Journeyman Geek

Nemesis ^2

djsmiley2k - CoW

Nemisis Part Deux.

Shadow The Princess Wizard

13:29

Nemi

djsmiley2k - CoW

well done nukers.

Raedwald

@ShadowThePrincessWizard Dates (and times of day) are a problem only to those who do not know how to cut that Gordion Knot.

Shadow The Princess Wizard

I see Jon

Rubiksmoose

13:51

So, I guess I'm still figuring out the deleting culture here, so can someone explain/guess why this question got deleted?

I'm just trying to learn a bit more so I can avoid putting work into something that later just gets removed.

Glorfindel

@Rubiksmoose wild guess: the user posted that question in order to gain enough reputation to chat? Or at least that was the interpretation by the users who voted to delete?

Shadow The Princess Wizard

@Rubiksmoose it's a dupe, and got answers elsewhere.

djsmiley2k - CoW

So why delete as opposed to marking as dupe?

Shadow The Princess Wizard

If you want to answer a dupe, post the answer in the source question, if not already posted there.

@djsmiley2k-CoW no added value, and as @Glorfindel mentioned, appeared to be "rep hunting".

(didn't check that route myself)

djsmiley2k - CoW

doesn't closing as dupe stop you getting rep from it?

Rubiksmoose

13:53

@ShadowThePrincessWizard Except the user wanted to chat on Islam.SE not MSE. They weren't rep hunting.

Shadow The Princess Wizard

@djsmiley2k-CoW nope

djsmiley2k - CoW

well that's a dumb bug....

Journeyman Geek

eh, I'm not not really sure the deletion was necessary

Shadow The Princess Wizard

You get rep from closed questions, only locking prevents further votes.

@djsmiley2k-CoW err... no?

djsmiley2k - CoW

Post a question that's already answered -> get rep anyway

yes. dumb.

:D

Rubiksmoose

13:54

@ShadowThePrincessWizard We leave dupes specifically to stand as signposts as indicated by Roomba behavior right?

Shadow The Princess Wizard

Feel free to start a feature request so that closed questions won't give rep, but expect tons of downvotes. ;)

djsmiley2k - CoW

Reward for searcing for dupes? nope

Shadow The Princess Wizard

@djsmiley2k-CoW when done on purpose, it usually attracts more downvotes and negative score, Meta users aren't dumb. ;)

Journeyman Geek

though, I trust rene... hmm

Shadow The Princess Wizard

@Rubiksmoose only when they're of good quality, that one just appears to be bad quality.

So in a nutshell: don't post an answer to a badly asked dupe. :)

djsmiley2k - CoW

13:56

@ShadowThePrincessWizard doesn't only happen on repper.

Rubiksmoose

I also disagree that it was an actual dupe though...

djsmiley2k - CoW

@ShadowThePrincessWizard lol

Rubiksmoose

It was an MSE dupe, which is to say vaguely related, but the actual problem was different.

djsmiley2k - CoW

but... closing -> you get nothing

answering -> you might get rep

no wonder the site's a mess xD

It rewards bad behaviours

Shadow The Princess Wizard

@djsmiley2k-CoW but it's not, as far as dupes go it's well organized.

djsmiley2k - CoW

13:57

@ShadowThePrincessWizard talkin about SE as a whole

@ShadowThePrincessWizard and the user who asked?

Is still wondering the answer to their question

Shadow The Princess Wizard

@djsmiley2k-CoW the mess is with behavior, not content.

@djsmiley2k-CoW what about the user?

djsmiley2k - CoW

@ShadowThePrincessWizard their question is deleted and now they're wondering wtf to do?

Rubiksmoose

@JourneymanGeek It certainly didn't seem that way. And I haven't heard any compelling reason here yet.

Shadow The Princess Wizard

You can't chat with less than 20 rep, unless given explicit write access by a mod.

Journeyman Geek

Well more - what's the benefit of the deletion?

Shadow The Princess Wizard

13:59

@djsmiley2k-CoW read the dupe?

djsmiley2k - CoW

I can't?

Journeyman Geek

We're really proactive for off topic stuff

djsmiley2k - CoW

because the question was deleted

and I'm not 20k.

THANK YOU FOR PROVING MY POINT.

Journeyman Geek

10k

Shadow The Princess Wizard

@djsmiley2k-CoW OP always see their own question, even when it's deleted.

Rubiksmoose

14:00

@ShadowThePrincessWizard Correct, but their issue was trying to bypass the Q&A system using chat. It wasn't actually about chat reputation. That was the more important point.

djsmiley2k - CoW

If it was marked as dupe, I'd be able to read it

@ShadowThePrincessWizard what does it say?

sigh

/me gives up

Journeyman Geek

undeleted and left closed.

Shadow The Princess Wizard

@JourneymanGeek hey! I'll tell @rene :P

Rubiksmoose

@djsmiley2k-CoW It was closed as a dupe before being deleted FWIW.

Journeyman Geek

Folks can yell at me if necessary

Shadow The Princess Wizard

14:01

You don't want the flower to yell.

djsmiley2k - CoW

@Rubiksmoose well that's at least more helpful.

@JourneymanGeek AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

These mixed up mp3s are driving me insane

Journeyman Geek

... driving?

Shadow The Princess Wizard

I only vote to delete obvious crap or trolling questions, didn't check that specific question though.

djsmiley2k - CoW

:D

s/driving me//g

Rubiksmoose

FWIW, I'm not concerned about my rep here, I'm actually just trying to figure this out. I almost repcapped that day without that question so I stand to gain about 6 rep lol.

Shadow The Princess Wizard

14:03

@Rubiksmoose no rules set in stone

Journeyman Geek

It shouldn't be about rep

Shadow The Princess Wizard

Each 20k user is free to decide how to cast their delete votes.

Journeyman Geek

and I kinda disagree with a few things with chat regulars ;p

Rubiksmoose

Yeah I answer to help people.

Shadow The Princess Wizard

So if 3 such users vote to delete a closed question, it's deleted.

Journeyman Geek

14:04

yup

Rubiksmoose

@ShadowThePrincessWizard Of course they are. I'm not sure how that is relevant. I agree completely with the right of the people to vote. I'm trying to understand why it was voted that way.

mag

@JourneymanGeek putting it mildly intensifies

Shadow The Princess Wizard

Anyway, you can still see the question even if it's deleted when you posted an answer to the question, even with less than 10k rep, so you can flag the question and ask for undelete. @Rub :)

@Rubiksmoose almost same as downvotes: we can't really know. ;)

Rubiksmoose

@ShadowThePrincessWizard Oh I know. That's how I knew it was deleted and who deleted it ;)

mag

@Rubiksmoose you can always see your own deleted questions and deleted questions which you have answered

Rubiksmoose

14:09

but getting it undeleted was also not my goal (though I think it is better now that it is undeleted), it was about trying to understand why. Which, I realise is not always possible I promise you.

@mag Yup. I'm aware.

mag

think I had a brainfart there, I misread what shadow said

Rubiksmoose

NP :)

@ShadowThePrincessWizard FWIW that is what I'd expect to see and how I VtD as well. The fact that this one seemed to fit into neither category was what was confusing.

Journeyman Geek

@Rubiksmoose so, people complain, they can explain themselves, Problem solved ;p

Rubiksmoose

Yup :)

Tinkeringbell

Only when people complain nicely though :P

mag

14:26

@Tinkeringbell so you're complaining about people complaining?

can people complain about that or would that be too much complaining?

Tinkeringbell

Meta-complaining ;)

mag

I got nothing today that was my best pun of the day

Tinkeringbell

I'm not complaining. I'm encouraging better behavior ;)

@mag Aww... What's wrong?

mag

bad mood bad new week bad weather and work is crap today

time for the all negative shuffle

Tinkeringbell

Ooof...

Monday, bloody Monday? :P

mag

14:33

there is a thick fog over the town you can barely see 25m and it's not clearing up

Tinkeringbell

Does a cute No Drama Llama help a bit? It has cheerful colours...

mag

monday being monday I have to go shopping after work, which will be treacherous with the fog so it'll take a lot longer

Tinkeringbell

@mag You don't like that? I actually kinda like the stillness that seems to come with foggy/snowy weather.

@mag Oh, yeah, travelling isn't such fun in those conditions.

Rubiksmoose

@mag :(

curious

14:50

@Tinkeringbell That llama is the cutest thing

Tinkeringbell

@curious Thank you! :) It was supposed to cheer mag up a little though, didn't seem to work ;)

curious

How about a cuddly cactus

mag

@Tinkeringbell already almost got run over this morning by a **** in a silver bmw that didn't think 25m visibility fog would warrant turning on his lights or slowing down below 50 km/h as he drove across the main street in town

set the mood for the whole day

Tinkeringbell

@curious Awww! That one is really neat too!

@mag May he forever step in puddles and have wet socks.

curious

@mag Ugh.

PM 2Ring

14:55

@djsmiley2k-CoW Sure, dupe questions shouldn't get rewarded, but the OP shouldn't be punished either, unless it's obvious that it's likely to be a dupe. And even then it might be hard to find the original question(s) if you don't know the correct search terms, or the dupes that the system offers when you try to post a dupe don't seem like a good match.

The problem with dupes isn't the dupe questions, it's the dupe answers. It's not just the issue of fragmenting the knowledge, it also reduces the effectiveness of the voting process. All the answers should be in a single pool so they all compete with each other for votes. Having multiple pools makes it a lot harder for future readers to know which answers are the best. Some more of my thoughts on dupes: meta.stackoverflow.com/a/322110/4014959 — PM 2Ring Nov 2 at 23:41

Hitodama

give out a bonus %rep for replies on a question for each dupe the question has.

And then watch the fights when users start a dupe war

PM 2Ring

Yeah. You don't want to encourage people to link to dupes that aren't good matches. There's enough of that already.

Raedwald

@PM2Ring "but the OP shouldn't be punished either" punishment can be meted out when necessary with downvotes for "not useful" duplicates (for yet-another zero effort debug my NullPointerException questions, for example)

Hitodama

@PM2Ring To be fair, I was more thinking about people arguing on which post is the dupe and which one is the "original".

PM 2Ring

Also, we want to encourage dupe hunting. It's not just about rewarding the answerers of the dupe target.

Hitodama

15:03

@PM2Ring oh, if you answered you would be looking for more dupes to close since any one that get closed would get you more bonus rep.

Raedwald

+1 rep for voting to close as a duplicate after the asker confirms that the duplicate fixed their problem?

PM 2Ring

@Raedwald Agreed. The OP does need to show some effort. But we can't expect them to be experts at finding dupes. It's hard enough for the site experts.

I've downvoted and delvoted plenty of useless dupes. I just object to thinking that all dupes must be bad simply because they get closed.

2

@Raedwald Perhaps, or even +2, like low rep editors get. OTOH, the OP is often the least qualified contributor to a page, so it may not be a good idea to trust their judgement on the appropriateness of dupe targets. ;)

Rubiksmoose

@PM2Ring Yeah I've seen OP agree to close their question as a dupe of something that was very much not a dupe before.

PM 2Ring

One suggestion is to allow people to vote on dupe suggestions, which we kind of already have in the form of upvotes on the "Possible duplicate of" auto-comments.

Rubiksmoose

On my site, I generally upvote questions that are dupes if I would have upvoted them if they weren't.

I am Monica

15:17

To be fair, it's tough to find duplicates if you actually search the system. Search is... not great.

Rubiksmoose

For sure. It can be very tough. And sometimes people put a lot of effort into a question that ends up being a dupe.

I am Monica

... or a lot of effort into an answer.

Rubiksmoose

And then there's that fact that it isn't always obvious when something is actually a dupe.

mag

@Raedwald I'm firmly against tying moderation actions to rep

I am Monica

@mag you mean like downvote penalties? ;)

mag

15:19

if you take one look at the depths of depravity people stoop to in service of otherwise useless badges for review queues, you'll see why I think that

Raedwald

8081781: So remove the +2 rep for editing?

Rubiksmoose

Yeah, on every site I'm active on I think, if anything, dupe-closing is over-applied already.

PM 2Ring

As the sites accumulate more & more questions, it gets harder to write a good new question that isn't a dupe, but it also gets harder to find good dupe targets. This problem is obviously going to get worse in the future. I don't know how SE Inc intend to handle it, but perhaps powerful machine learning can make dupe hunting easier.

mag

That works because it isn't an efficient way to farm rep, has a low hard cap, takes rather long and isn't reliable

if you get +2 for a dupe close vote you bet people will find the first 40 questions they see every day to close as vaguely relevant dupe

Hitodama

@mag stare long enough at the abyss of the review queue and the queue will look back at you.

mag

15:20

the smarter ones will search for Qs with T-1 dupe votes already and just rubberstamp, to avoid sanctions

djsmiley2k - CoW

then remove their dupe privildges.

Raedwald

"perhaps powerful machine learning"... I think that warrants a "now you have two problems"

djsmiley2k - CoW

hah i got star'd

Rubiksmoose

I just really don't think people need more incentive to close a question as a dupe. It seems to happen at least often enough on the sites I'm active on. I'm not sure if it is a problem on other sites. It's definitely not an issue on MSE.

mag

a negative incentive would work

PM 2Ring

15:22

@IamMonica I rarely bother using the built-in search. I mostly do a site: search using Google. In The SO Python room we maintain a collection of dupe targets, but it's not that large, and although it does have a search facility it's pretty basic.

mag

if a Q is closed as a dupe its answers are permanently converted to community wiki

Rubiksmoose

@mag one issue would be that it would have to be reversed if it was later found not to be a dupe (it happens a decent amount on RPG which it isn't always clear).

mag

nah, reopening would fix that

Rubiksmoose

I'm not sure that would inspire people to move their answers over to the dup or not though.

mag

reputation isn't such a central incentive that it needs to 1:1 align with answers

I am Monica

15:25

@PM2Ring exactly... but we can't expect the casual user to ignore the search input in the site header. "That's just for show. Use google!"

PM 2Ring

@Rubiksmoose It depends on the site, and the tag(s). A month or so ago, one of our Python roo regulars, who is admittedly on a bit of a crusade to clean up dupes, found around 1000 dupes to a fairly common Pandas question. Most of those weren't closed, and there were a lot of low quality answers.

mag

mind you, I'm talking off the cuff here. Whatever is actually done would need to be tested and analyzed by a data scientist to find out if you're not just shooting the foot with it

spitballing is fun but none of us have done the legwork to make a qualified suggestion

Rubiksmoose

oh for sure.

@PM2Ring I'll bet. And often even when the answers are high quality they are not rarely already covered by an answer on the dupe target.

Raedwald

@Rubiksmoose Zombie reviewers seeking badges is possible because all they need to do is click on "Looks OK". Trying to farm rep for a +1 rep is is harder when you have to 1) find a duplicate target and 2) get other voters to agree with you.

Journeyman Geek

@Raedwald until they fail a review audit. Funny story that.....

PM 2Ring

15:33

@IamMonica True, and it can be good for tag-specific searches, presuming you know the right tags to search. A big problem with using Google for dupe hunting (& I assume other search engines) is that it gives very high priority to the question, especially the title. Trying to find a good answer you've seen before by keywords in the answer (but not in the question) is almost impossible.

curious

@JourneymanGeek Review audits are not on all the sites though, no?

I thought they were only on SO

Rubiksmoose

@Raedwald Yup though we have audits for that ;)

curious

In my little corner of the world, we have to look at the review queue every once in a while to make sure it's not just about badge hunting

Rubiksmoose

@curious oh, that I'm not sure of. I've never encountered one at least on my site that I know of.

@Raedwald But to your core point, my issue is not that people might abuse it for more rep, it's that people don't, in my experience, need more incentive to close things as a dupe. They already do it for free!

Raedwald

@Rubiksmoose I think they need an incentive to close-as-duplicate rather than post an answer to something that is yet-another-duplicate. Some people close-as-duplicate; I think not enough do.

Rubiksmoose

15:42

@Raedwald The thing is, there's nothing stopping someone from doing both even in a case where someone gets rep for VtCing something.

I've actually answered questions that I later voted were dupes before.

Raedwald

@Rubiksmoose Rep hunting economics would disuade posters from answering and closing-as-duplciate, if the rep rewards were tuned.

Rubiksmoose

@Raedwald Possibly. I'm still not sure I see the issue I guess, but, again, that could be a site specific thing.

We have a handful of very active gold-badge holders on RPG so dupes generally get closed very quickly unless it is unclear.

It's probably pretty different on SO where there are lots of different tags and tons of questions and not enough people to close all of them at any given time.

Raedwald

@Rubiksmoose HeroQuest, a homebrew rules-lite system. Others in the past

Rubiksmoose

@Raedwald oo! What do you play?

Also feel free to check us out ;) We have a very active chat room as well if you ever feel like shooting the breeze even if unrelated to RPGs.

[shameless plug]

@Raedwald Very cool. I've never played HQ before, but the system is a classic.

(assuming you're using some homebrew variant of it.)

Raedwald

What we play depends on who is refereeing. When we play HQ, we play it straight.

(My preferred system is Fate)

Rubiksmoose

15:58

I've always wanted to play Fate, but never quite gotten a game going.

rene

@JourneymanGeek Okay, will do later.

PM 2Ring

16:13

@Rubiksmoose There's definitely not enough dupe closing on Physics, and plenty of high rep users don't even realise that they ought to look for dupe targets. There's a chat room, but it isn't used for coordinating dupe work, or close votes. And not many gold badge holders on the site. And even those gold badgers are fairly restricted. Eg, one guy has gold in general relativity, but not in special relativity.

Stevoisiak

Reminder in relation to a recent post: URL shorteners have been banned on SE since 2010.

PM 2Ring

One of the Physics mods is very prolific at finding dupe targets, but he just posts them in comments. He never dupe-hammers until at least one regular member casts a close as dupe vote.

Rubiksmoose

@PM2Ring That makes a lot of sense.

In that case, I can see how an incentive might help that kind of situation.

Stormblessed

-16

Q: Stack Exchange’s date system won’t work in 89 years

I was looking at an old post, and noticed how we display dates from a certain amount of time ago: This is very non-futureproof design. How will people living in the melted remains of society in 89 years know the difference in age between a question from 2009 and a question from 2109? This is ...

Somehow it got undeleted XD

PM 2Ring

On SO, it's not hard to get a language tag gold badge by the time your rep is around 10k to 15k. On Physics, it's more like 50k+.

Rubiksmoose

16:35

@Stormblessed lol

@PM2Ring oh wow.

Hitodama

@Rubiksmoose wrong room :P

Rubiksmoose

@Hitodama lol

Hitodama

Oh, and btw, if someone think to know Demon's Soul lore... have a look here

not that I really hope someone could actually answer

but you know, I love to collect tumbleweed badges

djsmiley2k - CoW

nice question

rockwalrus-stop harming Monica

16:54

@ShadowThePrincessWizard Amazon had a search engine. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A9.com#A9.com_search_portal

Feeds

17:07

Introducing “The Loop”: A Foundation in Listening

Sara Chipps and Juan Garza on November 25, 2019

TLDR; We’re going to be sharing our product development process with you, from feedback loops to timelines. We’ll be doing so through our new series – The Loop. You can give us your thoughts on what you’d like to see us do by filling out this survey: Through the Loop. We’ll also be releasing Moderator Training and some new feedback mechanisms to help us form decisions as we grow.

Since the early days of Stack Overflow, our community has seen a lot of growth and change. As we reflect on 2019 and start thinking about 2020, our company also continues to rapidly grow. We have new l …

Bart

... oh boy ... here we go

Kevin B

meh

ArtOfCode

better late than never I guess

John Dvorak

TL;DR: we're sunsetting MSE and we'll be cherrypicking people we're willing to listen to?

2

Kevin B

just seems fake to me

John Dvorak

17:16

Everything since monicagate has been nothing but a fever dream

Kevin B

i've received the survey emails in the past, but i'm not comfortable with such 1 on 1 surveys

user58

> 1. To continue, please confirm you are at least 18 years of age.

.....

rockwalrus-stop harming Monica

@user58 Wouldn't pass a COPPA review.

mag

Do I want to read that or is it going to make my crap day worse?

user58

Their "new mechanism" relies on an external site that doesn't allow for people under 18.

Rubiksmoose

17:22

@user58 Well, one of the new mechanisms.

The only one currently implemented.

rockwalrus-stop harming Monica

I just went through the survey. It was almost completely useless. There was no way to suggest improvements except through shoehorning it into an answer to another question.

Kevin B

Why does it need gender/age/race info?

what does that have to do with improving the site

mag

@KevinB Probably because the metrics they're optimising for are partly based on making the site more popular and accessible for marginalized people

you can't measure that unless you collect that data from respondents

Kevin B

sigh

so pick and choose who you build the site for

rockwalrus-stop harming Monica

I'm mostly convinced that the major reasons marginalized people don't like SO are the same reasons that non-marginalized people don't like SO, but they may perceive those reasons differently.

Kevin B

17:28

That makes me feel like my feedback will simply be ignored if i provide that info.

user58

> We plan to transition things like bug reports, user and customer support, user feedback, and company announcements off of Meta over the course of next year.

So... yep. Meta is in essence being shut down.

mag

@user58 I called it

rockwalrus-stop harming Monica

If most reasons people don't like SO aren't marginalized-specific, optimizing for the exceptional cases isn't going to help much.

mag

instead of un-shitting the mess meta became they just sunset it

user58

Like... that's kinda all the stuff that goes on meta. "We plan to relocate all of the stuff that goes on meta elsewhere" is equivalent to shutting it down.

10

Kevin B

17:30

who decides which moderators are part of said exclusive group?

mag

this is their response to their community not being in line with their corporate strategy

user58

"We’ve revisited the best use of our Meta Sites"

mag

they just sunset the community because screw taking a hint

Kevin B

i expect meta to still exist after this for Self-governance discussions

well, the individual site metas anyway

mag

I'm becoming more sympathethic to people demanding firing of managers by the minute

John Dvorak

17:33

I'm becoming more sympathethic to people demanding firing managers into the Sun by the minute

rockwalrus-stop harming Monica

That's very expensive.

John Dvorak

Fair. Rendez-vous with the Roadster?

Raedwald

Oct 28 '16 at 6:03, by Shadow Wizard

@zaq so better shut down meta and be done with it.

John Dvorak

Free Ride with Starman. No training required. You just sign a liability waiver and hop into this steel can that will take you for the ride.

Literally breathtaking.

mag

17:50

@JourneymanGeek seems like I was right last week and they're sunsetting meta after all

still overly pessimistic?

Stevoisiak

Well... at least there's no more doubt about SE's feelings on Meta

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