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00:00 - 20:0020:00 - 23:00

00:02
@ShadowWizard It's not like we're blindfolding the youngest... oh wait. We are.
I'm pretty sure I avoided this stage several years ago...
everything
everything could go wrong
@AndrasDeak Jeff Atwood's giant S
Jeff who?
@rene Out of curiosity, are you traveling?
No, or yes, depending on your viewpoint.
00:16
@rene Explain?
The earth is travelling, I'm not.
@rene Not intra-Earth?
00:29
@AndrasDeak Artwood. Distant cousin of mine.
00:48
@ArtOfCode Is Deak Artwood related to Jeff Artwood?
@SonictheAnonymousHedgehog actually, I asked not to be pinged for these.
@SonictheAnonymousHedgehog we don't do that no more
I propose a personal delivery of a sticker sheet of appropriately scaled Ses
@JourneymanGeek Did you even see what that was a reply to?
@JourneymanGeek Sorry, forgot.
 
3 hours later…
04:25
@SonictheAnonymousHedgehog flowcharts are dope
@SomethingBadHappened What do you mean?
05:02
https://meta.stackexchange.com/questions/318478/how-can-i-know-unwan‌​ted-sites-resolving-or-redirecting-to-my-site
05:13
Update: Most of us survived.
06:09
@SonictheAnonymousHedgehog flowcharts are great
06:20
@Mithrandir I'm partially glad
other than the most bit
snort
@SonictheAnonymousHedgehog ... that's a little too easy
@SonictheAnonymousHedgehog half certain its a reference to that ;)
er
2
Q: What happened with this attempted migration? I've used all the mod tools I know about and I still can't figure it out

Monica CellioToday a question was asked on Writing. Five users voted to close as off-topic, belongs on another site (English, a defined migration path for us). The question shows as on hold, off-topic with no migration link. Somebody asked about it on meta, so as a moderator I tried to see what had happene...

that ^^^^
06:46
off-topic is good to pick community detection - esysss‎ - 2018-11-18 06:40:36Z
@Mithrandir you survived the night? ;)
oh, just saw you above message. lol
"Most" implies some didn't... o_O ;)
@ShadowWizard that worries me lol
Nah @Mithrandir is alright. :D
After 2013 --> I answered on meta today feeling :)
07:31
@JourneymanGeek So, what's your opinion on my flowcharts?
If I had one, I'd give it to you
@JourneymanGeek I'm asking because I low-key used SU as an example. Do you agree with that example or should I change it for something else?
You're free to do that
Seems fine, but eh, if migration needs a flowchart....
maybe we have it too complicated?
huh
Slow Sunday
07:41
I already active on charcoal :) need some flag :)
Yep slow sunnday :)
07:51
@JourneymanGeek Well, the second flowchart is just technicalities; the first one is the actual policy-based one
@SonictheAnonymousHedgehog in general ;)
cause honestly I ask 2 questions
is this a good question?
and is the other site going to find value from this?
What you two talk about?
08:25
@ShadowWizard a flowchart
@andmyself of what?
@ShadowWizard of how to not migrate 🎲
@andmyself oh. Sounds complicated...
@andmyself ... dice?
Sharp eyes! ;)
08:43
@JourneymanGeek We try to avoid talking about them.
(Don't worry, everyone's fine. I just have a strange sense of humor after only sleeping one out of the past three nights.)
Craps is a dice game in which the players make wagers on the outcome of the roll, or a series of rolls, of a pair of dice. Players may wager money against each other (playing "street craps") or a bank (playing "casino craps", also known as "table craps", or often just "craps"). Because it requires little equipment, "street craps" can be played in informal settings. While shooting craps, players may use slang terminology to place bets and actions. == History == Craps developed in the United States from a simplification of the western European game of hazard. The origins of hazard are obscure and...
blame Windows 10?
@andmyself ahh
09:04
@andmyself seeing dice also on LG4 android.
09:48
@SmokeDetector kaboom
 
1 hour later…
11:11
@JNat cross site spammer for you when weekend will be over. :)
@ShadowWizard eh, I am a little torn on that one...
not sure if spammer or just.... a bit...
wasn't that one migrated? 0_0
@JourneymanGeek nope. OP appears to ask a new question, much better, in the proper site.
Wait...
Yeah, it was migrated and rejected because it was really badly asked. Better not migrate crap. meta.stackexchange.com/posts/318399/revisions
Crappy questions will be closed on any SE site. Ideally.
11:15
@JourneymanGeek I checked the MSE post, it was obvious spam with some phone number. Can't have any doubt on that.
@ShadowWizard I'm leaning towards ... erm...
I was mistaken about the whatsapp spam though. :/
paranoid/mentally ill personally
@JourneymanGeek we shouldn't care. Spam is spam even if driven by illness.
@ShadowWizard I don't think the classic spam flag is really meant for those
get em gone, sure
15 messages moved to Chimney
Maybe I'm splitting hairs...
11:17
@Shadow Did you clear my off-topic close vote here by closing as a random target and immediately reopening?
@JourneymanGeek well I didn't flag yesterday, not sure what flag I'd use. But anyway, such user better be nuked anyway. They're being as destructive as a spammer.
@ShadowWizard I decided to VTD
I think the community spamflagged it tho
@SonictheAnonymousHedgehog no, sorry it it appeared that way. I closed as dupe because I thought it's a dupe then on second thought decided it's the wrong target and was out of time to find better targets.
I did think your vote to close as specific to one site is wrong, but did not use the hammer to clear it. I don't do those things. :)
It's a classic discussion vs. feature request conflict, sometimes it still trips me. :/
That's the nature of meta ;)
11:29
(also a source of so much drama ;) )
did someone say drama?
@AndrasDeak BEGONE FOWL SHADE!
More seriously
There was never any real clear idea of what meta was.
I tend to consider meta to be "helpdesk" - either for the site and SE + a place to discuss issues + make feature requests
none of which really fit the other Q&A well
Meta Drama
11:38
well the minor stuff anyway
that's offensive to the victims of magic
@JourneymanGeek yeah there was. It is murder.
@AndrasDeak well Jeff didn't really want meta ;p
my impression was "meta discussions are a huge waste of time so let's have a separate place where we can more easily ignore most of them"
though that impression has largely been influenced by recent developments
not really
Jeff was actually pretty active on meta in the early days
On the other hand, I think things were simpler then
11:55
I know, I miss that
fewer sites, not as much visibility (and external drama...)
my impression is that the whole crap-on-the-community stance started after Jeff left
@JourneymanGeek well he didn't have much choice....
@AndrasDeak I wouldn't say crap on the community
but I think very different goals
Maybe just pee? :P
11:56
I've only been here for a few years so I can only try to piece together stuff a posteriori
It can cure jellyfish stings, you know. :D
Jeff was (is?) focused on the one thing
"lets make a better Q&A site!"
"Yanno? I think I can make a better forum"
Joel seems to be more of a 'classic' tech-business type.
@JourneymanGeek depends. All that has happened since The Blog Post of Welcomingness fits in "crapping on the community" fair and square
Which could turn out better in the long term
@AndrasDeak Here's the thing though
its easier to ignore the folks who are outright antagonistic than...
for that I've been here and I can form an educated opinion
11:57
well people who are not
@AndrasDeak Its, to me, not that simple
I think there's a few factors
1) Q&A was a mature product
When I say "crapping on the community" I don't mean ignoring snarky bastards such as myself (may I add that I wasn't a snarky bastard for a very long time, I only started being completely honest when it became evident that it doesn't matter either way)
2) Community relations was hard and "things have been working so far"
it will dry clothes. It will also catch fire one day.
Much like my dryer
I mean making decision after decision that shows that the people filling the actual product with content are secondary to everybody else
@AndrasDeak I think folks figure it'll be ok in the long run
well figured
That was weird.
11:59
@ShadowWizard is gone ...
@JourneymanGeek Which folks? SO folks or community folks?
@AndrasDeak probably more management
I don't really blame anyone up to, say Tim's level for this mess
@rene I'm not gone!!
:D
I am here!
@JourneymanGeek that I'd understand.
@AndrasDeak Name one?
It's always easier to address specific concerns ;)
12:02
@Tinkeringbell huh? What?
quite honestly... and people may get mad at me for it....
@ShadowWizard I somehow posted an image of my profile picture in here... No idea how I did that.
@Tinkeringbell CTRL+V and it was on your clipboard? ;)
@ShadowWizard It wasn't on my clipboard.
Be thankful it wasn't a new selfie.... :D
12:03
interpersonal.stackexchange.com/q/8390 is on my clipboard :P
but I'd almost blame the pre-restructuring marketing team for a little of it
Are you on mobile? @Tink
@ShadowWizard Nope, pc. But let's listen to Journeyman ;)
> how-to-react-to-clerks-mocking-me-in-the-supermarket
Why was it deleted? @Tinker ^
12:04
@ShadowWizard Repost ;)
@Tinkeringbell trying to pretend that quality control is unfriendly and insinuating that we should not moderate people coming from minorities. Trying to pacify angry people standing on bird-shaped soap boxes with arbitrary and inefficient changes that don't actually address underlying problems but make life worse for quality providers.
Trying to pretend that the familiarity of a user with the system should imply that they should be handled differently, in an ironic contrast with the fact that everyone should always follow the new code of conduct. Kicking out a whole site from HNQ with no good reason and in completely demeaning ways with no consideration given to the community and individual members involved.
sorry, I don't keep a list so I could only come up with these off the top of my head
@AndrasDeak you can do quality control more friendlily
I guess not so bad a list considering that the blog post came this spring
@JourneymanGeek yes you can. Jay didn't talk about that in the blog post
12:04
I've been posting "Welcome to $site" posts for ages.
it was more like "Awww, please don't dupe hammer everything :("
@AndrasDeak hah
@AndrasDeak That's a nice list ;) For the quality control, I think it's not a thing of 'We should not downvote/close questions' but 'We should find ways so we don't have to do so so much anymore'. Hence the question wizard for example
I think we dupehammer too much on meta ;)
As for the 'not moderate people coming from minorities'... I dunno where you've seen that one, I've never seen it. I do agree though (and that's coming from IPS, not SO) that e.g. IPS isn't always LGBTQ friendly for example. If someone asks 'I'm shopping for women's clothing as a man, how can I deflect awkward questions', they get answers like 'go shop somewhere else'. Not the most welcoming... :/
12:07
@JourneymanGeek we don't meet much on metas because I'm usually on MSO, but I've explained multiple times that I agree with the intent of the welcoming initiative and I believe in the underlying problems, but the way the company has been handling it has been completely wrong in each turn. Of course, "completely wrong" merely in my opinion and of other members of the "vocal minority" being "obnoxious" on meta.
@AndrasDeak I kinda feel that its focusing on the wrong thing ;p
So, I've been here a while
and here's the funny thing - a lot of complaints about newbies has happened... in the early days.
so how do we onboard newbies without relying on attrition? ;)
> Let’s stop judging users for not knowing things. (We’re a Q&A site!) It makes me sad when someone get downvoted for posting a duplicate. We should better surface them in the posting flow, but it’s not reasonable to expect askers to find dupes consistently. Users aren’t “too lazy” to search; searching takes less work than posting.
> And little makes me sadder than comments on answers saying, “Don’t answer questions like this – it encourages them.” Now, some questions are off-topic. (I’m genuinely sorry, but we simply can’t explain how a glass pitcher can smash through a brick wall with no apparent injuries; we are a programming site.)
But it’s totally cool to answer questions without giving a grilled poop sandwich about exactly what’s allowed. It’s fine to volunteer in one way without being expected to read and enforce every rule and meta discussion since forever.
@JourneymanGeek I did start to think twice before (or after) closing. :)
oh, forgot the first block that sets the tone
@AndrasDeak I disagree with the latter part
12:11
> Too often, someone comes here to ask a question, only to be told that they did it wrong. They get snarky or condescending comments for not explaining what they’ve tried (that didn’t work). They get an answer… but the answerer gets scolded for “encouraging ‘low-quality’ questions.” They get downvoted, but don’t know why, or called lazy for not speaking English fluently.
Or sometimes, everything actually goes well, and they get an answer! So they thank the poster… only to be told that on Stack Overflow, “please” and “thank you” are considered noise. All these experiences add up to making St
I'd DV the answers tho ;)
Where's this from?
all from The Blog Post of Welcomingness stackoverflow.blog/2018/04/26/…
the disaster that set us down this course to the land of insanity
Yeah but you can like take those quotes and it'll look real bad, or read the entire post and also see stuff like:
> We trained users to tell other users what they’re doing wrong, but we didn’t provide new folks with the necessary guidance to do it right. We failed to give our regular users decent tools to review content and easily find what they’re looking for. We sent mixed messages over the years about whether we’re a site for “experts” or for anyone who codes.
@JourneymanGeek I agree with the intent but Jay hilariously missed the point in my opinion. Which is fine, but despite immense feedback on MSO (and I guess MSE) we're still down this road of "Hey, here's a newbie who didn't even bother reading the Tour, PLEASE MAKE SURE YOU READ THE CODE OF CONDUCT BECAUSE YOU HAVE TO BE NICE PLEASE READ IT NOW"
@Tinkeringbell yeah, that's most of what I've seen that counts as taking responsibility.
we're still stuck with the education of lazy users being pushed to veteran users of the sites
12:14
@AndrasDeak So be nice, and point them to the tour. Just don't use a snarky condescending comment to do so.
@AndrasDeak I thought SO had a question wizard now? It's not satisfactory?
@Tinkeringbell yeah, and I'd be OK with that. But as I said, that's not what's going on
@Tinkeringbell not that I can tell from the front page
anyway, I have to go (and this isn't a discussion that would lead anyway :P Been through it countless times)
Enjoy your day/evening/whatever :)
we're in the same time zone
Afternoon it is then!
you too, thanks ;)
12:17
@AndrasDeak you know.... at first I thought like you do now. But... it changed.
No thanks ... those are not permitted
@AndrasDeak even a Wizard can't stop all the crap, you know. ;)
2:19 PM here. What's the time for you? @Tink
That's... noon. No?
12:19
you said afternoon!
(that's why I asked)
It's afternoon?
12:00 is when you switch from morning to afternoon :P
is there a difference between noon and afternoon? :P
just the "after" part... ? :D
Yeah, so the first is just a shorter version of the second?
12:21
lol
Not in Hebrew
In Hebrew afternoon is two words which are actually simply "after noon". :)
Though it's often shortened to acronyms אחה"צ. :D
Interesting.
Here, we have 'middag'. It fits between morning and evening :P
Goeiemiddaaaaaaaaaagggggg!
Yay. I just won a large sum of money?
No, De Dik Voormekaar show just started ...
Ohh... Right... the money is more of a Gooooooeeeeeedenaavond.. :P
I'm a bit young for the Dik Voormekaar show ;)
12:35
:/ ... are you calling me old ...?
@rene I have subtle ways of doing that :P
Grrrr
Well, you are @rene :3
I try to hide it
I'm in denial
So you're getting a younger wife and a motorbike?
12:39
Hmm, no
not even considering ...
Not that old then ;)
Or... already past that stage XD
I would first need to find a wife before I can get a younger one and I don't have A in my driver licence ....
So there are "practical" issues to start my mid-life crisis...
@rene You could get an old model bromfiets, one of those 'just after the world war' bikes :P Licences B come with an AM license automatically.
Maybe I'm not that desperate ...
Not that old then.
12:45
:D \o/
13:02
KABOOM * 3
(three off topic questions sent to the graveyard)
@Tinkeringbell this?
Een bromfiets is een gemotoriseerd voertuig op twee wielen en kan worden beschouwd als een tussenvorm tussen fiets en motorfiets. Een snorfiets en een brommobiel zijn volgens de wet ook bromfietsen. Ook een lichte trike of quad (vervoersmiddelen met respectievelijk drie of vier brede wielen) kan gelden als bromfiets. Indien een voorschrift geldt voor alle bromfietsen, dan geldt het dus ook voor deze voertuigen. In het spraakgebruik worden de termen snorfiets en bromfiets echter vaak bedoeld als niet-overlappende categorieën voertuigen. Zo nodig zullen we in dit artikel bij formele Nederlandse...
What you linked is generally called a 'scooter'
@Tinkeringbell maybe I can drive a Solex ....
@rene or a Puch.
13:16
That is also an option
as long as it is an "gasgevertje"
13:27
@Tinkeringbell ah, a moped
@JourneymanGeek that sounds like moping... Which is not what you do when riding one of those :P
A moped ( MOH-ped) is a scooter with bicycle pedals, generally having a less stringent licensing requirement than motorcycles or automobiles because mopeds typically travel only a bit faster than bicycles on public roads. Mopeds by definition are driven by both an engine and bicycle pedals. Some mopeds have a step-through frame design, while others have motorcycle frame designs, including a backbone and a raised fuel tank, mounted directly between the saddle and the head tube. Some resemble motorized bicycles. Most are similar to a regular motorcycle, but with pedals and a crankset that may be...
13:55
[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Manually reported answer (batch report: post 1 out of 2) (94): What is the an Oracle role, in the insurance industry ? by hrisikesh saloi on money.SE
[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Manually reported answer (batch report: post 2 out of 2) (94): UK: National Insurance on employee loans when there is no interest benefit by hrisikesh saloi on money.SE
@ShadowWizard Post 1: Already recently reported [ MS ]
14:31
lol I downvoted an answer and now can't edit without review. 1999 rep. O.o
15:14
@ShadowWizard Stockholm syndrome
Morning...
huh, did I miss welcoming blog drama?
OK.... who hacked Google and put that in there?!
glaring at @Bart
@andmyself sure! @Andras need some welcoming and love! :D
15:33
[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Bad keyword in body, bad keyword in title, blacklisted username (287): 120 Ton Crane in Pakistan | Auto Link Int Pakistan | Construction, Engineering, Procurement in Pakistan by autolinkpk on webmasters.SE
15:47
hmm....
Isn't it the same child as in Evan's profile?
Beyond non-unique displaynames you can add non-unique profile images as well
(that sounded way better in my head)
and he's using Rust!
But.. but... also same last name.
Maybe this is his friendly brother?
hehe
He's not active on SE so we can't know...
Also no links to any external sites.
lol
That one got flagged once and ranted about it.
(when he put Jeff blog avatar or something)
LOL
Are you ready to have your mind blown?
That is not fire either...
So why is he so scared?
@Jeff are you here? ;)
> Jeff who?
lol
He was last active in the "Let's get philosophical" room, years ago. Guess Tavern wasn't serious enough for him! :D
16:48
[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Blacklisted website in answer (92): Directly connecting two NAS boxes by Jay Today on superuser.com
I read "biking" as "bikini". I should sleep...
@andmyself Never go biking in a bikini ;)
17:17
Does anyone know about the Yearling badge and it's awarding?
We have a user that just receive their 4th Yearling badge on Meta in 2 weeks:
That's possible.
it counts every multiple of 200 rep, i.e. 200, 400, 600, 800, etc.
And they've been a member for 5 years apparently, so they should get a fifth soon ;)
@andmyself Huh?!
17:20
@Werner It's 200 rep and 1 year for the first one.
If you're active for 2 years and you cross 400 rep, you get another.
if you're active for 3 years and cross 600 rep, you get the third... etc.
But if you've had a profile for 3 years and you just manage to cross 600 in that third year, you get 3 yearling badges that year.
10
A: How does the Yearling badge now work over multi years?

animusonIf you miss the badge for a previous year, you won't get awarded that year's badge until you "catch up" to where you are supposed to be. So if you sit at, say, 50 reputation and then come back in 4 years, you will have to get up to 800 reputation and you'll receive all four badges at the same tim...

@Tinkeringbell Ahhh...
...so you can catch up.
that badge can only be given per day though, so yes... expect the 5th yearling tomorrow
If you've hung around for a long time, but not contributed, and suddenly start contributing, you can get multiple such "annual" badges in one year.
@andmyself That answer seems a bit off though. If the profile is over 5 years old, OP should've crossed 5 * 200 +1 = 1001 rep and then gotten all five at once, if I believe that answer?
I'm going to look at their rep this year :)
@Tinkeringbell I already did...
...they had increased contributions (rep) just in the last couple of days/weeks...
17:26
@Tinkeringbell I remember shog or someone has explained something like that though.. but I (always) might be wrong...
...and I think stepped over each 200 rep threshold a couple of days apart.
That looks okay-ish (They also got the 5 year one just an hour ago)
I still find it weird though. They got the one on October 28 with just 448 rep or something.
So it seems this:
> If you pass your two-year anniversary and only have, say, 391 reputation, you don't get it for hitting 401 half-way through the year, because half-way through the year the requirement would be 2.5 * 200 + 1 which would come out to 501 reputation.
Stopped being applied.
I believe it's simpler now... a full year since you joined, per 200 rep...
Might very well be, that answer is old.
I'm an idiot. Disregard my previous message. I should really sleep...
18:10
@ShadowWizard Since we're mocking Google results, I came across ^ the other day while writing validation for a date of birth field
@andmyself Duh.
Of course not. People can say that word if they like
And if it doesn't get flagged, you get away with it ;)
only one candidate?
:(
extension! extension!
@MarkAmery lol
@andmyself why is this brought up again?
They posted about usage of 'shit'.. Oh shit!
@andmyself actually, Shog's been told he's crossed the line by site mods a couple times
@andmyself *eighth except that Productivity.SE got shut down
19:07
@Mithrandir vote count on that meta post?
19:18
@Mithrandir well, he is drawing the line.
Tim Post did say that in case of a dispute between an SE employee and yourself, you can send a letter to SE senior management
And wait 6-8 years?
Yeah, it's probably better to just vent your grievance on Twitter. Response time counting in minutes, followed by several days making rounds in this room.
19:43
Just send them love letters, to add confusion
Is this some sort of an off-season Valentine's day joke?
@rene I thought this was the time for Sinterklaas poems ;)
Oh, yes
Too bad that 'Sinterklaas was thinking, what kind of gift he should be bringing' doesn't rhyme :P
I'm not capable of any rijmelaarij in Dutch, let alone in English
19:50
I was pretty good at making them in Dutch, just had to make sure they wouldn't point out too many of the other person's flaws. But I always used the Rijmwoordenboek.
I don't think I'd be capable of writing one in English either.
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