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12:01 AM
@Ollie You can award the worst of the three (or two, of the three) first, and then offer another bounty of a higher value on the same question; awarding two or three bounties in succession, of increasing value.
2 hours later…
2:00 AM
@Philippe You are lucky, some of my former co-workers were sophisticated, on so many levels. Having worked at the company (and several prior failed businesses) rather than the Peter Principle (because Peter was the owner's friend, and in charge) the upper management (due to lack of formal credentials) had Illusory Superiority clouded by noisy mental information processing.
They had ideas about how things worked that would challenge the Lemon Juice Bandit:
The Dunning–Kruger effect is a hypothetical cognitive bias stating that people with low ability at a task overestimate their ability. As described by social psychologists David Dunning and Justin Kruger, the bias results from an internal illusion in people of low ability and from an external misperception in people of high ability; that is, "the miscalibration of the incompetent stems from an error about the self, whereas the miscalibration of the highly competent stems from an error about others". It is related to the cognitive bias of illusory superiority and comes from people's inability to...
Everything would be not quite right, each error correcting the prior one; cobbling together a misshapen figure, a Frankenstein that worked but not well.
[Partial credit: Wikipedia and Google - for a means to attempt to explain the above, and a place for them to look it up.]
2 hours later…
4:23 AM
The removal of the mobile sites, I think, will mean an end to the old maroon color for mod-only tags being used on actual sites, leaving chat rooms on this server the only place it'll stay
2 hours later…
6:28 AM
and good morning
7:09 AM
7:21 AM
> Retired from SO after hitting 100K close queue reviews.
So bottom line, wasn't worth it.
@Luuklag good? ;)
Once upon a time, we had morning trains here.

Morning Train Record: 14 vagons

Jun 10 '14 at 8:01, 11 minutes total – 15 messages, 14 users, 0 stars

Bookmarked Jun 10 '14 at 8:14 by SPArcheon

@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 I usually flag those for moderator attention if there's a pattern, either of suggesting them or approving them, in the hopes that a friendly moderator will inform them of the error of their ways.
@RyanM Don't ever do that again on Monday morning :P
It hurt my brain to try and read that, somehow.
@Tinkeringbell I surely can't imagine how 😇
In my defense, 'tis only Sunday night here, at least by my definition (haven't slept yet).
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 nice one
@RyanM Ugh. I'm almost jealous, but then I remember it will be Friday here sooner for me :P
7:42 AM
Relatedly, good night all o/
sleep well :)
8:03 AM
@RyanM nah, no point. Take one down, 100 others arise.
@Luuklag good old times! :D
@RyanM sleep tight!
hmm what's the origin of this? Why "tight"? Doesn't sound very comfortable.
ohh found it!
Q: origin of: sleep tight, make sure the bugs don’t bite

ptsWhere does the phrase sleep tight, make sure the bugs don’t bite come from? Is it part of a longer poem? A Google web search didn't reveal anything useful. I'm not a native speaker of English, I don't know the English nursery rhymes.

Now I'm sleepy again :P
@Tinkeringbell take this:
!!/redbull Tink
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 No such command 'redbull'.
No thanks. That does nothing but add weight XD
8:12 AM
!!/coffee Tink
@Luuklag brews a cup of Ristretto for @Tink
here have one without the calories ;)
Thanks ;)
oh, ristretto is just espresso with less cafeine...
not going to help you that much then
It's okay. All I need is a good night's sleep, and I'll be fine again.
8:22 AM
@Tinkeringbell too bad you still have an entire day ahead of yourself
Been too busy partying in the weekend?
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 The bed bugs are your reward for reviewing.
@Luuklag Wish that were true... pets.stackexchange.com/q/31712/11575 < That :P
8:39 AM
@Luuklag depends how much sugar, and milk? ;)
@Tinkeringbell besides my comment there, you could try:
@Luuklag Been there, done that... our municipality sucks, you may remember we had to go to court to get that 30 dog thing handled...
yeah, that doesn't sound very promising
I'm moving soon, and my parents are really not interested in another 2/3 year process with lawyers and courts (which is understandable)
@Tinkeringbell ouch that's bad... :/
Well for me it was constant noise of shooting all day and night, I grew up in a place nearby big army base.
8:44 AM
You could try to get your hands on some "pink wheat", but that most likely will put you on the path to criminal prosecution.
I found it hard to fall asleep when the shooting stopped after some years. lol
@Luuklag it's upside down, roosters will dodge.
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 Yeah, this can be a real problem :P
@Tinkeringbell :D
@Rob I don't have bed bugs. ;)
1 hour ago, by Shadow Wizard Wearing Mask V2
So bottom line, wasn't worth it.
8:48 AM
I see, you're saying you were ripped off.
@Rob talking about the example case you brought. He quit SO (totally, I never really quit just reduced overall activity) because he made 100k reviews.
@Luuklag The 'halsband' looks promising... if he insists on keeping them walking around the yard and keeping multiple ones.
@Tinkeringbell I have my doubts on that, regarding animal welfare, but yeah. Ideally he should only keep one rooster, and lock it up at night
You might also consider getting a "nerts" or "wezel" and release that in your neighbours yard. Makes a lot of noize for about 15-30 minutes, but silence after that ;)
@Luuklag Locking it up at night still doesn't solve the problem of having noise all day to the point of 'not being able to read a book outside'... but yeah.
@Luuklag I think there already has been one a few years back naturally (though we're guessing that was a fox): Lot of noise, then afterwards there seemed to be less chicken noises and no more rooster for a while. Now he keeps all the chickens in a pen, all the time XD
9:07 AM
Yeah, my parents had that happen a couple of times as well. Every time those animalfreaks cut open the mink farm nearby again.
9:20 AM
Oh, lovely...
9:38 AM
@Luuklag funny thing is we have a crapload of wild chickens since the lockdown (less human traffic so they've been spreading out from their old range) and...
No one's complained
Not sure locking em up helps with the crowing ._.
@Tinkeringbell why are all your neighbours hoarders?
@JourneymanGeek Bad neighborhood? XD
Most good bad neighbourhoods, at worst you get shived? :D
It is hoarding town ... (sorry ;) )
@JourneymanGeek Okay, it's not that bad... but we have a good-for-nothing alcoholic, a pair of neat-freaks, the dog hoarder, the one with the chickens/roosters... fun fact: he's the same neighbor that came complaining when my brother got his drum kit as a little kid, and we hit the snaredrum a few times without closing the window when it was set up... also, a pair of 'tokkies' just moved in a few houses away, they're the one with the incredibly rude/unbehaved kids and loud noises...
It's almost like we're living in a street populated with cartoon stereotypes by now. I just hope we're background figures XD
9:44 AM
Oh! I forgot the religious fanatics XD
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 Yes, there's a thread of comments on the subject:
@DavidG "Also, what do they get for it? Not a single thing." It's purely altruistic. You do it because others profit from a better SO knowledge library. Personally, it's a loss of time. — Trilarion Sep 16 '20 at 9:28
@Tinkeringbell go wash your car in front of their house on sunday
@Luuklag I would... if I weren't so lazy. I just sent my brother today to drive it through the car wash XD
10:02 AM
I once drove through a car wash. I was asked to never do that again. Lots of damage.
ha ha ha
I had to get my car through the car wash twice. An Haagse Règâh left its poo all over the car. It was so bad on the driver side that I used the door at the other side. The door handle was covered and so was the rest of the car
ugh, yuk!
The guy at the car wash had a good laugh when I showed up ...
@Tinkeringbell Wrong Disney character.
10:08 AM
@rene Of course he had XD I hope he at least didn't make you pay for two rides? :D
This is Goofy.
A dog, so probably a relative of @JourneymanGeek
but never mind that. He is the one who says "YUK"
@Tinkeringbell You instead are a little fairy friend of a group of kids who don't want to grown up. There is a typo in the name but never mind that.....
10:27 AM
@rene The joke was on you, they used the security camera footage to make a commercial:
10:40 AM
@JourneymanGeek Not QUITE yet - at this point, I have a team that's definitely rebuilding. We're rebuilding quickly, but let's not assume that hiring people means they're instantly useful. CM roles have a VERY long onramp. At Wikipedia, I told them that it took me 18 months to get a CM - that i hired from the community - to be fully useful.
@Philippe Oh, well - I've had a few views on that over time but... at least you have the people
@JourneymanGeek "just throw people at it" ? XD
@Tinkeringbell beats throwing people out ._.
Fair, but throwing people at things, as tempting as it is at times with certain persons, doesn't often solve problems ;)
@Tinkeringbell anvils on the other hand...
10:44 AM
Anvils are great :)
@Philippe no matter how good folks are, quantity is a quality on its own, and what they lack, they can pick up. :D
@rene Haagse Règâh? Kind of dragon?
( SE has previously onboarded CM-ish folks pretty fast though. Team chaos kinda got hired with neither CM nor site knowledge and built up a lot of the smaller sites in the good old days)
In the good old days the CMs lacked many tools and vital knowledge required for managing communities.
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 and ... uh, and they did pretty well?
I suspect the main pain point was... well, internal politics
10:51 AM
@JourneymanGeek sure, with the limited resources they had. But it wasn't done "the right way".
@JourneymanGeek What's that inspirational quote again... about how swans seem so tranquil when swimming, but are paddling like hell where you can't see it?
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 - well, is there?
There was sorta a way "things were done here", and the ways "other folks do things" and the "way people wish things were done"
All of which are valid in various contexts
And what's the right way in one situation or context might not be in another
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 local dialect from The Hague, it is the name for a Heron, which happens to be in the city logo.
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 also, we literally had CMs dedicated to specific sites, something that's a practical impossibility now
but it had a few nice things. Not everyone pinged the same people :D
I think SE was really blessed with the people they had as CM's. Especially since when they needed some tooling that wasn't there, they made it themselves. I love that kinda get things done attitude. But those kind of people are rare to find.
But at the same time, such an attitude can cause friction as well. Seeing that corners tend to get cut, people get aggitated, because their not in the loop etc. etc.
(I know from personal experience)
11:09 AM
@Luuklag I kinda suspect that "build it if we need it" started pretty early on
Jeff was pretty hands on, and at least one of the original CM team was a dev
(and I used to use one of her userscripts for chat :D )
And I suspect (from talking to people who used to work there) - there were some internal politics that affected a lot of the parts of the company badly (and not just the CM team)
@JourneymanGeek sort of, what they're doing now. Or trying to do.
@rene so, only a bird?
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 Well - my own uh... experiences aside, I don't entirely agree with excluding the traditional community hiring pool as they did
Especially in the circumstances - hiring from both traditional and non traditional pools would have been nice without folks having to push for it
@JourneymanGeek most of the things that worked in the past can't be done now, SE got both bigger and the community itself changed, I think.
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 only a bird? schijtlijster is what we call them ...
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 on the other hand, throwing everything out is bad as well, and there's a few quirks to SE
11:21 AM
@rene so bird with lots of poo.... some humans also have it.... :D
Fun (?) story, I went to the Black Widow in cinema last week. It was night show, and after the movie it was around 1 AM, went to the toilets there. There were bunch of excited teenagers inside, about five of them, and they were all shouting and pointing at one of the stalls.
The stall was open, so I also took a look, and, well, the whole thing was covered with poo. lol. The stupid teenagers were taking pictures of it to share with their friends. (They didn't do it, someone did it before, dunno how, it was really impressive ;))
So.... not only birds do it! :D
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 Yeah I used to do my internship at a start-up, which just raised 20M series C I read about. Things are way different there now.
It used to be small and informal, now they employ 75+ people
@Luuklag yup, and SE has 500+
But it's not only the amount of employees
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 eh, In a sense though - different parts of the company 'seem' to be almost independent of each other
Especially as time went on
11:29 AM
@JourneymanGeek as they should, of course
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 kinda sorta
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 yeah not sure I agree on that. To a degree teams should be seperated, but cooperation makes your company bigger the the sum of all parts
Now, I work for a massive multinational with fingers every where...
and they try to keep us abreast of at least what's happening locally or within our account
And on the other hand, if there's an issue with another project, even for the same customer, we're insulated...
Pretty sure that at some point that sorta communication broke down
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 That really depends on how you look at it. Early SE and the CMs were definitely more startup mentality; weird hours, informal communication, free reign to do things, etc. Which is a perfect environment for building a community. It doesn't, on the other hand, transfer perfectly to a company that is no longer a startup.
@Luuklag should be done carefully though, not just mix the teams.
11:35 AM
Some things should be brought back to things of that era - like CMs having free reign to just communicate and interact - and other things shouldn't.
Or move people around like in Musical Chairs game.
@Mithical yes, that's very true. :)
@JourneymanGeek well it's in the past. I hope. <_< :)
Which if I was completely cynical, which I am possibly slightly - is something SE has done quite at least twice, maybe thrice in the past few years.
that's to say, less chairs ._.
@Mithical for once I trust their VP to do it right this time. Just hope his own mangers will actually let it happen.
11:38 AM
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 no, but you can work joint projects, or lend people out between teams for a fixed project/set time
@Luuklag sure, I talk about CM becoming a developer or vice versa.
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 and that's one part of old SE culture that's essential - the idea that the community is vitally important and worth spending time, energy and money on :D
I think the new editor is a great example from work that crossed teams
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 Its happened before!
Actually twice?
11:40 AM
Bluefeet is a SRE/DBA
close enough
Was she CM before? I forgot lol... :/
Gabe is somewhere else in the company
And how about that woman that used to organise the developer survey
I keep forgetting her name
Anita Taylor
"Product manager for the Public Platform team, starting Sep 2020. I joined Stack Overflow in Jan 2017 and have held a variety of roles, including leading our annual Developer Survey for a couple of years. I am looking forward to working with the community as we build out new features and functionality."
how big is that folder? You might want to start such a thing at 5 PM ;)
11:53 AM
It's not the size, it's the amount of items
Yeah true, but if there are really big items things could take even longer
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 yup
and after long minutes, it gives:
@Mithical Product support for teams IIRC
And after that, it became sensible and quite fast, finally.
12:18 PM
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 197 KB/s, is that the fancy new hard drive that you bought?:
O.o ... I've been listening to Spotify using the web player (can't install the app on this work laptop) and it just now started saying I can't listen because I have too many tabs open?!
Well it's upgrade from this one:
@Tinkeringbell say what
@Luuklag Say that....
12:20 PM
@Tinkeringbell LOL
I have, including Spotify.. 10 whole tabs open.
@Tinkeringbell run it in a different browser? :D
@JourneymanGeek No. F that. If they're really going to be like that, I'm going back to just listening to pirated music.
@Tinkeringbell sadly, it's their way to force people to install the app.
Well, it works. If someone really wants to use it, they'll install the app.
12:23 PM
Probably, yeah. I used the app a lot too, when I was still travelling a lot by train.
But there's no need for me to install the app now.
Also, I find this rather bogus: I have listened to Spotify with much more tabs open in the past...
And for such crappy behavior, I won't install their app, on purpose. :P
I guess I'm going to save some money each month now XD
@Tinkeringbell of course, the message got nothing to do with the actual bug, that's obvious
Microsoft isn't the only company with obscure error messages.
Besides. It's none of their business to control how many tabs I have open!
@Tinkeringbell personally I think they mean too many internal sessions on their server, attached to your client.
So maybe, just maybe, try using Guest mode?
12:26 PM
One click away....
Probably too few tabs open has caused an incorrect error message:
throwing guest (mode) on @M.A.R
Not really? I can't even load the page to log out, all it gives me is that error.
12:27 PM
@Tinkeringbell in guest mode?
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 I just said I can't log out on that page, so there's no opening Spotify in guest mode...
Forget about Spotify, I just got spam promotion email with awesome deal!
Should I buy it? :D
I'm not a fan of chardonnay... so don't ask me :P
There are other types, it's a 6-pack
Eh, still... no use in buying a six pack if it has stuff you don't like in there :P
12:35 PM
@Tinkeringbell always good as a birthday gift ;)
Hahaha okay, fair :P
1:04 PM
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 Suspicious, what size bottles (Aircraft?) - It's usually ₪ 94 each (for 750ml): wine-searcher.com/find/…
A miniature is a small bottle of a spirit, liqueur or other alcoholic beverage. Their contents, typically 50 ml, are intended to comprise an individual serving.Miniatures may be used as gifts, samples, or for promotional purposes. In Scotland and the Northeastern United States they are often known as nips and shooters, and referred elsewhere as airplane bottles or mini-bar bottles or travel-sized bottles. They are sometimes available in hotel mini-bars, on trains, and planes, and in other circumstances where serving from a full size bottle is impractical or uneconomical. They are sometimes sold...
1:28 PM
@Rob Sympathies. I've had this happen before
22 messages moved to Chimney
@Rob I know someone who used to collect those.. until their son tried to have a taste.
Sorry. I can't parse that, what does that have to do with throwing people at things?
@SPArcheon collecting... people?
No that won't work...
@RandomPerson d'you submit a ticket via the contact us form?
@JNat It was phillippes fault I think I read in the comments somewhere
1:42 PM
@Luuklag "in the comments" as in... what comments?
@RandomPerson - almost definitely a result of me digging and finding your old ticket and assigning it to someone on my team. :) — Philippe ♦ yesterday
there you go :)
Was already digging for it
yup, that checks out
just confirmed from Jira
oh, but I see animuson had already done that, so
so it turns out your in the wrong chatroom xD
@Ollie yep, my bad, was meant to be a reply to the wolf.
they collected the miniature liqueur bottles
@Tinkeringbell you should be able to fix the message if you like, less confusion.
Just point it to the wikipedia article above
Okay, fixed. Makes much more sense this way yeah
1:49 PM
probably a refuse from a message that I was writing before and never posted. Must have kept the wrong reply id.
2:27 PM
Piper Lawson on July 26, 2021
Here’s a detailed look into how we designed Collectives, starting from the initial ideation to all the decisions and considerations that led to what it is today.
3:06 PM
@Feeds A design deep dive into how we created Onebox
... :(
3:26 PM
@Rob 94 is triple the actual average price, totally greedy. e.g. mashkaot.co.il/…
Actually, with around 35 NIS per bottle, their deal isn't so good. lol
It's just wrapped nicely and looking shiny.
@JNat Yup. I asked a question regarding this: meta.stackexchange.com/q/367801
@RandomPerson yup, so I've seen in the meantime ;)
4:20 PM
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 I didn't price match, just thought the difference was suspicious, maybe it included shipping. From the vineyard it's: 22.79 Shekels - sutterhome.com/product/Sutter-Home-Chardonnay
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 It might include spam.
BTW: U$7 for a 750ml bottle means it's swill.
4:57 PM
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 Get this, for 34.12 Shekels; lowest price guarantee: walmart.com/ip/Carlo-Rossi-Chardonnay-Wine-4-L/177059150
Hobo Champagne
"I'll just have one glass"
the glass: ^
Includes free exercise kit.
The color is no coincidence, but it comes in red and pink too.
1 hour later…
6:24 PM
@Rob Or go with this:
Eur 10 for 3L
which would be 38.44 israeli monopoly money
6:44 PM
Whoa @Rob that photo of Charlo Rossi takes me back. My mom was not a big drinker so Wine in a giant jug or wine in a box were staples when we had company.
@Mgetz - yes i read documentation and have perfect knowledge and experience in this area. — RbMm 1 min ago
I can't believe someone actually said that
@Mgetz thats some serious confidence
@Rosie yeah, we only ever had them when we had company. My inlaws might buy them on a vacation though.
considering that it was in regard to something that can cause a major buffer overflow yes
I flagged it
There aint much use in flagging incorrect comments though
mods most of the time can't judge those flags as they lack domain specific knowledge
if it's actively harmful and unkind I think there is
6:56 PM
let comment upvotes single out the good comments
or better yet, write an answer yourself to that question, and then delete your comments
There is plenty of room to argue why route X or Y needs to be taken if you write an answer
there are so many issues with that question I don't feel confident to address it all
Then vote to close it ;)
7:07 PM
btw @Rosie now I spot you here in the wild, any news on when the new CM hires will be announced?
@Rosie When I was a teenager, half a century ago, they didn't have jugs or bags; and we drank Beau Joie, because it was cheap.
Meh I was too late
7:37 PM
@Luuklag I am hoping we'll do the announcement later this week. We give new CMs a chance to get through some onboarding and make sure they're happy with the welcome post before pushing it live and giving them their diamonds but hopefully very soon :) They are both great.
@Rob my early college years were about drinking Boons Farm during study sessions. The alcohol content was almost nil, it was $2 for a bottle, and it tasted more like sparkling fruit juice than wine
@Rosie good to hear. I hope they are still enjoying themselves before being thrown in the deep murkey watters that are Meta ;)
I think that they are. :)
Otherwise some bunny cuddles should cheer them up xD
7:53 PM
of all of the pets in the company my bunny is one of the most camera shy so she doesn't make as frequent appearances in meetings as the cats and guinea pigs do
haha yeah, cats are notorious for that. One of ours does that all the time as well
While the other one just finds a place to chill and only comes out around feeding time
Bunnies are ground animals so unless I put the laptop on the floor she's usually not visible
You could make a walkway onto your desk ;)
she is a rescue and missing a leg so ramps and stairs aren't her thing otherwise I would
Oh wow, yeah thats tricky then yeah
Good you chose to rescue an animal instead of buying one
Well I should call it quits for the day. Its 10PM already again
8:09 PM
Have a good one.

I love working with rescue animals. She picked me and my other rabbit who is sadly no longer with us, but she's been a happy bun even without her partner.
8:34 PM
OK I thought @Rosie's profile pic is an astronaut looking down in a deep brooding fashion
9:42 PM
@Rosie My able bodied rabbits, and especially my Guinea pigs (due to short legs), didn't like the stairs either; but I taught them. Then they didn't like linoleum, but got over that too; mastering running on linoleum and turning on a dime.

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