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8:23 AM
13 messages moved to Chimney
8:36 AM
@GetAnswerWizard was actually pretty fast, but badly configured torrent client on mobile ;p
9:27 AM
@SonictheWizardWerehog it fixes all broken images in a post (if it's able to). I'd be very interested in an example where it didn't...
What it should do better is taking into account the entire Q&A thread and fix all images at once. At least on sites where I have edit privileges.
@SonictheWizardWerehog ah, of course. The other images aren't available, not even via the Wayback Machine.
10:02 AM
... for a moment I thought my browser was hacked.
Then I realized which day it is will be tomorrow.
10:24 AM
Q: How to disable "time travel" entirely?

Sami KuhmonenEvery time I open a question I get this oh so funny 90s feel with scrollers and whatnots. In every question I need to click it off. Is this an attempt to keep people from using the site for a few days or how do I tell you "please never ever do anything like this if you want me to keep contributi...

While I love fun, I admit this is annoying even for me, and the fact we can't disable it is really really bad.
@Shog9 any chance to add the option to disable this like one can choose "I hate hats" during winterbash? ^
Can a mod really quickly make a synonym of ?
It's a bug. The back to the future button is supposed to disable it everywhere.
Oh dear god
@Catija evilest April fool's day joke ever
Honestly? We're going to have to mod meta-fires because of an April Fool's joke now? :)
Lucky for me I have two days off coming up
10:37 AM
Well, you have fun then! 😛
And, of course we had to turn it on at some ungodly hour of the day.
@Catija Around lunchtime? Yeah. Really bad choice :P
@Catija so... 6-8 days to fix?
sad laugh
Looking like they're poking at it, though.
IMO just pull the plug out for now, it's a total show stopper.
The Stack Egg caused a DDoS attack but it was turned off minutes after balpha realized that (or was it Nick?), they didn't let it run while broken.
10:50 AM
@ShadowWizard probably not balpha :/
@Tinkeringbell on the other hand weekend
@JourneymanGeek Yeah, weekend. You know, when there's supposed to be almost nothing happening :P
Looks like it's fixed for me on a per/site basis. Can y'all confirm?
@Catija Yes
@Catija not fixed, disabled. Gone.
Sec, let me try new browser...
11:01 AM
That's true, I can't turn it back on
they should've included an option to delete the cookie...? :P
Well, better than before, but still... not what I expect.
I've already written a userscript that clicks the time travel icon if the page is FUBAR'd. Are you saying I won't need to work on it anymore?
@JohnDvorak yup
@Catija um, the pop-up still appears every time even after I X it on one page
11:04 AM
That may be intentional...
Can check.
We're looking at the stickiness of that anyway.
yeah the stickiness is too... modern :/
Weird... I opened a new site and it took a few seconds for the popup to appear.
yes me too
The title word filter time machine "theme" is one of the worst ideas ever implemented on SO.
but it does eventually appear, and... I've told it "choo!" but it keeps on bugging me...
11:07 AM
I can't think of anything worse, design-wise at least.
well, the title word filter is still worse than this "theme" (or "breakage"), IMO
also, there's a little surprise if you scroll down enough... yeah, doesn't look great
I crafted that "set cookie" js into a userscript and am feeling much better now :)
The delay is intentional. Adding a cookie to the X in the popup.
yeah, the owl also did :P
> The delay is intentional.
that really makes you think "wtf is going on here am I hacked"
11:10 AM
@EKons don't click the "x", click the clock icon.
The "x" just close the banner.
I will :P
but not sure if it works network-wide yet
@EKons should tell it "chu!" instead.
It's oo sensitive.
@EKons oh, it's not and it won't be.
Nothing like that was ever made network wide, e.g. winter bash: you need to disable it on every site.
I'm fine with that, only very few people are active on many sites, so it's a rare corner case. Not worth the time the dev should spend on it.
That said.... some global "I hate fun!" preference in the profile would be... fun. :P
last year's yellow duck is a really good design
@MetaBugWizard agreed. But..... the bad design now is part of the prank.
That's how sites looked like back then.
principle 1: don't cause breakage
11:18 AM
This is a circus though :P
It should show "Welcome to Stackoverflow Stack Exchange!"
@Pandya nah, the company name is Stack Overflow
The network name is Stack Exchange I think.
meh... fix the big bugs first. ;)
Indeed - Stack Exchange is Stack Overflow to the extent that Google is Alphabet. Anyone heard of Alphabet?
@JohnDvorak I did!
the company name is Stack Overflow. For some arcane reason.
Brand recognition.
Also, can't see a way to flag/block the guest book messages.... they're open to spam/offensive crap.
Especially on non-technical sites, the network name is preferable rather than company name.
11:24 AM
@JohnDvorak saw an article about it long ago, forgot about it totally, until now. lol
@ShadowWizard I thought they looked like a set of preprogrammed messages showing up
I dunno if it'll show actual messages from other people?
@Tinkeringbell nope. It's real and live.
Oh wait
Maybe just showing own messages.
calling sock
yeah, all good.
Looks like the devs had some internal fun, collected bunch of those, and to make it appear real it's also adding locally what you write. All good. :D
By the by, could the timeout length pleeease be added to request quota error message? In case I click a button multiple times thinking it would disappear while trying to help millions of users ASAP some day again?
@ShadowWizard did you call?
@ShadowoftheShadow'sShadow yes
kicking sock away
11:31 AM
I think the only way to came out of time travel is Install Netscape 3.0! Haha
Can I even download Netscape Navigator?
Q: Why was the decision made to make the 2019 April Fool's joke enabled by default?

Sonic the Wizard WerehogSo far, as far as I remember, every April Fool's prank that SE has made has been non-intrusive, only really showing up as a minor sidebar while not affecting the site's design much. However, this year, the Time Travel Mode prank made drastic, intrusive changes to a site's design, which is not li...

@Pandya Ironically, that might actually work. Because NS3 doesn't support Javascript. Or at least not jQuery.
Language experts here, does this count as a disc jockey? diamondback.com/media/catalog/product/cache/1/image/1800x/…
11:37 AM
@JohnDvorak Yes
@JohnDvorak ask on retrocomputing.se ....
reminded me of GeoCities <3
The only great thing I can say about Time Travel Mode: it loads perfectly in IE11.
Built in Notepad!
It is honestly awesome
11:47 AM
Too bad those who were born in 2000s can't really appreciate this...
Neither do those born before 2000
!!/watch matteorusso\W*(?:dot\W*)?business\W*(?:at\W*)gmail\W*(?:dot\W*)?com
@Olivia That pattern looks like it's already caught by Bad keyword with email in body and Bad keyword with email in answer; append -force if you really want to do that.
!!/test matteorusso.business@gmail.com
> Would not be caught as a post, title or username.
11:48 AM
!!/watch-force matteorusso\W*(?:dot\W*)?business\W*(?:at\W*)gmail\W*(?:dot\W*)?com
Your test doesn't match your watch
crap xd
!!/unwatch matteorusso\W*(?:dot\W*)?business\W*(?:at\W*)gmail\W*(?:dot\W*)?com
um... the . doesn't get caught...
neither does the @ and the other .
!!/watch-force matteorusso\W*(?:dot\W*)?business\W*(?:at\W*)?gmail\W*(?:dot\W*)?com
@EKons \W* catches both
?: doesn't invoke predefined character classes. It's just a grouping construct.
For April fool chat.SE should show "Under Construction, try IRC until chat feature is released" ! Lol
OK. Toggle is fixed. ... and... so much for my last two hours of sleep tonight. :sigh:
@Catija I'm sorry 😬
This sounds like the worst April Fool's for everyone ever.
We fooled your sleep ...
@Tinkeringbell Seconded
12:07 PM
@Tinkeringbell and that by itself makes it awesome
No sleep is deserved by those dare to bring the 90s back. Those who would give us up. Those who would let us down. Those who would run around and desert us.
Tony the Pony. He comes.
@JohnDvorak lol
Zalgo was a good meme.
@rene Hahaha. This 90's kid likes the 90's design (even though I never once visited the internet in the 90's). But it having a bug like that, where it's not easily turned off, is understandably making some people a little bit more angry than they should be on a sunny Sunday afternoon ;)
12:08 PM
Or rather, Bobince's answer was.
6 messages moved to Trashcan
solved, let's move on
I remember following an old HTML for Kids tutorial that was based on HTML 3.2
I don't know if HTML has versioning before HTML5, because at that time, everything with X was awesome, e.g. XHTML
Was it on w3schools, perchance? I bet it's still there...
Wait. There is a newer version of HTML?
12:14 PM
@GetAnswerWizard well, except if the x was in cx
@JohnDvorak No; but it remained online until around 2016 or so (when it was taken down and replaced with a modern HTML5 version)
@GetAnswerWizard Well, the first two versions were called HTML and HTML+; it wasn't until later that they used versions, with 2.0, 3.2, then 4.01
(note to myself: beware of mods fooling around by editing "worst" into "best" later ;)
Reminder: when you have tens of millions of users, anything you do or change make will make some subset of those users angry.
Though doing it in a buggy way makes them even angrier ;)
It's true. You notice that effect even if you have only 1000
12:20 PM
That's their response? That "we don't have to do anything because the majority is OK with it"? What happened to being inclusive to everyone?
Maybe it's just idle musings of nick
I take offense in that tweet's insinuation that what SE did this year was perfectly OK
I dont know you can read that into that
Oh , just cool down will you @SonictheWizardWerehog don't make a drama out of a joke. have a laugh.
I don't see a 'we don't have to do anything' in there. Just an acknowledgement that it made people angry. But if y'all want that fight with Nick, take it to Twitter so I don't have to mod it.
12:22 PM
@rene No, it just goes to show their general thinking.
nick is a sysadmin, he could just as well be talking about some of the SEDE bugfixes that removed bugs people relied on for some stuff
grabs corn pop
@GetAnswerWizard Not sure if a single piece of cereal would be enough...
Fine, fine, fine. I'll suspend my disbelief in incredible coincidences :P
12:23 PM
Q: What testing is done on 'April Fool' pranks?

ColeValleyGirlSo, we have just had an 'April Fools' jape that activated on 31st March for many people wasn't capable of being disabled site-wide (or even better account-wide) presented a design (colours, moving marquee, random sparkles) that for many people renders the site physically unusable (admittedly th...

Q: Please don't repeat such unprofessional "full design" April's Fools in the years to come

JenayahTL,DR: this year's April's fools could be a source of confusion, or worse, in certain workplaces. Please stick to less intrusive stuff. Very related: Why was the decision made to make the 2019 April Fool's joke immediately activate?, but this asks about the "why", and is not a feature request ...

Q: Is it intentional that the April Fool's time travel feature has to be deactivated on a per-site basis?

topo mortoIt seems to me that the time travel feature has to be deactivated on a per-site basis. I've tried this in Edge and Chrome. Is this intentional? It's fine for people using one or two sites, but gives a poor experience if you are using a lot of sites, or just browsing through Hot Network Questions...

Not to forget the bug
Last year was fine. slightly annoying, but it was at least funny
When the update hit, I thought I had gotten some nasty browser plugin installed, followed by the inability to disable it and the issue that it essentially renders the site useless. How is that funny?
I know. All of them are legitimate questions. All of them deserve to be talked about. All of them also deserve that we talk about them in a calm, rational way.
If you don't find it funny because it was just too much this year that's good feedback...
If there are other things you'd rather see on April Fool's that's also good to mention.
How about something that doesn't make the site look like it has been hacked, and there's a movie-style panic in the HQ and lots of screens flashing?
@SonictheWizardWerehog no, it doesn't. It shows they do appreciate a good joke, and even better if it can't be switched off. And for that I praise them. You don't have to like the joke. Blame them again when they ignore you on April 3th. Today is not a good context.
FWIW, and this is my honest opinion: aside of the bug, I love it. It tells me that they're now confident fiddling with site design thanks to the unified theme.
@Olivia But that's the joke!!! 😛 I would totally personally say it was pretty obvious this was just a joke. But this did create a bit too much of a panic, I agree :)
12:28 PM
@GetAnswerWizard I posted something to that extent on MSO ...
@Tinkeringbell The joke was attempting to make the site or browser of the user look hacked?
I'd be fine with the joke if I could disable it network-wide with just a few clicks (rather than several minutes of furious coding that got me locked out of the entire network because a button I thought would disappear didn't).
@Olivia Probably not. But then again, I have little or no experience with hacking or being hacked, and so didn't immediately think of it as that.
Having to kill it on each site manually is ... bearable, but pretty much not fun.
@JohnDvorak Well, that's probably something you can request for April Fools to come...
12:31 PM
I'd hope it'd go without saying. But noted to make a meta post that says it.
Nasty stuff being added to a website is one of those things... Mainly through search plugins, but also redirecting the start page to NSFW stuff (haven't had either personally, but I know people who've gotten those types of viruses). I actually tested a browser plugin I thought was spam (which I was also correct about - it attempted to post an answer with a link to itself and also made the textboxes look weird). The textboxes ended up with a gaussian noise-like appearance.
Marquees and bright colors or other forms of distortion where there usually aren't any is usually never a good sign.
I'll keep it in mind ;)
If you think you got hacked... well, so you know, that's how GeoCities pages were built.
just do google image on it
(afk for dinnering)
And to be quite honest, having burned myself on various problems, I'm extremely careful to avoid them. That's why I have an HTTPS enforcer, a plugin that loads jQuery and other CDN JS stuff locally, along with 3 ad blockers and an additional tracker blocker, and JS blocking, to avoid stuff like XSS exploits on MSO
Some stuff appears where you don't expect it, and can be either harmless, annoying, or worst case scenario plain out damaging
Serious question, willl we have managed to kill some photosensitive epileptics during this year's April Fools' prank?
12:39 PM
And a bug that makes it impossible to disable doesn't exactly inspire a "this is by design"-kinda attitude...
@JohnDvorak I wondered about that too:
in Dawg's Waffle Haus on Stack Overflow Chat, 2 hours ago, by Erik A
It isn't. That's just something people say with colorful things, as long it's not bright and high-frequency flashing that doesn't really happen
@JohnDvorak hopefully no
The thing is, SE has no way to ensure they haven't. Those guys aren't going to post an angry rant from behind the grave.
No matter how much I'd love to see an angry rant from behind a grave.
@JohnDvorak I think if one of my loved ones died due to that, I'd at least shoot the site a message 😉
Not really from 'behind the grave', but they'll find out eventually.
Americans make lawsuits for everything, right? :P
Not the dead ones, those don't sue :P
You're right though, SE would probably get the news if they did maim someone.
You win some, you lose some.
1:08 PM
Microsoft put out a memo a few days ago banning pranks tomorrow, April 1st.
what if that memo was just an early april fools joke?
Then they should make another prank as well, turning the former into a meta-prank
I'd love a prank where the CEO sends a "YOU ARE FIRED!1!!" email to all employees. :P
glancing at @Joel
1:16 PM
@ShadowWizard Prepare for lawsuits, having to pay severance pays etc...
Luckily for everyone, I'm not CEO. :D
@JohnDvorak They should make another memo that says the earlier memo was an early april fools prank. Then either 1) the new memo is real, in which case april fools pranks are okay, therefore goto 2, or 2) the new memo is a prank, in which case the old memo holds, in which case the new prank violates policy, therefore goto 1)
endless loop detected
1:41 PM
Tried to install Netscape 3...
Time to drag up a VM :P
I had an OS/2 vm with netscape and opera on my old PC ._.
@ShadowWizard Mosaic will work on modern linux ;p
A: Why can't old PCs view modern sites?

Journeyman GeekSimply, a lot of modern HTML features we take for granted did not exist back in those days. There are attempts to build 'modern' browsers for older OSes - classilla, for example. You can easily load up linux onto a suitable PII or PIII system and still be able to handle a basic modern webpage. ...

1:55 PM
@JourneymanGeek I remember being specifically told not to go to sony.com back in the 90s because it used a TON of images and wouldn't load. Not because the computer couldn't handle it (it couldn't) but because our dial up was too slow. So I tried at school and it was still broken as all get out.
@Mgetz it wasn't the connection in this case ;p
.... actually ....
@ShadowWizard I wonder if I could throw this on a VM for maximum luls
what amazes me is I have clients that insist on using IE11
@Mgetz ._.
I THINK we're on 11 now. Might have been on 10 before
which is doubly fun cause I use a bit of a niche browser by preference
2:04 PM
@JourneymanGeek I refuse to support IE11
thus far no client has called me on it
@Mgetz we can't upgrade our machines, also they're off the internet.
mostly because I can say with certainty that MS would prefer we didn't
MS's biggest competion is.. their past selves
so that makes sense
@JourneymanGeek someone appears to already do this...
Q: Does not work on Netscape Navigator 3.0

tigerjieerFinally, after 20 years of suffering, StackOverflow now claims Yet all I see is NOTHING! Have all those years been wasted? Have I endured 20 years of ``error: insufficient memory'', browser segmentation faults, and JavaScript exceptions just for this? They lied to me! All I want are so...

That's why I wanted to install, to reproduce... ;)
looks like windows 98
2:07 PM
I also didn't find what response Netscape 3 expected from the server, was going to post a serious answer with that info. :(
Presumably on VMware, its a pain in the rear getting it to work on vbox
Or is it just "wrong" HTML, not recognized by the browser?
I had to go back to the future, that was hurting my eyes
@ShadowWizard it might not recognize a doctype
HTML2 didn't have them I don't think
@JourneymanGeek 11 is the last. If one says IE 12 they probably mean Edge.
(which is wrong, but meh)
@ShadowWizard we were on whatever came standard with windows 7
2:10 PM
@JourneymanGeek oh... think 11, yeah.
And 10 pretty sure came with Edge already.
@JourneymanGeek IE8 then
So confusing lol
THen we're possibly on 9
although that's very very unsupported now
As MS only supports the latest IE for each OS
well a good chunk of our tech stack is...
2:11 PM
Industrial tooling?
soon to be unsupported ;)
We run servers with a name rhyming with a certain doomed british vessel
Kinda surprised MS doesn't make an OS just for industrial tools, a very very stripped down NT stack
@Mgetz actually...
@JourneymanGeek still supported by HPUX!
windows embedded and such..
@Mgetz that's our OS
2:13 PM
@ShadowWizard try the 16bits version?
@JourneymanGeek AFAIK HPUX will be supported for quite awhile
at least on Itanium
@Mgetz Itanium's EOL in... 2022?
that said your power efficiency is probably crap
@JourneymanGeek as far as new production of chips yes
but HPUX will probably be supported on it until 2030
@Mgetz and "new" chips are a 2017 design at best?
@JourneymanGeek 2015 IIRC
2:15 PM
I'll be out of here by then ;)
Not sure where, but out
The process node is massive in comparison and intel has no intention to move
They could cut the power usage in half by moving it to 14nm
but they won't
Kittson is 2017 - that's the last itanium generation
also I wonder how it compares, core for core with a modern x86'
last released, the processors were taped out ages ago
@JourneymanGeek depends on compiler
You'd be better off buying Arm A57s
Java never had great support for Itanium
2:18 PM
I'm just a lowly level 1 support engineer ;)
mostly because Itanium really needs ahead of time compilation support
@Olivia but you're preceding them with dot and at...?
so it will capture matteorussodot.businessat@gmaildot.com, for example
!!/test matteorussodot.businessat@gmaildot.com
> Potentially bad keyword in body, potentially bad keyword in title, potentially bad keyword in username
Potentially bad keyword in body - Position 0-38: matteorussodot.businessat@gmaildot.com
Potentially bad keyword in title - Position 0-38: matteorussodot.businessat@gmaildot.com
Potentially bad keyword in username - Position 0-38: matteorussodot.businessat@gmaildot.com
!!/test matteorusso.business@gmail.com
> Potentially bad keyword in body, potentially bad keyword in title, potentially bad keyword in username
Potentially bad keyword in body - Position 0-30: matteorusso.business@gmail.com
Potentially bad keyword in title - Position 0-30: matteorusso.business@gmail.com
Potentially bad keyword in username - Position 0-30: matteorusso.business@gmail.com
2:20 PM
looks like something was changed while I was away
@Mgetz I'm not exactly a fan of this place, but employment and money are... well something I am a fan of ;)
I'd be happier if we were running something a bit more uptodate and a little less unusual
I can't even use backspace on our shell
@JourneymanGeek fair, I'm actually very curious to see what will compete with Xeon in the server
@Mgetz epyx and her chinese cousins seem obvious
@JourneymanGeek I've found the more you're off mainstream the more expensive it gets
@JourneymanGeek Possibly RISC-V or OpenPOWER
@Mgetz naw, I'm basically getting paid warm body rates
@Mgetz ironically it needs to be cheap and cheerful and scale well
POWER was never cheap and cheerful
RISC-V seems interesting
2:25 PM
@JourneymanGeek They seem to be working on that to an extent but you're right, I think RISC-V stands a better chance of doing the "Thousands of cheap cores" bit
and the fact that its starting as an open ISA
Oh I don't think that's necessary
I think the fact that they aren't charging a ton for a license helps
(also, mips is deadish, via's x86 is... kinda an odd limbo)
so google etc can experiment cheaply
2:27 PM
I've expected Apple to go their own way for awhile now
and WD's already swapping arm controllers with those
I don't.
Iphone aside, there's something to be said for commodity components.
you think apple cares?
@Mgetz its more profitable.
There is a reason the xcode compiler is closed source
speaking of MIPS, I really like the idea of delayed branches. Too bad there's usually nothing to actually do while waiting for the branch to happen.
2:28 PM
I think they'd keep the arm option open to strongarm better deals from intel...
@JourneymanGeek apple already makes their own processors I don't see them sticking with intel if they think they can increase margins
@Mgetz they design them, sure, but intel basically still has a big edge on fabrication over everyone else
@JohnDvorak Raymond Chen actually did an article on why delay slots actually really really mess things up at a silicon level
and apple's a bit of a halo customer
@Mgetz link?
AFAIK, modern CPUs' pipeline controllers are a hot mess no matter how you look at it, having to co-ordinate three instructions at once or balancing 8 logical registers between 32 physical ones...
2:32 PM
good place to start
@JohnDvorak trust me that's easy compared to dealing with interrupts at a point that's not friendly to interrupts
having a base ISA that's interrupt friendly makes the rest of that stuff easy
Can you just ignore interrupts while having branch delay stuff in the pipeline?
@JohnDvorak no because that would allow denial of service
Disallow overlapping branch delays / only if an interrupt is pending?
2:35 PM
@JohnDvorak How is user mode code supposed to know that?
I would expect the CPU hardware to know about interrupts
inherently interrupts aren't always pending and some are non-maskable
@JohnDvorak it does, but that means you have an instruction that may not get executed. So... why have it?
instead just block the pipeline for the branch
I suppose modern CPU hardware can generate branch-delay execution plans when none are present in the ISA anyways?
the main TL;DR: don't expose your pipeline via your ISA
@JohnDvorak we call that speculative execution
I mean, I imagine if I have DIV BX, CX; JMP loop$1, the CPU can jump first and then start waiting for an ALU to free up.
(Although, division can trap, so that would be an issue...)
2:42 PM
@JohnDvorak depends on the ISA, on x86 it can because there are no memory interactions. Ditto ARM and most others
most compilers would MUL by the reciprocal anyway
pretty much avoiding any possibility of using DIV at all costs
I'm still a bit puzzled how you can perform integer division via modular multiplication.
It's easy if you know there's no remainder, but you don't.
@JohnDvorak if either part is constant it's easy?
Is it?
return 3 / num produced IDIV just as I expected
2:45 PM
in most cases the divisor is a known quantity
@JohnDvorak yes but the vast majority of cases don't do that
It's worth noting there are ISAs where that kind of Multiplication or division IS async btw
> If you try to read a value from HI or LO, you must wait two instructions before performing any operation that writes to HI or LO. Otherwise, the reads will produce garbage
Excuse me???
> (Tricky rule number two was removed in the R8000. On the R8000, if you perform a multiplication or division or MTxx too soon after a MFxx, the processor will stall until the danger window has passed.)
Still, how does a write to a register affect the read two ticks before it?
The one that's already happened?
@JohnDvorak common practice if it involves IO.
2:56 PM
because the Multiplication and Division hardware is clocked differently than the rest of the chip
and runs in independent pipelines
basically it's a co-processor
Still it implies that HI:LO reads happen out of order...
@JohnDvorak possible, the point is that you shouldn't mess with them until the processor manual says it's OK to
either way it was exposing a pipeline feature to the ISA
What happens if I read from HI:LO, and then use that value to corrupt the read of that value?
no idea!
I'd expect it stalls the next instruction, and fail to fail the read
otherwise you have a causal loop. Those are not nice.
2:59 PM
I'd expect that prior to the R8000 it would completely corrupt the entire calculation
after the R8000 it would stall
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