Tavern on the Meta

Q: Measure Page Weight programatically in C#

True, but what's to say one should get a design over the other?

user259867

7:03 PM

@hichris123 A site with 10 QPD and 10K visits > site with 1 QPD and 1K visits.

cybermonkey

cv-plz (unclear)

-2

I want to measure the entire page weight (including html, images, JS, CSS etc) using a utility that I want to write in C#. I do not wish to use browser based add ons to do this since I want to create a dashboard with all the available pages and their respective page weights at any given time. Hen...

c# webpage

o/

@hichris123 - Don't forget about the exchange with 0.4 questions per day! :)

@HomegrownTomato quite obviously. But the latter is more likely to be shut down... what if we have a site with 5 QPD + 20K visits, but doesn't have an active enough community to graduate?

hint: it is beer

What's CB then?

7:05 PM

Am I missing something? If I undelete an answer, is the OP not notified of a new answer since technically it counts as being "modified"?

Oh, they're both 0.4 QPD.

Yeah, they are at the bottom together :)

Apparently beer and community building pair well.

@TravisJ That would make sense, but I don't pretend to know anything about that.

user259867

@hichris123 That's what SE said quite clearly: they are not shutting it down. I don't suppose you are losing sleep over the fate of a certain science site with 1.4 QPD and 1.5K visits?

@HomegrownTomato ES? No, I'm just confused as to where this is going. Before, you had assurance that you would graduate in less than 5 years (or probably be shut down). Now... you might never see a design.

7:08 PM

Which site only has 1.5k visits?

lol no?

That site has roughly 592500 visits

@TravisJ Per day.

Yes, per day is 1.5k

But that is not what was said.

Units are important.

For example, I don't think that a question with 1.4 QPD and half a million visits should be shut down if it is abiding by the guidelines explained in the MSE post.

@hichris123 You know, I'm right here. You don't have to talk about Community Building like I'm not. It's rude. I don't say things about Earth Science when you are right here

:P

user259867

7:18 PM

@hichris123 SE could do a category design. "Science" site, "Technology" site, "Arts" site. Still generic, but with some signs of affiliation with the category. This is something the site could get when it's "stable".

@Andy I never said anything bad about CB, just wanted to know the facts. Sheeh, CB people these days... :P

user259867

Which may be after 3-6 months of existence.

@HomegrownTomato huh, that's an interesting idea.

CB is... unfortunate. I'd honestly really like it to do well, but the stats don't lie. :(

In all honesty, we have a rather large Stack Exchange bias and I think that's the biggest problem. Other communities (reddit, Facebook, tumblr, etc) all have their own methods of building communities on their own platforms. It's hard to get people to jump ship to another platform. We do get occasional crossover, but it often feels like it's to get a second opinion. They are one off questions. Some stick around for a while, but many get an answer and leave. The core remains Stack Exchange focused

There are a few users that have a broader range of experiences, and they are getting more involved, but with the low traffic it's hard for them to shine.

7:24 PM

@Andy - Also, if that bias plays out in the voting, then those users with other experiences may feel disenfranchised by having their answers not be supported by the community.

CB needs some self inflection on how to CB the CB site itself ;)

Almost ironic really :P

Jim Reeves - Welcome To My World

►

@TravisJ That's a good point, but I'm not sure there is a voting bias. We do seem to appreciate the outside view. That's the reason I joined and threw my hat in for moderator actually. I had experience running a gaming community and wanted to try and remove some of that SE bias.

@TravisJ It is. We've commented on that more than once.

The other problem is, how do you Google for community building problems? SEO is difficult for this particular Q&A. The site evaluation showed that too.

It's hard though, to generate traffic for a site which is quite niche. The tough part is finding people to ask questions.

Some of the small exchanges all share that common aspect.

Yes it is.

This is why I wish the rules for question closure were not as strict in small exchanges.

7:29 PM

[ SmokeDetector ] Offensive answer detected: What is a good way to explain the difference between a Chaotic Neutral character, and a character who is just crazed? by Paul on rpg.stackexchange.com

Some of the large view building questions on Stack Overflow (1M+) were very broad at first.

But they generated a sense of community with all the answers, and they also create some of the core culture too!

For example, "needs more jQuery"

There is not such thing as "too much jQuery"

user259867

@TravisJ My impression is they aren't. When questions are few, people are generally happy to overlook their flaws, if there is any merit to the question at all.

@HomegrownTomato - From my experience they have been.

user259867

Of course, we may be looking at different betas.

7:31 PM

I have even had meta discussion on some of the smaller sites about this and it really discouraged me.

Another example, book lists.

Book lists are not good because over time they rot and they don't fit the format very well

But for a brand new exchange they provide a way for the whole community to kind of maintain something together.

They also generate a decent amount of traffic in general from an SEO standpoint.

user259867

So, who or what is telling new betas "no book lists here"?

@TravisJ I think you're right. We've had some broad questions. We spend time trying to narrow them in scope to be much less broad.

user259867

(On Math, we always had book lists. I hate them, but we still do.)

@HomegrownTomato - Moderators are saying that.

user259867

Moderators come from the community itself, don't they? Ideally they'd be a meta discussion about such things, before the moderators are even appointed.

7:35 PM

I mean cross site moderators.

I can't find the question that I asked which sparked a lot of discussion on the topic because it was deleted.

Ah, nevermind, I found it

@Bart Excellent

It was Shog9 who stepped in

@HomegrownTomato It falls under the "primarily opinion based" or "Questions with too many possible answers or that would require an extremely long answer". It's part of the Tour of every new site. So, that comes from the platform itself when the community is first created

@HomegrownTomato beer.stackexchange.com/questions/556/…

As one example

canon

beer should be automatically promoted

we're all alcoholics anyway

7:38 PM

@Bart In the end I just made chicken fingers. I also finally discovered my favorite breading. Panko + adobo = win.

Turns out pretty much everything + adobo = win. It's like the bacon of spice mixes.

Okay, now I'm hungry again

Not really a fan of breading

Although, Blue Apron is freaking amazing if you can get it in your area

blueapron.com

I like my chicken like I like my coffee. Crusty ... no wait ...

@TravisJ There's a Blue Apron about a 30 minute drive from me; it's pretty baller.

Next time I'm going to bread them in a bag instead of a bowl. The problem I ran into this time is the adobo settles to the bottom of the bowl, so the results are uneven.

Some of these are waaaaay too salty.

I didn't realize you could actually visit their facility.

7:42 PM

@canon I don't drink, so there's that. Yet people still think I'm a drunk.

@TravisJ Looking at the web site you just shared, I'm wondering if they're actually the same Blue Apron. It doesn't really seem like they are.

There's two awesome Blue Apron grocery stores, one in Bk and one in Manhattan, but they don't have the same logo or site as blueapron.com.

@JasonC - If you like Adobo you should add Ancho to it which is a spice form of the pablano pepper

user259867

@TravisJ I wish you'd asked for books that cover some topic really well...

canon

@Bart schizo-drinking/sleep-drinking?

@HomegrownTomato - I didn't know what type of books to ask for. I was hoping for some beginner stuff.

7:44 PM

@TravisJ Oh good call. I actually do have ancho powder, I didn't even think of it.

Sep 27 '13 at 15:10, by Bart

I hllove youou

@HomegrownTomato I closed a references question on CB too. We've had our attempt at fun too (whew...I hate open questions apparently)

@JasonC - Every once in a while I make spiced dried mango. Get some dried mango (preferably from a bin so they are cheap $3/lb). In a large bowl lightly spray then with some lime juice from a little store bought bottle. Once they are lightly coated in lime juice, use ancho, paprika, cayenne, and some crushed red pepper to season them thoroughly. Give them either 30 minutes in the oven at 170 or one day on a counter to dry a little.

Oh nice.

adds to list

I'm lost in cooking.se ....

7:49 PM

Cooking is an awesome site.

@rene don't go through there, that's the oven door

Oops...

I really like the cooking site too, the Seasoned Advice title is also fun :)

And, it's graduated so there.

Where would you rate it on a scale between Lifehacks and 10?

lol

7:51 PM

Up near 10 actually.

Cooking, Aviation, Worldbuilding, those are some of my personal favorites.

Cooking is a nice site, yeah. Even posted an answer there. But mostly a lurker.

I was having a really hard time with a sauce I was trying to make. I had to keep throwing the leftover sauce from making mushrooms away and it was really bothering me. But I asked a question there and it saved all my sauces!

\o/

\o/

ù

...

7:55 PM

train-pls

\o/

\o/

\o/

kick

bluff

@Andy hi, let's not post images that include racial slurs

8:03 PM

@Haney What?

the fourth layer of that has the n-word in it

(@Andy For the record my kick was a joke for breaking the chain.)

the infinite fail bit

@Haney I am sorry. I didn't see that in there.

please be more cautious of image selection, and delete that one

and we'll call it a day here :P

8:04 PM

It's been more than 2 minutes. I can't remove it.

Thanks.

done, no problem

have a good one everyone

keep it classy

Psh. Inferring offense when none is meant is why those cycles continue. /rant

I have no context; I can only operate on seeing an image with the n-word in it, and that's what I'm handling here - nothing more.

And it is resolved.

Cheers!

So...

@JasonC I'll have to find a new combo breaker image for next time.

8:07 PM

\o/

I'll do it...I will

user259867

The role of chat trains in community building

user259867

That could be a title, but I don't have a question to go along with it.

I found one that fits :)

With that, it's time to head home.

\o/

8:14 PM

user259867

More generally, the Tavern should contribute some material for questions in the chat-rooms tag on CB.

user259867

> How to deal with b0rken chat bots whose owners are at least marginally sane?

A: Can we do something about the "beta" label?

And conversely, how to deal with marginally sane chat bots whose owners are b0rken?

user259867

1

I've been a long-time proponent of removing the "beta" label when it no longer makes sense. I agree that it creates a lot of confusion… and a certain stigma when it looks like a site is never going to <quote> "get out of beta." But let's be careful not to replace this system with another set of...

user259867

8:35 PM

You've been a long-time proponent... from which I gather there are some long-time opponents, too. I hope we'll hear their side of the argument. — Homegrown Tomato 20 secs ago

user259867

(and knock some sense into them)

Meh

I can pretend to be a long-time opponent instead of completely apathetic if you'd like.

The opposing argument boils down to "let's graduate / kill more sites instead of making up a new status". Which, let's be honest, would be REALLY NICE if it was at all feasible.

Or you could just kill Lifehacks and call it a day.

user259867

8:38 PM

Once the non-feasible options are removed, what is left on the table?

Gupy

Its what's for dinner

user259867

There are minor league and major league teams. I think it works for them.

feature-request chat feed

Sometimes

user259867

My town won't have an MLB team, ever. But I like going to the ballpark once in a while.

user259867

So I'm pretty happy there is this other status.

user245368

8:41 PM

17

Q: Ticker feeds in Chat

The ticker feeds in chat are interesting, but also annoying. One feature that would make them very nice is a fade feature, where they fade away after displaying for N seconds (perhaps even user adjustable). As an example of this, I didn't clear my ticker for a while, and this is what I got:

"How can I kill a site using only shoe polish and a toothpick?" @JasonC

5

user245368

Apparently people are interested enough to post bounties.

user245368

Hi, @Shog9, I've seen your name all over the place, but I've never met you.

user245368

So, I'm Hosch250. Nice to meet you.

I hate ticker feeds. Please never use them.

user245368

8:42 PM

I don't - the room owner does.

Also, nice to make your acquaintance

@Hosch250 Shog is like the Community user—just a very active bot, but not a real person.

@Hosch250 Lies.

user245368

@AlexisKing Thanks for the clarification.

snickers

8:43 PM

@Hosch250 Pretty much. Shog's a pretty interesting NLP/AI experiment run by the cs.se folks.

user245368

OK.

@Shog9 !!/commands

hmm, seems to be broken

!!/blame

@AlexisKing It's Mooseman's fault.

user245368

It seems to be very successful, seeing as he provides official responses to meta questions regularly.

8:44 PM

Hmm. Must've crashed. I'll have to send out an email to the admin to reboot him.

user245368

I suspect there is a real person behind it, though.

[ SmokeDetector ] Bad keyword in answer: Generate Unique ID (fingerprint) for PC .Net by Roy Dowson on stackoverflow.com

user245368

How are things going over at SO since Bill the Lizard resigned?

@Hosch250 Doubtful. Some pretty decent prediction algorithms though.

2 days ago, by AstroCB

@JonasCz No; he actually predicts what future meta posts will be and then writes answers to them and sets up auto-posting to maximize productivity.

user259867

@SmokeDetector tpu-spam

user245368

8:47 PM

I'm more active on Code Review.

SO IS TOTALLY FALLING APART.

user245368

Flagged as spam.

Yeah, ever since we elected that shady Martijn guy, things have been going downhill.

Since Bill resigned questions have been exclusively about NullPointerExceptions, and stack traces have been banned.

at least the spammers discovered code markup

user245368

8:48 PM

Lol.

@rene The syntax highlighting though... not pretty.

user259867

I wanted to ask my first question on SO, about that "new date from string" confusion... But made the usual mistake of doing research first. So, no question.

@hichris123 post an FR on MSE to add 

We need Spam Review first though.

@HomegrownTomato You're stuck in a pre-Bill-resignation attitude. The tooltips on the upvote and downvote buttons have since been reversed.

user245368

8:50 PM

:O

user245368

Is that why SO had such a reputation for downvoting before?

user245368

The tooltips seem accurate now.

user259867

(The answer was: new Date("2014-06-01") uses UTC because the string is ISO 8601 conforming. new Date("2014-6-1") uses local timezone because the string is not ISO-conforming.)

@AnnaLear Nice job saying "Nobody wants your crappy crowd-sourced site designs" in a friendly way, by the way. (This is actually a real compliment, since I'm trying to work on that technique myself.)

Anna Lear

@JasonC Hah, thanks. :)

8:56 PM

@HomegrownTomato Welcome to JavaScript, land of the wat.

user259867

Yeah, it would be fun to write a script that uses the latter format and have it fall apart on the 10th of October.

9:09 PM

[ SmokeDetector ] Nested quote blocks in body: Store Text to String[] Arrays? by Ahmed Ebrahim on stackoverflow.com

user259867

@SmokeDetector edited

Q: Visual C++ Application Crashes after upgrading from Windows 2003 Server to Windows 2012 Server

9:24 PM

Anybody looking for a good laugh. (warning: medium Win32 knowledge required to fully lol.)

0

So I have this function: HRESULT hr = S_OK; hr = CoCreateInstance(CLSID_CppCmnBL, NULL, CLSCTX_INPROC_SERVER, IID_ICppCmnBL, reinterpret_cast<void**>(&m_pBL)); Here's some information on the CoCreateInstance function: https://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/desktop/ms686615(v=vs.85)...

c# c++ .net c visual-c++

JonasCz

Hi all ! I've been playing around with an idea for an alternative front end to the close queue. The idea is to have a sort of list of questions, taken from the api, having at least one close vote, and a two pane layout. clicking an item on the left loads it in the right pane (instant, no network request), showing comments, the close reason, and letting you close vote it with one click (undo option is there). The main part is having various filters and options for sorting. Thoughts ? Screenshot:

[feature-request] new vtc reason: "...because this question sucks."

cv-pls stackoverflow.com/q/30606909/656243

JonasCz

The biggest problem to making this work is getting questions which have at least one close vote from the api. Again, thoughts ?

@LynnCrumbling maybe the OP is a dev at MS and is the feature owner of COM? goes looking for a decent Linux distro

Q: The Stack Overflow tour is awesome, but shouldn't we have an explanatory video?

@rene HAHAHAHAHAAHA

@rene I ran slackware for years. Manually pulled & compiled everything. Started running Ubuntu and never looked back...

Anybody following this? This guy is getting blasted in comments.

-11

The Stack Overflow Tour is awesome information! So, why isn't it an explainer video yet? http://stackoverflow.com/tour (If I only had more time, I'd create one!)

feature-request help-center

Looks like they turned around toward the end...

9:38 PM

I think I answered it: meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/295882/…

but that comment thread can be moved to chat

user259867

@JonasCz I wrote this thing, which picks newest questions with a close vote or with a downvote (unless there are more upvotes than downvotes).

user259867

There is no way to ask API to filter for having close votes, so I request 200 newest questions (making two calls, 100 each), and filter them client-side.

broad stackoverflow.com/q/30607029/656243

^ needs-one-more

JonasCz

@HomegrownTomato Yeah, was thinking of doing this too, jut that it would be slow. Anyhow, is there any interest in something like this ?

user259867

Maybe some SO closers would. I wouldn't. Many more options than I'd ever use or try to implement. I don't do preferences, and don't care about UI.

user259867

9:43 PM

Plain, unstyled lists and tables, pls.

@JonasCz well, don't become an UX expert.... The only idea I like is the extra filtering. For me the close vote queue works as it is (but I'm one of the few, I guess)

bjb568

am awake

Q: How to setup coinbase wallets for users of my app?

From the worst-idea-ever dept:

0

I would like to have users sign up for my app with email address, and be given a coinbase wallet with as little friction as possible. I would then like to send them some coins to get them started. Is this even possible?

bitcoin coinbase

"Here. Have a wallet I've created. Ha."

"Feel free to use it to stash your extra BC. <grin>"

10:20 PM

reopen-vote-plz meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/295868/…

[ SmokeDetector ] Nested quote blocks in answer: How to wait until WebBrowser is completely loaded in VB.NET? by jangelcaballero on stackoverflow.com

@SmokeDetector edited

bjb568

10:37 PM

@hichris123 LRiO…

user259867

> Success and graduation are not the same thing

user259867

This motto du jour is quite relevant here, when I review transcripts of supposedly-graduating students.

user259867

"Sorry, your GPA doesn't quite get you a diploma. But remember, success and graduation are not the same thing."

bjb568

We have a software thing that lets us see scatterplots of GPA and stuff. Some graduates have like 1.6 GPA…

user245368

I have 3.98.

user245368

10:43 PM

I just finished my sophomore year.

user259867

@Hosch250 Good job. Meanwhile, what's with that Twitter account twitter.com/LearnOneNote ?

user245368

@HomegrownTomato Whoops.

user245368

I wrote an app for the Windows Store called Learn OneNote.

user245368

I set up a Twitter account, but eventually quit development on my app for a more challenging project - Rubberduck, the VBE add-in.

user245368

So, I changed the Twitter to my Hosch250 name.

user245368

10:46 PM

VBA Rubberducking

This chat has moved to Discord: discord.gg/MYX9RECenJ

[ SmokeDetector ] Nested quote blocks in body: Use Parmiter from the methode by Ahmed Ebrahim on stackoverflow.com

user259867

I considered using OneNote in class; we've got some rooms with large tablets that appear to be suitable. I'm not fond of standing in one place and writing on a tablet, though.

user245368

That room is the one with the feed on SO VBA questions.

user245368

I have it on my computer, it is free.