Greeting all! It's time to see if we can get some Moderators for this site!
Most Stack Exchange sites (like Ask Patents) are generally self-moderated by the community. The combination of voting, wiki-style editing, and control over your content makes this all possible. But when something happens...
Is meta the right place to complain/ask about problems I perceive with a specific (minor) SE site? Or should this brought up in the site itself (which feels wrong to me as I am not a member of this site and I just happen to stumble on to it and see disturbing tendencies in the community)
The question is not the problem, the answers are. And Islam.SE seems to be full of it
As it is a religious site, I guess bringing it up on their meta will not be well received. However, I feel SE as a secular company should pay attention to this.
Guys, that was what I am actually trying NOT to do: Have a discussion about religion and what is good, bad or how old/young it is and all what it comes with
It also gives me the feeling it was right to come here first, because if it already gets out-of-hand with so few people involved, well .... what will happen if I post it on meta?!
@dirkk if I understand correctly you're worried that certain answers that you personally don't agree with, may be upvoted, and perhaps even encourage discrimination?
That's the price of freedom of speech, one that must be paid.
@JanDvorak It really does not and I feel you are disrespectful against the Islam and have some prejudices. I am not saying or trying to say in any way that Islam is a "worse" religion than any other.
Yet you seem to want to limit the answers and appreciation of them that those with a specific religion give as supported by (according to them) their religion @dirkk
@Stijn No, the point is that I feel it is not just that I personally not agree with, but that they are not according to the universal declaration of human rights, which also Islam.SE (as all other SE sites) should respect.
@Vogel612 "at least by western standards" is untrue. The universal declaration of human rights was signed by almost all states of the UN, including the arabic ones.
The clash between the declaration of human rights and statements made in religious texts would be an interesting topic of discussion for the main sites @dirkk. But not sure you're getting far by limiting them in their answers they base on the religious texts
@dirkk censoring opinions is a bad thing. Everything should be discussable. It is the only way to change the opinion of someone else. In my country there was a lot of racism, there still is, and I think the taboo status of the subject plays a large role in it.
Sure everything should be discussable, but with guide lines we always had at SE. We do not tolerate hate speech and such and I think SE as a secular company should not allow discrimination because of gender (or other discriminations) on any of the sites.
@Bart well, my point is that I exactly don't want to mess in "their" community: As I am not islamic is it not my place to tell them (or anyone else, e.g. Christianity.SE) what they should do.
@Bart What's the point for me as atheist to downvote content on a religious site?
@JanDvorak In a way, you might be right. I want all SE sites to respect the universal declaration of human rights. What is wrong about that? This is very different than your criticism of the Islam in general.
@JanDvorak You are being nonconstructive. Not every distinction between gender is a discrimination. If you want to know and learn what discrimination is, get in contact with your local human rights activist groups like ai
@dirkk there is nothing wrong about that. But that's all you've brought to the table up to now. When "all they are doing" is answering in the light of their religion on a site where answers should probably in the light of their religion.
@Bart Your statement implies that this discrimination against women is the only view in islam or islan implies discrimination against women, although this is not true. There are many groups within the islamic world having no problem with equality of women.
@Bart It's basically the same as if I would answer from a super-conservative catholic church group like opus dei on Christainity.SE and postulate this is the only allow view in Christianity.
You can stand on the sidelines and say "not true. evil evil evil. Stop it Stack Exchange" ... or you could contribute (no matter your background) and provide information that clearly states otherwise.
From my perspective horribly unsafe code should not be put into answers on Stack Overflow @dirkk. So you downvote, comment, leave correct alternatives ...
@Bart For how realistic do you think it is for an outsider to change something which as it seems to be general consensus of a community? Bringing it up here (and possibly on meta) is me bringing it up
Seeing that this small chat discussion already developed into a religion flame war does not get my hopes up that an actual discussion would be very constructive.
@JanDvorak I don't refuse anything. It was pointed out that I did not participate on Islam.SE yet and I explained why.
@Bart Yeah, but hundred of users "poking" me on a potential MSE question does not feel very good to me. The last thing I want to do is to start a religious debate or hurt someones religious feelings. And unfortunately, discussion anything even remotely touching religion is an almost guaranteed success to being a non-constructive debate.
if you want islam.se to better denote which faction an opinion comes from, go to meta.islam. If you want SE to wipe any answers that conflict the declaration of human rights, go to MSE.
@dirkk well, you want to discuss a religious site. You have to discern whether the answers are accurate about an undesirable and potentially harmful thing, or inaccurate and potentially harmful per se.
if you want to forbid the opinion, bring it up to mse
Problem with forbidding the opinion is that you simply hide it. That doesn't mean it no longer exists and isn't supported by its followers. Underground opinion .... nasty stuff.
@JanDvorak I did not suggest that and have no idea why you think I did. As a community in the whole SE network we have a community guideline, right? I guess on none of the SE sites cursing and so on is tolerated and I think discrimination should not be tolerated as well
@JanDvorak I will. As I said, I come here to ask whether I should bring it up on MSE or somewhere else. Writing the question though will take me some time as it is much more complicate to me than some programming problem...
@dirkk your "discrimination" is their "according to [insert religious text]". Good luck sorting that one out. If you want a site on religion, you're going to have to accept the statements made in light of it. Now, if you say "but that's not supported by the religion at all", you either have a reason to downvote, a reason to comment, or a reason to supply your own answer.
@Bart well, when I look around at Christianity.SE I do not see the same behaviour. For example from their area51 proposal:
"For example, scholars will be interested in questions regarding the authenticity and dating of the Pauline epistles, to a lesser extent scholars might be interested in poetic devices used in genesis, and way off in off-topic land are questions of the "is homosexuality a sin / is faith alone required for salvation" sort which are of no use to anyone outside of evangelists and preachers"
Christianity.SE could also answer in many discriminating ways. (Leviticus 20:13, If a man has sexual relations with a man as one does with a woman, both of them have done what is detestable. They are to be put to death). Yet, I haven't seen this on Christianity.SE as answer
@JanDvorak Maybe. If one solution could be to limit the scope of the site, that would be one way.
I am not saying I have the solution or all the answers, I just see a problem in the way it currently is. For sure there are many ways how to improve this, limiting the scope could be one of them.
@Frank My point was exactly that, that also in Islam you have to read in context and every religion could potential conflict with human rights, not just Islam.
@dirkk Islam as a religion conflicts with human rights. That doesn't mean that we can't have an Islam.SE. The site itself is made up of the community members, so it is they who are being 'discriminate', not 'the site'. Therefore, it is possible for an Islam q/a site to be part of a secular network.
@Frank well, we kind of already had this dicussion so I am not willing to repeat me, although I would like to explicitly state that all religion stands in conflict with human rights, but religion itself is a human rights (actually, a lot of human rights are in conflict with each other).
However, I think for now I am going back to my simple world of AngularJS directives, which is by far easier to understand than religious debates...
> "I downvote or close questions if they are extremly poor but before doing that I write a comment but people in revenge used to register my email in porn sites
@Stijn On the OP's previously question, which this question is kind of an extension of, the OP commented that they had figured it out on their own. When thriqon suggested at the OP post an answer detailing what resolved it, their solution was to post a link as a comment. sigh
@Stijn Oddly enough, the OP posted code in that previous Q, but not this one.
@Vogel612 read as: . is a function that takes a function from B to C and a function from A to B and returns a function from A to C, where A, B, C are any types
@Lynn so you were in the no1 gay town in Germany for half a year and made a trip to the one state of Germany that doesn't want to be German, but independant?
@Vogel612 Most US cities have no train system to get from place to place. DC has a metro. NYC has subways. Philly has the L (elevated) .. but Lancaster, York... nope.
@Vogel612 Busses - yes, but if you want to go from city-to-city, there isn't much... busses, trains, or otherwise. And forget about making it a regular commute. The only solution to that is getting a car.
