Tavern on the Meta

Moshe

12:15 AM

@drachenstern incorrect. According to the FAQ (at last read) you may ask a question which you know the answer to.

drachenstern

1:04 AM

Yes yes, but in this case I don't think you would be adding a lot to the world of non-googlable questions

Moshe

Ok.

drachenstern

Remember, I am fallible. I do not always have the best advice. I am but one man. I rarely listen to my own advice.

ircmaxell

lol

> "Live a good life. If there are gods and they are just, then they will not care how devout you have been, but will welcome you based on the virtues you have lived by. If there are gods, but unjust, then you should not want to worship them. If there are no gods, then you will be gone, but will have lived a noble life that will live on in the memories of your loved ones." -- Marcus Aurelius

drachenstern

1:24 AM

Indeed

Hogan

drat everyone is gone

drachenstern

I am not

ircmaxell

nor am I

Hogan

yay!

that was funny... blame the AHA

u are mostly quiet @ircmaxell -- unless you can pop in to be a spoiler (:

ircmaxell

I am quiet? I don't think so. Perhaps in this particular room

Hogan

1:27 AM

ah... maybe that is it.

ircmaxell

I'm active on the Php room over on so

Quick question: can anyone recommend a functional language to learn?

Hogan

linq

sorry that was a joke.

What do you want to do with said functional language?

ircmaxell

learn it

Hogan

so... no goal?

ircmaxell

I feel very comfortable with OOP and the languages I've use it in. So now I'd like to broaden my knowledge by learning another paradigm

Hogan

1:30 AM

well I would say sml if you want to get ...

how to put it.

elegant / clean

but really right now you will probably get the most value out of JavaScript.

go with node.js

so you don't have any of the client stuff of browsers getting in the way.

ircmaxell

well, node isn't functional.

Hogan

sml or prolog for the "real deal"

ircmaxell

I know you can kind of do functional in it

Hogan

sure it is.

drachenstern

@ircmaxell I would suggest learning how to redo javascript programs as functional

ircmaxell

1:35 AM

that may work

drachenstern

screw "node.js" and just write javascript programs

it doesn't have to be tailored to a particular platform

Hogan

isn't that what node.js gives you?

drachenstern

huh?

node.js is to javascript as asp.net is to c#

Hogan

node.js pulls out JavaScript from the browsers -- thus no platform.

drachenstern

I can also run C# to create console apps

I can also use C# to create WPF or WCF etc

Hogan

1:37 AM

oh oh...

you are saying using node.js is using node.js as a platform.

got it.

drachenstern

yeah

Hogan

it is a point. but node.js is so bare bones... I see it like saying a c compiler is a platform.

mootinator

Or php?

Hogan

@ircmaxell What I was trying to say before is this -- you can pick a functional language just to get an understanding of what it all means. For that an old school one is best -- Prolog, Standard ML, Lisp variant...

ircmaxell

yeah, Was thinking about either Clojure or Haskal

Hogan

1:42 AM

or you can pick a more modern functional language which are not as "pure" -- but can be more easily used in the real world -- for these I would pick F#, Python, JavaScript -- etc

I actually don't know much about Clojure.

ircmaxell

it's a lisp derivative

drachenstern

What we need is a Wheel of Languages

Hogan

oy

ircmaxell

lol

Hogan

Lisp.. you will wear out the ( and the ) on your keyboard.

mootinator

1:44 AM

@drachenstern WoLK?

drachenstern

K?

Hogan

Drives me bonkers -- but some people love it.

mootinator

@drachenstern Added for ambiguity.

drachenstern

It certainly Kept that at the forefront

Hogan

@ircmaxell I was a fan of Standard ML, I liked the syntax the best.

ircmaxell

1:47 AM

I'll take a peak

drachenstern

ok, who here uses git?

Hogan

I believe Haskell is very similar.

I've used a bit of git.

drachenstern

how do I get submodules recursively?

isn't that what you call when you have a separate package installed under a primary package?

I'm a mercurial guy normally

Hogan

yeah.

drachenstern

as you can see I'm learning

Hogan

1:49 AM

that is what submodules are.

do you want to merge with your local or stomp on your local

drachenstern

stomp on my local

I don't know that they've been pulled down yet

I doubt they have

Hogan

git fetch

will stomp

and

get pull

will merge.

then for the sub-modules....

don't know them so well..

looky here cheat.errtheblog.com/s/git

there is a submodules section near the bottom

drachenstern

yeah, I'm bookmarking that

Hogan

Why you using git if you are a mercurial guy?

drachenstern

because I'm learning node and everything in that realm is in git

Tim Stone

2:05 AM

I just use hg-git, because I'm lazy like that.

drachenstern

that seems like more work than git

Tim Stone

It's pretty trivial. Although Dulwich was/is having issues, so then I had to crash-course in Python, but that's another story.

mootinator

WoPHPMVCFW

Hogan

I wish I had time to play with node -- looks like a lotta fun.

Anyway I off to bed goodnight.

@drachenstern I leave you with this : ktown.kde.org/~zrusin/git/git-cheat-sheet-medium.png

drachenstern

now that's a cheatsheet

mootinator

3:40 AM

fails at helping with homework.

Yi Jiang

Huh, so does this oy thingadongdong actually work?

drachenstern

4:10 AM

eh?

Yi Jiang

in Oy. on The Stack Exchange Network Chat, 24 mins ago, by Oy

in The Tavern (General) on Meta Stack Overflow Chat, 3 mins ago, by Yi Jiang

Huh, so does this oy thingadongdong actually work?

It does, yay!

drachenstern

Ah, somebody built a new javascript function eh?

Yi Jiang

@drachenstern Well no, he just plonked the RSS feed of a search for 'oy' in this room into the feedbot of that room

drachenstern

ok, so somebody learned a hackery thing to do to make that room have activity ...

whatever you want to call it, cute trick

Tim Stone

6:14 AM

Ah, nothing quite like 02:00 coffee. So much for fixing my sleep schedule it seems.

Yi Jiang

@TimStone It's a particularly hot afternoon here, 33 degrees. I want some ice coffee

Tim Stone

I'm kind of wishing I went that route myself. It's apparently cool enough in the rest of the house for the air conditioning not to come on, but it's unpleasantly warm where I am at the moment.

So hot coffee was probably a poor choice.

Reno

6:26 AM

@YiJiang Kopi Taim

I really loved those shops

I did not know how to order though

Yi Jiang

@Reno In Hokkian, but they should also take English these days

Don't know why Wiki spells it as two words, but it's usually one

Reno

8:31 AM

Jin is really pimpin' out there on the SO blog

Tim Stone

@Reno Hahah, I got a good laugh out of that photo.

Reno

haha yeah If he is not too careful he end up being covered up by bitches

(the NYC office I think)

Yi Jiang

9:27 AM

reddit.com/r/linux/comments/hd5sx/…

I'll... just leave this here

balpha

that's awesome

Reno

It's the ffmpeg guy

Reno

9:58 AM

Some you-know-whos have to take this grammar test

Benjol

10:15 AM

helooooo metaheads. lunch break here... so theoretically defensible misuse of internet :)

@balpha congrats on MIX video, very sexy ;)

Reno

Incoming spam

balpha

I'm not sure you've watched the same video I did...

@Reno killed

Reno

thank you :)

Benjol

@balpha, actually it was very strange seeing the three of you. It's a bit like reading a book and then seeing the film. I can't say I imagined that you looked different, I think I just didn't imagine a look at all, your entire identities were symbolised by a name and a gravatar :)

balpha

well, I have my photo in my gravatar :)

and Sam kinda does

Sam Saffron ♦, Sydney, Australia

20.5k 2 41 111

c# .net sql-server sql ruby ruby-on-rails tsql

Benjol

10:20 AM

@balpha You looked a bit different to that though :)

Maybe it was the jet lag :)

Sankar Ganesh

10:37 AM

what is this denotes flag weight 528.5188

why i m able to see flag weight with more digits

@Benjol: and @balpha: Please clear my Dobut

balpha

3

Q: Unnecessary precision displayed for flag weight

I currently have a flag weight of 531.7108. Is it just me, or are the 4 digits of precision after the decimal point just a tad unnecessary? Borderline bug I think.

support flag-weight

Sankar Ganesh

@balpha: Thanks

Benjol

anyways, lunch break over, back to trying to be productive, though this guy (author of Yi's link above) makes me want to give up...

Reno

10:57 AM

@SankarGanesh It's not nice to ping everyone

put the question here and anyone who is free will get back to you

Sankar Ganesh

@Reno Sure

George Marian

mutters something about it being to effing early to be awake

Loïc Wolff

11:59 AM

It's 2 in the afternoon where I am, so you're effing late for effing sake!

George Marian

LOL

Yi Jiang

@LoïcWolff It's 8 pm where I'm at, so you're free to go for the night

George Marian

Well, it's 5 AM here. It's still freakin early.

Loïc Wolff

@YiJiang 8 PM? Too bad I'm not paid overtime :)

George Marian

1:24 PM

> Let's face it, the only way the US administration could have got more column inches out of the outrage was if bin Laden had been caught in bed with a Las Vegas hooker and a bottle of Scotch, toking on a post-coital spliff while reading The Satanic Verses.

Gotta love El Reg.

balpha

-13

Q: Shutdown computer using CSS

Hi Guys, I want to shutdown my computer using CSS. Please tell me the different ways. Thanks

html css ajax css3 microsoft

George Marian

ROFL

Tim Stone

Hahahah

Well, they already made the mistake of adding in marquee to CSS3, maybe they'll get around to the computer shutdown transition in CSS4 ;)

George Marian

1:40 PM

Shutdown transitions. Nice.

Tim Stone

For giving your users a feeling of "WTF is happening to my computer?" when they visit your site. It's an atmosphere thing.

George Marian

LOL

ircmaxell

was an update just pushed to chat?

It's acting really funny for me (notifications aren't going away, pressing enter actually sends the message, but inserts a new line in the new message box, misc jumping around, etc)

Tim Stone

1:57 PM

Hm, seems alright to me. Which browser are you using?

ircmaxell

FF4

just started all of a sudden about 20 minutes ago

Tim Stone

> Did you graduate in the last 15 years (1996 thru 2011)? If so, you’ll want to take a trip down memory lane and join us for a Happy Hour reception at the Mill Creek Tavern

Hmmmm

My university is offering me free alcohol and food. That might be hard to pass up. Crafty alumni association.

ircmaxell

nice

ircmaxell

2:20 PM

Ohhh, fixed the bug. Turns out it was FF

Tim Stone

3

A: Careers Candidate Search is Relentless

Who knew a little unbounded recursion hidden in a callback was gonna get us a new testimonial? Should be bounded now :) Thanks for the report.

Ahaha

@ircmaxell Ah, what was the issue?

ircmaxell

Well, chat uses the local data store in the browser

I had run out of disk space, so the local store started throwing exceptions

but after I cleared up some space, it never stopped throwing the exceptions until I restarted it

Tim Stone

Ahh

ircmaxell

after a restart of the browser it worked fine

Yi Jiang

@TimStone Ahahaha

Nyuszika7H

2:43 PM

chat.meta.stackoverflow.com/rooms/349/…

LOL, it's frozen...

Yi Jiang

@Nyuszika7H TheFrozenRoomException

Nyuszika7H

lulz

Yi Jiang

catch(exception){
    if(exception === 'room frozen'){
        echo 'paging @balpha!';
    }
}

balpha

ReferenceError: echo is not defined

actually it's also a syntax error

Yi Jiang

@balpha try { 'punch @balpha in the face'; }

balpha

2:47 PM

chat.meta.stackoverflow.com/rooms/349/…

Loïc Wolff

And the exception is a string! Bah!

balpha

@YiJiang finally { regret(); }

2

Nyuszika7H

#!/usr/bin/env ruby
begin
    join_matching_rooms(/Rename The(.*?)Exception/)
rescue RoomFrozenException
    balpha.page
    balpha.punch_in_face
end

#!/usr/bin/env python
try:
    import re
    join_matching_rooms(re.compile('Rename The(.*?) Exception'))
except RoomFrozenException:
    page(balpha)
    punch_in_face(balpha)
# end

Forgot to add the ! to the end of balpha.punch_in_face... it's destructive...

Loïc Wolff

what's up with the end in the Python version?

Nyuszika7H

Oy

@LoïcWolff ahh, right, Python doesn't use end. I use # end to indicate block ends, though.

Loïc Wolff

2:52 PM

that's better!

you can also add

from stackexchange.team import balpha

4

Haha

@LoïcWolff Typo

Thanks

Now I can star it :P

The package '); DROP TABLE Users;-- does not exist. Please verify the package name

@YiJiang what language?

Loïc Wolff

2:57 PM

BalphaScript

4

drachenstern

So I have a question for le room, might be better suited for another place, idk

2

since our last SOMeetup was such a resounding success, we are doing another one tomorrow night.

However, this area is pretty techy even tho it doesn't seem to be (most likely true of everywhere, but this is where I happen to be)

Should I encourage the group to continue to meet under the auspices of SO/SEI, or should I encourage the group to come up with our own identity for our area?

Our state is looking to bring in real money to help encourage more tech in this area, both in the case of knowledge workers/IT pros, and in the case of things like FIOS etc.

So us having a core community of enthusiastic and veterate techheads and geeks would be a really good thing

being able to identify them as part of a worldwide phenomenon might be even better, or it might not

that could detract when it comes to decisions by the state, as they would view us as some arm of a larger group, and that we weren't really a dedicated community in the state

granted, you can't keep our type rooted just by willpower, and if we feel the need to migrate, we will (and do) so being part of a larger group just shows that we have like-minded brethren that might want to migrate here, especially if we show that this is a good place to be.

thoughts, opinions? rude remarks?

Yi Jiang

Microecons 101 - if the Australian government responds to a British tobacco export tax cut by raising taxes so that the prices stay even, what would be the change in revenue experienced by the tobacco companies, as per reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/hczwm/…

Tim Stone

@drachenstern Scrum! shakes fist

Yi Jiang

I don't see any changes at all, unless my analysis is incorrect...?

drachenstern

@TimStone well yes, that is a rude opinion :p

Yi Jiang

3:06 PM

Hmmm, this is assuming that it is the same company moving the tobacco from England to Australia

Tim Stone

@YiJiang Does it say which taxes are raised? If the sales taxes are raised, the tobacco company makes off better since it only has to pay the export taxes. If there's some import tax then I'd suspect there's no difference.

Yi Jiang

@TimStone I assumed import, but you're right, it could be sales

Tim Stone

@YiJiang Ah, it seems that it isn't sales tax, but an excise on tobacco, related to volume (so it's functionally the same as an import tax).

Moshe

3:23 PM

Why does Google Trabslate always pick the wrong word for the context you want translated?

It's as though it speaks it's own language.

@drachenstern I'm not sure what your question is...

Something about gathering "under the SO name" or not, but I didn't get the rest.

Popular Demand

@drachenstern My thought is that you should ping rchern with this.

Loïc Wolff

3:40 PM

ask @Nyuszika7H "The Code™" to do that.

Careful, might be oy-related. More than you can handle.

mootinator

I've been trying to manifest a 'CONCAT' aggregate in SQL Server through positive thinking, but it hasn't happened yet. What other steps might I try?

drachenstern

@PopularDemand I did. Do you have psychic powers? Do you know what her response was?

mootinator

And if so, @PopularDemand can you manifest that concat function for me?

Popular Demand

@drachenstern I think it's pretty clear that I don't. Also, your name is italicized; when did that happen?

mootinator

I don't think the universe cares that I don't want to put an ugly bit of code up.

Oh, I'm doing it wrong, apparently.

Law of Attraction

The Law of Attraction is a metaphysical New Thought belief that "like attracts like", that positive and negative thinking bring about positive and negative physical results, respectively. According to the Law of Attraction, the phrase "I need more money" allows the subject to continue to "need more money". If the subject wants to change this they would focus their thoughts on the goal (having more money) rather than the problem (needing more money). This might take the form of phrases such as "I have as much money as I need" or "I have a job that pays very well". Interpretation Skeptic...

I can't think "I need an aggregate function" I have to think "I already have all the functions I need".

Wait a minute, this is a scam!

drachenstern

3:52 PM

@PopularDemand some time ago. She said she was too sleepy, try again later.

@mootinator this.

Popular Demand

@RebeccaChernoff, are you sleepy?

drachenstern

@mootinator this is for MS SQL and you need to string together a bunch of results into one long string?

mootinator

@drachenstern Yes, and I'm aware of several ways of doing that, I'm just dragging my feet about it because the query I need to add it to is already a clusterf***.

Which suggests a UDF might be the way to go.

drachenstern

wait, why does it have to happen in the query?

I was gonna suggest a stringbuilder

mootinator

oky

drachenstern

3:57 PM

ok, dumb question: when I goto my user profile, down by the tags are some x ## what do those x number mean?

mootinator

Let me wrap my head around that for a sec.

drachenstern

@mootinator if you don't need it till you get out of the query, a foreach(string in results) sb.Append(string); sb.ToString() would be easier to code

mootinator

I'm not sure if that will work.

drachenstern

why not?

my code was not syntactically accurte

but the concept is true

additionally, it could be done with LINQ in even less lines of code, but I fail at that without an IDE

mootinator

Okay, it would work then.

I'd just have to rewrite this and do all the processing with LINQ.

Still not pretty.

drachenstern

4:05 PM

why would you have to do all the processing with LINQ?

You've still not answered that question

do you need it concat'd before you continue?

does the concating further impact future SQL?

mootinator

I'm joining aggregate data with non aggregate data in the query.

Trying to answer two questions, really.

1. Was this resource billed out for more than 10 hours on any day (excluding monthly and weekly tickets)

2. Was this billed out at all during the same month as a monthly charge, or during the same week as a weekly charge.

drachenstern

so how does concat'ing help?

for days where it did occur?

mootinator

I have quite the ugly query for that, but now they want to know:

drachenstern

like '1,3,4,5,6'

mootinator

What invoice numbers (could be up to 3, or more in theory) in a given day are the ones which add up to more than 10 hours.

drachenstern

4:11 PM

so yeah, a UDF would be better

maybe something with a pivot orientation too

Tim Stone

> @Tim, quick, add this to your resume! – Popular Demand 1h ago

Hah :P

Sankar Ganesh

4:51 PM

Hi All, I m Back, I have a Question on Flag weight, what happened if flag weight corresed 700 , i will get any gold badage

drachenstern

no

probably they will come to your house and beat you with a Giant S

my advice? IGNORE your flag weight.

Sankar Ganesh

hehehehehehe why @drachenstern

drachenstern

because it doesn't mean anything to you. It's a meaningless metric. All it means is "I helped contribute positively to the policing of the system".

they really should have "helpful, average, nonhelpful" for the flag weight display

that's all that's important. Either you help with flagging, or you hinder

if you even give one iota of thought to your flag weight, you've given it WAY too much thought.

Sankar Ganesh

Ok Mate, cool

:)

drachenstern

I would rather ask you to spend time editing answers to be current (for things that are older than 18 months and that are now wrong - preferably by adding comments) or to edit questions to be more understandable.

or preferably, instead, to answer questions.

but flagging, that's just not something to be concerned about, other than "am I doing it right"

Sankar Ganesh

4:58 PM

Well saiid @drachenstern

Yi Jiang

> why did you close it? i was gaining good number of up votes! lol :) – Bhushan 16m ago

:|

Tim Stone

shakes head

Sankar Ganesh

5:10 PM

Guys, please see my blog, and tell how to apply java code styles in my blog

sankarganesh-info-exchange.blogspot.com

drachenstern

you need something like this (hold please)

alexgorbatchev.com/SyntaxHighlighter

Sankar Ganesh

yes, absolutely this what i wanted, Thanks, My dear Friend...

drachenstern

5:27 PM

well, chat.SE has rolled over a million messages

in Ask Ubuntu General Room on The Stack Exchange Network Chat, 7 mins ago, by Rinzwind

good for the opera dudes and dudettes :D

ircmaxell

5:49 PM

looks like 723k here, unless the ids aren't linear

in Chat feedback on Stack Overflow Chat, Oct 8 '10 at 9:37, by Feeds

All feedback welcome!

@Feeds has the first post?

drachenstern

@ircmaxell I wouldn't doubt it

ircmaxell

that's post id #1

drachenstern

@ircmaxell I saw that :p

ircmaxell

:-X

Tim Stone

6:46 PM

> This message contains an event that this version of Lightning cannot process.

Well that's uncool.

Popular Demand

7:02 PM

Argh, just clicked "flag for attention" by mistake when I was aiming for "show 30 more." Clearly, it's time to go ask an MSO question requesting that those links be moved farther apart from each other.

Wes

@PopularDemand Haven't there been other requests for the same?

Popular Demand

@Wes I have no idea. I wasn't serious about asking.

Wes

@PopularDemand I think I've seen such a request before

Popular Demand

@Wes I wouldn't be surprised. People come to MSO with every conceivable request for UI tweaks and account settings and information options and whatnot.

(Which is actually what my original comment was alluding to.)

Wes

@PopularDemand yeah not picking up on sarcasm today

mootinator

7:10 PM

Microsoft is funny.

Popular Demand

@Wes Not your fault, I didn't really give you much reason to think I was being sarcastic.

@mootinator I demand evidence of humor.

mootinator

"You must install Zune software to update your phone."

They think they're Apple. It's cute.

ircmaxell

lol

Popular Demand

7:45 PM

Am I mad for reporting this?

0

Q: Main page question information doesn't match question page

I just saw the question in screenshot 1 after clicking on the link in screenshot 2. Note that the closure and vote count are mismatched. I did a hard refresh (Ctrl + F5) of both pages before taking the screenshots. The question is Please help me. I cant add topics. I know a lot of caching ha...

bug closed-questions votes frontpage

Tim Stone

@PopularDemand On Meta at least it normally takes about 30 seconds for the home page to reflect changes in the question, but it sounds like much more time than that had passed in your case.

Popular Demand

@TimStone It's now been 18 minutes and I'm still seeing it.

Tim Stone

Yeah, I see the same thing.

It's correct on the tag page, but not on the home page.

Popular Demand

<speculation wildness="very">I wonder if this has to do with question downvotes becoming free for voters.</speculation>

Tim Stone

There's lag in displaying questions as having accepted answers as well.

Though it all seems very inconsistent.

Hard to tell if it's supposed to be like that or not, heh.

Nyuszika7H

7:57 PM

@PopularDemand I can't reproduce it in Firefox 4.

Popular Demand

@Nyuszika7H I saw. Were you on the main page of SO?

Nyuszika7H

@PopularDemand No.

Popular Demand

@Nyuszika7H Well, that's why. This is only occurring on the main page. I'll edit to clarify that in a moment.

Hogan

I just posted the following comment "but that is the last requirements change I will accept." I wonder if the asker found it as amusing as I did.

Tim Stone

Heh :P

Popular Demand

8:00 PM

@Hogan I feel like I'm missing some context on this one.

Hogan

He asked a question

I answered

In comments he changed the question

I answered

In comments he changed the question

(repeat 5 times)

He just changed again.... I'm not answering.

Popular Demand

Ah, a chameleon.

Hogan

Sort of. It was an sql question... and he kept "narowing" the requirements -- so it was not as bad as some.

Popular Demand

> Flag these for moderator attention. These questions need to be reverted and locked. This is a total perversion of how a Q&A site works, and must be stopped outright. Repeat offenders should be dealt with by the mods as they see fit (Ideally this involves Ninjas, but suspensions work, too).

That was the unofficial but highest-voted answer to my question on the topic.

Hogan

@PopularDemand This might explain why a one year old question of mine got down voted today.

Popular Demand

8:06 PM

@Hogan Perhaps. I admit to being one of the people who wouldn't downvote many bad questions in the past because of the rep hit. Once I pass 10k I won't care as much, but that's still far away.

Hogan

My question was not so bad. The down vote was political. (shrug)

@PopularDemand Yeah I should... but I feel for the guy. If he reads my latest answer he should be able to figure it out.

In fact, my question was good in that it has gotten about 400 or so views in the last year.... clearly still something people are interested in.

Popular Demand

@Hogan Oh. That sucks. You know how it is, though... as soon as you create a system, someone else will try to figure out how to game it.

Hogan

I don't care. 2 points out of 10,000 is small. I will get to 10k at some point and then it all become moot.

ircmaxell

exactly