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12:00 AM
That sounded harsh, it wasn't meant to; I've done the same thing, and been downvoted, and deserved it.
They were called "FKEY resources", and they were Mac OS "CODE" resources renamed to "FKEY" with Resource Fork IDs 0 - 9
The System suitcase was one of two principal files comprising Mac OS from the original release to System 9.2.2, the other being the Macintosh Finder. The suitcase was located in the System Folder along with the Finder file and contained keyboard layouts, FKEY resources, sounds, and in System 6, bitmap fonts and Desk Accessories. Prior to System 7, the Font/DA Mover had to be used to move these into or out of the System suitcase. From System 7 and on, the Finder could open and modify the contents of the file. Over the course of subsequent releases, many of the user-serviceable items store...
> In System 6, the string "Help! Help! We're being held prisoner in a system software factory!" appears in the data fork <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Data_fork> of the System file; in System 7, it was updated to "Help! Help! We're still being held prisoner in a system software factory!". Later versions of System 7 alter the message further. A list of credits also follows in each case
I love it
@TheUnhandledException Nice!
I wonder if anyone ever found that and went to the cops.
Either believing it to be true or getting the joke but trying to fool the cops.
LOL. I remember seeing it when I tried to hack around in the system software. Prior to Mac OS 9, all applications / executable code on Mac OS was stored only in resource forks. opening apps with a text editor would normally show a 0 byte, totally empty file
@GraceNote I had just finished digging a nice tunnel, so I figured that a small break couldn't hurt. ;)
@TheUnhandledException Fascinating!
12:04 AM
@TheUnhandledException While it does seem that way...No, actually, let's go with that. :P
I sense sarcasm :-)
@TimStone I see. But this has been a long break, hasn't it? ♪
I'm having trouble logging in to Stack Exchange with my primary OpenID. Something's screwy on my WordPress site and I get either "No OpenID Endpoint Found" or:
> Unable to log in with your OpenID provider:

The OpenID Provider issued an assertion for an Identifier whose discovery information did not match. Assertion endpoint info: ClaimedIdentifier: technobabbl.es ProviderLocalIdentifier: technobabbl.es/author/voyagerfan5761 ProviderEndpoint: technobabbl.es/index.php/openid/server OpenID version: 2.0 Service Type URIs: Discovered endpoint info: []
I've never seen that mismatch error before.
@GraceNote Hm...you may be right. Perhaps... unacceptably long. o_o hears Minecraft noises echoing in the back of his mind
@TheUnhandledException RE: Switch statements: That is what the chat uses, but :P
@Voyagerfan5761 You're probably going to want to post that to MSO.
12:07 AM
@Voyagerfan5761 I got that before, sec
Q: Can't log in: Error occurred while sending a direct message or getting the response

Joshua GitlinThis belongs on Meta but I can't ask it there since, well, I can't log in :-) I'm unable to log into my account using my OpenID, josh.gitlin.name on either StackOverflow or Meta. The error message I receive after entering my OpenID on the login page and pressing "Login" is: Unable to log in ...

@TimStone My mission is complete. ♪
@Tim: But it's ugly right?
Do you understand what I'm asking, sans-ruby? :-)
Q: Login to SO via Verisign failing

I've just been logged out of SO and now cannot login again. My OpenId provider is verisign, and I can log into my account there OK. The message SO is displaying is: Unable to log in with your OpenID provider: Error occurred while sending a direct message or getting the response. An...

@TheUnhandledException I'm not sure, apparently I should be heading back to Minecraft ;)
@Voyagerfan5761 That's the dupe on Meta.
12:09 AM
It's actually not that ugly in the chat's code, but they're doing things a bit differently anyway.
But I do understand your question, yes.
I guess I didn't mean ugly, I meant "not very OOP-esque"
wants to strangle some devs
I meant, "The ruby poets do not approve, the groupies I will not have!!!"
Thanks everyone. I'll go and investigate. Hopefully I'll be able to fix it and get in to the writers.stackexchange.com beta. Cheers!
12:11 AM
Sure thing
What's funny is I found that question of mine by googling for "josh gitlin meta" :-D
Right. I would have suggested something like what the given answer uses. Ultimately in these cases where you turn some primitive ID value into an object of type x, there's always going to be some sort of semi-ugly step.
His was really elegant!
I liked it, and it was very ruby-poet like.
Maybe if I do it that way @rchern will be my groupie!!!
I use a similar technique for instantiating rules in this project based on their XML node names.
Hahahah. ;)
Cool. This is the kind of question I love asking other devs. I know I can make it function, but how do I make the code beautiful?
Thanks for the advice @Tim!
Yeah, my code isn't particularly beautiful, heh. But I'll go with that. ;)
12:16 AM
Mine often isn't. And we have few developers here, and they're all under me, so nobody complains. Which is why I get... nervous? self conscious?... when working on part of an open source, community project. I want my work to shine, not be spaghetti :-)
And I want my groupies and my macbook, dammit! ;-)
Yeah, half of what I do is open source, so I'm very self-conscious, heh. Thankfully very few people look at my code anyway. :P
Sweet. I want more free time to do more OSS
To be fair, the bulk of that is work-related.
@TheUnhandledException say what now?
LOL... nothing! Nothing at all! :-)
Go back to your chili :-)
12:29 AM
Wait, @rchern has chili that she isn't sharing with the rest of us?
She doesn't yet. She needs to go to the grocery store.
I said nothing @Tim!
Annual chili cook-off at work tomorrow. (:
@rchern Nice.
Oh wow, sounds like delicious fun. :)
Hmm...And now to pick something to work on.
12:42 AM
@TheUnhandledException - what's the latest with the XMPP implementation?
I am adding a bridge for chat.SE as we speak :-)
An instance of the SO-XMPP script
so the SE chat rooms will be available via XMPP
As we say in hebrew, מה זה?
As opposed to before when... ?
oh, you mean SE, not just SO/SU/SF?
I mean SE specificlaly
12:45 AM
can you work on the authentication?
That's important.
Unless I can log in with my already-in-use gmail account or OpenID, I'm sticking to the browser end of things.
Two stars on the chili conversation - to highlight the smiles being opposite directions
And really, does Jeff read Meta? Why did my proposal get no response?
Sorry, was making the announcement
I need help with authentication!
I am not sure how to make it any easier
12:49 AM
What can I do for you?
Brainstorm :-)
What about making a program that copies the cookies?
I agree it's clumsy and difficult
But I am not sure how to improve it
Like, a utility that will get you the cookie info and send it to your server.
What info does your end use to identify users?
Like, if I send in a message, how does it identify me as not logged in?
My info authenticates users based on them sending their fkey and cookie at the moment
12:50 AM
If there are 2,3 or more users who all connect at once, and none are authenticated, what is tied to them?
Each user, based on their JID, has an instance of the class SOXMPP_LoggedInUser
IP address?
What is a JID?
This class contains two private member variables: cookie and fkey
JID is your jabber ID. Like moshe@gmail.com
what language are you writing in?
12:52 AM
Don't know Ruby, but let me see what we can come up with.
But, the language isn't the problem. The biggest problem is how to make it easy for users to get their somusr cookie
the cookie is given to the chat client, right?
if you can describe an easier method and an easier way to get the somusr cookie, I can do the Ruby
yes, the cookie is sent via SO's servers to the browser
And because of cookie security, we can't just copy and paste a cookie from one directory to the other.
But it's marked HTTP only so JavaScript can't read it
12:53 AM
Is there a way to "invalidate" the cookie for SO so that SO won't accept it and then read it?
I presume a tampered cookie becomes invalid.
I'm not sure
but if it's copied (thereby invalidated) it's fine because your system can read it.
As long as you tell it to.
It sounds like you're trying to set a cookie in a chat client
sorry, say again?
Because the whole idea of XMPP is to not use the browser, in favor of a chat client
which part?
> It sounds like you're trying to set a cookie in a chat client
12:55 AM
When I'm using your system, I'm using a chat client, not a browser.
I'm not sure what you're asking
But, the StackOverflow servers don't know that :-)
My server is a bridge between XMPP messages and HTTP POSTs to the chat, as if the browser were doing them
So where do cookies come in? I thought cookies were part of the way browsers work.
So that's why it needs your cookie. It essentially impersonates you
What about using AJAX to read the cookie?
You can impersonate HTTP through AJAX and then get the cookie like that.
They do. You send the cookie to the XMPP server, and every message you post to the XMPP server, it creates an HTTP POST with your cookie, as if it were a browser
OK. Now you're on to something. @Tim, WAKE UP! STOP PLAYING MINECRAFT!
12:57 AM
But what about for reading the cookie intially?
To quote you:
@Tim, can we make an Ajax request and read it's headers to get the SO chat cookie?
> But it's marked HTTP only so JavaScript can't read it
You answered your own question
You suggested Ajax which is a great idea
What's up?
I wonder if we can circumvent the restrictions...
12:58 AM
Oh, no.
That was actually a bug in Firefox for a while.
browser developers are smarter than I
Sorry Moshe. No dices
Meh, Safari?
I revert to my third party idea.
Cookies are text files.
You don't need to pull them in from your end.
I mean, for that matter, the server could make its own request if you had a good method for validating users.
1:00 AM
You need users to install a utility which reads the actual cookie file from the Firefox (or browser) cache. That utility can upload the cookie itself.
This won't be easy
It's a matter of:
b)Browser/OS path checking
How hard can it be if the user wants the program to run?
(Yay me for oversimplifying things.)
I believe Firefox stores cookies in SQLite, but yeah.
Firefox Addons can read them
Firebug can read HTTP only cookies
Yeah, of course.
1:02 AM
SE Chat bridge is now running!
in The SE Tavern on The Stack Exchange Network Chat, 2 mins ago, by Josh
The bridge is now up an running. To join this room, join the XMPP/Jabber MUC: the-se-tavern@sechat.smart-safe-secure.com
So maybe look into firefox and firebug related stuff...
A firefox addon to log you in?
Wait, how does FireBug read HTTP only cookies?
If it's done, it's doable.
It's an Addon
Addons have more access I guess
I doubt Firebug lite can do it
So perhaps an addon is a good start.
Yeah, and we could possibly make a Chrome one too
Once you get a valid cookie it should remain valid
Ok, I got to get working on College Admission essays.
1:06 AM
I know I need to make the system allow you to auth in one room and that auths you in all rooms
oh, fun
I do not envy you @Moshe!
Although, I use Safari.
(The safari remark came out of order due to bandwidth speed issues.)
OK! chat.stackexchange.com XMPP bridge up and running at sechat.smart-safe-secure.com!!!
in XMPP, 45 secs ago, by Josh's Socks
This will be a more permanent version of the XMPP server, restarted only when there's major updates, unlike the "testing" / "bleeding edge" version I am running on MSO chat
@Chacha102 please feel free to pin that ;-)
Ok guys I'm off for the night
I'll catch you later @Moshe and @Tim!
@TheUnhandledException See ya!
1 hour later…
2:38 AM
More Minecraft death. :(
Think it's time to actually start coding..
@TimStone see if you were fighting them pigs you would be gaining ground instead :p
Can't you download a Minecraft CPU plan and code against it in the game?
Well, I was hoping to actually be productive, so I'm not sure if that'd get me started on the right foot. ;)
@DanGrossman since you can build a NCC1701 and a 8 bit computer, I suppose just about anything is possible in that game ;)
Making it both wonderful and evil at the same time. :P
3:23 AM
Q: Why not to pass endResponse parameter as true in Response.Redirect method.

M.Nadeem ShaikhWhy not to pass endResponse parameter as true in Response.Redirect method. As per MSDN documentation, Redirect method calls Response.End method which internally tries to raise ThreadAbortException. If the attempt is successful the calling thread gets aborted which has adverse affect on your site...

vote to close anyone?
I'm not at that level yet :|
@drachenstern added a 4th.
What's happening all
Oh, not much.. watching the office.
UK or American?
I mean, original or bad remake?
terrible remake :)
@rchern what kind of Chili are you making? I made a white chili yesterday.
3:31 AM
Not good. You should checkout:
An Idiot Abroad is a 2010 light entertainment travel documentary television series broadcast on Sky1, as well as a spin-off book published by Canongate Books, created by and featuring Karl Pilkington and his radio show colleagues Ricky Gervais and Stephen Merchant. Overview An Idiot Abroad charts Pilkington's reaction when visiting the New Seven Wonders of the World as well as to the situations he's placed in, the country's cultural habits and idiosyncrasies. It was stated by the shows producers that Pilkington has no prior warning about these situations. Gervais commented: "This is a (m...
i saw a couple episodes of that!
Pilkington; he has to be scripted
I don't know... if so, he's kept it up an awful long time.
did you see the animated show they did based on their podcast?
@Fosco - aye
Karl Pilkington is from my home town, so I can attest that his stupidity is wide-spread
yeah? ever met him?
3:46 AM
@Fosco food.com/recipe/kellys-chili-50732 with some modifications
Cool.. looks like it has a lot of good flavors
@Fosco - Manchester has a population of 2.6million ... so yea
He's my best mate
thought I might relol a discussion from SO Tavern. Aspergers is now called "shifty wizard disorder"
@Fosco It's sweeter than some are used to.
3:57 AM
oh wait, my bad, you wanted me to relol ;)
4:13 AM
anybody get anything on the comment on this link?
A: C# Regular expressions find and replace links with only uppercase characters and don't match exclusions

drachensternOk, I'm confused. If you have a collection of controls and or tags on your page, you can test them to see if they are anchor types, and if so, you can get the href attribute from the tag, then set the href to href.ToLower ... Is there a particular reason to use a regex to solve a string and DOM ...

I only get a bunch of UTF boxes
@drachenstern Apparently they want to give you infinity upvotes, heh.
user image
@YiJiang +1
I like the way someone put it in SO Tavern
in The SO Tavern (General) on Stack Overflow Chat, 2 mins ago, by Dan Grossman
He gives your comment +infinity [box box box box box box box box box box]
@drachenstern Meh, the better way to get around the 15 char limit is an empty link.
No need for unicode and co. - [ ](http://www.google.com)
@TimStone sadly I didn't get infinity upvotes tho... my repscore stayed the same
@YiJiang yeah we had that discussion here the other day, no?
3 hours later…
6:56 AM
Er.. :P
asplodes and brings @TimStone with him
Ah. ;)
Note to self:
 * How do you objectively measure the number of people that will *ever* get to a question from Google?
  * What's this minimum "worth"?
  * Should we close questions on games that are too obscure because "not enough people" are going to play them?
  * Why isn't this "worth" stuff mentioned in any SE FAQ, if it's important enough to warrant closing questions?
  * Isn't helping the asker good enough for a Q&A engine?
 * What about "why doesn't my code work" questions on StackOverflow?
  * How many people are going to have the same snippet?
@TimStone Ah! Kube!
7:00 AM
I'm using a blog.SO post to prove Jeff wrong. This won't go well.
Hooray for Minecraft!
@radp This is a fairly lengthy note to self. :P
@radp Wait, wait.
Jeff wrote a blog post about not deleting things?
@TimStone About not closing things.
You can't delete open questions, so...
Did I enter an alternate universe at some point?
I wonder if anyone has seen this two posts on Math.SE
Q: I quit. Here's why.

IsaacI have offered my resignation as a moderator to the SE team and I think it's important that I provide some explanation here. Principally, I decided over the past weekend to pull the advertising for math.SE from a local professional newsletter because I was no longer comfortable recommending the ...

Q: An open letter to Jeff Atwood

Akhil MathewDear Mr. Atwood, I have been an active user on Math.SE for several months now. I have enjoyed participation in the website together with the interaction with other mathematicians that it has brought me. I have learned much from the answers provided me by experts, and I am glad to have contribute...

@TimStone Welcome to Gaming, where consensus can never be reached.
7:06 AM
@radp so should we be grabbing popcorn and a front row seat?
@radp -1 already, probably from Mr. Atwood himself :P
@YiJiang It's okay, I'll downvote the question too :P
Oh, and I need a 3ker to push this question to meta
Q: How to write html code to ask?

YugalHi, How can i write the xml and html codes here. Because the tags are not printed. Is there any special tag that allow to write html tags too. thanks

They gave someone a two year suspension on the maths site? Wow, those guys must be really extreme over there.
@YiJiang Done
@YiJiang no, there's Jeff's downvote, heh.
I'll take his comment as a compliment, I guess.
7:17 AM
Yeah, I suppose so. ;)
@TimStone Indeed :P
I can understand his point to the extent that if the site were full of those questions it would be contrary to the goal of providing useful information. However, the risk of alienating users by closing questions which do in fact have a specific answer when the danger of that being the site's destiny is slim seems fairly minimal, so I don't know why it's viewed as such a large problem.
@TimStone and one permanent ban.
We've been struggling to choose what to do on game reccommendation questions, which annoy far more people.
There are other priorities for the local close police :P
Indeed. The subjective material has a much larger tendency to get out of hand, heh.
See ya.
7:33 AM
Hm, I'm debating whether or not I disagree with Jeff enough to reply. It seems that 2.5% of the questions are tagged identify-this-game, which admittedly is a little larger than I expected.
A: switch or other device?

taspeotis i want to get a network device working as a multiplexer. for example, only the data sent to port A would be forwarded to port B completely.

I actually laughed at that, heh.
1 hour later…
8:59 AM
Cool... somebody made a really nice minecraft icon
365psd.com/day/233 <- Get the psd file free here
You and your docks!
The concept looks nice, but that pickaxe leaves me unsatisfied.
1 hour later…
10:06 AM
Q: jQuery - Bold all the words in a query

BahaiResearch.comI have a large HTML document, a book, and need to bold every occurrence of "Toronto". How is this done in jQuery?

Mr Welbog's puppet?
10:27 AM
Must resist temptation...
10:44 AM
It's funny how @Jin now pops up three times as "featured user" on stackexchange.com, just because of the new design threads he open for each of the graduating sites
1 hour later…
11:45 AM
Okay, wait a second.... when did Meta get back kbd support?
Or rather, THE CASTLES ARE BACK!!!1!!1!
12:36 PM
A: Formatting Sandbox

Yi Jiangkbd is back! Castle building will resume in 3... 2... 1...

1:03 PM
@YiJiang November 7 or so.
@spoulson Hello.
@PopularDemand Hmmm... didn't notice. Right
1:22 PM
Hm, just caught up on radp's Meta Gaming post and those two Math posts. How odd.
Wow, there's a question with eleven delete votes.
1:35 PM
Do we have an FAQ entry for the global inbox/multicollider yet?
1:48 PM
Morning everyone
@PopularDemand Not that I've seen
Q: Is something supposed to happen when I click 'inbox' in the new(ish) Stack Exchange drop down (top left) ?

adolf garlicIt shows a red circle with a number indicating that you have a response to a comment or question, but clicking it doesn't do anything. Is that the intended behaviour. If so, then it's rubbish. Am using FF 3.6.12 on xpsp3

People are burning a huge model temple outside my house right now for a person who died here recently
The fire's throwing burning paper several stories into the sky
Joss paper (, , , or / Vietnamese: vàng mã in the North or giấy tiền vàng bạc in the South), also known as ghost money, are sheets of paper that are burned in traditional Chinese deity or ancestor worship ceremonies during special holidays. Joss paper, as well as other papier-mâché items, are also burned in traditional Chinese funerals, to ensure that spirit of the deceased has lots of good things in the afterlife. Traditional Joss paper is traditionally made from coarse bamboo paper, which feels handmade with many variances and imperfections, although rice paper is also commonly used. ...
Hm, I just posted a bug report with screenshots that I could have more easily just reproed because it's a Markdown bug.
@YiJiang I've heard of that before, and I'm all for tradition/culture, but is that a public safety hazard?
@PopularDemand It's not, but it should be
The air pollution alone should trigger asthma attacks
2:34 PM
XMPP authentication does need some serious work
I can't make it work on chat.SE at all
2:58 PM
A: Sequential UID generation for MySQL Char() or other Field

EJPIsn't that a contradiction in terms? And your motivation for requiring sequentiality remains obscure.

Somebody just asked how return x[--y] works; I wince automatically at those as I brace for the explosion of weak ten-word answers
I'm going to start pasting the FGITW part of that every time it comes up
3:15 PM
3:28 PM
Hey @rchern!
How'd the chili cooking go? :-)
we'll find out in a few hours (;
Good luck!! I hope you win again
What's the prize? Next week off? :-)
3:30 PM
How does it work anyway?
Cooking something with chili in it? Surely you're not going to actually cook chili only, right?
Anyway, building a new website, and it just makes me depressed, some of the things it reminds me of
Wait, do I get chili?
As students we're suppose to take part in competitions like these: splashaward.com
Now at first it might seem there's nothing wrong here except...
1) The site is designed with table s.
2) The name of the competition insinuates that the web will undergo three more "iterations" in the next 5 years
3) In the Secondary category, all we have to do is to present a "business proposal" - a glorified Powerpoint, that is
#2 shows that these people have no idea what they're talking about
#1 shows that these people really aren't professionals
I just found the phrase "Web 5.0" on that website
#3 means that we should do the same - talk rubbish and pretend our fictional website is the next Facebook
@MichaelMrozek #2 there, in my rant up there
Oh, that's what you meant. I don't think it's actually going to last 5 years
3:38 PM
@MichaelMrozek It wouldn't last 5 years if the world operates like anything these people believe it does
Grrr. My home connection died.
@YiJiang, there is no such thing as "just chili". Every time I make it it comes out a bit different haha
@rchern Somebody's cut off your line so that you won't know the results!
Oh, and they treat us like idiots. That's all.
The chili cookoff is here at work (;
Meh, I can't eat chili. This, in a country where the people are crazy about their curry, is rather unfortunate
Gah, is this a MSO bug? A Firefox bug? Or a Firebug bug?
Q: New "[tag:" syntax interferes with Markdown links

Popular DemandLinks in [link text][number] format don't work properly if they follow a tag using the new [tag:tagName] format. Screenshots: results in Putting the tag inside the link is worse. Here's the result of [[meta-tag:bug] some text][3], where [3] is the list of questions tagged discussion: bug s...

(I'm just referring to the last part.)
3:44 PM
@PopularDemand Firebug shows you what Firefox sees, which is the DOM
Or rather, what Firefox sees of the HTML, so it will be weird if you have invalid HTML there
@YiJiang Gotcha.
@PopularDemand That post has become almost completely unreadable, by the way
@MichaelMrozek Yeah, I'm still working on it.
(Cutting down, this time, not adding more.)
@PopularDemand Anchors inside anchors is definitely invalid, so that's how Firefox trys to interpret the HTML
That post gives me a headache just looking at it, much less trying to understand it. ):
3:49 PM
^ Rejected cover design. Hehe... :P
@PopularDemand Suggestion: Completely remove the confusing part about how Firefox and Firebug's source differs, remove the images (since they don't add anything) and just present the bug as it is.
The mix of text and images with no separation and images with text does my head in
Also inline tags and code blocks that scroll off the side. It's pretty much every different kind of element possible in a post :)
@YiJiang I'm already editing to do this.
@MichaelMrozek I thought maybe there was a secret badge for that!
@PopularDemand Tumbleweed :P Because nobody wants to read a question like that
3:56 PM
Morning @Tim!
I have some good news. I think I found a way around the cookie problem -- a way to make authentication with XMPP much easier, and safer!
@MichaelMrozek sweeet!
> Michael Mrozek thought you'd be interested in this proposed Q&A site. If you like the idea, you can click the "Commit" button below to be notified when the site is created.
Michael Mrozek was wrong <_<
How dare you
3:57 PM
Meh... don't play international chess. Why can't we have one that covers all of the variations?
I can't commit though as I know nothing :-(
@TheUnhandledException That's why I'm not committing either, but I look forward to reading posts there when it's public
@TheUnhandledException Nice!
@rchern There's no chili in there!
3:58 PM
@MichaelMrozek Ugh, chess. I used to have a book of "what moves would you use to make black win in three?"-type puzzles.
@Tim et al: Here's my plan... The XMPP component should also be an OpenID provider!
I never could understand those, since you can't predict what the other player will do.
A Singaporean would grab the nearest bottle of chili source and dump it on the yellow bit before even touching it
That way you could add your XMPP OpenID to your profile and that would allow you to authenticate... right?
Hmm, sounds good in theory.
3:59 PM
@YiJiang Correct. That is pie, not chili. Very observant. (;
@PopularDemand We do those at work; normally either their reactions are forced or you have to prove you can win for all their possible moves
@rchern I knew it! I could cook, man!
There was one where no reactions were forced, and the solution was a giant tree of possible moves
Or rather, I can eat. Cooking is a totally different story

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