Tavern on the Meta

Its one of those thing I believe the folks on the pointy end of things would change in a heartbeat, but I don't really see HR changing without some reason they consider acceptable

forest distrusts StackExchange

Typical.

Journeyman Geek

2:32 AM

Its not a small company with a BDFL. And I'm not inclined to raise a huge fuss over it at this point. I can't think of anything productive that will actually change things at this point.

forest distrusts StackExchange

Just saw balpha's starred message. Looks like an actual web sec guy is going to be staff.

That might help a little. I wonder if he'll fix 7345d3f076bd42030ddf01bda265504b4e7755db ;)

Journeyman Geek

lol

its standard big corp stuff I think

honestly? If you ever get unlucky enough to watch one? totally do it high.

forest distrusts StackExchange

I do that whether I'm lucky or not.

Journeyman Geek

You'll need it

I think I live commented one on (private) chat...

forest distrusts StackExchange

Commented one what?

Journeyman Geek

2:34 AM

lol

watched security training video, snarked on it.

forest distrusts StackExchange

ah

So I guess he won't fix it after all lol

Journeyman Geek

lol

he's also working on teams

forest distrusts StackExchange

SE needs some help.

Journeyman Geek

SE had a dedicated security team at one point?

forest distrusts StackExchange

Not anymore?

Journeyman Geek

2:35 AM

even had a fairly good, high level person

I kinda lost a lot of visibility over stuff like that as people left

forest distrusts StackExchange

How's this... if they actually start taking security seriously, I'll drop any and all bugs I've found.

But they won't. I doubt it, at least. I don't care for companies that don't take sec seriously.

Journeyman Geek

short version

I don't know, and I don't really know who I can ask "Hey, so y'all need to talk to forest"

SE's basically... changed a lot, back and forth over the last decade

forest distrusts StackExchange

lol I wouldn't help them

Not unless they learn how to help themselves first

Journeyman Geek

\o/

That's a work in progress, even on the soft side of things

forest distrusts StackExchange

Well, they better hurry.

People gonna find bugs.

If I can, anyone can (and I suck at webapp exploitation!)

Actually, I suck at webapp anything.

Feeds

4:46 AM

stackoverflow.blog/2022/06/07/…

Feeds

5:34 AM

Oh yeah, I didn't even know they renamed it the Willis Tower in 2009, because I know a normal amount about skyscrapers.

Shadow Wizard Says No More War

7:08 AM

Huh? JNat not pingable?

@JNat cross site spammer for your ever caring handling. Thanks! :)

Shadow Wizard Says No More War

7:29 AM

@tripleee @RyanM how come Smokey reported it here? The spam was deleted less than 20 seconds after being posted, meaning Smokey reported a deleted post.

Quite a major bug, luckily MSE doesn't get much spam.

tripleee

@ShadowWizardSaysNoMoreWar there may be a bug, but it's also quite common for the chat library to take several seconds to deliver a message which was scheduled when the message was not yet deleted

Shadow Wizard Says No More War

Even worse, the MS page doesn't even detect it's deleted.

tripleee

the chat server will nominally accept one message per 20 seconds and we are constantly pushing against that

Shadow Wizard Says No More War

@tripleee no, the bug is that Smokey doesn't detect it's deleted.

tripleee

hmmm, yeah, possible

Shadow Wizard Says No More War

7:33 AM

e.g. see here, it says "(deleted about 1 hour after being reported)" but it does not show such message on the MSE spam.

tripleee

I think the deletion watcher has issues when the message gets deleted before it gets a chance to start watching, but this is purely speculative

Shadow Wizard Says No More War

@tripleee good speculation. ;)

tripleee

I created a bug report, I guess Makyen knows much more than I do about these things github.com/Charcoal-SE/SmokeDetector/issues/7060

Ryan M

@tripleee @Shadow if it's the issue I've been seeing, if the post is deleted before the MS report is complete, then the deletion watcher won't catch it. That doesn't generally happen unless a mod nukes it very quickly...which appears to have happened here, as it's at -1 and deleted 19 seconds after it was posted.

As a Stack Overflow mod who frequently reports to Charcoal, it's not at all uncommon for me to nuke the post a little too quickly before the deletion watcher is ready.

So I've seen this a bunch of times. Of course, the room where it's supposed to auto-delete is on SO chat, so I tend to solve it by deleting the messages myself...

Basically, it requires deleting the post after SD has read the contents, but before it's reported to MS.

(posted the same on the GH issue)

I think that would make this a metasmoke issue, since I think the deletion watcher is in MS.

But I'd have to check to be sure.

Shadow Wizard Says No More War

9:47 AM

@RyanM but how can it be fixed then?

Ryan M

@ShadowWizardSaysNoMoreWar Well, the metasmoke devs are also part of Charcoal, if you mean about it being a metasmoke issue.

As far as how to fix it specifically, it probably need to detect the post being deleted on creation of the MS report, and enter the deletion-watcher code path at that point.

Shadow Wizard Says No More War

10:10 AM

@RyanM yes that sounds good, hopefully it's doable.

@Glorfindel misclick? The question is on topic, there is indeed a survey run by SE itself, and it's fine to ask questions about it.

Voted to reopen but need four more, or your vote. :)

Glorfindel

@ShadowWizardSaysNoMoreWar no, I migrated it to MSO but it seems they rejected it?!

correction: the author deleted it themselves: meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/418568/…

Shadow Wizard Says No More War

@Glorfindel but you chose wrong close reason, it's about SE just about specific site. Anyway no big deal.

Glorfindel

@ShadowWizardSaysNoMoreWar that's automatic when voting to migrate.

Shadow Wizard Says No More War

@Glorfindel oh so that's bad.

At least need to let the mod choose the close reason that will appear upon rejection.

Tinkeringbell

10:35 AM

@ShadowWizardSaysNoMoreWar Eh, no. That's more work, not less :P

Better to make the generic off-topic reason more generic ;)

"This question isn't suitable for this site in one way or another" :D

2

Shadow Wizard Says No More War

lol

There was something I wanted to do but forgot

Journeyman Geek

"Mental note: Remember to remember what I forgot"

Sonic the Save Ukraine-hog

11:22 AM

@ShadowWizardSaysNoMoreWar Per its tag wiki, questions about it here are only on-topic if they have to do with the survey's integration with sites other than SO (specifically, awarding badges on other sites). In previous years before that feature existed, such questions were always closed as off-topic with the author asked to post on MSO, with the only as-yet-open ones being those asked pre-MSO-MSE-split.

SPArcheon

11:53 AM

Had to came here just for this...

@Feeds Hated the title. Read the rest, hated it a little less.

I suggest that a tech site should avoid titles that look like your average "doctors hates this simple lifehack" clickbaits.

Easy way to get your point out horribly wrong and get people angry very fast.

Just my two cents though, fell free to continue this way.

Luuklag

self deleted spam, that didn't got the spam flag on it: meta.stackexchange.com/questions/355852/…

Glorfindel

12:11 PM

nuked - Smokey is already watching that domain

Meta Andrew T.

12:29 PM

@forestdistrustsStackExchange well, SE said they take it very seriously.

Shadow Wizard Says No More War

12:41 PM

@SonictheSaveUkraine-hog my concern now is the wrong close reason, which gives wrong impression the survey isn't related to Stack Exchange.

New user seeing this will just get really confused that's all.

@MetaAndrewT. well on this one I do believe @forest, but still believe SE is above the average, which is enough for me. But for top level security people, it's not and I understand them.

SPArcheon

1:30 PM

@ShadowWizardSaysNoMoreWar "over the average" really means nothing when we live in a world where some executive thought that a talking, bluetooth operated doll didn't need anything like a basic username/password support on the dedicated app, allowing anyone near enough to make the doll talk in the middle of the night.

rene

→ 52 messages moved to Chimney

Shadow Wizard Says No More War

@SPArcheon well hopefully if the executive bothered to hire the security team SE works with (don't think they have their own these days), they would put firewall on the doll, and at least show the hacker some ads when the hacker took live video from the doll. :D

hehe finally found what triggers Red Peter. ;-)

He really, but really, hates moderation bots. :D

SPArcheon

1:53 PM

@ShadowWizardSaysNoMoreWar since you already plan to annoy him...

Viggo Mortensen

Viggo Peter Mortensen Jr. R Danish: [ˈviko ˈmɒːtn̩sn̩]; born October 20, 1958) is an American actor, author, director, musician, photographer, poet, producer, painter and writer. Born and raised in the State of New York to a Danish father and American mother, he also lived in Argentina during his childhood. He is the recipient of various accolades including a Screen Actors Guild Award and has been nominated for three Academy Awards, three BAFTA Awards, and four Golden Globe Awards. Mortensen made his film debut in a small role in Peter Weir's 1985 thriller Witness, which starred Harrison Ford and...

ask if he is a relative too.

why italian? Wikipedia sometime is just odd

Shadow Wizard Says No More War

@SPArcheon or actually him

Just in case, this is his actual Wikipedia profile. :)

LOL

This is priceless. SE should totally adopt at least some of those. :P

SPArcheon

@ShadowWizardSaysNoMoreWar Those tags exude English elitism. Do other languages equivalents even exist?

Is there a tag for knowing the actual Japanese counter words instead of using "tsu" like a kid would?

Japanese counter word

In Japanese, counter words or counters (助数詞, josūshi) are measure words used with numbers to count things, actions, and events. In Japanese, as in Chinese and Korean, numerals cannot quantify nouns by themselves (except, in certain cases, for the numbers from one to ten; see below). For example, to express the idea "two dogs" in Japanese one could say 二匹の犬 ni-hiki no inu (literally "two small-animal-count POSSESSIVE dog"), or 犬二匹 inu ni-hiki (literally "dog two small-animal-count"), but just pasting 二 and 犬 together in either order is ungrammatical. Here 二 ni is the number "two", 匹 hiki is the...

Anyway back to trying to understand how c# 2.0 "ApplicationSettings" configuration actually works....

In 2022....

Shadow Wizard Says No More War

@SPArcheon probably

@SPArcheon hehe actually I wrote something about it on SO back in the day, kind of

Reading settings for specific DLL rather than the main application settings.

And for different subject, Israel finally have this:

@Spe surely knows what it is. :D

Oh wait it's written on the sign, in English too. ;)

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Spevacus

2:10 PM

An Insect radar? What in the world?

Shadow Wizard Says No More War

@Spevacus radar that detect insects ;)

SPArcheon

@ShadowWizardSaysNoMoreWar ApplicationSettings is that old thing you configure via "Properties->settings" (compared to the more commonly used AppSetting config section.)

Spevacus

Now why would you need to detect insects?

Shadow Wizard Says No More War

@Spevacus when they cause harm, mainly, it might help nuke them.

@SPArcheon ohhh. yeah, rings a bell, used those as well.

Total mess, they keep being reset upon full build, for example.

SPArcheon

On a test Win Form project I see that the settings are read once when the app starts and then even if you change the app.config file they are not read again unless you do Properties.Settings.Default.Reload(). But obviously they are updated if you restart the app.
What I can't figure out is why on IIS the old setting manage to persist in memory EVEN IF ISS IS RESTARTED. ***HOW*** is that possible??? If I change the content of web.config and restart the application pool or IIS I expect the service to use the new values.

(please don't ask why I use this horrible thing in the first place instead of the AppSetting version, not-my-code)

Shadow Wizard Says No More War

2:16 PM

@SPArcheon well that's above my pay grade. ;)

Try asking on Stack Overflow.

runs away

@Spevacus anyhow it's something that exist for years in other places and Israel was slow to adapt, like many useful technologies that aren't being invented here.

Heck, we still don't have any kind of metro, for example.

Just ancient non-functioning bus system that can't serve all the people.

We're good at exporting what we make here really fast, but it's one way, sadly.

Shadow Wizard Says No More War

2:41 PM

!!/coffee Justin for learning fast :D

SmokeDetector

@ShadowWizardSaysNoMoreWar brews a cup of mocha for @Justin

rene

3:43 PM

→ 3 messages moved to Chimney

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