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5:00 PM
@rene the disagreement stuff is being hugely misunderstood, though. It only relates to FRs and definitely shouldn't relate to support questions at all.
 
It is misunderstood because the UI gives you no clue you should be doing something differently here.
 
I use them for "this is a bad question". Bad questions, for me, include off-topic stuff, stuff that's been asked hundreds of times before and could be found with any sort of search at all, horrible suggestions, questions asked to stir things up...
Meta is an imperfect system for support. Shoehorning feature requests, support requests, bug reports, and community discussions into a Q&A platform is going to wind up with a system that doesn't perfectly work for all of those.
Downvotes on questions that people don't like - including legitimate support questions - is a part of that.
 
Rob
@KylePollard It demonstrates the avatar bug, which supposedly was fixed: boardgames.stackexchange.com/users/36554/toroid stackoverflow.com/users/16481593/toroid
 
eh, the way i see it... if you see a post you don't think should be downvoted, the only action you can take that isn't claiming everyone who disagrees with you is abusing the system is to simply cast an upvote on it. If you don't think it deserves upvotes... then there's nothing to fix, an upvote at that point has no more meaning than someone downvoting everything just because.
 
5:15 PM
@Rob Hah, great catch, I'll pass it along 😁
 
Rob
Thanks.
 
@Catija But it doesn't happen to you so often, compared to users less familiar with SE.
 
@user1271772 technically/literally that's incorrect. I probably have received more downvotes than most people on MSE.
 
@user1271772 Such as... new users who can't be bothered to read the on-topic articles? It didn't happen to me (much) on any of my sites.
@JourneymanGeek A nuking might be in order for superuser.com/questions/1663896/why-songs-are-important-for-us
 
Rob
@Catija It's a great danger. A sock goes around upvoting various people it doesn't like, and some random people, and it's other accounts (to combine with other methods to avoid suspicion); then years later (if and when) you catch them thousands of reputation are lost with the "user was deleted" message.
2
 
5:22 PM
Maybe rene can check in SEDE. I'll bet I'm in the top 50. 😀
@Rob as someone currently deleting thousands of targeted votes on SO... I fully understand.
 
Rob
It's then that they complain; there's been many a complaint here about loss of less than a hundred, even lengthy discussion over a single vote.
 
@Catija you have on average 11 downvotes on your posts, where 4 downvotes per post is the overall for MSE
 
Rob
No 'upvote targeting'?
 
@rene Thanks for providing us with the mean, what about the variance?
 
are you kidding me?
 
5:27 PM
@rene Me?
 
Rob
Full stats, with graphics and sound.
 
Looks like I missed a lot. :(
grabbing old popcorn from the fridge
 
@Rob It's unrelated to the backfill identicon problem, but we're aware of the problem and have a fix planned.
 
sdc fresh-popcorn for Shadow
 
Rob
5:28 PM
^ OK
 
@Ollie ping cause Smokey to ignore
 
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 You can scroll up to the one-boxed question by Catija with a question that had a score of -7 (now it's at -1) :)
 
sdc fresh-fish for @Ollie
 
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 No such command 'fresh-fish'.
 
5:28 PM
@Ollie No such command 'fresh-popcorn'.
 
@user1271772 just sort my questions and answers by score. It's between thousands up and ~1000 down.
 
Howdy, I hope everyone is doing well. Also I wish fresh-popcorn was a command.
 
@Catija but score doesn't always reflect downvotes
 
@Rosie Salty, or sweet?
 
@Rosie yeah the potential is endless! ;)
 
Rob
There's brownies coffee tea
 
@Catija Just checked the answers: lowest answer has a net score of 0 !!! I appreciate there may be both + and - adding up to give 0, but nothing with negative net score!
 
@Rob Brownie is misleading, it's just brown
 
Two questions have negative score. One has -8 and one has -766.
 
@user1271772 yeah. But I have a question at -788 or so
 
5:30 PM
Salty, popcorn made on the stove with no butter and a ton of Old Bay Seasoning is how we roll in this house
3
 
i.e. it's not given to anyone like coffee and tea.
 
@Rosie how is your community-a-thon going?
 
Rob
Not to be confused with Brownies or Girl Guides.
 
@Rosie whoa, that's royal
here it's just tons of butter and salt in the microwave.
 
@Rosie Nice! We never do homemade but if/when I go the cinema, I get fresh salt popcorn too :)
 
5:32 PM
@user1271772 yeah, probably, but I'd still miss a lot. :)
 
@rene That's what I thought! (thanks for doing that by the way)
 
@rene
it is going really well, it's fun to get back on some sites and post in some new ones, also it has been fun to see some more posts from staff members on other teams that don't get to engage on the SE sites as much
 
@rene I wonder if turning everything orange yesterday wasn't just some nefarious plot to get some quick community-a-thon points :P
 
@KylePollard that's awesome! Is there already a bug report for that?
 
@Tinkeringbell lol I wish
 
5:34 PM
@Rosie sales?
@Catija you win! :D
Huh, @Rosie also got into HNQ
7
Q: Is answering the phone with the greeting "pronto" standard in Italy?

RosieMy future father-in-law is originally from Ischia. When he answers the telephone he says, "Pronto" vs saying "Ciao" or "Hello". He told me that growing up that is how everyone answered the phone. I was curious if that was unique to Ischia/Naples or if it is customary across most of Italy to answe...

 
@Catija Do you think that your experience from the question from October 2019 with score -788, makes you able to relate to new users like the one you showed us today, whose first Meta question had a score of -7 at the time?
 
And with real identity, not a sock. :D
So you get bonus points for reaching HNQ? @Catija ;)
 
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 all around the company really, as Yakkov pointed out in the Meta post we've had an even higher number of employees signed up before the event started compared to last year which is nice to see
 
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 I'm not aware of an active bug report for that bug, I didn't find anything with a quick search
 
@KylePollard heh, well silent fix is good as well. :)
 
5:39 PM
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 🐱‍👤
 
@Rosie My colleague from Milano always answered the phone with "prrrrrrrrrronto !!!"
 
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 Rosie is in charge of things with Yaakov and JNat , so she's better able to answer.
 
Answering phone is going to be gone soon-ish though.
 
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 *shudders* The sooner the better...
 
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 It's already turned into just 'Yeah' here... caller ID makes saying your name quite superfluous XD
 
5:40 PM
@Mithical nah, yet another human interaction going kapoot which is sad, IMO.
 
Of course, if it's an unknown number, that's fun: "Good afternoon, this is Tink"... Yeah, it's your best friend I have a new number XD
 
I don't answer unknown numbers.
 
^
 
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 I stutter badly on the phone. I much prefer text communication.
 
true, to phones going away, I was actually fascinated by the answer and how caller ID impacts the greeting one picks up with which I wouldn't have guessed
 
5:41 PM
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 I'm too curious not to :P At least, if they are showing a number and the number is Dutch.
 
If someone wants they can send me WhatsApp or even SMS and I'll add their contact then might answer their calls. :D
 
if it's important enough ill get an email or a voicemail
 
@KevinB That's fair, I too let things go to voicemail from time to time.
 
@Catija hehe, well, looks like it's a secret! ;)
 
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 I was going to make a "I'll call you to test" joke, but then realized you probably have me saved in so it won't be an unknown number ;)
 
5:43 PM
I'm not sure if phones will really go away, or if we'll just replace voice calls with video calls. I've done a lot of video calls during lockdown....
 
i don't expect them to
 
oh no
we're replacing phone calls with whatsapp
 
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 Unfortunately I've not had a phone number since 2013, so I can't sign up for WhatsApp!
 
@Mithical quite the same for me, and I'm just bad at expressing myself in actual conversation anyway.
 
I do enjoy oral calls on Messenger though :)
 
i don't expect voice calls to ever really... "go away", whether they remain over phone numbers or other means of identification
 
@Mithical I don't know... I somehow find voice calls easier than writing letters :P
 
"letters"? You're obviously doing WhatsApp wrong...
 
@Tinkeringbell well after the 100th spam call your curiousity will dwindle. ;)
 
@user1271772 my second (deleted) question ever was downvoted... but it's not really a competition... I can be sympathetic. I frequently leave comments or messages in here like I did earlier when I come across stuff that I don't feel should be downvoted. I understand it pretty well. What I'm saying is that I don't think it's always the response questions get. Many do just fine.
 
5:44 PM
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 There's actually very little spam calls... I added my number to the 'don't-call-me-register' (belmenietregister).
 
Most calls here are from other companies trying to get us to spend money
 
Companies can be sued for damages if they do call despite my number being in there :D
 
@Mithical very true! And I'll gladly answer! :D
 
Though it's recently been replaced with something else, so I have to see how bad it'll get.
 
@user1271772 heh, good for you! ;)
 
5:46 PM
@Mithical I mean, if I have to write a polite WhatsApp... I wouldn't really know where to start. Making a polite phone call though, I've done that enough times to have a habit.
 
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 Yaakov is overseeing the whole points thing but we don't get bonus points for HNQ. We also don't get points for the activity we do on Meta sites
 
Also... it's too easy for people on the other side to dismiss a WhatsApp I guess. Some things in life I only got arranged by phoning just because the poor call center worker on the other side isn't allowed to hang up on me.
 
@Tinkeringbell no such thing here, so my number is exposed to all kinds of spam calls... luckily by now I blocked most numbers and also set it so it's not even showing calls from blocked number. The silence is beautiful. :D
 
@Tinkeringbell I messaged my commanding officer yesterday like "hi <name>, mind if I leave base today?". (Officer officer, not NCO.) WhatsApp is great for being not too formal :p
 
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 I had 3? 4? mysterious calls from a US number a month back. But that's about all.
 
5:48 PM
@Catija For what it's worth, I appreciated you posting that one-box here today, and I was one of the people that upvoted it after you brought it to our attention here :)
 
@Tinkeringbell just a secret stalker fan... ;)
 
@Mithical Oh sure. I was mostly thinking of the times I do use my phone to call, which would mean I'm either calling to make a formal complaint or get something done quickly :P
Like I said, especially with the formal complaints it's easier because the person on the other side can't hang up on you, that's bad customer service ;)
 
I had one case of ex-girlfriend who went nuts for a while and kept calling me from unknown numbers, but it was really long ago....
 
@Tinkeringbell I wish I could hop on the phone to resolve rebooking a flight credit. I was disconnected so many times that they pushed me to Twitter and I've been in and I've been in a week and a half long DM with bots and agents. I want to cry
 
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 What's wrong with just serial upvoting then?!
@Rosie WHAH? That's terrible customer service....
 
5:50 PM
@Tinkeringbell it's being reversed, and the stalker fan doesn't get to hear your voice. ;)
 
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 Trust me, my voice isn't something you need to hear, especially not if you expect it to speak English XD
 
@Rosie I once had to change my name on a reservation we made, and because my brother made the reservation with my dad's credit card, and I didn't have the card around at the time I called.... the customer service person just called me back in the evening after I had time to get home, and everything was sorted out within 10 minutes.
 
You know.... think the only time I spoke English before the meeting with Yaakov and Mithical was like 20 years ago when I worked freelance for someone in England.
 
(just to make you jealous :P)
 
5:52 PM
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 You were a bit quieter than I had expected.
 
והיה פחות עברית ממה שציפיתי
 
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 Why'd you have to speak English when meeting with those two? I'd expect the three of you to share a native language?
 
@Mithical yeah I'm much louder in chat. And brave. ;)
 
@Tinkeringbell Yaakov and I both speak English as a native language.
 
5:53 PM
(I didn't dare talk about my favorite subject ;))
 
yeah @Tinkeringbell I feel really bad because I have so much empathy for phone support staff and it isn't their fault but the company has been really terrible about the system they are using for rebooking. I would just do it myself but they don't give me access to do that. It's really frustrating. I'm trying not to pay double what we booked these tickets for originally but we'll see
 
@Mithical Oh... never realized!
 
(My Hebrew is much worse than my English. Sha should be able to confirm that.)
 
@Rosie Fingers crossed it works out... and yeah, call center employees don't have the easiest jobs.
 
@Mithical yeah I'm the black lamb exception. ;)
 
5:54 PM
@Mithical Hahaha I just see you type Hebrew in here from time to time, and that's what you get for making assumptions ;)
 
(:
 
See, Hebrew smiley faces :P
 
It's supposed to just be upside down!
The text equivalent of :upside_down_smile:
 
so a frown?
 
@Mithical I tried learning Hebrew as an adult and it is so hard. When I speak I would start the sentence in Hebrew and end in French. I love languages, I just wish I was better at picking them up.
 
5:56 PM
@Tinkeringbell nooo
@Rosie כן, זה קשה
 
@Mithical Kidding! ;) I know the yellow upside down picture you're talking about ;)
 
@Mithical well it was good practice for me, plus you two are the רוב. :)
 
aye
I'm a bit curious what the waitress thought when we asked her to take that photo, though... looked like she gave us a bit of a weird look before agreeing :p
 
@Mithical well you hardly said anything in Hebrew so can't really tell, and you write Hebrew just fine. :)
 
@Mithical it is. I'm starting to learn a little Italian now and so far this is the easiest time I've had trying to learn a language. I'm also not doing it as part of a course where I'm being graded so that probably is why I'm less anxious about it.
 
5:59 PM
Just join the military, it'll do wonders for your language skills...
/s
 
(sorry had to!! ;))
hehe
 
... *slaps Sha*
 
Rob
 
@Mithical finally! :D
 
brb catching a bus down there to do it in person
 
6:00 PM
dancing in anticipation
 
I have to hop, but nice to "see" everyone.
 
\o
 
@Rosie happy hopping! Cya!
 
🚽
 
Rob
Thanks for visiting, while you're busy.
 
6:02 PM
@KevinB not yet but thanks for reminding me I need to go. ;)
 
Rob
Save it up.
 
@Rob oh I do.
Interest is worth it.
:D
 
TMI... TMI.
 
Rob
Cast for length.
 
Though this makes me feel bad when I tell my son not to do it, how unhealthy this is etc. :P
 
Rob
6:04 PM
Only applies to tub peers.
 
@Mithical well we were a weird trio, like trio in the beginning of jokes... (i.e. not the usual friends hanging together, or family members) ;)
 
A young soldier in full uniform with two giant backpacks, a bearded American, and an awkward Israeli walk into a cafe...
 
@Mithical well doing something under stress is a risk, might get opposite result. But usually it works just fine.
@Mithical exactly! I knew your writing skills will prove useful one day. :D
 
you mean they haven't already? ;_;
 
@Mithical not for me... ;)
 
6:09 PM
:'(
 
first time I'm subject of your writing, no? :)
 
...I suppose.
 
Oh no wife getting back from her אימון soon, and it will mean time's up.
@Mike welcome back! Breaking over a year of silence here? ;)
OK, contact lenses also start to hint I need to remove them... cya everyone!
 
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 Gym, or what?
 
6:47 PM
Hey @rene I ran one of your SEDE queries and then clicked "Display Name" in order to sort the usernames alphabetically:
 
kewl!
 
It seems that clicking DisplayName caused at least 2 results to disappear, both of them with the first character of their username being lower case!
 
they are probably sorted at the end
 
andselisk and agaitaarino were both in the original list, but then got removed when I clicked DisplayName!
Oh, hahahaha, so basically a is considered after Z
 
yeah, that is how JavaScript does "sorting".
 
6:51 PM
This MSE search gave nothing: meta.stackexchange.com/…
 
there are weird things with client side sort: meta.stackexchange.com/questions/307605/…
 
Searching the same thing in Google though, gave me this:
1
Q: Sql ORDER BY alphabetically no casesensitive

user3455363Today I encountered problem that causes difficulty for me to solve it. In application I want to display records in aphabetical order thus in SQL statement I'am using ORDER BY, But it looks like CAPITAL letters are before lowercase letters so record starting with Z is before a. This is example o...

 
Still no answer to the Glorfindel question?
 
Nope. SlickGrid is .. better replaced but that is too much work to take on.
 
Rob
7:08 PM
@KylePollard Homer knows his gyms from the gyrls.
 
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 I drop in from time to time. We're doing SO Teams at my company now and I find myself needing meta links a lot more frequently that normal
 
user728672
7:49 PM
what user has 7 downvotes on meta with first question?
 
user728672
nevermind i found it.
 
my first question got an easy 30 upvotes
well, on mse anyway
on so first question got a -3, but that happened 5 years later randomly, around the same time i commented on a post that i downvoted
 
8:05 PM
@KevinB Better than my first: ~4 votes before it was closed as a dupe ;)
 
8:17 PM
@ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 It used to be really terrible a couple of years ago, but it's generally really dry land in general. My parts are pretty good though
 
@Luuklag You do realize that custom comment close reasons are still visible in the close dialog even after the comment is deleted, right?
 
@SonictheAnonymousHedgehog ouch, how could i forget
 
I see how the question is opinion-based, but don't see how it's off-topic.
 
retracted it, cause it wouldn't look pretty on the post notice
yeah was at a loss for the right close reason there
Looking at the username I might have pissed off a staff member doing that @SonictheAnonymousHedgehog
 
We used to accept questions of this format, which is why the author thought it would be acceptable to ask that.
There are several past examples, most of which are still open.
 
8:30 PM
yeah, but then again they most likely are from '09 or something
 
People cite posts from late 2000s/early 2010s as "evidence" that their post is suitable ("broken windows")
This has happened quite a bit with SO-specific posts, as those were accepted here before April 2014.
 
yeah, when I encounter such a gem I usually VTC them
or in exceptional cases ask for a hist lock
its self deleted now anyways
 
8:49 PM
Well that should be enough front page flood from me today
Have featured posts always shown up on top of the frequently asked questions list?
 
yes
 
Odd to call those frequently asked :/
 
Since 2012, apparently.
9
A: Why does this question show up in the Frequently Asked Questions list if it isn't tagged [faq]?

Shog9Because it's featured. And that's how the FAQ list works on Meta: it includes faq entries, and featured posts. This behavior predates the introduction of the Community Bulletin board, and no one has been bothered enough to change it.

 
Max Horstmann on July 21, 2021
If you’re building a new app today, it might be worth taking a closer look at making it cloud-native and using Kubernetes from the jump. The effort to set up Kubernetes is less than you think. Certainly, it’s less than the effort it would take to refactor your app later on to support containerization. 
 
@Mithical I might turn that into a FR someday
 
9:18 PM
So @ShadowWizardWearingMaskV2 did you also throw all your Ben & Jerry's icecream in the trash?
or mithical as well ;)
 
9:39 PM
@Spevacus Much of my rep was gained through questions, which don't count for tag badges, and a high number of votes on fewer answers (I have 2.5 times the number of votes required, but not enough answers in the tag).
 
Yeah, I'm also quite close to the score requirement but, obviously, way behind on the answer requirement. Meta's very vote-rich.
 
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