Tavern on the Meta

user315433

12:07 AM

2

A: How do I make a profit buying cloud-hashing contracts?

The profit is the lesson: you got scammed.

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Manually reported answer: Matching events on timelines of different scales for a video scrub bar by eli on ux.SE

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Manually reported answer (batch report: post 1 out of 3): How do I make a profit buying cloud-hashing contracts? by vinzz89 on bitcoin.SE

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Manually reported answer (batch report: post 2 out of 3): Worth investing in to a cloud mining companies? by vinzz89 on bitcoin.SE

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Manually reported answer (batch report: post 3 out of 3): How can I calculate the profitability of this dash cloud mining contract? by vinzz89 on bitcoin.SE

user202362

I don't get it when someone is like 'get on social media so I can contact you' thing, I can be contacted some 10+ ways and my friends contact me all the times despite the fact I am not active on social media. How to show a lack in sincerity ...

user315433

12:30 AM

If you call my regular number, it just goes to my pager.

SmokeDetector

1:06 AM

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Link at end of answer: Would the name Maida be considered a “Japanese name” by Kazu on japanese.SE

user202362

@SFTP add beak, could be a parrot:

user202362

user315433

1:43 AM

> GDPR meeting: "No Nick, we can't just ban all the European IPs" pic.twitter.com/pnI4lAZxjX -- Nick Craver at 6:00 PM - 11 Apr 2018

SmokeDetector

1:54 AM

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Bad keyword with a link in answer, username similar to website in answer: How do I update product shipping using PHP in WooCommerce? by simplehuman on wordpress.SE

user202362

reduce cost, train chicken to deliver letters

user202362

then a question stuck me: why use owl when you can use pigeon? does the letter have to be delivered at night?

John Dvorak

higher payload?

Pigeons don't do night shifts?

user315433

It's whatever was the nearest bird with Uber app.

HTTPS

2:14 AM

@TelKitty uhh... get on Tinder so I can contact you?

user202362

number of spammers contacted through my company website in the past 30 days: 67, business, personal or important email: none

user202362

now I have to finish the last form so I can post all three letters together then go clothes/grocery shopping

user202362

also ... where is the swag?? how to score last in every race

user315433

> the race is not to the swift, nor the battle to the strong, neither yet bread to the wise, nor yet riches to men of understanding, nor yet swag to telkitty; but time and chance happeneth to them all

HTTPS

2:47 AM

:6852520 fake "Technical Team" comment detected

user315433

> Here's a travel tip: if you have a middle seat on a flight longer than 3 hours, get a bunch of tiny bottles of vodka from the flight attendant and use them to set yourself on fire. @BartOrr1 -- David Haney at 7:24 PM - 11 Apr 2018

user315433

Flying to West Coast (Portland) this Friday...

user315433

Reportedly, Portland is like Stack Overflow.

user315433

Wonder if I'll be reviewed on arrival.

user315433

If the analogy holds, probably not until my return flight.

user315433

3:24 AM

Sigh.... I know I posted Should this site get additional moderators appointed? on April 1, but it wasn't a joke. Those NAA flags cast in February that I mentioned... still pending. Looks like none of 3D moderators read the post.

user315433

I'm only willing to visit placid lakes, salt flats, and painting exhibits until the world's 3D technology improves.

user315433

3D Printing is a headache

HTTPS

3:38 AM

Reading recent discussion on Meta Hinduism feels like they are in a civil war...

Nog Shine

@HTTPS Hahaha

A warrior is talking then

Awesome Poodles

@SonicWizard, did you flag a couple placeholder questions for closure?

If so, then the SA community needs to come to some kind of consensus. We've only ever done that to the worst of the worst.

Nog Shine

@HTTPS I too don't like the atmosphere but can't help to solve the issues to normal. Some disagree with help center and Main meta posts which have network wide consensus.

HTTPS

And a certain user is quite aggressive (strong language) on Meta. This is only me personally, but I was a bit surprised they hasn't been suspended to cool down... though I can see suspending them will worsen the situation with mod clashes...

O well, I don't think I can help the situation either... moving on~

Nog Shine

@HTTPS I don't know which one user you are talking about but a user has many issues, he got suspended to cooldown a few times and perhaps voting irregularities too.

user315433

3:48 AM

Some CMs kind of disappeared... when was the last time Grace Note posted anything other than templated election questionnaires / community ads things?

user202362

making out or domestic violence?

Sonic Wizard

4:08 AM

@AwesomePoodles Just for evaluation, to see if the flags get deemed helpful or declined, so as to know if I should continue to flag such questions in the future or not

Awesome Poodles

4:34 AM

@SonicWizard Let me know how it turns out. I'm inclined to give 'em the BotD but the site/group never really developed a clear policy (except on the tutorial spam ones).

HTTPS

4:52 AM

@SonicWizard What's wrong with some of placeholder questions?

Sonic Wizard

@HTTPS Because there's a close reason for them?

HTTPS

oh ok, apparently there's already a precented discussion

15

Q: My app has to be published first? But it's still under development

Okay, I want to build an App that allows me to create questions on Stack Exchange. I registered it here on Stack Apps but now when I want to create a question I get this message: { "error_message": "Applications must have a registered Stack Apps post to write", "error_id": 403, "error_name...

hmm, hard choice, I'll leave it for SA regulars then :(

SmokeDetector

5:51 AM

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Blacklisted website in body: Make Pakistan your first love by Alishba Noor on wordpress.SE

user310756

6:14 AM

user310756

@sha

user310756

wrong room dammit

user310756

@TelKitty CPR

SmokeDetector

6:49 AM

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Bad NS for domain in body, bad keyword in body, bad keyword in title, blacklisted website in body, pattern-matching website in body, +1 more: As should be obvious, the fixings in turmeric forskolin are generally normal, by Exinglity19 Virk on graphicdesign.SE

HTTPS

@YvetteColomb curious question: how do your feel about being an SO mod until now compared to on other SE sites? :)

you're free not to answer on here though...

Magisch

@YvetteColomb nice foals

rene

7:45 AM

@balpha it looks like websocket messages with action 1-questions-newest-tag-php no longer cause a new questions element to be added to the DOM. See the report here meta.stackoverflow.com/q/365897/578411

HTTPS

7:56 AM

> It is downvoted because [...] you still have a facebook account [...]

I should try that approach next time

rene

Feel free

Derpy

looks like someone is confusing unicorns and pikachu

SmokeDetector

8:22 AM

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Blacklisted user: Does anyone from Team Iron Man wear caps? by adam hooley on scifi.SE

HTTPS

@SmokeDetector the selfie abuser came again

rene

8:54 AM

any delete voters here: meta.stackexchange.com/a/308987/158100 /cc @Bart @ShadowWizard @Glorfindel @JourneymanGeek

Derpy

@rene is that NAA?

HTTPS

flagged with abusive cat flag though...

rene

@Derpy well, low quality, maybe rude/abussive. So red flags could work

Derpy

<sarcastic>I'm not sure, maybe it is just a wrong answer that should be downvoted</sarcastic>

rene

delv-pls 20K problem meta.stackexchange.com/questions/308983/… /cc @Bart @ShadowWizard @Glorfindel @JourneymanGeek (needs one more)

HTTPS

9:00 AM

or just a wrong site to post (intended to answer on Puzzle.SE)

user310756

@Magisch thanks :) they are new babies I bought - they were trapped from the national parks - wild horses. Feeding the little man up, he's so small

user310756

Our baby is still due - I'm acutally sitting in a pitch black paddock typing this to you :)

user310756

@HTTPS oh it's so busy and there's so much to learn - as we don't use many of the features on pets, as we haven't had the need to (yet)

user310756

I am really enjoying it

user310756

I find it harder to handle flags from this laptop than my desktop - don't ask UI and my huge font so I can read it lol

HTTPS

9:03 AM

@YvetteColomb great to hear that :)

user310756

@HTTPS thanks for asking secure connection

user310756

I am not disapponted at all- in fact it's better than I hoped

user310756

and it's good to pass the time of day (night) on foal watch :)

Derpy

.... and Window just decided to disable desktop icons font drop-shadow.

user202362

Would be interesting to see @Yvette's reaction if Tuppy's baby is not brown :x (s)he would be the only non-brown horse ~_~

Derpy

9:08 AM

@TelKitty that's why horses are so inferior to candy colored ponies. So few shades, so few choices....

Where is my purple horse? Why there is no horn option?

That said....

shouldn't we vote to have @Yvette change her avatar to Malon from Ocarina of Time (and by consequence @TelKitty one to the cuckoo lady from Kakariko village)?

HTTPS

> If you are looking for a dog that behaves like a cat, may I recommend just getting a cat. -- pets.stackexchange.com/a/20148/3671

user202362

sometimes you walk your dog, sometimes your dog walks you!

Derpy

@HTTPS maybe he likes getting awoken in the middle of the night by a dog that has just decided midnight is the best time for a barking concert?

user202362

@Derpy In reality, pony looks like this:

user202362

9:18 AM

the small one

Derpy

@TelKitty nonsense. They look like this:

don't try to trick me.

your picture is just a poor photoshop work

user202362

woot? ponies are like midget horses

user202362

SmokeDetector

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Bad keyword with email in answer: How did they hack my Wordpress sites by Janet Jonas on serverfault.com

Derpy

@TelKitty that is a dachshorse, a d&d creature. Commonly used by halflings

user310756

9:33 AM

@TelKitty we have one chest nut - which is a type of brown I guess

SmokeDetector

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Bad keyword in link text in answer: What are the differences between different types of cloth backdrops? by david willy on photo.SE

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Bad keyword in answer, link at end of answer: Searching for a specific object in an ArrayList by aneliaa on codereview.SE

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Blacklisted website in answer: Number of irreducible polynomials of degree $r$ in $F_2[x]$ by careenjoseph on mathoverflow.net

user310756

9:56 AM

I got a mosquito smushed in my track pad

rene

One bug down ...

user310756

the mozzies are rampant atm

Derpy

HTTPS

poor moth...

user310756

@rene oh I get the bug joke now lol

rene

10:09 AM

Yeah, my humor is of high quality ...

user310756

hahaha

user310756

refined flower quality

user310756

@HTTPS may moth rest in peace

SmokeDetector

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Bad keyword with a link in answer, link at end of answer: Why is the JSON content from heredoc not parsable? by Daniel on unix.SE

Sonic Wizard

cv-pls meta.stackexchange.com/questions/308989/…

delv-pls 20k+ meta.stackexchange.com/questions/308989/…

SmokeDetector

10:40 AM

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Misleading link: Аудиозаписи в VK API by Иван Петров on ru.stackoverflow.com

SmokeDetector

11:31 AM

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Manually reported answer: Error when trying to update or download module – WAMP by john smith on drupal.SE

balpha

11:52 AM

@rene (left a comment) it works fine here, any additional info that may help debugging?

Magisch

Are some of the CMs on vacation?

I was expecting some more CM involvement in yesterday's IPS drama. Maybe it's a way of trial by fire to have the community work it out themselves

balpha

I'm intrigued, what drama are you talking about? I have no context

Magisch

There was a very ... contentious question on IPS yesterday that blew up

involving a lot of comments, active discussion on race relations in the US and elsewhere, a few meta posts, some disgruntled users, some people calling others trolls

and a lot of very heated sentiment

we're not quite through yet but it got pretty bad yesterday

over here: interpersonal.stackexchange.com/questions/13071/…

You can probably see a lot of the now gone cruft with your dev access balpha

It spawned 1 2 meta questions

balpha

sigh

anyway, looks like @JonEricson did get involved?

Magisch

@balpha I called all of this happening a couple minutes after the Q was asked

Yeah Jon locked an answer due to an edit war

From past experiences I would have expected a mod or CM to shut the thing down sooner, though

rene

12:02 PM

@balpha I'm trying again to repro, hold on

Magisch

The atmosphere over at IPS meta has gotten quite hostile lately tbh. It's really tiring and makes me not want to read meta much anymore

balpha

so... you're saying the IPS regulars should work on their ... interpersonal skills?

SCNR ;p

Journeyman Geek

heh

WHy would anyone want to read meta?

(I mean, I engage in it but clearly I like pain or something)

@Magisch more seriously though, from what I've seen, some aspects of IPS just seem kinda draining.

rene

@balpha does it matter that I have PHP in my ignored tags?

balpha

very likely so

Magisch

12:05 PM

@JourneymanGeek I don't mind that too much. Just the hostility has been growing so much

It seems people just stopped assuming good faith and now it's just a bickerfest with people assuming the worst of each other

I kinda came to SE to escape that pervasive divisive attitude

Journeyman Geek

Well, its kinda easier on tech sites

There's a good reason you have more drama on non tech sites

and most of our drama's on chat

Magisch

Yesterday's IPS drama was mostly on meta

and under the question

I also have a feeling we're burning out our mods

Journeyman Geek

Well, that's something for the CMs to deal with

its not unheard of for them to intervene on meta or help out if needed

rene

12:20 PM

@balpha you're right, on the tags that I have ignored I do get websocket messages but the div.new-post-activity doesn't get added. I don't recall it worked like that before nor why you wouldn't want to add that div for my ignored tags. I mean, don't even subscribe for the websocket action in that case, if performance is the reason to do so.

I'll add a comment on the meta post

HTTPS

12:48 PM

@Magisch did the question got into HNQ? I didn't remember see that question...

HTTPS

1:07 PM

Something to try: always post answers without addressing "you" and "I".

(now curious, how many answers have I included "you" to refer OP or "I" to refer myself?)

SmokeDetector

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Bad NS for domain in answer: Discussion board - add 'nickname' functionality (SharePoint 2010) by shawnivan110 on sharepoint.SE

HTTPS

@HTTPS apparently quite many. It's hard to avoid them...

SmokeDetector

1:28 PM

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Bad keyword in body: Strategic Approach for Application by user32151 on sqa.SE

rene

1:48 PM

Looks like this is vandalzing an entry: meta.stackexchange.com/review/suggested-edits/57332

Derpy

Btw, I have received a first reply to my support ticket about the different reported prices for a VM of the same size in the Azure portal and Azure pricing tool

it basically is:

> Good question. We too are wondering why this is happening. Will contact you as soon as we can discover the cause of this weird behavior.

rene

LOL

Magisch

@Derpy sounds off script. You probably bypassed t1 and t2 support

Derpy

@rene Some years ago, we noticed a weird bug on our on premise internal SharePoint farm (which is luckily used only as a document storage) : out of the blue, workflows started to run on document library folders.

This is a feature SharePoint never had in the first place. OOTB no workflow can run on a folder - multiple vendors had to develop custom products to be able to do that.

SmokeDetector

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Bad NS for domain in answer: Some apps displaying white screens by Adam Jordan on superuser.com

Derpy

1:56 PM

We opened an incident with Microsoft. We even sent them the full backup of the web application. They were able to reproduce the bug using said backup.

They spent months trying to find out why that was happening and how it was possible in the first place. They found nothing.

about four months later, they gave up.

rene

awesome story ...

Derpy

> We recognize the bug you have reported and were able to reproduce it with the sample you provided. We weren't able to identify the the source of the problem, nor how to fix it. We suggest you drop and recreate the aforementioned site collection. If the issue persists, consider reinstalling the whole farm. As we weren't able to solve your problem we have refunded you any cost tied to this incident

rene

reinstalling the whole farm and who is going to pay for that?

HTTPS

unpractical "practical" solution?

Derpy

@rene guess it? Us, of course ^_^'

that said...

yesterday, by Derpy

My head canon is that right now, a manager is asking one of the dev if he also published the changes to the live site when he updated the prices on the pricing calculator six month ago (or if he also committed the DB transaction after updating those data....)

^ still my best guess right now.

I can also foresaw the mentions about the issue in the next marketing reports

> We finally discovered why our price drop strategy for Azure VM didn't give the expected results. The online price charts were never updated with the discounted prices.

rene

2:09 PM

> We did base the bonus of the sales department on the older, higher prices. We'll ask them to refund the salary they received due to this mishap

Derpy

@rene still better than:

> We discovered that the higher prices on the price calculator were the right ones. We retroactively applied the correct prices to all billing data for azure customers in the past year.

> You have a week to pay the difference before we confiscate your pc.

John Dvorak

s/pc/life/

Jon Ericson

2:33 PM

@Magisch I'm somewhat involved behind the scenes. I woke up to a ton of pings on my one meta answer there. So I guess I'll be more involved today.

rene

It is a shame I don't want inter-personal skills, I would never be bored ...

HTTPS

2:48 PM

you just need inter-pollination skills ...

SmokeDetector

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Potentially bad keyword in answer, potentially bad keyword in username, username similar to website in answer: Cannot install Elementary Tweaks in Loki (no release file for the repo) by ysfl on elementaryos.SE

Magisch

@JonEricson With all due respect, the situation has escalated far beyond control now

It feels like people just get away with ignoring explicit moderator instructions. It's extremely disappointing that some of our most active members on IPS are among them

Sorry to wake you up like this :p

Derpy

Apr 9 at 12:59, by Derpy

once there was an user in a room. She has an avatar with a blue pegasi on it. Multiple time she was bashed, multiple times the basher was suspended from the chat. In the end, guess who moved on? If you guessed it was she... you won!

HTTPS

Everytime you commented about SE's goal being a high-quality repo of Q&A, I upvoted it.

Magisch

I feel like I'm talking against a wall of "but my feelings" here

How hard is it to take your uncharitable opinions of other users and just not post them

HTTPS

2:59 PM

FR: ban "you" and "I" on IPS.SE

or just ban "you"

John Dvorak

bad idea

HTTPS

Well, I'd ban you instead

John Dvorak

still a bad idea

HTTPS

do we need to ban "thee" also?

John Dvorak

most likely a typo for "three"

Derpy

3:03 PM

@HTTPS thou?

HTTPS

seems a typo of "tho"

John Dvorak

itself a contraction of "though"

Derpy

nope, just "Ye Olde Butcherede Englishe"

SmokeDetector

3:22 PM

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Bad keyword in title: How can I watch FIFA World Cup 2018 for FREE? by Willam on security.SE

user315433

3:51 PM

> It's time for me to leave Stack Overflow. I don't know my timeframe yet, but I'm looking for my next thing. Seeking a community-focused engineering role. If you have ideas, get in touch. DMs are open. -- Ana Noemi at 8:17 AM - 11 Apr 2018

user315433

What's an example of a community-focused engineering role?

user315433

Social Engineer?

Anonymous

Glitch!

Anonymous

now with Glitch for Teams!

Tim Post

@SFTP A really good example is the early days of SO, where many of the developers also directly worked with the community.

So you could push something, get feedback immediately, iterate, and keep doing that (sometimes for days) until it was just right.

A role at a more mature company would be someone that looks for pain points in products, and tries new approaches to solving them. Or, essentially, being the person that has their ear to the ground and the person that checks in code and builds out.

Magisch

4:08 PM

I'm less and less convinced that IPS will end up being workable long term tbh

HTTPS

IPS will work fine. As long as there are active mods, SE sites will be self-correcting...

It's a natural selection.

Like those who left Physics.SE to create non-SE site called Physics Overflow

Anonymous

Natural selection requires a lot of death.

Sonic Wizard

My system is still experiencing technical issues; I'm about to go for a checkup.

HTTPS

Go check-up with Dr. Eggman...

Sonic Wizard

@HTTPS Nice idea, walk right into his trap

user315433

5:02 PM

Dash did enter the TIW thread after all...

user315433

> This is really an awful response, especially as so many on the SO team have been working on improving exactly these issues for years. “I have one contrived example” doesn’t refute people’s lived experience & isn’t how people feel safe and welcomed. Listen instead of asserting. -- Anil Dash at 8:57 AM - 12 Apr 2018

user315433

Question is, how do you make people feel welcomed while downvoting and closing their question? Is adding :) in a comment enough?

HTTPS

I think I just realized that SOUP reorders the 'vote' sorting (on meta?) so that accepted answer won't get pinned when it's lower than the top-voted answer (or has negative score?)

surprising and confusing at the first...

Andy

You sure? I haven't noticed that behavior

πάντα ῥεῖ

5:21 PM

Hey @Princess

HTTPS

@Andy observed on this MSO post

@SFTP "Welcome to [site.se]❗ SE is not a discussion forum, but a Q&A site. Please take a quick [tour] to understand how this site works, or 😊👉🚪"

or sometimes selfie is needed too, even in the comment

SmokeDetector

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Shortened URL in body: HELP, I need Chinese to answer my questionnaire! by Priscila de Moura on chinese.SE

user315433

5:50 PM

> when you record a macro, Sheets converts the macro actions into an Apps Script automatically. If you want to update your macro, you can simply edit the script directly instead of having to re-record the macro from scratch. You can also write your own Apps Script functions and import them as new macros. gsuiteupdates.googleblog.com/2018/04/…

user315433

I don't have a reason to use this myself, but looks like a pretty big change in Sheets functionality. Hopefully there will be fewer "please write a script for my ultra-specific task" questions on SO and Web Apps.

Princess Luna

@πάνταῥεῖ o/

John Dvorak

> I should have changed that stupid lock, I should have made you leave your key
> If I'd known for just one second you'd be back to bother me
> Go on now, go, walk out the door
> Just turn around now
> 'Cause you're not welcome anymore

πάντα ῥεῖ

@Princess ;-D

user315433

-4

A: Hijacked certificate and Remote Login. Office computer compromised with a virus?

Burn the machine with brimstone and fire like this

HTTPS

5:57 PM

@JohnDvorak and that's why Tim lost his key...

John Dvorak

again?

user315433

> i cannot find any cleaning products so far with milk or honey in. chemistry.stackexchange.com/a/95079

user315433

Mix equal parts of milk and honey, stir, apply liberally to the surface to be cleaned. #lifehack

user315433

Or pour into washing machine instead of detergent...

Princess Luna

Wrong input box XD

HTTPS

6:02 PM

@SFTP Sustainable Living?

SmokeDetector

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Offensive answer detected, toxic answer detected: Random letters and touch input on iPad by Yunis Jama on apple.SE

SmokeDetector

6:21 PM

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Email in answer: USA visa refused 4 times by MICHAEL FOXX on travel.SE

user315433

@SmokeDetector EDIT SUGGESTED

HTTPS

@SmokeDetector toxic answer... that's.. new?

user315433

Yes, Smokey is using perspectiveapi.com which was already used by HeatDetector for comments.

πάντα ῥεῖ

@HTTPS Not to mention those little flies, which will come and stay sticky :-D

HTTPS

6:34 PM

#causeasceneSO (not for the faint-hearted)

πάντα ῥεῖ

@HTTPS I'm quite tired reading about the so called toxic community at SO (or SE in general), unless new users stop polluting these sites with plain s--t. I receive a weekly newsletter from Quora since I've signed up there, and just keep it for the nods and laughs.

HTTPS

And this whole week I got exposed to many discussions on toxicity, including on YouTube, not only about SO/SE. What is this... Toxic Week?

πάντα ῥεῖ

@HTTPS Just follow @POTUS. They might have some answers for you (or just not) :-P

Not to mention it's a Friday 13th tomorrow again ...

Princess Luna

7:00 PM

@HTTPS T;DR: a bunch of users see hate against 1 rep users who break the rules and still don't try to follow them (with horrible "excuses")

nicael

I didn't even know it was a thing

(it's not anymore, but it's the first time I see the migration from already-inexistant stack)

user315433

> . @StackOverflow community gatekeeps around what is a "valid" question to shut down minority voices. One community only uses SO for answering questions (no forum or chat). I asked about the licensing for their neural net training data. Inappropriate question! #causeasceneso -- Sage Sharp at 6:43 AM - 12 Apr 2018

user315433

Yeah, obviously closed because the asker was a woman, not because licensing questions are off-topic...

Anonymous

@HTTPS I ignored your warning and my peril and now I am emotionally damaged.

Shadow Wizard

7:15 PM

@READandSee-It'sNotaDupe no you're a duck

I'm afraid to ask, but... what's not a dupe? @READ

Anonymous

Maybe that emotional pain is just my latent psychic abilities beginning to surface...

Anonymous

@ShadowWizard This is not a dupe, even if it's a terrible idea.

Catija

@READandSee-It'sNotaDupe Has Jon converted you to that line of thinking?

Shadow Wizard

@SFTP yeah, I find it really ugly that women use their gender to try and gain sympathy. If anything, it only harms women in general. But guess we can't really fight this, so better not take part.

Catija

7:19 PM

.... ok...

user315433

Hm. A flight with 40 minute connection involving two JFK terminals. Delta is unable to give me either (a) seat number for the 1st flight; (b) boarding pass for the 2nd flight. My confidence in reaching Portland tomorrow is waning.

Shadow Wizard

@READandSee-It'sNotaDupe huh. So I'm part of the reason for your name change... #feelingAshamed ;)

Anonymous

@Catija I'm not sure that it is a bad idea, but I am considering that it might be a bad idea. :P

Catija

@READandSee-It'sNotaDupe You really should try to see if one of the CMs will take pity on you and change your name back. I went looking for you the other day and had to do it by finding your account on SO first.

Anonymous

It's the second time I've made a post on the eve of April Fools without realizing it. But at least that one actually was a joke.

Shadow Wizard

7:20 PM

@Catija you're as far from there as one can be, from what I see and from what I know about you. But when a woman whines "they closed/downvoted/deleted my question/answer because I'm a woman" it's just wrong in so many levels.

Jon Ericson

Cromwell's rule

Cromwell's rule, named by statistician Dennis Lindley, states that the use of prior probabilities of 0 ("the event will definitely not occur") or 1 ("the event will definitely occur") should be avoided, except when applied to statements that are logically true or false, such as 2+2 equaling 4 or 5. The reference is to Oliver Cromwell, who wrote to the General Assembly of the Church of Scotland on 5 August 1650, including a phrase that has become well known and frequently quoted: I beseech you, in the bowels of Christ, think it possible that you may be mistaken. As Lindley puts it, assigning a...

Anonymous

@Catija I'd rather wear it out as a lesson not to impulsively change my name. ;)

Anonymous

@JonEricson A wise tenet.

Shadow Wizard

@READandSee-It'sNotaDupe whoa! +28/-28!! Posted these days, it would be like -50/+0

Catija

@ShadowWizard I agree with your general thesis. But, really, people of all stripes do this... I've been accused of all sorts of "you're only doing this because I'm ____". It hurts all of them...

The difficulty for me is finding a way to respond to or evade that assertion and get to the actual problem.

Anonymous

7:25 PM

@ShadowWizard Yeah, it caught the tail end of humour being tolerated. One of the last Fridays in Iceland. 😐

πάντα ῥεῖ

@Catija Don't respond beyond DVs or CVs. That's what I've learned the hard way.

user315433

> Thanks, Anil. To be clear, Jeff has not worked here for years, and his views here do not represent us at all. We're very aware that SO is not welcoming to many, especially people new to programming, women, and people of color. We are listening and trying to get better. -- David Fullerton at 12:21 PM - 12 Apr 2018

user315433

Wonder how SO leadership became aware of the site being unwelcoming specifically toward people of color.

user315433

Hopefully not "by reading Twitter".

Anonymous

oh, Jeff is back to fighting on Twitter?

user315433

7:28 PM

Yes, he never learns..

Anonymous

I kind-of appreciate him taking these fights that the staff can't for the sake of professionalism.

Catija

But that doesn't sound like he's doing it quite right?

Anonymous

Jeff was a mediocre community manager, but he really does advocate the vision passionately.

Anonymous

> It's been ~24 hours, so here are the results. Brand new user, clearly feminine name, random programming question. Not seeing any toxicity?

Anonymous

This is not a professional response.

Anonymous

7:31 PM

oh LOL he was being called about by Anil?

Catija

Yeah.

Jon Ericson

@SFTP Partially from the annual survey and partially from research I can't talk about right now.

Anonymous

Well, from having read a ton of them both on Twitter, I'll side with Jeff over Anil any day.

Catija

Is Joel going to be talking about it in that blog series?

Jon Ericson

I have no idea.

Anonymous

7:33 PM

I worry about people like Anil, who has strong opinions about many things but very little understanding of how Stack Overflow actually works, having too much influence on Joel/management.

Anonymous

His philosophies are a great fit for Glitch, which is doing amazingly, but Stack is a very different beast.

Adam Lear

That's a false dichotomy. Stack Overflow can maintain its mechanics and be a more welcoming place overall.

2

Catija

SO can maintain it's quality and be welcoming, too.

Anonymous

It definitely can, but it must be done with careful understanding of how things work, so as not to break them.

Catija

You need to find a way to lessen the burden on the first responders, though.

Adam Lear

7:36 PM

@READandSee-It'sNotaDupe Sure, no argument there.

Well, maybe a little argument. :) There may be some things about how SO works that we'd need to adjust. Hard to say what or how, but "we've always done it this way" isn't a good product development strategy regardless of what problems are in need of fixing. So we'll see.

πάντα ῥεῖ

I appreciate that Jeff still has some opinion and stands it. Joel might need to report his investors.
A similar case:

imore.com/sites/imore.com/files/styles/xlarge/public/field/…

Anonymous

That's a truth: whether the change is good or bad, the community will probably still say "you're ruining the site". Which makes it all the more difficult to really judge. :/

Anonymous

I've read/heard Anil mention Stack a lot of times, and I see him having those strong opinions without that understanding. That's probably fine, since it's a valuable perspective to have at the table, and the staff do have the understanding. I am just paranoid due to his relationship with Joel, and the fact that he's confident enough to engage with Jeff about these things.

Adam Lear

I don't think Anil is as unaware as you think.

You might disagree with his ideas, but that's not the same as him not knowing what he's talking about. :)

Anonymous

That could be. Often what first appears as "ignorance" is just a disagreement one level deeper than you've [heard] discussed.

Anonymous

7:43 PM

I've never spoken to him. The people who have seem impressed, and I trust many of their judgements, so maybe I owe him more commutative trust.

user315433

The % numbers in survey aren't a proof of any problem. If NFL fan forums are mostly visited by men, does that prove they are unwelcoming to women?

user315433

Maybe "participation in online forums, specifically Stack Overflow" is not really an essential part of being a developer?

Anonymous

Also did I mention that Glitch is amazing? Well, I'll mention it again. And again. It's one of my favourite things released in the last five years or so, and the team seems to be doing an amazing job. 💖

Adam Lear

I've never actually used it... I really should. I keep hearing great things.

Anonymous

Stack has left me feeling empty whenever a web page doesn't have an "edit" button, and Glitch lets me put them on every little tool I whip up for fun (example), and host them forever for free. :D

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7:48 PM

@SFTP Since when were SE sites meant to be "online forums"?

Catija

@AdamLear So, what part does your pair programmer play? Moral support?

Adam Lear

@Catija Fur heap overflow

he's shedding like crazy right now

Catija

Hee hee. Awww, poor guy. Finally warming up for him? Losing the winter undercoat?

Magisch

Cats are amazing

Adam Lear

he must be, but I'm also pretty convinced he's really just one fluffy undercoat with legs

Magisch

7:56 PM

@AdamLear What breed is your cat?

Adam Lear

we don't know for sure, but he's some sort of a mix of birman and another fluffy breed. persian or himalayan maybe

πάντα ῥεῖ

@AdamLear Sometimes pukes at your keyboard (without giving a specific reason)? Best companions ever :-D ...

Adam Lear

Thankfully, never on the keyboard (yet) :)

Catija

Have you ever given him a bath?

Adam Lear

Hahahaha no. I like having my limbs intact.

Magisch

7:59 PM

Giving cats baths is usually a bad idea if you dislike being clawed

When I was 7 I dropped my cat at the time into a filled mopping bucket and I'm pretty sure I had to get stitches

Catija

But soaking wet long-haired cats are about the funniest things to look at.

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Adam Lear

I once had a cat I had to give a bath to (backyard rescue)... he wasn't super into being dried off, though, so he bolted and hid in his safe spot. Which is great, except that his safe spot was the litterbox.

Magisch

@Catija Do your cats tolerate being bathed?

If so, how did you train them to do it?

πάντα ῥεῖ

@Magisch Catnip probably :-)

Catija

8:03 PM

I don't have a cat right now.

But... my understanding is that if you get them used to being bathed as kittens, you can do it all their lives.

Magisch

I've never seen a cat that tolerates water even slightly

πάντα ῥεῖ

@Magisch Me neither so ...

Catija

Funny Cats Love Water Compilation 2014 [HD]

►

Adam Lear

Fat Cat Swims To Lose Weight: News Anchor Can't Stop Laughing

►

πάντα ῥεῖ

@Magisch But being curious about you laying in the bathtub, and doing all dangerous things about balancing the rim. Bad injuries received, when they failed and fell into the tub.

Magisch

8:07 PM

current apartment doesn't allow pets sadly

otherwise I'd have 2-3 cats right now

πάντα ῥεῖ

@Magisch They can't really deny small pets like cats or so. Did you know that?

Magisch

They can and do

I'm getting this apartment for less then half of what it should be

there are some ... tradeoffs

πάντα ῥεῖ

@Magisch Not legally. But I can understand you don't wanna fight for your right.

Magisch

Unofficial conditions include no pets fund your own repairs and no complaining when they operate industrial saws downstairs on 6am and on the weekends

πάντα ῥεῖ

@Magisch Better than bearing your parents maybe ;-)

Magisch

8:11 PM

@πάνταῥεῖ Getting the apartment for 275 when it should easily be 600 based on location helps

πάντα ῥεῖ

@Magisch Did your job situation getting better at least?

Magisch

aye

done with the apprenticeship, got promoted, my boss has a lot less say over what I do now

became data protection officer a while ago so technically speaking they can't even fire me anymore

πάντα ῥεῖ

@Magisch Sounds a lot better since "then", yes. Thumbs up!

πάντα ῥεῖ

8:54 PM

Regarding that (boring) discussion about _toxicity_ :
If you attend to handle toxins in the wrong way, you shouldn't wonder getting intoxicated.
(FWIW)

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