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1:48 AM
35 messages moved to Chimney
 
 
5 hours later…
6:38 AM
@Spevacus Same.
 
7:17 AM
@SmokeDetector ok
 
@ShadowWizardSaysNoMoreWar k
 
@Luuklag That message is not a report.
2
 
 
2 hours later…
9:31 AM
@Luuklag yeah sadly someone upvoted that... :/
I mean... 0 efforts when asking why on earth should we help such person??
!!/coffee lazy me
 
@ShadowWizardSaysNoMoreWar brews a cup of ristretto for @lazy
 
 
1 hour later…
10:46 AM
@Tinkeringbell do you need me to flag this user that claims to be 12? meta.stackexchange.com/questions/379968/…
 
@Luuklag They say 'in class 12'. I already googled, that means they're in the 16-18 range usually. So I wasn't planning on doing much :)
 
ahh, to quick to jump to conclusions
 
No worries :) If you do see one that actually says they're 12, you can always flag :)
 
 
3 hours later…
1:22 PM
I'm unsure how to feel about this question. I modified the last sentence to be actual english, but with that change it just feels like a dupe of this post.
 
@Spevacus You got an answer lined up?
 
Naw, just curious how others feel. I voted to reopen as it falls within, what I would consider to be, a reasonable level of opinion-basedness for Meta.
That doesn't mean it's not a dupe still, though. If that dupe (which Rob originally linked) doesn't actually fit, then I don't really know what does.
 
@Spevacus agreed. It's not so wide open that literally anything is a valid answer.
reopened and dupe voted
 
Joining you in that.
 
good
 
1:42 PM
You didn't even give me time to get into the second closing menu @tink
 
:D
I'm fast today. Mostly boring meetings ;)
 
@Tinkeringbell yay for those
We just got emailed that all our physical meetings are cancelled on monday
 
I'd rather not have them, but it pays, so whatever.
 
Due to expected farmers protests
@Tinkeringbell exactly. I get paid to drive to people, thats even better.
 
Ah, yeah. Coworkers here also cancelled the office day because of expected protests, the roads have been a bit blocked lately ;)
My day was cancelled anyways, I'm supposed to have my last day of covid isolation today :)
 
1:44 PM
@Tinkeringbell the covidiot finally contaminated you?
 
I'll call the doctor tomorrow to ask if I really can go outside, even though I still have a cough. But everything I found on the internet said that you could stop isolating after 10 days.
@Luuklag Not even the covidiot. He's not a big problem anymore now that I live on my own. This was a coworker that was also being a covidiot ;)
 
@Tinkeringbell don't you need to be symptom free for at least 24 hours?
 
@Luuklag Apparently, not..
 
you could ofcourse have just a regular cold
How about getting yourself tested again?
 
@Luuklag Eh, I could always do another self-test, sure. Maybe tomorrow ;)
 
1:48 PM
Or just get a GGD test, or do those no longer exist?
They apparently still do, but most locations have been shut down
 
Yeah, bunch of locations have been shut down, and you only need to self-test anyways.
 
I don't really trust those selftests, or rather I don't trust people to take them carefully themselves, as that is the major limitation to their specificness
 
2:11 PM
I'm smart enough to do one right ;)
 
2:59 PM
@Luuklag I didn't trust em till I tested positive :D
 
3:31 PM
mom's got it again - so far so good on my side, tho hopefully I don't test positive before sunday.
 
 
3 hours later…
6:51 PM
@JourneymanGeek you got plans on sunday
Hope your mom doesn't get too sick
 
lol
If I test positive on sunday I can skip work
 
@JourneymanGeek hahaha
 
35 messages moved to Chimney
 
@rene You need to reduce those N emissions from your Chimney by 70%
 
I'll drive my tractor up your chimney, okay? ;)
 
6:59 PM
@rene Good luck with that xD
You might want to pick monday to do that, then you won't be noticed amidst all the other tractors
 
yeah, it is going to be a big party, for sure
 
are...are there expected to be a lot of tractors on Monday?
 
Farmers protest?
 
@RyanM Preferrably not, but our dairy farmers are kinda protesting/rioting. There are plans to reduce the N emissions from agriculture to meet EU guidelines on Nature conservation. For some regions emissions need to be cut by 70%. The only way that's going to happen is by cutting the number of cattle, which will mean the end to about half of the dairy farms in NL.
 
:(
 
7:08 PM
ah yikes
 
Lmao they brought the cows with them
That's awesome.
 
Yeah, they wanted to make politicians decide which of the two needed to be slaughtered
 
Fairly moving choice of protest. It's a tough call.
On one hand, the environment is super important. On the other, peoples' livelihoods are, too... There's got to be some compensatory plans if this goes through right?
 
Yeah, I thought that was a pretty neat way to protest
@Spevacus Ofcourse, but these people say: "we are farmers, we can't be anything else"
They feel like their culture gets taken away from them
which is really tragic ofcourse
 
7:13 PM
Yeah that really sucks.
 
But they are kinda overplaying their hand right now. They ended up busting through police lines at the private residence of the minister of Nature, and at the private recidences of some parliament members
 
All that does is cast their argument into the mud. :(
 
Besides blocking major highways, hindering emergency vehicles at the same time
 
Uck. I do hate when that happens.
 
At the same time there isn't that much the police really can do without completely escalating the situation. They seized a tractor here and there, arrested a few handful of people
But for every cop there appears to be at least one tractor.
And to be honest a regular cop-car really isn't a match for a tractor
They do have some larger riot vans etc, but those are limited in numbers, and can't go off-road like tractors. So if those block the entrance to a highway, they will just pass right by them over the grass etc.
 
7:16 PM
I used to live out in the almost-middle-of-nowhere, surrounded by a large number of farmer families. They're pretty dug-into their ways. I mean, they drove their tractors to their high school graduation ceremonies. If that isn't proud-to-be-a-farmer, I don't know what is. I imagine it's the same over there.
 
So either politicians manage to calm things down, or I'm afraid we're going to see militairy vehicles in the streets.
@Spevacus Yeah. You can get your tractor license at 16 here, just like your moped license, lot of kids make use of that in the rural area's. It definetly beats biking 30+ mins to school in the rain.
This clip shows a bit what were dealing with right now, across multiple highways the last few days
Monday is said to become a new high in number of protestors
 
lol, just dumping hay in the middle of the highway
Yikes.
 
I wouldn't be surprised if their going to aim for airports on monday
Farmers feel treated unfairly, as most of the reductions have to come from the AG sector, as its easiest achieved there.
 
7:50 PM
@Catija - how do y'all want Stacks Editor bugs reported? Answers to meta.stackexchange.com/q/360033/165261, new questions, something else?
 
8:10 PM
@RyanM A fair few Stacks Editor bugs have started being reported as new questions: meta.stackexchange.com/questions/tagged/stacks-editor (sort by newest)
If you need more convincing, Glorfindel has also posted one: meta.stackexchange.com/q/379709/622284
 
8:28 PM
What the heck is condensed ice?
 
@RyanM All I get are Genshin Impact articles, so my best guess is that it's an IRL debuff that makes you more tired.
 
@Spevacus Oh, I don't want that. I'm already usually very tired.
 
In other words, it's a very chilly lecture room.
@RyanM Are you more or less tired now that you've sprouted a diamond?
 
@Spevacus [insert plagiarized copy of the Wikipedia article on insomnia here]
 
Oof :(
lol
Are you guys drowning in flags, btw? Not that I'm complaining, but I've noticed that the ones I raised back on the 9th are still pending, and I was curious if y'all were alright.
 
8:35 PM
Very much so.
 
@RyanM on SO?
 
What would you attribute that to? Lots of nasty stuff coming in, an inundation of flaggers, mod burnout?
 
I've personally handled 1905 flagged posts this week.
 
Goodness. Other site mods would be unlucky to handle 1905 flagged posts in their tenure.
 
We've mostly been keeping it between 800-1000 pending flags.
There are just...a lot of them. The plagiarism is really not helping, either, because those are extremely time-consuming to handle.
We probably need more moderators, but it's unclear how much interest there is from qualified candidates who believe they could be elected.
 
8:38 PM
@RyanM If I had the time I would love to help out, but I most clearly lack the rep and badges on SO
 
Other things that would help would be improvements to NAA/VLQ handling, including stopping the crap from being posted in the first place, allowing enough NAA flags to delete a post (spoilers: if a post has 8 NAA flags on it, it should really have been deleted five minutes ago)...
 
You've got the makings of an interesting feature request there. Having NAA flags act like mini delete votes the same way Spam flags do could be neat.
Really only helpful on SO, but neat.
 
I believe it's my 90-day anniversary of sprouting said diamond. Stats in that time.
 
@RyanM doesn't that just indicate a lack of people using their del-votes? Or aren't enough people with the priviledge?
 
Still can't quite catch Dharman on that deletion stat, though...
 
8:43 PM
Dharman before a diamond: I wish I could help out more
Dharman after a diamond: *pew pew pew pew pew*
 
@Luuklag Little column A, little column B, I think. Might be a good PSA, honestly... or to suggest that some of our NAA flaggers invest their effort in the Low Quality Answers queue instead.
 
@RyanM a little PSA once every while is definetly a good thing
 
But yeah, if one flag + 4 "recommend deletion" votes from 2kers deletes an answer...5 NAA flags from 2kers really ought to.
 
@RyanM sounds like a FR to me
especially if you tie that in with being overwhelmed with NAA flags
 
8:47 PM
That's not horrible, but it's certainly not great either, considering by the time you've sifted through those ones, there'll be plenty more to replace them.
 
Yeah it's really that second part that's the problem :D
Heck, I personally have 16 pending flags and I'm a moderator :D
Most are plagiarism-related, where more work is required.
 
Do you come back to the things you've left flags on that haven't been picked up yet, or do you just try and handle other stuff first?
 
@RyanM well 216 custom flags is the bad part I guess, I can't imagine any of those being a quick thing
 
Well hey, 4 of those are mine, and they're pretty quick to deal with IMO (one could be declined if mod info turns up nothing interesting)
 
Well, a tiny percentage are... "duplicate answer: [link]", or just totally invalid flags :-p
 
8:51 PM
but those plagiarism ones, they aren't just a quick check on the off-site resource and be done with them?
 
Ah, man, I don't really think about it but I imagine you get a fair few really crappily-explained flags.
 
@Spevacus those are quick to, just decline
You can't be bothered to write a clear flag, you won't get any help.
 
:/ Ew.
 
@RyanM no doubt about that needs deleting
 
8:57 PM
How many delvotes, out of curiousity?
 
@Spevacus zero
 
Well, 20k isn't that easy to get I suppose.
 
2/6 flaggers were 20k
 
Oh.
 
@RyanM could they have exhausted their delvotes?
 
8:58 PM
I'd say I'd think they were out of delete votes but I should know better than to assume.
 
or isn't that something you could see?
 
also keep in mind that you only get 30 del votes per day
@Luuklag It's not, annoyingly. That's another feature request we could really use.
Investigating invalid close/delete votes is almost impossible.
 
Seeing the remaining amount of regular up/downvotes isn't necessary, but seeing remaining moderation-related votes feels like something you all should be able to see.
 
We can see them if we're linked to the questions, but we can't go from a user's profile to the questions they've close/delete voted.
 
@Spevacus you get to see your del vote quota as you perform a del vote
 
9:01 PM
If the &sort=closure/deletion/undelete/reopen endpoints on the profile were open to moderators, one could probably fashion a script to determine a particular user's remaining moderation votes.
 
Yeah, I don't really care about the remaining count, I want to see what they voted on.
 
@RyanM can you see who voted on a post then?
 
@Luuklag For close and delete votes, yes.
 
Yeah they can see moderation vote history per-post
 
Even if we couldn't, if we were really curious, we could just cast the last vote and then everyone would see it ;-) but we can.
 
9:03 PM
What do you think is the tool improvement that you most direly need right now? I know you've probably got quite a few scripts to make up for other parts of the UI, but what's something you would really like to see happen tomorrow?
 
@RyanM yeah, thats pretty public though
 
@Luuklag Only if the related action actually occurs at some point and doesn't age away. (minus del votes, those dont age)
 
@Spevacus Personally? Automatic plagiarism checking.
 
@Spevacus yeah true
 
It's tedious to do manually, plus we often don't catch people until hundreds of posts in.
A user with 37k rep and 600+ answers was recently destroyed for plagiarism.
 
9:05 PM
@RyanM so that every post gets a plagiarism score? Just like with university papers for example
 
At which point that's a surefire mess to untangle, yeah... So like... Do you have to search through every single post to find one that's not plagiarism, or do you just blow the profile away when it's that bad?
 
@RyanM wow, thats one crazy vote invalidation
 
@RyanM Good... Lord.
 
@Luuklag Something like that. I'd take a "possible plagiarism [link to source(s)]" flag.
 
Anyone want to build a bot to auto-check for plagiarism? Call it... Lie Detector?
 
9:07 PM
@Spevacus The 37k user was destroyed without a complete check after a couple moderators concluded that nearly every single one of 100+ posts checked was plagiarized.
 
@RyanM yeah that aught to suffice
 
Generally, we start bulk-deleting at some point if a high enough percentage are plagiarized, then offer to undelete anything they identify as not plagiarized.
There was one user with a bit over 200 posts, 82 of which were plagiarized...that sucked. I checked every one.
 
Ah, I remember you offering that (the offer to undelete non-plagiarized ones) to someone and they gave you a link to one that definitely was still plagiarized.
 
Both people to take me up on that offer have identified at least one plagiarized post as not-plagiarized.
One even had my comment on it with the link to the source...
@Spevacus Guttenberg in SOBotics might be a good starting place for that. I'd even be happy with something that searches SE more thoroughly.
Guttenberg relies heavily on the linked/related questions feature, which isn't great.
 
opens SObotics
immediately flags 4 Natty posts, all of which were pretty clear-cut
 
9:11 PM
With some users, you can tell if the posts are plagiarized or not by the writing.
So once I've decided they've crossed the "bulk delete threshold", I'll go through and delete anything that it looks like they didn't write, then check the ones I think they might have.
 
anyways, im heading off to bed. its already past 11 pm
 
night! o/
 
o/
 
o/
 
o/
 
9:13 PM
If you're interested in hunting plagiarism, BTW, we have a private room on SO chat for it so that we can discuss it/collaborate without calling people out publicly.
 
That's a good idea to have, especially with 37k rep people posting blatant plagiarism everywhere...
 
Let me know if you want in
 
Sure, why not? I'll see if I can't contribute a bit.
Chat profile Id is 11171084
 
9:31 PM
@RyanM I think we're about to put out a new version in the next week or two, so it's possible that we've already addressed it - but as to reporting it anyway, you can either create a meta question or even put an issue up on the GH for it.
 
 
2 hours later…
11:21 PM
Celebrated the 90-day anniversary of getting my diamond by deleting over 500 posts today.
Mostly plagiarism.
 
11:54 PM
Omnomnom
 

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