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12:42 AM
I'm being notified to review my own tag wiki edits
 
 
2 hours later…
2:36 AM
ugh
 
 
4 hours later…
6:43 AM
7 messages moved to Chimney
 
4 messages moved to Chimney
oh
 
This was supposed to have gone up yesterday, but when I woke up this morning and checked my machine I noticed that I had everything drafted out but the Submit button was never hit. Oops. — Grace Note ♦ 2 days ago
 
and I can vote there ...
strangely enough ...
sd remove
 
 
2 hours later…
8:56 AM
[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Bad keyword in answer, potentially bad keyword in answer: Criteria for selecting language for first programming course by anushka sharma on cs.SE
 
can someone unprotect the coc post again
 
[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Potentially bad NS for domain in answer: View all files in a website's directory? by Phumelela on superuser.com
 
9:22 AM
@Magisch It's unprotected again :)
 
@Tinkeringbell If you are linking to the dog answer in your meta post, it is probably better if you link to the specific edit revision.
 
@Derpy Which one, the deleted one? I was going to get to that comment sometime today :P
 
animuson edited out the threats and the answer is now locked, so if anyone follows your current link they wont get what you are talking about
 
@Derpy Oh, I missed that I guess. I'll go and take a look. :)
TBH I haven't taken a look at the answer/flags there yet today. I noticed animuson's answer yesterday evening and that was it :)
Thanks, I'm going to take a look now :)
 
don't worry, just wanted to warn you in case you missed the edit.
 
9:31 AM
@Derpy woof?
 
@Tinkeringbell probably the revision id link is enough (maybe add a notice about the edit). Should be this one
 
@Derpy I linked to revision 6 directly ;) But it's done :)
@Magisch And it got protected again about 5 minutes ago :/
And it's unprotected again :P
 
10:04 AM
another thing you may want to add to the discussion. Did you ever see this post?
 
[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Bad keyword in answer: Is Academia.edu's "mentions" feature real? by Sage on academia.SE
 
I think that replies to someone who really fear for their safety fall in the same objection shog made there.
It is useless to advise them to carry a mace or some pepper-spray. They need to get help - fast help from someone who is able to give it. Police maybe. Social services. Not some random internet folks that will reply two days later.
 
10:32 AM
[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Blacklisted website in answer, pattern-matching website in answer: Tin Whistle as a second instrument, easy to play single notes? by jeanrhall on music.SE
 
10:53 AM
@Derpy Well, sure. Did you notice that was on a question that I wrote? ;)
Also, the answer read 'mace him' which made me thing I was advised to use medieval weaponry instead of what's called pepperspray ;)
TBH though, there's a very strong culture where I'm from where people with disabilities are looked upon as 'they can't help themselves, deal with it'. Which in this case made me think there was something I was doing wrong, instead of that this was something that was seriously out of bounds.
I've since learned better.
 
11:24 AM
Oh, nice, Lego is about to start selling a VOLTRON(/Golion) set?
 
12:01 PM
I really wish there was a way to sort your flags by time handled at
 
12:23 PM
@Derpy yeah, saw that news, quite surprised
 
12:37 PM
@SomewhatMemorableName well, someone did build a lego Aquarion, so...
 
 
2 hours later…
user351483
2:15 PM
Oh heck. Where have I ended up? Gosh, I'm on main meta!
 
ohno
 
@Snow This room is so hard to find, how could you end up here by accident?
 
> According to the new/upcoming Code of Conduct, you should move on and do nothing whenever you experience something you don't like (or flag if it's harassing - what answering a duplicate clearly isn't). As you've seen by your declined flags, the moderators also don't mind someone answering duplicate questions.
 
@KevinB Did you receive that message? Interesting as it directly concerns the passage of the new CoC I highlighted in my answer to it.
 
2:21 PM
oh man, are people pulling off that kinda BS already? :(
 
well, at least it's on a deleted answer
 
Well, to me, answering a dupe is at your own risk (of being closed)
If he's copy pasting answers to dupes, I typically close as dupe, then let the user know he should be closevoting or flagging as appropriate
if its plagurism... πŸ‘ΏπŸ‘ΏπŸ‘ΏπŸ”₯πŸ”₯πŸ”₯πŸ”₯πŸ”₯πŸ”₯πŸ”₯πŸ”₯πŸ”₯πŸ”₯
 
The cases i see are rarely ever copy paste, they're questions that are so easy to answer that copy pasting would be a waste of time
 
This question for example, it's a very obvious dupe... but he answered it. and when it was closed as a dupe, he hammered it back open
 
2:27 PM
ooh
that probably needs a mod to look at it
I didn't realise you could gold hammer open
 
My new plan: Publish every vile thing a human being could ever say about another human being. Ditch the code of conduct: we just delete insults as plagiarism and there isn't any more discussion needed.
 
@TimPost Nothing would be read more often than that
 
Also, whoever went to the weirdest bar in the galaxy and wrote For a good time: tpost@stackoverflow.com on the bathroom wall -- thanks; I owe you one.
 
You are welcome
 
@TimPost Make it community wiki, so everyone can add their own insults :D
 
2:37 PM
[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Potentially bad ns for domain in answer: CentOS 7 httpd failed to make connection with backend by Ramon R. on unix.SE
 
Nothing is seemingly more conroversial than asking people to be a bit nicer to each other.
 
@TimPost .... This sounds brilliant
 
> But i was being nice! They were the ones being mean!
 
It's always someone else's fault that I'm an a**hole; blame them instead.
 
hah
@TimPost unless you're the one who's proud of being one.
We all know people like that ;)
 
2:42 PM
@AnneDaunted I think a lot of people may be afraid they're going to be asked to be too nice
Hand out upvotes like participation trophies or something
 
@Tinkeringbell or niceness is used agressively
 
@Tinkeringbell But upvotes are and will remain anonymous
Maybe they think that, as they are helping others, they deserve some fun
or that they could be targeted by crybullies
 
@TimPost I dont envy you for the task of rooting through all these replies
 
@AnneDaunted I read an interesting theory on that kind of thought lately... That people can't stand being average, so if they aren't excellent at something... They find something they're really bad at/ make themselves special
 
@AnneDaunted the bullies will find something.
 
2:47 PM
@Tinkeringbell People are too afraid of abstract concepts
 
@Tinkeringbell heh, the people around me are better at a good many things. That's not bad ;)
 
I found it a very harsh way of looking at people, as it poses it like people do this deliberately... Yet I've noticed that people either associate themselves with stuff they're good at or something which makes them different in some way... You never hear someone say they're average and boring. Unless they can off course boast they're perfectly average and boring XD
 
@JourneymanGeek They always do
 
@AnneDaunted and hopefully either try the folks who don't care, or really are going to turn it around on them ;)
 
@Tinkeringbell If no one is average, then being average makes you unique, doesn't it?
 
2:49 PM
that's not how the definition works
 
@AnneDaunted Haha true. I think the previous chapter hammered close that loophole though by saying no one is special ;)
 
@JourneymanGeek Or those who call the cops ... err ... mods
 
@AnneDaunted heh assuming it happens here
 
@KevinB I guess the definition of an average person is: Everyone who doesn't want to be just average
 
@AnneDaunted wait - what? then how will they show they aren't kid anymore? How will they show off their alpha status? What's next, suggest them to start reading fairy tales again?
 
2:52 PM
I've had a few clear cases of folks trying to take out an offensive post being deleted here on my blog
and a few ... sad little folks who just tried to troll me anyway...
I do feel sorry for folks whose sense of self worth is based on their percieved ability to make someone elses life miserable.
 
@Derpy they aren't all bad guys. Sometimes people just want other people to listen and think.. and see the same problem they're seeing.
 
@Derpy I guess not behaving like a kid is not an option in their eyes?
 
A lot of folks though...
 
@AnneDaunted If they were, they'd have forgotten their anger after 10 minutes in the corner... Angry adults hold grudges a lot better/longer
 
@JourneymanGeek Maybe you should link to your worst enemy's blog in your profile then
 
2:58 PM
@AnneDaunted I don't really hate anyone.
I mean, if you think about it, when folks lash out, they're sad, and need a hug.
Just that sometimes that hug is from a hungry lion.
 
Or from a cute dog
 
woof :)
 
@Tinkeringbell Children can do so, too. Probably different circumstances (e. g. the difference between a parent making me obey for my own safety and a bullying co-worker)
 
You should really beware that if you populate the place with lions, you'll kill all humans and you'll only be left with lions and vampires. Vampires can't eat lion blood and will starve. Lions don't watch ads.
 
Where do the vampires come from?
 
3:11 PM
They come from ghosts that taste of fresh blood. Ghosts can subsist on coagulated blood, but it's more work because they have to search for it, and they too will leave once the blood becomes too old and devoid of nutrients. One issue is that the blood of today's cash cows gets stale too quickly and is useless for ghosts. We want ghosts.
 
No, I'm afraid of ghosts.
 
Satisfied ghosts stay ghosts. Unsatisfied ghosts turn to vampires or to Yahoo.
 
3:29 PM
@Tinkeringbell To be fair, I was talking about this
> Surprise at flags on vulgar messages. Language that would invariably get your comments deleted on the main site occasionally gets flagged and deleted in chat. Confusion reigns.
and expecialy this.
With the standard reaction "how they dare! We are grown up! We are not child! Our room culture allows this! We are entitled to! Who they think they are to come here and tell us what to do... just because they own this place?"
 
i mean... flags it chat cause a lot more ruckus than comment flags do.
a hell of a lot more
 
@Derpy Ah. I didn't directly make the link with chat, so I thought it was just about how people behaved and the sites in general
 
@Tinkeringbell well, it is not like many users react very differently when they get an answer / comment removed because of a rude message flag or even because a staff member had to step in personally.
 
The problem with chat flags is if a room is getting a lot of them, the room is penalized. but we don't have the tools to really deal with it. The most we can do is move the message
 
I saw a good share of rants like "How dared shog/balpha/Tim/Grace to delete my post? Who he think he is??"
 
3:38 PM
@KevinB I'm.. not so sure about the penalized. From what I've seen, once it starts getting a lot of flags, people step up and try to help get it past the troubles, while trying to not disband the chat community
 
They do try, but the room often gets frozen in the process or threatened to be frozen. At least that's how it felt over in js chat
There would be a bunch of flags, messages would be moved, and then a mod has to sit there and try to piece together what happened so they can deal with it
If you're not there for the conversation, it's quite hard to figure out what happened when messages are split between two-three rooms
 
@KevinB Would you say it worked? That the people left there now feel free to be there in a constructive manner and the troublemakers have gone or bettered their behavior?
 
No.
lol
 
@KevinB that's true....
 
the "troublemakers" are still there, we just lost the people who actually held constructive conversations
 
3:42 PM
:/
 
and that's in quotes because I don't consider them troublemakers
 
Same is predicted to happen with the new suspension-happy CoC
 
they're just the ones that happen to attract flags from time to time
 
the difference is seeing it deleted real-time (chat message) vs need refresh (comment)?
 
[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Pattern-matching product name in body: Bungee jumping and maximum force by robax on physics.SE
 
3:44 PM
The difference is you get zero feedback for deleted comments
 
With chat... I don't think just being able to freely delete messages as an RO would be good enough, it would need to be tracked in some way, that's why i was suggesting tieing it to the kickmute
 
@JohnDvorak Trust me I smash the mod message button pretty hard if your comment was r/a. That's only true if the comment was noise, but since such noise is allowed in chat...
 
@SD TIL "Max Force" is a product name...
 
yeah off topic discussion is allowed in chat, but... that gets weird when an off topic discussion is something that not everyone would appreciate being discussed
where do you draw the line
 
like, discussing an article about something potentially offensive
 
3:48 PM
yes
 
@KevinB Where ever your room seems to want it. It's perfectly okay to ask people to take stuff to another room so a main sites chatroom can stay on-topic
@SomewhatMemorableName Oh that's a harder one.
 
Agreed... but that doesn't stop it from being flagged
 
The Lounge wanted their line deep into the land of the shadows. Got denied.
 
it's hard to draw a line on this without just resorting to "Only discuss javascript in javascript"
which... is basically what it has turned in to
at least in r17
 
Chat.SO -> Discord.SO -> IRC.SO -> IRL.SO(!?)
 
3:51 PM
IRL meetings, perhaps?
 
@SomewhatMemorableName IMO that isn't impossible, but might require more effort on the tact side than most internet people realize
 
... and while discussing the topic, at the peakest point, a non-regular joins the room... and chaos ensues
 
[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Potentially bad ns for domain in answer: Error installing iptables-persistent by lukeismighty on raspberrypi.SE
 
4:11 PM
[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Manually reported answer: Commodity vs. Currency by user84992 on bitcoin.SE
 
4:30 PM
@SomewhatMemorableName Sorry. I had a case of 'chatty bus driver syndrome'. I think that might depend on the tone of the conversation? Mind you, I'm saying conversation, not discussion, on purpose here ;)
discussions on the internet tend to get heated a lot quicker than conversations.
 
4:47 PM
@saulspatz ok. Thank you for that. Users on this site are so kind, sometimes $\stackrel{\bullet\,\bullet}{\smile}$ — user477343 7 hours ago
As a non-regular, it's really a weird feeling to flag a comment saying that "this SE community is kind" as NLN.
Am I... jealous of that site, or just doing a SE user's duty?
 
@SomewhatMemorableName Maybe both?
 
@SomewhatMemorableName I'd say it's nln...
 
5:01 PM
@JohnDvorak ..and a number of very-highly-skilled and experienced C++ developers, (Puppy, Mysticial etc), disappeared from SO.
 
5:13 PM
pretty sure Mysticial is still around
 
 
@Shog9 Not seem him/her much:(
Not seen it much?
 
there
 
5:28 PM
Interestingly, there are featured questions on meta, yet if you click on featured (next to active and hot), you see the questions with an open bounty instead. That's maybe a bit confusing.
 
well, != bounty ...
but at least both are featured in a more specialized place
 
I do not mean tags, I mean the yellow featured on meta box.
 
but...
that means the question has the featured tag
 
bounties are "featured" because someone has paid for them to be featured
using rep
 
5:37 PM
it's just that you have two different ways of being featured and both are distinct from each other - having the featured tag or having an open bounty.
 
Only because they needed an easy way to control what posts get "featured" in the box.
the tag is a relatively easy way to accomplish that, and "featured" seems like the appropriate name
 
one is only available on main site but open for public, the other is only for meta site and mod exclusive
but well, would it be reasonable to change "featured meta posts" to "PSA" instead???
 
i mean... it's pretty obvious once you click on the featured tab that what you're looking at is bounties
 
@KevinB But if you were looking for questions with open bounties, would it be obvious that you have to click on the featured tab?
 
hmm, the featured tab is already stand out due to the number badge though
 
5:49 PM
i'd never do such a thing
 
and it's gone when there's no bounty -_- (still can access directly from URL though)
 
i'd rather bounties just not exist
 
why?
 
they interfere with closing
 
what if closing just cancelled the bounty, like it never existed?
 
5:54 PM
that would be nice, but could be abused
 
On normal sites, when do CM handle flags? Do they intervene if there is something pending for a long time?
 
put a 500 point bounty on your question, get the answer you want, vandalize it, and get a refund
at least currently that would require mod intervention
 
@NogShine Or if something is causing trouble I guess... I know of a case where a CM declined a bunch of flags on IPS because of them being pending for a while, and yesterday someone helped us out clean up a messy answer :)
 
Like I read sometimes that CM handled flags on SO when the queue is high.
 
But right now there's flags that have been pending for a long time and those were left alone ;)
 
5:56 PM
@Tinkeringbell It's animuson.
 
@NogShine I didn't want to name names :)
 
@KevinB But would vanalizing not lead to a rollback and a mod locking the question (rather than closing it)?
 
depends
 
@Tinkeringbell :) We can name CM's here. He handled an answer and wrote a meta post too. We can name for positive deeds. There are rules when to ping though. ;)
 
all the OP would need is one person to vote to close it as a dupe
they accept it, and get refund
 
5:58 PM
Only in case one person's vote was enough to close the question
and then you could safeguard against such shenanigans, e. g. that the bounty will be awarded in this case and the user can't get it back this way.
 
6:22 PM
I guess it's unavoidable that some *Language.SE allow native language on per-child meta discussion... though whether it's welcoming to non-speaker or not....
 
6:37 PM
Create an account with the association bonus, offer a 100-rep bounty, and then after awarding it, delete the account. (As you've never posted or voted more than once, it will be immediate.) Recreate the account, it will be given the bonus again. Repeat...
Additional steps: create a new sock, award it a 200-rep bounty on one site to give it the association bonus rights, then on another site, do this to grant your own account more rep.
 
6:53 PM
hmph...
 
did the tag tooltips always used to popup so frequently when hovered over?
the new one just caught my attention, i don't recall what the old one even looked like
 
7:13 PM
@KevinB you could still go to other sites except SO, MSO and MSE... but anyway, both still has 1-second delay before pop-up, though the new popping animation feels faster because of fade-in, instead of wiping
and of course, bigger.
 
It's likely just the fact that it's larger that i'm noticing it more
The first time i saw it was because it got stuck open
 
 
1 hour later…
8:46 PM
@SonictheInclusiveHedgehog Except that it'll be blindingly obvious what you're doing
 
9:06 PM
The humor is gone on this site: meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/370607/…
The 418 I'm a teapot route still works. I just tested it intensively ...
 
> On casting the last of 5 votes take extra care that all is correct. In case there are 3 or 4 votes who had a different or in your opinion wrong close reason don't vote because your vote will be overridden. -- Community moderators: Review bans will be issued earlier @ German.SE
While the goal looks good, I think some wordings/concepts are... not really correct?
 
9:21 PM
@SomewhatMemorableName I think they never saw leave open but let first see how it goes?
 
9:47 PM
You can always try to buy Sweden. That makes that the *.se domains come for free ...
 
meta.stackexchange.com/questions/69589/… (@Shadow) (close older one as dupe of newer one with team response)
 
Hey. I created (stole/copied/changed) a browser userscript for our Mathematica.SE site that adds several helpful buttons to the post-editor. The script is highly successful and used by most regular users. However, I'm not a JS guy and adapting the code was a pain. Can someone give me a hint how I can find information about setting up WebStorm correctly so that SE functions like StackExchange.MarkdownEditor.refreshAllPreviews() are recognized and I can develop and debug the script easily?
 
@Magisch I know. But what about the former case, where you just award a whole bunch of bounties to other unrelated users?
@SomewhatMemorableName Monica Cellio said she switched to Stylus a while back
@Shadow Never mind, OP hammered the target before I could retract my prior vote.
 
Btw, I came here because it was mentioned on StackExchangeScripts to drop by. I have looked through several Q&A about WebStorm and Chrome userscripts but I really wonder, how professionals work on such projects.
 
@halirutan that is rather broad so your best bet is own of the chatrooms. Maybe the javascript room on SO can help out
 
9:53 PM
We do have quite a bit of experienced user script writers here. Unfortunately, I'm not yet one of them.
 
@halirutan I would not call my self a professional but I write the scripts simply in the editor that comes with the script manager in the browser, in my case Tamper Monkey
that prevents that I have to mock stuff like StackExchange.MarkdownEditor.refreshAllPreviews()
 
@rene Really? Oh man.. then I'm lost. I'm quite experienced with Java/Kotlin but never got warm with JS. I always thought I'm doing something seriously wrong when setting up my dev-environment.
The main reason I asked here first is because I'm not sure it will be closed instantly on SO.
 
In that case, might I suggest that you do ask users on Stack Overflow Chat.
And the converse, let's redirect idownvotedbecau.stackexchange.com — Glorfindel 36 mins ago
@JourneymanGeek ^^
 
I really would like to look over the shoulder of e.g. Tim Post, who helped a lot some years ago when I wrote this. Maybe I just ask. Thanks for the input everyone.
 
@rlemon see above thread ^^^^ any advice on a WebStorm setup for SE Userscript development? (or do you know someone who might have advice?)
/cc @Makyen ^
That is the most annoying best I can do ...
 
10:01 PM
i have little to no experience getting autocomplete support added to ide's, i don't use it
 
@KevinB But how do you discover all the js functions that are available? Do you read the minimized js code?
 
well, no, i read docs most of the time
unfortunately there are none for your case
 
@halirutan calling StackExchange from the browser console might work
 
@KevinB :)
 
There is however the object available on window in the console
 
10:04 PM
@halirutan you don't need to read the minified JS code, if you mean the SE code: dev.sstatic.net/Js/full.en.js?v=8981fe7b960e
 
ctrl+u on that and you've got linenumbers
 
@SomewhatMemorableName Nice. How could I have found this without your help?
@KevinB Yes, this works. Thanks.
 
As a rule of thumb... When writing userscripts, do most of your work in the browser console. Test everything in small pieces, explore the DOM and whatever the page's scripts expose... Leave for your text editor only once you already know what you're going to write.
 
@Shog9 OK, that's exactly what I was doing the last time and I was sure back then, that this cannot be the right way :)
 
10:09 PM
@halirutan hmm... curiosity? trial and error? like calling StackExchange.notify.show("Hello World") on main site :)
 
@halirutan here is the unminified wmd.js
 
ew
clicking the X on the notification doesn't hide it
 
@SomewhatMemorableName @rene Thanks. Both sources help and I can use them to make WebStorm recognize the functions.
 
you're welcome
 
10:13 PM
you're welcome
 
we're all welcoming
 
🚽
 
sd del
 
10:51 PM
@SomewhatMemorableName This would be better as: StackExchange.notify.show(message, messageId). IIRC, without a messageId, the user won't be able to dismiss the notification and/or you won't know that it's the notification which you initiated that you're removing (e.g. it could be a notification from some other script).
 
11:26 PM
@halirutan Unfortunately, I'm not aware of a good IDE setup for userscripts, certainly not one that includes what's available specific to Stack Exchange (e.g. the StackExchange Object, and the other Objects that SE adds to the global scope). If you do find one, I'd be interested.
2
I've done most of my userscript development on FF with GM3 (Greasemonkey 3.x), because it stores userscripts in separate files on-disk, which allows you to easily edit with your preferred editor, rather than only with the userscript manager's editor (or having to copy-&-paste the entire script all the time). Unfortunately, that's going away shortly with the EOL of FF 52ESR.
GM3 also more strictly enforces the separation of userscripts from page-scripts, which helps prevent writing code that creates security issues, even when that separation is not so strict (all other userscript managers). For more information on how to handle this separation, it's a good idea to check out how content scripts work for browser extensions.
As has already been mentioned, exploring both the non-minimized code, which you've been pointed to, and the various Objects which SE adds to window are quite helpful. To get a better feel for what is called when, I created a userscript which hooks into every public function in StackExchange (and other Objects) and reports the arguments passed. At the same time, I, of course, also hook all of the AJAX calls with reporting of the arguments passed (data sent) and data received.
This allows me to more easily reverse engineering what SE is doing in any particular situation. Combined with the unminimized code, it's effective.
As has been mentioned, experimenting in the browser is quite beneficial, but I tend to compose in my editor of choice and then copy into the browser, if desired. Frankly, that's usually only when experimenting to figure out how something that already exists in-page works, or things like determining what CSS is needed to be adjusted, etc.
 

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