Tavern on the Meta

2:55 AM

@Shog9 @Shokhet hey guys sorry too much too drink to do anything with code tonight will deal with all tomorrow good night and ty for all your help

Feeds

4:04 AM

"This will take a while, which sucks, because I'm already so busy chiseling out igneous intrusions from rock formations and watching Youtube loops of the Superman fault-sealing scene over and over."

user202362

this strip tells us that use the right posture to push a rock or you might end up with back pain

user289971

4:44 AM

Yeah well that was on Charcoal HQ

user289971

Whatever

6:01 AM

@JasonC @hichris123 Can you make me an RO in Chimney as well or at least give write permission there?

6:24 AM

Are moderators supposed to be impartial

Or they can exhibit bias towards users

I am honestly curious

Can they say "well, rules A and B only apply to so-and-so, but for you, I won't apply it"

sure, they are human, not robots. They can make judgement calls.

Is singling out users really a judgmeent call

I'm having trouble understand -- I thought moderators were supposed to impartially apply the law to all

user202362

@whoa SE constantly classify users as dogs, cats, raccoons and baboons. They are others but we will not go into details. It looks like that you have been classified as raccoons, this category of users have the lowest level of privileges and tend to be on every suspect list. You sir, maybe a raccoon

Not say "well here's our undesired question list ... don't worry, it doesn't apply to you ^.^"

Without context I can't say and might be different on some sites so this is better brought up on the site meta or maybe in chat with said moderator

6:31 AM

I've already sent a message to the email

community email or w/e

I'm just confused -- can site moderators simply ignore the rules when talking about a specific group of users

"theses site rules do not apply to you"

I thought rules were meant to be enforced down to a T

user202362

of course it doesn't, would you treat a raccoon the same as you would treat your dog?

If you have send the email I'm sure the CM team will look into it,

I sure would. I'm not biased towards dogs

Or cats

Would you treat dogs/cats/raccoons differently?

Would you treat dogs/cats differently

user202362

of course I would, I would walk my dog on a leash but not my cat

afk

6:33 AM

Who says you can't leash a cat?

No one's stopping me from leashing my own kitties :)

Just because they're not dogs doesn't mean they don't have to be a cat

Not every raccoon is the embodiment of chaos

user202362

you sir, are a raccoon. take my word really

Not every dog/cat is the embodiment of good

And you sir, are just an animal.

Take my word, really :)

user202362

nobody said cats are embodiment of good

I'm not biased -- I don't classify people just to be cute

So why did you classify people into 4 categories?

Surely there's a reason

user202362

there are many more

user202362

6:36 AM

but you sir, are a raccoon

You sir, are a troll then

user202362

afk

That's fine with me, I'm just classifying you based on mythical creatures

:)

@JasonC great work on chat topbar 1.11! However, the changelog dialog is vulnerable to mouse-wheel overscrolling :p

anyway, that's very uncritical, ignore it...

8:09 AM

Seems UK Election is a good thing to watch now...

...hung parliament?

Derpy

@Elephant Did they try to reboot it?

Bart

8:57 AM

I'm not surprised by people calling @Telkitty a troll. Sir however ...

user202362

Trolls are just a sub-category of raccoons

TIL.

9:40 AM

→ 16 messages moved to Chimney

user202362

10:43 AM

farming.stackexchange.com

user202362

nothing, no result found

45

Agriculture & Farming

Proposed Q&A site for professional farmers, hobby farmers, and anyone else who raises animals, crops, and/or other agricultural products.

Currently in definition.

user202362

ty

Derpy

brb, I'm going back to nature.

user202362

11:09 AM

it rained the whole day - a whole day without exercise

user202362

I am having suicidal thoughts

> It sounds like you’re going through a hard time. I’d really like to help you, but unfortunately, we’re not well equipped to do so here. Your best option is probably to call a suicide hotline. People are on call there to talk to people struggling with the same kind of issues you are, regardless of location. If calling is not good, you can chat with them live online. It might not help, but what’s the harm?

user202362

I am having suicidal thoughts because I have not exercised for a whole day, I am sort of an exercise addict

that's scary. just like having suicidal thought if not enough SE

user202362

ok, not suicidal thoughts, just depressed ... I can't mentally accept the fact that I have not exercised for a whole day

Bart

11:26 AM

So ... go exercise

user202362

11:52 AM

heavy rain, might wait until tomorrow morning

Derpy

12:05 PM

A: Why does my cat paw her food from the bowl to eat?

12:20 PM

Shaaaaaaaaaaaaun!!!!

Shokhet

1:23 PM

@JasonC There's no rush, and no need to apologize! Take your time and do it right.

...and if the script keeps working the way it is, it's still much better than using chat without it. If I have to learn to scroll a little bit, then so be it :)

user315433

1:39 PM

It's 3 years since Data Science went into public beta. The most viewed question asked in the last year: Why do internet companies prefer Java/Python for data scientist job?

user315433

> Blessed are the forgetful: for they get the better even of their blunders.

user315433

1:59 PM

0

My Kitty used to drag food out of bowl, but got her a spoon. quite neat eater recently!

3:42 PM

Does anybody have a second to help me test something in chat for the topbar? It requires a second person.

@JasonC sure

Sweet meet me in chat.meta.stackexchange.com/rooms/1034/shadows-sandbox

"sweet meets"

Not unlike hot meat posts.

Or exchanging meat stacks.

Ew. Nevermind.

meat.SE

3:52 PM

Mmmm

@peterh Welcome to Tavern on the Meat.

3

EWWWW

peterh

@JasonC Welcome! :-)

@Guero I never understood why the SE is working so actively to avoid its growth

@Elephant To be fair I would totally be in to a butcher's se site.

Although it's probably too narrow.

there's already Seasoned Advice

Oh right, duh.

Which I'm already totally in to.

peterh

@Guero If the creators of the Data Science SE could have got the possibility to freely select from the anyways closed questions of other sites, and import them, all of the SE sites would be much bigger

@Guero Because the owner didn't wash the bowl enough well, and the old meat remains are rotting on it and stink. The cat senses the odor, and understand very well that it is a stinky bowl, but with fresh meat.

@Guero And the cats hate the rotten/stinky things. They like most the mouses and similar, small things what they've just killed and they are still warm and bloody.

@Guero Most dogs aren't so choosy, except if they had some bad experience, for example they've ate rat poison already or tried to eat the food from a mouse trap what clased their noose. But cats are by default choosy.

4:04 PM

@Elephant @Shokhet Everything's fixed and published, will be there when you update. Changes.

peterh

@Guero Alternatively, it is also possible that the owner washed the bowl well, and the odor of the washing materials deter the cat. Cats hate also the non-biological odors, their genetical program says it is poison.

@peterh Holy metaphors, batman

Shokhet

4:21 PM

@JasonC Cool! Thanks so much! :D

Chat reply fix: confirmed. 👍

fist pump

user315433

5:44 PM

Jun 5 at 22:17, by Gerry

Keyboard shortcut users: does "g p" work for you on SO? It's supposed to go to your profile.

user315433

Bueller..? Bueller..?

5:56 PM

@Guero I've never used them before but I just turned them on and there doesn't seem to be a p in the g list

user315433

Oh. It's different from other sites like Super User which have H in there.

user315433

I never looked at the options because I memorized them long ago.

user315433

Funny, Unanswered is still there although it's no longer a thing in the UI

user315433

And F sends you to /faq only to be redirected to /tour

user315433

6:04 PM

Options for non-SO sites ^

user315433

So, both A and P are removed on SO for some reason. ?

user315433

Thanks for noticing!

@Shog9 I'm looking at this firefox patch now. Why is changing the setting stuff into window events needed for firefox? Just curious. The GM_ stuff is supposed to work in FF I thought.

@JasonC it's not. It's yak-shaving.

Ah. Why do you prefer doing it that way?

6:11 PM

The bulk of the script has no need to run in a privileged context (access to GM_* API). When injected into the page itself, it has direct access to other scripts (jQuery), events, expandos, etc. - so no need to load jQuery twice, no need for unsafewindow.

Also, it's a lot easier to debug.

Ahhh

This is great

The only privileged APIs the script needs while running are those to save / delete settings - since you were already wrapping the GM_* API for this anyway we can just proxy those through a custom event on window, and use a little stub in the privileged userscript to handle 'em.

The alternate solution is to load jQuery into the privileged context or not use jQuery, both of which are more messy than this solution and also don't have the debugging bonus.

I see

And fundamentally, tampermonkey vs. greasemonkey sandboxing differences were the root of the firefox issues?

Now, there's a wee little downside: settings changed in one page don't automatically update in other pages open at the same time. I don't consider this particularly important, but if we wanted to work around it there's a simple solution to that.

@JasonC yeah, pretty much; I was actually kinda surprised it worked in Tampermonkey.

...sorta makes me uneasy about the sandboxing Tampermonkey does

but, that's a problem for another day

From what I was reading gm changed their sandboxing behavior a while ago to make it more "proper", but also broke a bunch of scripts and irritated people in the process (probably for a good cause though). And afaict tampermonkey retained the old gm behavior.

But I'm fuzzy on the details

6:17 PM

@JasonC well... That happened a long time ago

@Shog9 That's OK it never really behaved quite that way anyways. I was never monitoring for external changes to settings.

Atm in the current version if you change settings in one window, it'll "update" the checkboxes in the settings dialog in another but it'll be inconsistent with what that page is actually doing. A little odd but I didn't really care about it.

When Greasemonkey was brand-spanking new, it pretty much just injected the script into the page with only enough of a wrapper to prevent namespace collisions. Then it added some APIs, some of which were potentially dangerous and some of which were obviously dangerous.

This is good, I have a couple other scripts I probably need to make similar changes to.

At the same time, there were pages that were actively trying to detect userscripts and mess with them (because programmers are dumb and were doing dumb things client-side without thinking about it, and so naturally took a dumb approach to fixing that when folks decided to take advantage of it)

Heh

6:20 PM

...so there were two potential problems to solve:
1) make it harder for pages to reach in and disable userscripts
2) make it harder for malicious scripts in pages to hijack userscripts for privilege-escalation attacks

ɥʇǝS

and don't run userscripts on pages you don't trust

Ah, so they separated window and such to keep it isolated?