Tavern on the Meta

3:00 PM

@Moshe Yes, that's true, it's the only thing that is bothering me too because it actually has an effect on everyone else

drachenstern

@Pekka so can I remind you that there's always DIY.SE ;)

Aiden Bell

@GeorgeMarian - my self nomination is being populated by people in here

Michael Mrozek

@Josh There's a decent chance I'll end up not voting for myself, so I won't feel bad if you don't either. There's too many other people I want to see as mods that are way more qualified; last time I checked the list there were six people I wanted to vote for and two people I wanted to downvote 9 or 10 times if possible

George Marian

@AidenBell ah, ok

Moshe

See, its not just a. Bike.

drachenstern

3:00 PM

@MichaelMrozek I'm having the same problem

Pekka

@drachenstern hahaha! I don't have that much to share there :)

Aiden Bell

@MichaelMrozek - You have my vote in the noms

drachenstern

no but you'll want to learn more

Moshe

Sorry, iPhone.

Michael Mrozek

I might not even make the primaries, the minimum rep is past 10k now. I only have 16k

Aiden Bell

3:01 PM

@MichaelMrozek - im on 14k so we shall see

Benjol

@MichaelMrozek, ah, Pekka's got some extra rep for you :)

drachenstern

I'm waiting on Skeet to ask for it too :p

Michael Mrozek

@Pekka Initiate rep transfer

drachenstern

@MichaelMrozek that's what I said :p

Moshe

Didn't know that. Minimum rep for primaries? Shows how much I know.

drachenstern

3:02 PM

@Moshe it got updated yesterday, too many nominations

Moshe

Hey, @Pekka, I could use a rep donation to make the elections.

:D

Wait are those SO or SE overall rep?

drachenstern

SO reps

Moshe

@drach was that a request on MSO? Or on the elections page.

drachenstern

restarting my call after 23 minutes

:(

Pekka

@GeorgeMarian I've grown a bit tired of the computer work, that is the main reason. I need to do something else. I do have a number of other interests that I want to try and pursue in a way that pays the rent - I'm searching for something interesting in the tourism and culture fields mainly here in my city, but one never knows where I may end up in the end.

3

drachenstern

3:03 PM

@Moshe sorry, mistyped, stupid being-on-hold-and-fixing-a-soda

Pekka

2 mins ago, by Michael Mrozek

@Pekka Initiate rep transfer

drachenstern

too many nominations

they want to keep it to the top 30 users that apply

Pekka

Who wants a 550 bounty? Huh?... huh?..... :)

drachenstern

Who here would turn down a 550 bounty? Huh? ... huh? .... ;)

Moshe

Me me me meme meme meme oy.

Michael Mrozek

3:04 PM

They should let us buy extra votes in the primary for 1k rep apiece. We'd all be bankrupt

drachenstern

don't forget there's a few days gap on those

Pekka

@drachenstern If it wouldn't take 24 hours, I would start some silly question and slap a bounty on it

What is the meaning of life?

How do I move the turtle in PHP?

George Marian

@Pekka That's understandable. I've considered switching to different fields. I hate to see you go, but I guess this means I may have a chance at answering some PHP questions. ;)

drachenstern

@Pekka bah, start six or seven questions :p

Tim Stone

@MichaelMrozek I'll broker that deal for you all. My commission is 15%.

Moshe

3:05 PM

@Pekka in Python, how do I move a turtle is not a crazy question.

Pekka

@GeorgeMarian yeah! :) I think I will be popping up in chat occasionally and posting whatever new I'll be doing at the time.

@Moshe Haha!

George Marian

@Pekka Heh, you can't stay away completely. :)

Yi Jiang

@Pekka Well, it's only 500 now that there's no 50 free rep

Tim Stone

@Pekka I suppose if you drop in from time to time we can forgive you for abandoning us ;)

Pekka

@TimStone All right! :)

@YiJiang True.... But I think you can do a 550? I'll check

drachenstern

3:07 PM

I'll help you verify it ;)

Moshe

No 50 free rep? Why? /me likes free rep

Pekka

@YiJiang True, 500 is the limit now

Moshe

I will too

wonders which is worse: a voting ring or a rep ring

:D

Pekka

@Moshe but a rep ring is all about sharing!

Moshe

True.

Michael Mrozek

3:09 PM

I'm going to start leaving comments like "I don't think I could support a candidate who doesn't give me free rep every day from now until the end of the election" on every nomination

Some would call them bribes; I prefer "reverse campaign contributions"

Zypher

Baksheesh

Baksheesh is a term used to describe tipping, charitable giving, and certain forms of political corruption and bribery in the Middle East and South Asia. Leo Deuel sardonically described baksheesh as "lavish remuneration and bribes, rudely demanded but ever so graciously accepted by the natives in return for little or no services rendered." Origins Baksheesh is a Persian word, written and originating from the Pahlavi (Middle Iranian) language. Types of baksheesh *Charity to beggars. In Pakistan and India, beggars solicit alms by crying 'baksheesh, baba!'. * Tipping. This does not c...

Moshe

@Michael - remember Mr Null Vote?

Aiden Bell

@MichaelMrozek - Just make some election pledges like "will ban jquery questions"

Moshe

That's why I'm not qualified.

Aiden Bell

and "will ban PHP questions that do not start with: 'I know PHP is rubbish but ...'"

2

Pekka

3:10 PM

@AidenBell oh yeah!

Michael Mrozek

Poor PHP people. They've been traumatized by asking questions on forums

Pekka

The PHP tag is going to love you for that kind of campaign pledge.

Moshe

I wonder... How can I learn C# .NET if my primary computers are Macs?

Aiden Bell

Ok ok "I know everything I write in PHP should be written in Python but ...."

@Moshe - I think mono runs on mac

Michael Mrozek

Clearly we need an electoral college system where each tag gets a certain number of votes based on the number of questions in it, just to arbitrarily complicate this

Aiden Bell

3:12 PM

@Moshe and Monodevelop through X11

Michael Mrozek

"I know you're popular in the Java tag, but what are you going to do for my district of C++?"

Moshe

I dunno about Mono...

Aiden Bell

@MichaelMrozek - I will lower the C++ tax by insisting all Java questions are garbage collected at a faster rate than the JVM"

Moshe

Mono makes me nervous. And, it didn't take me in and give me breakfast.

Aiden Bell

@Moshe - Mono is alright and Monodevelop is a nice IDE if you don't want to eclipse it up

Moshe

3:14 PM

I can handle Eclipse. But will code written in Mono run straight out of VS 2010 or at least 2008?

Aiden Bell

@Moshe - for most stuff if the API is implemented mono-project.com/Compatibility

Moshe

@Benjol, thanks.

Speaking of breakfast, mine awaits. Later.

Pekka

16 mins ago, by drachenstern

@Pekka so can I remind you that there's always DIY.SE ;)

Actually, there are a few SE proposals I will be following closely

It would be lovely if Outdoors.SE and Drawing Comics.SE would work out

We shall see.

drachenstern

Yeah, I think if anything you should keep the account but just like lock it out for now, or something

put it on "vacation mode" or something

remember that proposals need existing SE2.0 members with high reps to get off the ground

You've built a rep on SO, shame to waste it when you could be helping outdoors.SE

is pretty good at devil's advocate sometimes

Pekka

Jeff and Joel are veritable devils!

2

Tim Stone

3:18 PM

Don't forget you'll need at least 20 rep to chat :P

drachenstern

finally got through to the pharmacy

Michael Mrozek

@Pekka There's your winning campaign platform right there

Pekka

Didn't think of the fact that high-rep users can help proposals

@MichaelMrozek yeah!!!

Michael Mrozek

Not only can they help proposals, they're painfully necessary, which sucks for proposals with tons of interest but no high-rep interest

Tim Stone

@MichaelMrozek Ah yes, like the guy who has that dermatology proposal.

Pekka

3:20 PM

@MichaelMrozek true. No one can escape the web of Jeff and Joel

Michael Mrozek

@TimStone I wouldn't describe his proposal as having "tons of interest", although he certainly would

Tim Stone

I haven't looked at it lately, so I'll take your word for it. :P

Pekka

However, the outdoors proposal I'm following has two identical twins with as much following, they have enough high-rep support.

Michael Mrozek

@Pekka We'll make a new SO!

3

16 hours ago, by Michael Mrozek

Well, we'll go be mods on a new, better SO. With blackjack, and hookers. On second thought, forget the new SO and the blackjack

Pekka

@MichaelMrozek yeah!!! Sounds great.

badp

3:21 PM

@MichaelMrozek Why so much hate? I'd also keep the blackjack.

drachenstern

@MichaelMrozek I would deem it as of interest to lots of people who've never heard of SE or SOIS and who could really use a good place to become better informed.

Michael Mrozek

@badp I refuse to corrupt Bender's vision like that

drachenstern

Just like we were before SE/SOIS

@badp cultural reference? Are you familiar with Futurama?

@Pekka Then why haven't they been merged?

Pekka

@drachenstern because they're programming the tool to do that RIGHT NOW

4

Q: Can the hiking proposals be merged?

There is a number of proposals with a "outdoors" theme and massive overlap on Area 51: Backpacking, Hiking, and Camping - Proposed Q&A site for all age groups who love to travel the world with just a backpack to enjoy new exciting places. Hiking - Proposed Q&A site for everything relate...

drachenstern

@Pekka bah, that's just SILLY

Pekka

3:24 PM

@drachenstern it is being wrought and knitted as we speak

Or was it knit?

drachenstern

So I see, thanks for the enlightenment

Pekka

English.SE to the rescue!

drachenstern

lol, I knew someone was going to say that ... figured it would be @Josh

Pekka

On second thought, I'm too lazy to look it up.

Josh

@drachenstern what what?

I just came back

Pekka

3:25 PM

@drachenstern is it knit?

drachenstern

scroll up @Josh

Pekka

It is knit.

Moshe

I think I could help improve SO, the mobile site, that is.

It's so difficult to edit questions or even answer on a mobile device.

drachenstern

en.wiktionary.org/wiki/knit

I did knit, I have knitted, I will have knitted

but you can have things which were knit together

Pekka

@drachenstern ah, thanks!

Very nice

drachenstern

3:26 PM

technically that last usage is a little older, and not really prevalent

in fact, that word is mostly out of style with the bulk of the population, outside of the range of sweaters

Pekka

Right

drachenstern

@Moshe so go visit webapps or one of the sister SE sites and pitch in with making a better interface

Moshe

And, you can't star, can't format and can't upload images either.

drachenstern

0

Q: What is the difference between “tits” and “boobs”?

What is the difference between “tits” and “boobs”? P.S. I'm not sure if this question is appropriate but as English is not my native language I really would love to know the difference.

usage differences

Moshe

@drach - where would I contribute?

Josh

3:28 PM

@drachenstern ROFLMAO

Pekka

@drachenstern ahahahahaha

drachenstern

@Moshe I can star, I don't need to upload from an iOS (if I do I do it through a photo app) and I don't have a problem with anything but backticks on iOS

@Moshe there is a whole site dedicated to the SO API

when you are on a computer ask me again, not from iOS

Yi Jiang

@drachenstern Talking about awkward...

drachenstern

> I only see the PS, where is the actual question? post pics

Moshe

finds that question offensive, as I wouldn't want it onscreen at work or with kids around

Pekka

3:29 PM

@YiJiang the Borat effect - the freedom to ask embarrassing questions under the cloak of foreignness

Yi Jiang

@Pekka Ha!

drachenstern

@Moshe why? They're bound to hear it elsewhere. It's also common for boob to refer to a clown

George Marian

@drachenstern Brilliant!

Moshe

Can we try to avoid posting things like that if they are going to get one boxed please? I don't need that on my 21.5" iMac, no thank you.

If it's a link, I know not to click. If it's a OB, the link clicked itself.

@drach - yes but the question was obviously not asking about clowns.

drachenstern

@Moshe ok, obviously you are not meant to chat on the iPhone. Go find a computer and come back and have a real discussion. You're picking nits that make no sense.

Josh

3:32 PM

@Moshe you really think kids haven't heard the words "tits" or "boobs" before?

Moshe

And "bound to hear it elsewhere" is a lane excuse IMHO. If nobody said that, the world would be a better place.

drachenstern

You're being way too puritanical with this.

Josh

Also, @Moshe, I was going to flag the question however it does appear to be a serious question with serious answers

drachenstern

It is a serious question. I'm adding a serious answer right now.

the comments were silly, but the question and answers are serious

Josh

@Moshe There's always going to be some words used to refer to a woman's breasts. And whatever words are used, some people will find some of them offensive

George Marian

3:33 PM

stirs the pot

"Won't someone please think of the children!"

Josh

Better kids see a real question with real answers than what Google would give you for the same words...

Tim Stone

@GeorgeMarian Oh you :P

George Marian

@TimStone I just couldn't resist. Such an appropriate time for one of my favorite Simpsons quotes.

Tim Stone

Heheh

Josh

@GeorgeMarian I am. I think trying to hide the real world from them is more damaging than explaining it to them on their level. :-)

Moshe

3:34 PM

@Josh - depends which kids. That's not the point. The very fact that it is an akward question proves that some people will be sensitive to that. If people will be offended, why not err on the side of caution?

Fosco

on the internet?...

may as well shut it down.

Josh

If people are offended that's their problem :-)

Moshe

I disagree.

Josh

It was not meant to be offensive

George Marian

@Josh I absolutely agree.

Josh

3:35 PM

If people take offense they are reading it wrong

Fosco

You can't expect people to censor themselves to meet the lowest common denominator of sensitivities.

Josh

@Fosco well said

Yi Jiang

And the information presented by the answers are interesting, and potentially useful

George Marian

Overly sheltered children tend to have problems in the real world.

drachenstern

serious (But longwinded) answer provided

Josh

3:37 PM

@Moshe, I feel that by saying that it's offensive to ask questions about words which are offensive, you're making the situation worse and making those words more taboo. It's much better to say, "This is a word which some consider offensive and here's some better word choices for you", and that helps make everything less offensive!

2

drachenstern

@Moshe You really need to meet more people in the world. The French would say your viewpoint is ridiculous

Josh

I would think that someone who was offended by the word "boob" or "tits" would think that was a great answer. And thus they would support a question asking what the words mean because the answer explains that they are (potentially) offensive words and educates people, thus helping make the offensive words used less

if you refuse to allow discussion about offensive words how will people know they are offensive and know to avoid them / know what the alternative non-offensive versions are?

</rant>

Moshe

I hear your points but I still disagree. Can we agree to disagree here?

Josh

Yup, I'm done :-)

Coding Gorilla

@Josh +1

drachenstern

3:39 PM

+1 on agree/disagree

Josh

@Moshe Of course no offense, disrespect, etc intended. I don't fault or begrudge you for having your own opinion! I respect that you stand your ground on what you believe

Moshe

ok, 3G data chews battery like a beast. I'm off, cya later.

Josh

Even if I believe you're wrong ;-)

drachenstern

I should really play on E.SE more often, I've got a 300 point rep there for nothing! It's a shame I have a job, I could easily get to 10k on three or four sites this year if I could just get paid to SE all day

Josh

@Moshe take care

Moshe

3:40 PM

@Josh Ditto, thanks.

drachenstern

@Josh That's like "I'll fight to the death to defend your right to disagree with me"

Josh

@drachenstern I wholeheartedly believe this!!!!

drachenstern

and that sparked me to go find it, which ...

classroomtools.com/voltaire.htm

Yi Jiang

@drachenstern What's E.SE? Electronics and Robotics?

Coding Gorilla

I'm offended by all the offending that seems to be taking place these days...

2

Josh

3:41 PM

And IO am tempted to get my sockpuppet out of the wash just so it can star that also.

drachenstern

The phrase ``I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it'' is widely attributed to Voltaire, but cannot be found in his writings. With good reason. The phrase was invented by a later author as an epitome of his attitude.

@CodingGorilla I'm offended by your getting offended that I might be offending someone!

Josh

@CodingGorilla +1 :-)

drachenstern

Hall herself claimed later that she had been paraphrasing Voltaire's words in his Essay on Tolerance:

``Think for yourselves and let others enjoy the privilege to do so too.''

In his A Book of French Quotations (1963), Norbert Guterman suggested that the probable source for the quotation was a line in a 6 February 1770 letter to M. le Riche: ``Monsieur l'abbé, I detest what you write, but I would give my life to make it possible for you to continue to write.''

wow, what a thing you can learn in a morning

Josh

@CodingGorilla I'm offended by the notion that gorillas can write code. We all know only monkeys can write code!

;-)

Coding Gorilla

No offense to @Moshe, its not aimed at him at all, but people just get way to offended way to easily

drachenstern

3:42 PM

I'm sure most of you don't care about all that, but there you go, you've been suitably educated against your will if you're reading ;)

Josh

Coding Gorilla

@Josh It is difficult, they have very fat fingers

Josh

LOL

@drachenstern STOP MAKING ME USE UP ALL MY STARS!

2

drachenstern

lmao

Josh

(Or said another way: WHY ARE YOU BEING SO INTELIGENT TODAY @drachenstern???)

drachenstern

3:43 PM

shhhh quit making me lol, I'll get in trouble

2

Josh

;-)

drachenstern

@Josh cos I woke up???

;-)

Josh

woah. I quietly slipped past Rebecca Chernoff on the chat leaderboard. I am really frightened now.

4k more messages and I surpass Jeff Himself. Then I request he ban me...

Yi Jiang

in The Bridge on The Stack Exchange Network Chat, yesterday, by badp

A new challenger appears!

drachenstern

@Josh lol, yeah ok

I was surprised to see I was up to 1.3k/week

I'm 200 behind YiJiang

George Marian

3:48 PM

Oh...my...goodness!!! These idiots emailed me my password in plain text!?! I sure hope they call and bitch about me not giving them my address and references up front. That'll be a fun conversation.

Yi Jiang

@drachenstern Welcome to the top list of people with <del>no life</del> most chat activity!

2

drachenstern

@YiJiang oh, I've been here for that list for a while now ;)

By tomorrow or the next day I should be past you tho ;)

granted, passing you means moving past pop demand at nearly the same velocity

Yi Jiang

@drachenstern Oh noes! (goes off to set up chatbot to spam the Sandbox with large number of messages)

drachenstern

actually, we'll probably both pass him before I pass you

lmao @sandbox

Yi Jiang

You

Are

Talking

Too much!!!!! I need more messages!!! Arrghhh...!

drachenstern

3:51 PM

lmao, but I'm using full complete thoughts per post :\

you're string one word per post... that's cheating!!!

CHEATER!! :p

status-completed

@YiJiang You should start using 1 letter per line

drachenstern

I do tend to hit the retry/cancel a bit tho :(

status-completed

L

i

drachenstern

@statuscompleted shhhh, don't give him ideas

status-completed

k

e

Josh

3:52 PM

status-interrupted

status-completed

t

h

Josh

status-oops

status-completed

i

s

Yi Jiang

status-complete

drachenstern

status-winning

Josh

3:53 PM

Couldn't tear yourself away huh @Moshe?

Yi Jiang

@drachenstern Arrrgghhh....!

status-completed

Just like that I got 10 messages for today :p

Yi Jiang

status-need-less-life

Moshe

I actually just wanted to ask if anyone knows of a Mac address changer for Mac.

Josh

ifconfig

Moshe

3:54 PM

And, @Zypher, you around?

status-completed

Isn't that for linux ?

Tim Stone

@YiJiang I feel like's not the direction people usually go in.

status-completed

Or it works too for Mac ?

Moshe

@Josh, I can just change it there?

@stat I suspect its a Unix thing

Josh

Yup. ifconfig lladdr *addr*

Moshe

3:55 PM

Cool!

Zypher

@Moshe yes but writing a very sarcastic email to cisco right now

5

drachenstern

See, if you were on a computer, that would've been way easier

Josh

where addr is a colon separated list of hex digits

@Zypher hahaha

Yi Jiang

@TimStone What, are you implying that there are usual people here?

Tim Stone

shrugs

Moshe

3:55 PM

Ok, once you're writing emails, please write me a not sarcastic one with your UDID please.

Josh

@statuscompleted OS X has ifconfig also

drachenstern

@GeorgeMarian We all got distracted by meta-MSO topics, what were you saying? plaintext password?

George Marian

lol

Tim Stone

@Zypher Just tell them you're going to switch to Juniper.

Josh

@Moshe You're talking to Zypher here. I don't think you can get any response which lacks sarcasm to some degree ;-)

Zypher

3:57 PM

@Moshe i can promise and email ... sarcasm is generated by a cal to /dev/random

Moshe

@Josh I did tear myself away. I see you where right here waiting for me. :P

@Zypher heh

Josh

I've moved in to the tavern due to my housing woes. I live in here now, I never leave ;-)

Aiden Bell

sudo ifconfig en1 ether 00:e2:e3:e4:e5:e6

In OSX btw

George Marian

@drachenstern Yah. I just applied for a job. I had to create an account on their job app service. Which annoyed me to no end. (Yet another account out there somewhere. Yay.) I dealt with their request for my address and references by stating that they will be provided when appropriate. Then, I noticed the email with my password in it. =/

Moshe

status-battery-is-at-fifty-one-percent

Josh

3:58 PM

@AidenBell yes ether == lladdr

Tim Stone

@GeorgeMarian Heh... shakes head

drachenstern

@GeorgeMarian this is why I try and go for org-SSO when I can, depending on the SSO of the org.

Aiden Bell

@Josh fair enough

George Marian