Tavern on the Meta - 2024-04-19 (page 1 of 2)

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12:44 AM

@M.A.R. hmm, thanks for all the explanation, interesting

2 hours later…

2:36 AM

@ShadowWizardLoveZelda the retaliation happened.

3 hours later…

Journeyman Geek

5:41 AM

→ 26 messages moved to Chimney

Petəíŕd The Spring Wizard

6:24 AM

@ShadowWizardLoveZelda Shadow The Chess Wizard :P

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

7:09 AM

@Marco had to dig a bit to find it, yeah. Unconfirmed reports of missile attacks on some military bases in Iran. Well, if that's the retaliation... that's very fair and hope it seals the deal, as I said before.

Journeyman Geek

@ShadowWizardLoveZelda I think that's more of a "we can hit you whenever you want" rather than a "we're going to kick your ass"

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

@JourneymanGeek nah, their ass needed some special kicking, on their own land.

But it all depends on the volume, and actual targets.

Journeyman Geek

yup

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

So military bases are legit, and less than their attack, which would have hit many innocents if not blocked.

Journeyman Geek

I was half expecting a few weapons plants to auto-deflagate personally

(catch fire)

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

7:16 AM

lol

That still might happen any time. :D

1 hour later…

8:23 AM

@M.A.R. I think we can organize something involving a dialysis machine if you really want.

@M.A.R. otherwise (but yes, in that case you will die before the process completes) there is Plastination available.

Plastination is a technique or process used in anatomy to preserve bodies or body parts, first developed by Gunther von Hagens in 1977. The water and fat are replaced by certain plastics, yielding specimens that can be touched, do not smell or decay, and even retain most properties of the original sample. == Process == Four steps are followed in the standard process of plastination: fixation, dehydration, forced impregnation in a vacuum, and hardening. Water and lipid tissues are replaced by curable polymers, which include silicone, epoxy, and polyester-copolymer. The first step of plastination...

Which would work for a nice 80' style "the collector" horror movie trope

we could even add a plaque "M.A.R., they though we couldn't replace their water and turn them into a real size action figure"

Journeyman Geek

→ 9 messages moved to Chimney

→ 3 messages moved to Chimney

1 hour later…

Journeyman Geek

9:42 AM

→ 6 messages moved to Chimney

10:11 AM

I love how utterly toxic the updates to the One Piece mobile game from Bandai are, all while pretending to be "Anniversary new content! Fun!"

Watching the reddit for that game never disappoints

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

11:02 AM

@SPArcheon in the sense you can always find drama ongoing?

@SPArcheon meh, bet the ancient Egyptians did it better, and without plastic. ;)

Ah! We'll all turn into Mummies if water will be gone. :P

11:22 AM

@ShadowWizardLoveZelda exactly

@ShadowWizardLoveZelda so, bacon basically?

2 hours later…

1:37 PM

Scared to ask but is my memory playing tricks or there is/was an user with a name similar to mjstral?

oh, right, now I remember where I heard the name, forget this.

Bonus question: Where is London located? (a) The British Isles (b) Great Britain and Northern Ireland (c) The UK (d) Europe (or 'the EU') (e) Greater London

2:11 PM

@SPArcheon really? For me?

Journeyman Geek

2:25 PM

→ 4 messages moved to Chimney

@M.A.R. Stealing your brother lines now? (yes, this is a very obscure joke)

@SPArcheon If I google "dialysis brother movies" what will I find?

2:40 PM

Explanation: in the movie King Tweety there is a (very annoying) scene that has the (very annoying) titular bird keep asking (in his very annoying voice) if everything in a room is "for him". Coincidentally, in the same movie Tweety (who is even more stupid than usual) keeps saying (and thinking) that Sylvester is his "big brother"

So, since you are clearly Sylvester as proven by you avatar (some may try and say that is Tom, but that is a blatant lie)...

you can briefly see it here in the trailer.

King Tweety | Trailer | Warner Bros. Entertainment

the full scene is longer and far more annoying.

@ShadowWizardLoveZelda ok... Strange, unconfirmed reports? Israel hasn't confirmed it yet?

Journeyman Geek

they tend to neither confirm nor deny such things

hmm

@SPArcheon well that was some Sherlock level inferences

And I had no idea the bird was even called 'King Tweety', or had a movie

What about the bird would seem kingly to kids?

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

@Marco nope. Not sure why though.

Our clown minister did post a tweet about it, mocking the government he's part of, but except for that, nothing.

2:52 PM

You have clown ministers? True diversity

hmmm

hmmmm

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

@M.A.R. yeah he's doing more damage to Israel than 1000 missiles, hitting their targets.

@JourneymanGeek are you confirming that they won't confirm or deny it, or are you confirming that they confirm it by not confirming it?

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

This is the tweet.

2:56 PM

Journey's gonna answer with "yes" in 3, 2, 1

Journeyman Geek

@M.A.R. Yes

@ShadowWizardLoveZelda I dare not enter such accursed place lest it ask for my personal info again

@JourneymanGeek that never gets old dog

@M.A.R. The bird is not a king, but the premise of the movie is that he is mistook as the king bird of a small island in the middle of nowhere. As for why the island had a king bird... no clue, but by the end of the movie it is shown that there was a mistake and he is unrelated (oddly enough, he is still the cousin of the actual queen)

@ShadowWizardLoveZelda maybe you're working for the evil necromancer Elon Musky to lure innocents into that place?

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

@M.A.R. it asks, but you don't have to give. ;)

@M.A.R. eww

OK so I'll take screenshot for you. ;)

user image

The word is: דרדלה

> פירוש המילה דרדלה הוא "חלשלוש", והמקור שלה לא ודאי. לפי הבלשן ד"ר רוביק רוזנטל, מדובר במילת סלנג ישראלית מקורית, המתחזית או נשמעת כיידיש.

TL;DR: he called our attack "weak", in a mocking way.

3:03 PM

'Scarecrow'? Decent Batman villain depending on the rendition

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

I mean, it was weak, sure. But the whole point was to make it look strong. :D

@M.A.R. nah that's דחליל

@ShadowWizardLoveZelda so what is he proposing instead? Nuke a city instead?

I'll never understand the rhetorics of Israeli politicians

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

@M.A.R. yeah other minister offered to send nuke on Gaza.

And I'm sure they both, with all their followers, dance in the streets if Israel nuke towns, yeah.

@M.A.R. in their case the rhetorics are simple: kill, kill, and kill. Oh, and be cruel while doing it, babies would be a bonus. Plain and simple.

That's what's so baffling. How does crap like that fly? I mean, if they say something like that in any country in Europe, they'd be thrown into jail then a mental asylum

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

They used to be on the extreme far right wing.... now they're mainstream here, almost.

@M.A.R. yup. And the answer is that it's the only way for the government to survive, i.e. accept their crap.

3:08 PM

Nuking Gaza would be like replacing salt with rhodenticide

@ShadowWizardLoveZelda hmm

Well I guess America's also been experimenting with insane fools that say what no one on Earth could possibly believe

When it comes crashing down on them, you can only hope you're not caught in the shockwave

I'm feeling poetic today

@M.A.R. Are we living in the same Europe?

Wait, actually... same Earth?

Well okay everyone knows by Europe I mean European countries you can point on the map that aren't Russia

So yeah, as moronic as the Brits can be, for example, none of them can get away with proposing to nuke Ireland

Now don't interrupt me, I'm gonna quote a mildly relevant poem for the occasion

Ehem

Ehehehm

Something rose something briar

Winds and lakes and bees and stuff

Why then should man, teasing for grace

Spoil his salvation for a fierce miscreed?

Andreas moved to Codidact

Interruption

3:18 PM

The morale of the story is don't be a jerk

I think.

@AndreasmovedtoCodidact Ha! I had already finished quoting

Your plans are foiled, you cannot spoil a fierce miscreed now! In yo face!

Andreas moved to Codidact

@ShadowWizardLoveZelda Those 3 words have been Bibi’s policies for the last 30 years. He’s never wanted to live peacefully side-by-side with his neighbors. His policies are like taken straight out of a dystopian sci-fi movie: supress the population, expect regular uprisings, shoot, kill, rinse, repeat.

@M.A.R. Who said that’s what I was interrupting?

@Marco what's got you so worked up?

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

@M.A.R. sounds cruel indeed. ;)

Andreas moved to Codidact

@Marco If you have nothing constructive to share, don’t share anything.

@Marco it certainky seems to be strong enough to trigger you. Everyone is entitled to their opinion.

If you object to his, you need to provide your own

3:24 PM

@M.A.R. I am feeling lazy to do it

I didn't recite all those verses for nothing

Let's not spoil the world's grace for salvation

weak narratives make me lazy.

Israel and his friends are the villains, and blablablablabla

I dunno about the villains, and I dunno what the word 'Israel' refers to in your message.

Andreas moved to Codidact

@M.A.R. Considering that many European countries have given Israel at least partial support, seems like reason to say that it flies in Europe, too. For instance, cutting the support to URNWA, because less than 10 (some had been tortured to confess) of 30,000 employees partook in the October massacre. Germany has been financially supporting their war, too, if I’m not mistaken? Possibly Britain and France, too.

But yes, Netanyahu has been starving kids and that's usually what villains do

I haven't heard of any victims starving babies in defense

Andreas moved to Codidact

3:28 PM

The European countries have also begun supporting more sanctions on Iran, despite Iran’s attack doing only mild damage to Israel, and being a response to Israel deliberately bombing Iran’s embassy in Syria.

@M.A.R. My sentence was very simple, what didn't you understand?

@AndreasmovedtoCodidact that's a bit cynical. Europe would certainly hesitate if they remotely suspect nuking places is being seriously considered.

@AndreasmovedtoCodidact well that's just Tuesday

Andreas moved to Codidact

@M.A.R. I may have skipped over some parts of the discussuon in here. I don’t think European countries would support any sort of nuking, no, but they certainly are accomplices in child slaugther, attempted genocide, and ethnic cleansing. Of course, nowhere near as much as the USA.

@Marco I'm a simpler person than your sentences

Andreas moved to Codidact

@M.A.R. I mean, we’ve sanctioned Iran for other stuff. I would not sanction them over this particular response.

@Marco If you have nothing useful to say, you’re soon to become my 2nd ever person on my list of ignored people, as I’ve had nothing but hostile and unproductive encounters with you in here. Please wrap up.

3:33 PM

@AndreasmovedtoCodidact again, that's just Tuesday. Yemen, for example. And unlike Israel, Saudis aren't popular, they just have money.

@Marco just an advice, make what you want of it. You probably should avoid harsh wording, should the parrot notice messages like that one she wont probably be very happy with them

It's very odd for any political entity to claim a higher moral ground, and we should be immediately suspicious of those that do.

Which is everyone these days.

Andreas moved to Codidact

Oops, I flagged one of MAR’s messages by mistake while mass-flagging in here. Please ignore it, moderators.

@Marco need more calcium

@AndreasmovedtoCodidact noooooo

@SPArcheon hard words? I am responding on the same level only. And who is the parrot?

Andreas moved to Codidact

3:35 PM

@M.A.R. D;

@Marco you're just being passive-aggressive, and no fun

Did I use that word right. Someone might say you're being active-aggressive even

Andreas moved to Codidact

@M.A.R. There you got it right.

@Marco no one's forcing you to participate in this conversation dude. Maybe take a break until you cool down a bit?

Dang, and I recited a poem and everything.

Andreas moved to Codidact

You are so poetic.

No, no one is forcing me, and no one is forcing you either

@AndreasmovedtoCodidact thank you very much

@M.A.R. Why don't YOU take a break? I'm very calm, you guys that are very nervous.

3:40 PM

@AndreasmovedtoCodidact as usual, my bout of activity is a direct result of me procrastinating from doing some real work

@Marco you don't sound calm

2

@M.A.R. IYes, 'm very calm, YOU two that don't sound calm.

Good on you

Andreas moved to Codidact

@M.A.R. Real work? What’s that? The only true work is that of fairies and wizards, with their magic wands pointed at the skies. Let there be fantasy! Oh, what work, again?

@AndreasmovedtoCodidact I for one think we should just hand over all scientific writing to chatGPT

Andreas moved to Codidact

@M.A.R. That would certainly make the world a better place.

3:44 PM

@M.A.R. SciGen

The meager grant money can be spent on buying a chatGPT subscription, ice cream, and posters advocating for science and humanitarian aid to malaria victims

Petəíŕd The Spring Wizard

Wow that's a ~~hot~~ long discussion

@Petəíŕd The Spring Wizard I'm a gift that keeps on giving

Petəíŕd The Spring Wizard

lol

@ShadowWizardLoveZelda look I can only stretch an analogy so far before it breaks

Andreas moved to Codidact

3:51 PM

@SPArcheon tf...

@M.A.R. Yes

@SPArcheon you know, stuff like this is why a disgruntled wizard creating a doomsday device for vengeance seems plausible

@M.A.R. I would be more inclined to say "Genshin artifact system"

Andreas moved to Codidact

Too much Genshin.

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

4:18 PM

@AndreasmovedtoCodidact he's not PM that long, luckily, and in the beginning he was quite good. The one thing that drives him though is the desire to stay in power, and since the last elections, he did become a puppet of the extreme right wing people, which caused all the mess we're now in, both from the inside and outside.

And somehow his followers followed that change as well, which is the real pity in this whole situation, and why it can't be easily solved. (elections)

That said, he also still listens to USA when really having to, like in the case now with Iran. Which is a pleasant surprise.

@SPArcheon no need for any parrot, few 10k users can have the same effect.

@AndreasmovedtoCodidact any 10k user can see and vote for chat flags.

@ShadowWizardLoveZelda I think she can bring harsher consequences.

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

See? Now you have a reason to reach 10k rep here, so come back from Codidact! @Andreas ;)

Andreas moved to Codidact

@ShadowWizardLoveZelda Never!

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

:(

Zoe is on strike

@SPArcheon She can suspend or longer, but with this many messages, the suspension is already going to be long

Andreas moved to Codidact

4:25 PM

@ShadowWizardLoveZelda Hey, I'm still in chat... Infrequently.

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

@Zoeisonstrike most would likely get "invalid" vote, but yeah couple might get "valid" giving one hour chat ban.

Zoe is on strike

It's 30 mins * number of messages deleted with valid flags, but a mod can directly suspend for days or years

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

@Zoeisonstrike one year is the max by UI, no? (for longer the mod has to use hacks aka scripts.)

Zoe is on strike

@ShadowWizardLoveZelda On main, yes. In chat, I don't know

Andreas moved to Codidact

She always comes when you speak about her...

Zoe is on strike

4:27 PM

Let me suspend community real quick and get back to you

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

@AndreasmovedtoCodidact like Shog!

@Zoeisonstrike rofl

Zoe is on strike

aww, can't suspend community in chat

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

haha!

@Zoeisonstrike it has begun.

Zoe is on strike

That's what I have socks for :P

Andreas moved to Codidact

4:28 PM

@Zoeisonstrike So suspending the community in disbelief is what keeps you warm. Huh!

Hearing about SE lore reminds me of vanilla

Zoe is on strike

The max in the default UI is 9999 hours

Like, you wanna hate the taste, it's so overused

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

@AndreasmovedtoCodidact anyone and whatever keeps them warm, ya know. :D

Zoe is on strike

I can suspend seemingly arbitrarily long by modifying the HTML, though. I suspended by sock for 41666 days for science

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

4:30 PM

@Zoeisonstrike which is 416.625 days! Nice.

@Zoeisonstrike yeah that's the hack I was referring to.

Like RO could once delete any chat message.

Zoe is on strike

I extended the number of digits to 6, and got until May 19th 2138

If you suspend them for 415 days instead, they might not learn their lesson.

That extra day and 15 hours makes all the difference

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

@Zoeisonstrike what color?

Zoe is on strike

Actually, the extra day is to account for leap years and leap seconds

Andreas moved to Codidact

@ShadowWizardLoveZelda Well, he rose to power in opposition to the Oslo peace agreement, claiming that any scenario in which Palestine would be a free country, would be one in which Israel is unsafe. The conclusion from that thought is that Palestine must be suppressed in order for Israel to be safe. That's been his policy from the start: supress Palestinians, and occupy more and more territory.

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

4:31 PM

@Zoeisonstrike isn't it extra day every four years?

Zoe is on strike

@ShadowWizardLoveZelda The colours of the rainbow

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

@AndreasmovedtoCodidact kind of, yeah.

@Zoeisonstrike plastic socks will last that long, no problem. All you're doing is adding a nasty surprise for the poor mod who will have to deal with your sentient unsuspended sock

I'm just going to put it on record, if I'm punished for doing absolutely nothing wrong, I'll contact the SE team via meta.stackexchange.com/contact.

Zoe is on strike

@ShadowWizardLoveZelda Yeah, but what if the day sneaks up on us and the extra day isn't added? It's a pretty big deal

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

4:32 PM

@Zoeisonstrike nice sock! :D

Zoe is on strike

@Marco Ok

All in a day's work

Zoe is on strike

@ShadowWizardLoveZelda It was supposed to be a replacement for this bot, but then the strike happened and it died before I had the chance to start

I was working on the chat library to support it before the strike

Andreas moved to Codidact

@ShadowWizardLoveZelda I think the retaliation launched (yesterday, was it? Or last morning?) was deeply unwise. I hope it doesn't escalate any further.

@AndreasmovedtoCodidact meh

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

4:34 PM

@Zoeisonstrike ouch. Poor bot.

Andreas moved to Codidact

@M.A.R. Neh?

Oh, come on! My headphones turned on the speak-to-chat, again. This is the worst functionality ever invented.

@AndreasmovedtoCodidact all of it is deeply unwise. Us plebians can do nothing about it.

Zoe is on strike

@AndreasmovedtoCodidact I hope it doesn't either, but let's be realistic; it will. The problems in the region go deep, and aren't rooted in anything logical. The shift to nationalist regimes isn't helping either

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

@AndreasmovedtoCodidact well on this I disagree, the retaliation was aimed on military bases only, minimal damage, if at all, no innocent victims at all. And I don't think it will escalate any further, in the near future at least.

So fingers crossed, there won't be a last last last retaliation

That's really all I can do or say.

Zoe is on strike

4:36 PM

@ShadowWizardLoveZelda But now Iran feels wronged, so they're going to retaliate because Israel retaliated. Then Israel is going to retaliate because Iran retaliated. Rinse and repeat, and you have one large serving of a nasty escalating situation

Andreas moved to Codidact

Phu, Zoe spelled out my thoughts for me.

One would almost believe we agree on the matter.

@AndreasmovedtoCodidact ew

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

@Zoeisonstrike that's the reason Israel didn't declare it as retaliation, to give Iran the rope they need to get off the tree.

Andreas moved to Codidact

@M.A.R. What ew?

I'm ew?

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

Of course they might take the rope and use it to try and strangle Israel, but meh... that's already their choice to make.

4:38 PM

@ShadowWizardLoveZelda except on both sides we're dealing with poop throwing monkeys who don't have much use for ropes

Andreas moved to Codidact

@ShadowWizardLoveZelda Couldn't Israel just have taken the rope that Iran gave them to get off the tree?

@AndreasmovedtoCodidact agreeing is ew. But sure we can all be ew together <3

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

@M.A.R. I still hope Iran leaders have more sense than our leaders.

Zoe is on strike

@ShadowWizardLoveZelda What it's declared as doesn't really matter. Israel is also insisting there's no genocide in Gaza, but footage on the ground currently disagrees. None of the actions here are logical; taking a semi-logical action to justify retaliation isn't helpful

Andreas moved to Codidact

@M.A.R. Mr. and Mrs. Ew, with the Ew children at Ew Manor.

4:39 PM

@ShadowWizardLoveZelda HAH! Hahahaha

Zoe is on strike

@ShadowWizardLoveZelda If they did, they wouldn't have launched an attack in the first place

Brb

Andreas moved to Codidact

@Zoeisonstrike Actually, Iran has been holding back for a long time these months, and only after Israel bombed their embassy, they fired back at Israel. If they had not launched an attack over that, they'd have given Israel a pass to continue bombing their facilities.

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

@Zoeisonstrike they had to, the patience can't be infinite. But they also could either launch a surprise attack, or launch 3000 missiles instead of 300, which would have changed the equation and start a full scale war for sure.

Friendly reminder: If y'all are going to talk about politics, and especially political topics where people have strong views, remember to keep it civil and follow the CoC.

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

4:42 PM

@AndreasmovedtoCodidact yep something like that.

@cocomac thanks, I'm trying to follow that indeed.

Andreas moved to Codidact

@cocomac It's been civil for a while now. :)

@cocomac loved it.

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

Mithical would have already send everything to trash long ago, but they're now offline. ;)

@ShadowWizardLoveZelda :(

Zoe is on strike

@AndreasmovedtoCodidact See, that's why the situation keeps escalating. It's retaliation for retaliation for retaliation for retaliation for stuff that happened so long ago that no one really remembers what started it. Iran could have solved it politically. Not going at it militarily wouldn't have been giving Israel a pass - ignoring, maybe, but not ignoring doesn't mean "launch the missiles"

Andreas moved to Codidact

4:44 PM

Well, we are only a handful of people discussing it here, us alone are not going to change the world, but if everybody discusses hard and important topics in small groups like we do, it'll be a positive contribution to the world eventually. :)

→ 10 messages moved to Trashcan

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

@AndreasmovedtoCodidact which rope? Iran keeps fueling the fire using their proxy aka daily rockets on our northern towns. It's kind of "legit" while the war in Gaza is ongoing, but still - if Israel can act against it, it will.

The big problem is that there are people who don't like it when they disagree with them, so it turns from a healthy discussion into a fight.

Zoe is on strike

@ShadowWizardLoveZelda See my last message; they could've voted to condemn Israel in various bodies of power (probably the UN security council?), but chose violence instead. Every single side in the conflict has, and that's why it both keeps escalating, and why it never fully deescalates

Andreas moved to Codidact

@ShadowWizardLoveZelda That's a point. (Btw, unrelated to the argument, are these towns on land regarded as occupied by the UN?)

4:47 PM

@ShadowWizardLoveZelda yeah

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

@Zoeisonstrike pretty sure they tried to do that, but USA has veto.

Zoe is on strike

Ugh, right

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

@AndreasmovedtoCodidact the towns they bomb? They're inside Israel, evacuated.

Andreas moved to Codidact

There's always a permanent security council member putting down vetos against great stuff...

Zoe is on strike

There really should be an amendment or whatever banning vetos from countries with direct stakes in a given vote

Andreas moved to Codidact

4:48 PM

@ShadowWizardLoveZelda On the land initially given to Israel, or land since occupied by Israel?

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

@AndreasmovedtoCodidact ah, no idea - guess it's occupied, as all of Israel is occupied since 1948.

Andreas moved to Codidact

@Zoeisonstrike Yes, and I think 90% of the world agrees, but none of it can happen unless the permament members agree to it. And if it's forced through without them, you risk having them leave the UN. That doesn't exactly help the world, either.

The UN is useless.

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

ah, you mean this.

> The Golan Heights are a rocky plateau in the Levant region of Western Asia that was captured by Israel from Syria in the 1967 Six-Day War. The international community, with the exception of Israel and the United States, generally regards the Golan Heights to be Syrian territory held by Israel under military occupation.

@Andreas

Andreas moved to Codidact

@ShadowWizardLoveZelda Yes. Thanks.

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

4:50 PM

So yeah, the towns are part of it. ^

Zoe is on strike

@AndreasmovedtoCodidact Ugh, so it's basically the same problem as trying to make the US a democracy

Andreas moved to Codidact

I'd be curious to see how countries like Iran would react if Israel gave up all land occupied past what was given in 1948 from the UN.

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

@Marco yes and no. And no, can't explain that in a nutshell but might try to figure a way to explain sometime.

@ShadowWizardLoveZelda ok haha

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

In Israel most people consider the UN as useless and/or just anti-Israel and ally of our enemies.

Personally I don't see that as black and white, that's all.

4:53 PM

fair

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

7 minutes!

@ShadowWizardLoveZelda until the end of world?

Zoe is on strike

It's 90 seconds to midnight

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

@Marco nope. (well, can't know! Hopefully not. ;))

Andreas moved to Codidact

@ShadowWizardLoveZelda I mean, at the moment anybody legitimately criticizes Israel, the Israeli leadership quickly labels them as anti-semettic and other atrocious tags they can be given. It's not particularly constructive.

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

4:54 PM

@Zoeisonstrike where?

Andreas moved to Codidact

@ShadowWizardLoveZelda In the virtual world.

Zoe is on strike

@ShadowWizardLoveZelda theguardian.com/world/2024/jan/23/…

@ShadowWizardLoveZelda somewhere

@ShadowWizardLoveZelda again, I think this sorta misses the point, as does Andreas's.

@ShadowWizardLoveZelda the doomsday clock

4:55 PM

1 hour ago, by M.A.R.

It's very odd for any political entity to claim a higher moral ground, and we should be immediately suspicious of those that do.

Andreas moved to Codidact

@M.A.R. Can you exemplify it?

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

@AndreasmovedtoCodidact things one do to survive can be ugly sometimes, I agree. But even with that, there are lines that should not be crossed. :/

It misses the point to try figure out which side was "justified" in doing what they did, now, three months ago, or three years ago.

Andreas moved to Codidact

@ShadowWizardLoveZelda What do you mean by the last one? What line? In terms of criticizing, or negatively labelling the criticism?

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

@M.A.R. yeah one of the biggest problems, boils down to "who decides what's legit/justified and what isn't".

@AndreasmovedtoCodidact terms of the things Israel do to survive, which is sometimes, too many times, things our PM do to personally survive aka keep being a PM.

Zoe is on strike

4:57 PM

@ShadowWizardLoveZelda It doesn't really matter. The question for any logical state that wants to avoid war or further conflict is "what can we do to de-escalate this situation?"

We're trying to weigh the actions of entities that are nothing like us, using our own moral frameworks. If some idiot spat in my drink in a bar, do I punch him in the face? That's how we're thinking about it.

Andreas moved to Codidact

@M.A.R. No, don't punch, but you can pour the drink over him. :D (Not a serious joke, I get the point)

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

@VLAZ ah, thanks.

2 minutes!

Andreas moved to Codidact

1,5 minutes.

But these things that we call "Iran" or "Israel", they're totally different from us, from every prominent or insignificant member of them

Zoe is on strike

4:59 PM

And third-party bystanders who want to avoid war in the region should be asking "how can we help de-escalate the situation?" rather than throwing weapons at a war that both hasn't started yet, and currently is seen as a war of aggression

Shadow Wizard Love Zelda

@M.A.R. so what is the point?

@VLAZ ugh

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