Tavern on the Meta

stackoverflow.com/questions/22976224/…

Can I flag comments that link to W3Schools as rude/offensive?

Anna Lear

no #antijokechicken

Q: nmake compiled files are nowhere to be found

0

My occasional forays into the Microsoft universe are always intensely miserable but this takes the cake... I have a Qt/C++ project which builds perfectly on Linux. After I taught Visual Studio how to find where it installed itself, entered a special shell to make its command line tools visible (...

can someone with enough patience edit the rant out?

@AnnaLear Why did you squash my joke so hard? youtube.com/watch?v=9bi8W9IRcxQ

@LaszloPapp On it. I love editing.

@LaszloPapp There you go.

Still a crap question though.

thanks, yeah, closed to vote, and I would encourage others, too. ^

1:03 AM

@LaszloPapp closed to vote? I'm sorry, I don't know how to do that :P

(voted)

haha

Better now? :P

indeed, the tavern maffia closed it, thanks.

@JasonC Wow... quite the de-rant you did there :O

Louis

Closed to votes is what many OPs would like their questions to be. "You wanna vote, eh? Well, you can't because my question is closed to votes! :-P"

1:05 AM

How are you patient enough to do that?!

I would just give up after a few sentences :P

indeed, the tavern maffia closed it, thanks.

@Doorknob It only took about a minute. It's fun. Read -> interpret -> translate -> write. I enjoy editing documents in general.

Off-topic: MDN is starting to consistently turn up as the first result for my JS searches instead of w3s****ls. This is an exciting time! :D

10

NICE. I just had a small success, myself. @Doorknob

Braiam

@Doorknob use private browsing instead! Is the path that leads to hell >:)

1:11 AM

@JasonC Hooray, another lost soul converted!

God, I love Qt so much. (✿ ♥‿♥)

@LaszloPapp Tavern maffia? Heh.

chat.meta.stackoverflow.com/rooms/707/moderator-mafia

Not quite Tavern Mafia, but close enough. :P

A: Virtual function performance: one large class vs many smaller subclasses

:)

-2

Please avoid virtual functions at all cost for heavy computation. They can severely impair the cache usage which is a killer for graphics and performance critical software. This does not require any benchmarking and profiling. This is a generic graphics programming principle. One typical example...

the unexplained downvotes are back :)

1:32 AM

We really need a canonical question about performance analysis wrt. misguided / ineffective micro-optimizations. So many questions like "I'm downloading 6GB from the internet, will my code be faster if I use pre-increment instead of post-increment?"

Louis

I have not voted on that question but I'm in the "don't speculate, profile" camp.

> possible duplicate of Is My Question Another Stupid Microoptimization Question?

Jason: you seem to be a java programmer, so it explains why you do not care about performance. :)

I have actually worked on low-level graphics optimization for years.

and in there, also people including Sony who did the play station series, would disagree with you. It is not "micro-optimization", but fundamental architecture decision.

because the whole point of the code is to be performant, and that leads the architecture. Why do you think e.g. eigen is doing "micro-optimization"?

@LaszloPapp Lol; actually, I'm a C++ programmer, and I almost exclusively write real-time simulations, multimedia control/rendering applications, and high-throughput embedded stuff. I stick to Java on SO only to keep up on my Java, but I hardly ever use it.

smacks self for forgetting a return in JS function and spending 10 minutes debugging it

1:38 AM

either way, I am surprised by three downvotes in a row, without any explanation.

:-)

People probably have the stigma in their mind that "benchmark it" before doing anything, whereas that statement just does not completely stick in graphics :)

@LaszloPapp It's not that I disagree with the cache stuff; you're absolutely right. It's just that the OP didn't specify performance requirements, etc. This to me is a red flag that the OP hasn't thought about it right. He may be justified but the fact that he left that stuff out of his post means he probably isn't at a point where he's making good judgments about which optimizations to make. Just a guess on my part; trying to read between the lines there.

I didn't downvote your post though, fwiw. I think it's perfectly valid.

a graphics programmer works like this in my experience, do everything upfront to avoid performance penalty, and when doing it different has a significant advantage, then benchmark may (not) be justified.

@LaszloPapp That "benchmark it" stigma isn't so much a response to "bad micro-optimization" as it is a response to questions that seem, at least at first glance, to indicate that the OP is not prepared to make those judgments yet.

Oh absolutely, but that comes from experience, and a question like this does not indicate experience. That's what I'm trying to say, I suppose. If that makes sense.

I really hope my answer does not get deleted due to downvotes. :)

It's weird that it got so many, I don't think it deserved any really.

1:41 AM

I have the faith it will be upvoted over time when graphics people get to see it, and not just generic programmers.

There's a pity upvote, lol.

Yeah, I have no clue about C++ or OpenGL, so I'm going to stay away from voting @LaszloPapp.

^

discovers JS debugger; statement and is amazed

@LaszloPapp Your downvotes may be saved by an accept, I bet. It seems like what the OP wanted to hear, plus I probably judged him more harshly than he deserved.

that is alright, although it is not opengl related.

The thing is, it is not the first time I confront hardcore C++ programmers about it.

fanatic C++ programmers think you have to use every feature of C++ everywhere, including runtime polymorphism.

1:46 AM

Lol, hardcore C++ programmers. Please don't get me started on that rant. I call them template-monkeys.

I once read a great quote, maybe it was here in chat actually, "C++ is like an octopus made by nailing extra legs onto a dog." It shows in the kinds of code that developers tend to produce.

rust is better for graphics programming anyway. :)

Actually you should see the mess I ran into here at work a couple days ago. Basically a new CAN 301/402 library, C++, completely misguided API design. The developer gave it to us for free essentially in exchange for us testing it for him. I gave up on it but, it was a mess of boost incompatibilities, STL objects across static library boundaries, 5 different coding styles, it was a nightmare. Especially bad because it's intended goal is for safety-critical applications. @LaszloPapp

I wrote a CAN library a couple of years ago in C++, and I think I even ported it to Qt, but once the project had been finished, i stopped working on it.

I'm writing one now. And targeting Qt. In all honesty, does it have good 402 support and would you consider it to be developed and reliable enough to sell (if possible)?

I am not working on it anymore, and I am not sure I have access to the code anymore. It was on my other laptop, and have never pushed to github, etc.

1:52 AM

Because this has been a week and a half of working through CAN specifications and writing underlying frameworks that I really need to move past, there's a lot more work to do.

(apparently, I still have the plain C++ version of it)

the C++ version is faster though.

Ah, just thought I'd ask. I've been keeping my eyes open. If I can write something good here I'm going to just open-source it. I have a few patches to libcanopen too, it's about time that library had its todo list squashed.

also, what hardcore C++ developers do not understand is that, algorithm complexity does not quite work on real embedded as they learn in the books.

Q: Comparing Words in Sentences using C#

sigh Why so many programming questions on meta today?

-3

I want to compare words in sentences but I have problem that the Freq can't count the frequency of the word in sentences for (int a = 0; a < cleansing.Count(); a++) { for (int b = 0; b < cleansing[a].Count(); b++) { for (int c = ...

discussion

@LaszloPapp I love watching hardcore C++ guys have their minds boggled by interrupt-driven programming on devices with 8kB of memory and a 50MHz clock.

1:56 AM

by hardcore, I mean the opposite, write C++ code that requires an atom reactor to run, and benchmark it only when the whole software is broken and would need a rewrite to have acceptable performance. :)

Haha, I think its understood that we both mean "hardcore" facetiously.

@hichris123 And it's a really stinky question to boot.

Dammit, I accidentally closed a browser tab for a key document I've been referring to all day, and now their web site just happens to be down.

Anyways dinner break over, back to work. Later.

Modern CPUs have incorporated many tricks to make virtual function calls fast, or at least faster than they used to be, because modern OO languages tend to emit them a lot.

-> wait, what? you have a hardware, and then someone invents wrong programming mechanism for that, and then you improve the hardware to accomodate that improper software mechanism? It feels like fishying the fishy stuff. Wouldn't it be outright better to fix the programming mechanism you use? Also, powerful desktop PCs are not the only market. There are consumer devices, like game consoles, etc. — Laszlo Papp 1 min ago

the tag score updater did not work today either, yay... :'(

2:12 AM

@LaszloPapp It almost never works. So don't count on it. :(

yeah, it has been broken lately along with the loading of the review queues. I hope it is not an architectural issue of scaling for SE.

2:34 AM

Okay, I need 10k on meta to laugh at the deleted questions. :D

Jan Dvorak

3:21 AM

SPAM mathematica.stackexchange.com/questions/45720/…

4:31 AM

Hi all!

I've been sick today, so that's why I haven't been around.

But I'm feeling better.

:)

@JasonC stackoverflow.com/questions/22978610/…

You say, to an empty room full of grayed out users. :''''(

Ha yeah I saw that. I formatted his thingy and even left a helpful comment.

And downvoters, explain yourselves when you downvote a new user. By downvoting new users' first questions, you will make them leave SO and they won't know why. — Blue Ice 5 mins ago

arrgh I hate it when people downvote new users and don't explain

@JasonC everybody's asleep lol

Who might be awake, let's see...

@JasonC: yay, one more downvote without reasoning. \o/ Typical case of 1-2 ignorant or unhelpful people giving downvotes, and then the rest is just Crowd-thinking after seeing 1-2 downvotes.

Lol

4:37 AM

it is crazy to get 4 downvotes without any reasoning, and getting comments upvoted with almost the same content.

Oh the accepted one got a downvote too. performance and c++ are the two touchiest tags, and here their powers are combined.

@LaszloPapp you're talking about the question I mentioned?

@BlueIce No; stackoverflow.com/questions/22975959/…

Q: How can I accelerate my visit to stackoverflow.com from overseas?

@JasonC First question I see in performance:

0

I am in mainland China, which is far away from US. stackoverflow.com is such a great platform. It helps me a lot (sorry that I cannot contribute much for now :p). Is there any solution that I can visit this website faster? My connection speed is 8MB. It always takes more than three seconds to ope...

performance pagespeed

Haha; lunch time in China, says the map.

4:40 AM

@JasonC: the accepted answer got critics, so the one downvote is not unfair, really. Compare that to my four downvotes without explanation.

@LaszloPapp ouch, sorry.

Now you have two upvotes :/

You can guess where they came from ;)

well, upvotes do not help understanding the unexplained downvotes :)

but thanks.

@LaszloPapp BUT THEY HELP HEAL THE PAIN

waaaaah

:-)

Generally, all down votes can be explained by "somebody clicked the down arrow".

^ ... does that help?

4:44 AM

I do not know how to encourage people to be helpful and provide reasons, especially if they see 4 downvotes or so, and no one has provided any reason yet.

"Sorry, my cat clicked the downvote button."

I wonder when I downvoted last time without providing a reason if there was none yet.

:D

I do that all the time on crappy answers that aren't actually naa.

then there are the people who downvote, you get them to speak up, then you fix, and they still keep the downvote without further reasoning. :)

that is not helpful. They will not learn how to be better part of Stack Overflow.

@LaszloPapp they got attached to their downvotes, and they don't want to set them free.

4:46 AM

:)

Oh yeah, I always thought it'd be nice if I could see what answers I've down voted have been edited since I down voted. It's kind of hard to keep up otherwise.

that is an unfortunate way of thinking about the site.

@JasonC: you can when the author notifies you like I did.

you get a red notification since it is a message.

@JasonC I just realized that performance has synonyms in 21 other tags

You can't notify somebody if you don't know who they are though.

Oh

!

4:47 AM

"You get them to speak up"

stackoverflow.com/tags/performance/synonyms

Nevermind

@BlueIce: wow

@JasonC You are stealing my train of thought :P

@BlueIce Haha I love that slowness existed.

4:48 AM

@JasonC and fast

lol I can imagine the tags on a question being c++, printf, for-loop, and fast :P

stackoverflow.com/review/suggested-edits/4542041

gahh:

I just proposed two more synonyms (query-optimization and micro-optimization), although I'm not 100% sure the first one flies.

@BlueIce Whoa there ` abuse...

@JasonC don't forget fastness, the complement to slowness ;)

And sadness :(

I'm glad fastness is empty, lol. Although I was hoping to find some gems there.

@JasonC because you will be sad if your code is slow

@JasonC also, why did it seem like a good idea to that person to change "doesn't" to "doesnt"?

Your assertions about 'incorrect programming paradigms' are merely circular reasoning. — EJP 2 hours ago

I cannot understand his comment. Can someone translate it into English? :P

4:57 AM

wut?

I am inclined to close the question as primarily opinion based.

voted so.

3 more close votes to come.

@JasonC You want stupid questions, buddy? You want stupid questions? Well, fine. Have your goddamn stupid questions.

:D

@LaszloPapp here you go!

it would be friendly to retag a question with stupid. :D

5:02 AM

@LaszloPapp This is where EJP is coming from: A "paradigm", by definition, is a typical usage. You can't really have an "incorrect" one, although you can certainly have ugly ones. So the fact that a lot of people used that technique makes it a valid paradigm, that's what a paradigm is.

incorrectly used paradigm.

a paradigm is good for the case it was invented, not for others.

@LaszloPapp

:D

If it's used for other cases besides the one it was "invented" for then it is no longer a "paradigm" -- unless it's used frequently. I see what you mean but the word choice is problematic. Maybe um... let's see...

just explain it in comment, please do not edit my post just yet :)

5:05 AM

Pattern? Sort of? I don't know.

I will edit it based on feedback after a while.. there may be more feedback.

Sorry man it's officially exceeded my attention span, lol. To be honest I'd just let it go and focus on more interesting questions.

well, I prefer to provide fewer, but quality posts.

2

Q: How to delete system file in rooted android?

0

I am new to android Programming. I am creating a program to remove gesture.key from data/system/gesture.key. I could this in adb but I don't know how to start in eclipse ! I found some examples in stackover flow. But I can't , I am so newbie ! Please help me to delete this file . My phone is root...

android

^ wut?

He "is so newbie"?

@JasonC :'( i fear this one will be also going down the tubes

@JasonC where did this go: chat.meta.stackoverflow.com/transcript/message/1960436#1960436

?

@JasonC found it, nvmd :)

my wifi is being a meanie

it is disconnecting me every 5 seconds

:(

Welp, I can't really stackoverflow any more then, so I'm going to bed.

Goodnight @LaszloPapp and @JasonC ! See you all tomorrow!

feature-request status-declined markdown latex

5:27 AM

@BlueIce Lol; phones aren't rooted by default precisely to keep that guy from messing up his phone.

@BlueIce Night

Dammit, I want LaTeX support on SO so bad.

107

Q: LaTeX on Stack Overflow?

MathOverflow has an awesome engine where you can embed LaTeX in questions, answers, and comments. Can we get something like this going on Stack Overflow? I think it’d be appropriate as I at least pretty often want to write something like n^2 and would benefit greatly from prettier markup.

Curses!

what minitech with 448 reputation on meta after 78 answers and 59 questions?

6:01 AM

@JasonC: heh, got the 5th downvote without explanation ;-)

Lol

:)

Commodus does not explain downvotes either.

wow, and I got getting downvotes :)

starting with my most upvoted answer :)

what a coincidence, and of course without explanation... I do not understand people.

Sometimes, I am not surprised H2CO3 deleted himself getting shitload of downvotes after the critics for his moderation nomination.

@JasonC: time to move on, and get into the same argument elsewhere :)

6:39 AM

@LaszloPapp meta.stackoverflow.com/users/160410/minitech?tab=bounties

His real reputation is 8598

Morning, @michaelb958!

how do you know that?

@ShadowWizard It's late afternoon for me.

So it means if he haven't offered all those bounties he would still have 8598 rep

strange, I do not see anything like that.

ProgramFOX

@LaszloPapp You need to go to the "offered" tab.

6:44 AM

Yes, that is what I just did.

interestingie

@ProgramFOX whoops, was sure I posted this link for me it was default tab

But he earned +75 from a bounty too

@3ventic so that's part of his current rep (448)

Of course

I've only offered 1 bounty in the whole network :o

@michaelb958 how I always forget your timezone?! ;)

@3ventic wow. why?

6:46 AM

I haven't found worthy content that much..

@ShadowWizard Especially given that I always crash your morning trains by pointing out my timezone.

@3ventic on Meta there are plenty of worthy things, 116 bounties so far but only selected few really helped.

I don't feel like meta bounties help unless the question is a discussion

@michaelb958 yeah, the poor train...

or unanswered support I guess

6:48 AM

@ShadowWizard: worthy contents are oftentimes ignored even with bounties. Been there, done that, got no response.

@3ventic well, I believe it helped here. Bug was fixed after several months.

LOL, as we talk here about bounties, I just won one! ;)

well, gz.

@LaszloPapp: Please explain my another Question also , which language is best to develop the application in qt. And please explain what is differences pons and cons of different languages. I am Requesting to u Please help me — user3472783 2 mins ago

"pons and cons" :D

Q: network programming - C vs Java

7:19 AM

-1

I am starting an IT course on networks, which will include some network programming. I'm offered the choice of writing the code for assignments in either C or Java, though the advice is to go with Java as [to paraphrase perhaps incorrectly] its socket programming class will make life easier. Di...

java c networking

delete vote please.

what to do with the answers there though? Should they be flagged? Or feeding primarily opinion based questions should not be flagged?

@LaszloPapp if you think the question itself should be deleted, no point flagging its answers as they'll go away with their parent question as well.

no, I do not have delete votes left and no one seems to have given any delete vote to it just yet.

either way, I have just made an experiment by flagging the third as VLQ. Let us see how it goes.

Btw, deleted questions can also come back, in which case, the answers are still poor.

7:38 AM

@LaszloPapp very rare that deleted questions are undeleted. Anyway you got a point, so flag away. :)

I am pretty amused by the fact that this user with 100K+ feeds clearly primarily opinion based questions.

and it is only from February, not like 2009 or 2010.

we are back to the reputation means nothing in certain cases?

@LaszloPapp why back? this is the situation for as long as Stack Overflow exists.

I wish that was clear to stubborn high-rep users, too.

@LaszloPapp That's part of how they get to 100k in the first place. No offense to those users, they help people a lot, but I often see high rep users answering the most silly questions in the hopes of getting a few upvotes before a question is closed as off-topic or duplicate.

the question is why they get upvotes instead of downvotes?

7:47 AM

Because they post a correct answer?

Many people are clueless about the "rules" we have in place, so they don't know any better.

there is no correct answer for primarily opinion based questions.

I got a famous question badge for a question closed as off-topic haha

enjoy while it lasts... it may be put into oblivion soon.

It's been sitting there for 6 months now...

7:49 AM

so? Many such questions are deleted when someone starts the deletion process.

mm

ProgramFOX

@3ventic Linky?

Q: What are the differences between 'proof' and 'prove'?

2

I've been wondering for a long time when I should use proof and when prove. They seem so awfully similar and I can't get hands on any good examples that would show the key differences. I know both of the words have to do with confirming or considering as truth of some sort. What are the key diff...

meaning difference

oh, I do not know this site, so it may behave differently.

I don't know the site too well either

that's my only post there

7:52 AM

@3ventic generally speaking, there is big difference between "closed" and "bad".

ELL.SE and English.SE are two sites I'm honestly afraid to post on.

There might be many questions which are excellent and helpful, yet off topic for Stack Exchange sites.

Yours appears to be somewhere in that range. :)

True, but some people have if(closed && not dupe) delete(); mindset.

I see that quite a lot

@3ventic totally agree and it should be changed

actually, I delete dupes, too.

7:54 AM

In some cases it does make sense

@LaszloPapp ... You're kidding, right?

heck, no! Why would I?

If a question is off-topic and it's useful, but it gets outdated quickly, there's no point keeping it around

@LaszloPapp heck no kidding or heck no deleting dupes? :P

a useful question is not closed in the first place without migration.

@LaszloPapp The whole point of the duplicate system is to allow multiple formulations of a question to point to the correct place.

2

7:56 AM

is that possible I do not agree with the "whole point" of the duplicate system?

(in the long run, not short)

This tag-statistics query is horrifying. Just horrifying. I will be keeping whoever wrote that well away from my databases. With a sharp object, if necessary.

That's possible yes, but deleting duplicates is surely not the best way to handle whatever you find wrong about the system.

@michaelb958 lots of copy-pasting

you are entitled to have your opinion, and I will keep that in respect, but nothing more :)

Some duplicates serve no value, but most of them do

7:58 AM

@3ventic I dare you to run it and not be horrified at the result set.

but here, duplicate was a really narrowed down sidetrack.

the question was about off-topic, etc, overall.

really "useful" off-topic questions will be protected by mods, and if you disagree you can always vote for undelete; I really cannot see the problem. A question usually does not get closed for being super good after all.

@michaelb958 I just ran it, there must be an easier way to get those results. It took a long time, too.

I really should start my own room on Meta chat. Any suggestions how I should call it?

@Stijn I'm waiting for the execution plan. I suspect I will be horrified.

@ShadowWizard Wizard's Tower.

@michaelb958 "18 rows returned in 64369 ms" for c# and java

8:01 AM

@Stijn hmm... possible but too obvious. Thanks!

@Stijn weird, isn't there a 60 seconds timeout??

@ShadowWizard I thought the timeout was 120 seconds.

Also, the execution plan is horrifying. I'm trying to mangle the CSS so I can screenshot the whole thing.

@michaelb958 oh, maybe. 60 should be enough though, anything taking more than that is likely to bring down the database anyway.

Bart

Deleted content is pretty damn invisible @laszlopapp. And mods protecting "useful" off-topic content is not something I see really happening. Either that or your definition of "useful" is far too narrow.

if even mods do not find it useful ... well, it is perhaps not useful?

and actually, deleted content is visible in the moderator tools with votes, etc.

Bart

Or they don't see every freaking duplicate

8:04 AM

you may not have enough reputation to see it, but it is there.

Bart

A limited set is

Got to go. I'll be back with that screenshot.

no, I think moderators can see every deleted post.

and if it is not duplicate anymore, the op will raise an undeletion anyway.

Still not sure if it will have long range purpose, but...

chat.meta.stackoverflow.com/rooms/721/shadows-den

8:25 AM

Well. It's been rather quiet.

@3ventic did you just change your display name?!

3ventic's Shadow, Jyväskylä, Finland

4k 1 12 32

support discussion bug feature-request top-bar edits reputation

I might have

@michaelb958 tumbleweed.gif

@3ventic but you're no wizard! ;-)

Yeah, I'm just a shadow.

8:28 AM

2

@3ventic I have a shadow too, you know

@michaelb958 ohhh, in the name of all SQL gods WHAT IS THAT?! :D

SQL protip: you shouldn't need thirteen SELECTs in a row.

Your assertions about 'incorrect programming paradigms' are merely circular reasoning. — EJP 6 hours ago

Shadow of the Shadow

Hello!

How come there are so many shadows here without ~~the Sun~~ any light at all?

8:30 AM

this comment has got 4 upvotes, but I do not understand what point it is trying to make to improve the post. Could someone help me with this, provided someone understands the point of it here :)

@3ventic big minds cast a long shadow

Wizards can make shadows without light.

@3ventic Well, @ShadowoftheShadow's profile picture is @ShadowWizard's son (I think)...

@michaelb958 well spotted!

I think his profile picture is his son too

a different picture though

Shadow of the Shadow

8:31 AM

I'm just a sock :(

No, you're a shadow.

Oh, I got an idea for new profile picture for my sock. Thanks guys!

I'm an aeroplane!

Your son's shadow?

@3ventic not yet, but he will be a great wizard one day

8:34 AM

what happens to separately deleted answers if a deleted question gets undeleted?

will the separately deleted answers get also undeleted, or they remain so?

They stay deleted as far as I know

Jan Dvorak

reject-pls stackoverflow.com/review/suggested-edits/4543636

JIT

cv-pls stackoverflow.com/questions/22981785/…

rene was quicker than me!

The page is still loading...!

8:36 AM

Tnx

My connection sucks so much that the review had been rejected (last vote by @rene) for 33 seconds before I even saw it.

@michaelb958 review page? Yeah, first load after a while takes couple of minutes

there was a meta post about that...

@rene yeah, can't find it. Maybe deleted :(

Couldn't find it either

8:41 AM

Well, someone ranted about it for a couple of sentences in this answer.

Now that is a helpful answer...

For the uninitiated, that is an example of a much better query execution plan.

Hmmm, still 2 index scans...

vlq meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/229011/…

No, wait, it's actually spam.

yeah

8:50 AM

I saw that it wasn't English and cast a knee-jerk VLQ.

too late I already flagged

@michaelb958 oh, bags!

@ShadowWizard Laszlo mentioned it chat.meta.stackoverflow.com/transcript/message/1921661#1921661

There is no meta post though

@rene yeah, most likely OP deleted it when it wasn't 100% reproducible.

I suspect per-user cache built once, and when being built takes time

9:10 AM

Dilemma. I'm not hungry but I always eat in this hour. What should I do?

@ShadowWizard First, spell "dilemma" with two Ms.

Maybe I should go down to the foam-cutting shop and get a collection of giant letters and punctuation to hit people with. That would be fun.

@michaelb958 I blame Chrome correction! That's what it suggested :(

@ShadowWizard This is why I turn off autocorrection on everything that has it as soon as possible. I don't need no stinkin' autocorrect!

@michaelb958 oh no, not auto but if there's typo it becomes red and I can see suggested fix

I turned off auto correction in my cellular phone from day 1

I operate without spell checking in my browser. Either I know what I'm typing, and don't need a red underline to spot typos; or I know what I'm typing, and don't want the browser offering "corrections" for technical terms.