~ Who needs sleep here?

@TheLittleNaruto

@DroidDev Well... The way he put might be convincing for you. Not for me. Also I didn't like this line: "I wish some of the Hindu extremists could learn Dharma and Hinduism from Mahatma Gandhi." It was a totally biased statement.

@TheLittleNaruto why not convincing enough? and same why for the biased statement also

@DroidDev Do you think only Hindus are extremists ?

@TheLittleNaruto no, but here, he is talking just about hindu extremists

@DroidDev First answer my question, Did you read Mahabharata ?

@TheLittleNaruto kinda, I did when I was a kid. Don't remember much of it now

just remember various stories told

@DroidDev The way he put, is really convincing. But that's half cooked.

@TheLittleNaruto what's the rest of half then?

Read Mahabharata I can't tell you whole story in a comment.

well....from what I know, Arjun really did reject to fight, because other side were relatives

don't want to read again just to confirm that

Of course he did.

It was not Pandava but Kaurava who started the fight

@TheLittleNaruto you are right. Discussion on it won't be possible in these messages. Also, I did not want to focus on religious angle, but wanted to focus more on Gandhi's intellect

Let's say there are 2 princes of a Kingdom. One prince is elder, but he wants to have at least place anywhere in the country where he can live with his family he doesn't have desire of the kingdom, but younger prince that also doesn't want to give him.

What should the elder do now ?

Think of the situation.

@TheLittleNaruto well, in this case, it was necessary to fight and resolve the matter. So, what do you think about arjuna's rejection of fighting when people arrived on battlefield

also, still, want to keep the focus on Gandhi's intellect

@DroidDev That was cowardice, I agree. But again think of the situation. If it would be just Kaurava, it would have been easier for him, but he had to fight against his super grand pa, Gurus and uncles.

@TheLittleNaruto well....it wasn't a surprise for him. Everyone knew what they were in for, before they arrived on battlefield. War is not a place for generals to change their ideologies. Anyway, why are we discussing this?

@DroidDev About Gandhiji intellect, he was sure did right in his whole life. But few decisions of him were really unforgivable

@TheLittleNaruto yeah, now we on right track. Decisions like what?

also, unforgivable? :O

@DroidDev He could have saved bhagat singh rajguru and sukhdev, but he didn't.

This was first mistake

Second was dividing country

@TheLittleNaruto that's just a lie, propagated by politicians for political gains. Nobody would have been able to save them at that moment, and it wasn't their wish either. Their whole plan was to "die" for nation, so that more and more people can then be informed about struggle of independence

@TheLittleNaruto how do you think Gandhi did that? I am not able to understand this.

@DroidDev Because it was not like Gandhiji was a simple person by that time, Even British rulers couldn't have done anything against him. If He would have talked to the rulers, He could have saved them. But he clearly denied helping them.

He didn't even try for it.

@TheLittleNaruto that's just mere speculation. Muslim league wanted a separate nation long before independence, and that was their only reason and condition to participate in struggle for independence, after a certain stage of struggle of independence. Now, why congress agreed to that, is because they needed more and more people for struggle, otherwise, it just wasn't possible.

@DroidDev I can also say, this is just mere speculation

@TheLittleNaruto Nobody else did either. Do you think Lal Bahadur Shastri did, or Nehru did, or anyone else. It just wasn't possible.

@DroidDev Again you didn't understand bro.

Gandhi was a great public figure

@TheLittleNaruto no dude, you read the history of congress and Muslim league, in the history of Struggle of independence of India. Those are the facts, not speculations

You understand this

@TheLittleNaruto So was Jinnah

and Nehru

Not as compared to Gandhi

@DroidDev We have to disagree to agree on that.

@TheLittleNaruto so that is the reason with which gandhi would have stopped the division of nation?

@DroidDev We were talking about saving Bhagat Singh and 2 others.

We didn't come to the second bad deed yet.

@TheLittleNaruto well...that also is not possible. First, you have to consider Baghat Singh, and their wishes. They did not want to be saved. Second, if someone throws bomb in our assembly, and then their president tells us to pardon the terrorist, what would our president do

@DroidDev Again. It was never the assembly of Indians but British rulers. Why should we care ? Living in India and getting ruled by bunch of outsiders, How would you feel ?

@TheLittleNaruto what we care about is not the topic. You can change the assembly of nation in that message, and still the conditions will hold true. Nobody is going to pardon a militant, if they have captured one, just because someone said so. And yes, Indian freedom fighters used to be called militant, before we got independence.

@DroidDev I wasn't expecting you to go that far.

@TheLittleNaruto facts are facts. And that is the truth. People blaming Gandhi for Bhagat Singh's hanging are wrong. Though, I admire Bhagat Singh too much, he was an atheist too, and a marxist. A great reader and philosopher. He didn't take the path he took just for the kicks. He had his own ideology and path on which he walked, just like Gandhi himself.

@DroidDev Sorry Beere, it was not good to even think them as militant for even a slight moments

I actually equate both Gahdhi and Bhagat Singh, at intellectual and philosophical levels. The ideologies they developed forced them to take different paths, for same goal

@TheLittleNaruto I am not saying they were militants. I am saying they were called militants.

well...

@DroidDev Understand this, choose words wisely. It was like first you abuse someone and later you start liking

Beere! It's not acceptable IMHO

@TheLittleNaruto well....then you need to read above messages again. Can't say anything more than that, if you are getting emotional, and not reading the facts

because facts are only things, on which I can debate

Alright

Back to my point

Gandhiji could have saved them because he was a great public figure by that time.

Let's say he couldn't even save them, But for the least he should have given it a try.

@DroidDev Nope their plan was not to die.

That was the extreme case they had accepted the time before the bomb attack

@TheLittleNaruto nope, they threw the bomb, and then didn't run and gave their arrests themselves. Then, Chandrashekhar Azad was planning their escape from prison, which they denied.

@DroidDev No! Sure after prison, they denied the escape.

@TheLittleNaruto you said no to which part?

@DroidDev "gave their arrests themselves"

@TheLittleNaruto that is actually true. They didn't run, stood their, and gave the arrests themselves.

@TheLittleNaruto mkgandhi.org/articles/bhagat_singh.htm

Well..

But still he should have saved them.

That won't change my point.

He was just 23 aged

And that was not Just Bhagat Singh but Sukhdev and Rajguru as well.

@TheLittleNaruto I think its wrong to judge Bhagat Singh based on age. He was way more than anyone at his age. He was actually prodigy. But, still, if you read the link I shared above, you'll come to know, it just wasn't possible

@DroidDev In that sense, nothing is possible, but people should give it a try. Then only we come to know whether it can become possible or not.

@TheLittleNaruto you gotta read that link. The fact is, Gandhi, after tremendous public pressure, on two occasions tried to change the death sentence to life commute.

@DroidDev From your link:

> Gandhi alone could have intervened effectively to save Bhagat Singh's life.He did not, till the very last.

Also about dividing country, Gandhi ji never tried to avoid it, instead he was following the concept of favoritism. That is making his favorite boy Nehru as Prime Minister instead of Sardar Vallabhbhai Patel who was better candidate than Nehru.

And that would have been possible only after dividing the country

:7083735you read one line, but not the full article.

And that's what he did.

But in any case, I do agree that Gandhi ji revolution really helped India in getting independence. He was great being.

But division and not saving those guys are not acceptable

@TheLittleNaruto I don't know about favoritism, but stopping the division was out of anyone's control at that time. Actually, I think there might be a link between how british implemented divide and rule since the beginning.

actually, it wouldn't have been possible for Jinnah to get any seat, if a separate nation wasn't created. But, that's again a speculation.

@DroidDev They were very smart into that. They sure put the seed of divide and rule since the begining.

@Dro I want you to ask a question on Qoura, "What do people of Pakistan think of division of the country which they were part of before independence ?" Because I am sure most of us Indians were/are against it.

@TheLittleNaruto hmm....I think its a good question, but the emphasis, in its current form, lies more on, What do Pakistanis think about India. I think you want to ask about the actual division that happened, and not about any particular country. Right?

If yes, we need to re-word it

@DroidDev Yes right

Wouldn't a direct question be better? Like, "What do Pakistanis think about division of pre-independent India? Why it happened and what were the consequences?"

if we don't include the later part, you are bound to get biased answers

@DroidDev Yeah better!

we can still reword it tho

But I am more concerned about "the division" Do they really wanted ?

@TheLittleNaruto I don't think anybody in present can answer that. People who asked for it, or worked for it, are mostly dead. Its just their ideas and the results that live on

@DroidDev Let's see that.

Whatever it is.

wait...lemme think of another rewording

Sure please

baby urban Pakistan

@TheLittleNaruto Pakistan [Neighbour] of [India].

what do you think about this @TheLittleNaruto :

Do current Pakistanis think that creation of separate nation in 1947 was beneficial for them?

@DroidDev PERFECT!

Yeah we can post this question.

still, this is bound to get biased answers.

Share me the link when you post it.

oh....I gotta post it? Lol, I thought you were going to post it

Ok I'll post

Can we add some description like:

wait....still thinking on a rewording

this biased answers thing is what I am not liking

Put the hate aside between these two countries at present while answering.

@TheLittleNaruto no, actually, by asking "beneficial", we are making this biased question already

morning

@DroidDev Oh!

@kId morning o/

One more thing, I liked the fact that Gandhi ji was one spiritual person.

How do present Pakistanis feel about division of India in 1947 and its affects on today's generation of Pakistan?

@TheLittleNaruto I think this one is perfect

what do you think?

@DroidDev Sounds good.

this gives just enough room for user imagination, that they can stay on topic, I think

Yes right

Should I post now or you will ?

@TheLittleNaruto sure, please go ahead and share the link. I hope you get some good and lots of other answers, so I can know more about it

@TheLittleNaruto that's where the idea of non-violence came about. Also, he ate mutton and all when he was young though (maybe once only), but later felt sorry about it

@DroidDev qr.ae/TUpLe6

@DroidDev Yeah I know about it.

And yes when you're a spiritual person (truely spiritual as in realized) you see the whole world as one, there is no difference.

@TheLittleNaruto I actually respect anyone who develop their own principles through their life.

@DroidDev Thank you Man

@TheLittleNaruto well...otherwise, you won't be spiritual, right?

@DroidDev right

@TheLittleNaruto tumbling (?)

@TheLittleNaruto for what?

@DroidDev For respecting me :P

@TheLittleNaruto oh...lol, can't say anymore on the topic :P

I left all these non veg because the same thing what Gandhi ji felt

@DroidDev :P

@TheLittleNaruto I forgot what he felt, but I know that he felt sorry because of lying (to his father?)

Oh! Then my reason is different

I requested answers on your question

Thanks

Ok I'll start work now lol

later o/

@TheLittleNaruto ja ne

Sayonara

@DroidDev like you were telling, a similar answer I got from an idiot. Can you add some comment ?

@TheLittleNaruto no need. Just let it be. He is kinda true tho. Most people can't think of how things were before independence, and so can't compare the benefits/affects to today. I am hoping some historian intellectual will come across and will answer with facts and figures

~ Shadow

Hi!