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12:40 AM
Huh, I guess I missed happy hour this week.
too busy being happy, eh?
happens to the best of us
gotta be more like @ShadowWizard: find the racism that lurks on meta, and use it to temper your happiness
Napping. :D
Had a good day today. Deadpool 2, pizza at a new place within walking distance... afternoon nap... and getting to actually see my son before he goes to sleep.
Dammit you got to see Deadpool 2? Jealous.
I see very few movies any more. Tomorrow's Andy's birthday so we played hooky.
12:47 AM
Somehow I have to see Solo...
Probably gonna try to squeeze it into an off day
(which is a perk of the slightly crazy hours)
1:27 AM
Lots of things to do today...wait for my new, larger tripod coming tomorrow, prepare another slide deck in the meantime, and help my mom out with hew new catering business
I acquired a new studio light. Great way to repurpose the new battery I bought for my old tape camcorder from 1999
@Catija Send us a picture of the cake
2:12 AM
@SonictheInclusiveHedgehog Not doing a cake... doing a no-bake cheesecake... which is more like a pie.
My sister's made cheesecake, but I'm not sure if it's no-bake
3:06 AM
Anyone experiencing 500 errors when accessing Meta?
3:23 AM
[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Bad NS for domain in body, bad keyword in body, bad keyword in title, bad pattern in URL body, blacklisted website in body, +2 more: These SkinCell Pro Hydrocolloid are essentially by Markmicks on graphicdesign.SE
@SonictheInclusiveHedgehog yes
and my so profile as well
3:41 AM
@SonictheInclusiveHedgehog works for me
@peterh if you were close to a network ban, you probably would be asking that question with a sock.
Being occasionally terribly wrong about a few things isn't against the rules
4:27 AM
Morning Saturday afternoon, and it's a great time to go outside~
5:06 AM
[ SmokeDetector | MS ] URL in title, bad NS for domain in body, bad NS for domain in title, bad keyword in body, bad keyword in title, +6 more: www.nutritionfit.org/rapid-tone-shark-tank/ by Sawly1936 on drupal.SE
5:26 AM
@JourneymanGeek Ever gotten "too many requests" during normal use of the site?
~ Not everything is star-worthy...
@SonictheInclusiveHedgehog It's Stephen Rauch's fault.
5:47 AM
@SonictheInclusiveHedgehog No
But tbh, SE's mostly in the background for me
I just contacted SE about it
6:31 AM
@JourneymanGeek Can I get a quote of the reply to my comment on meta.stackexchange.com/questions/310391/… please?
I don't think you want to see it.
User's unhappy with your comment shrug
also, you probably would have been better off commenting that its an unsupported browser
ah no
maaan, that actually might have been a valid bug report.
> The latest version of Chrome (66) works on somes sites, but crashes trying to load a unix.stackexchange.com or Software Engineering page.

Specifically, this is when tapping a link in the weekly email. Chrome is launched briefly showing the sg-links URL with a blank page. Then returned to the browser-selection popup.
TOTALLY a valid bug report, even if it happens with other sites
6:49 AM
[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Offensive answer detected, potentially bad keyword in answer: How to communicate to a new coworker that I am not comfortable being touched? by Davide on interpersonal.SE
7:39 AM
> will down vote my own question.
8:02 AM
[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Bad keyword with a link in answer, non-Latin link in answer: Blender High/Low vertices versions in same object by goly on blender.SE
[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Non-Latin link in answer: Trying to add physics to leather strap on thors hammer by jody on blender.SE
@SmokeDetector tpu-
@SmokeDetector tpu-
8:31 AM
[ SmokeDetector | MS ] URL in title, bad keyword in body, bad keyword in title, blacklisted website in body, blacklisted website in title, +2 more: mp3-converter.xyz/i-wanna-know-bea-miller-mp3-song-download/ by GinBrow on puzzling.SE
1 hour later…
@JourneymanGeek lemme guess, a self-righteous "you are exactly what is wrong with Stack Exchange."
I get that a lot. 0.2 a year
Or maybe more often
Well, at least I'm exactly what's wrong with this chat
Or maybe this chat is exactly what's wrong with me
Hard to tell if it's one or the other
@M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ I'm also not a fan of "I closed/downvoted because foo"
9:45 AM
Best is to say nothing at all, and flag, vote appropriately.
@M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ you simply don't mix well with SE ...
If a bot visits a post, does that count as view?
@M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ or you are what is wrong with you
All chemistry, nothing unnatural :3
10:03 AM
@πάνταῥεῖ any unique IP in 15 minutes count as a view.
Run a cron job to curl your posts every 15 minutes just to show off on the viewcount ...
That might well explain some viewcounts I see at some questions in the diaspora corners of SE.
After seconds.
!!/tea user202729
10:18 AM
@πάνταῥεῖ brews a cup of earl grey tea for @user202729
[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Manually reported answer: Can a man go to the mikva on shabbos and yom tov? by Adolf Hitler on judaism.SE
The user name?
Quite intentional
Sure in that context.
1 hour later…
11:34 AM
@hey brews a cup of Espresso for @hey
That urgent?
Yeah, just returned back from the outside after a good time...
7 hours ago, by hey
Morning Saturday afternoon, and it's a great time to go outside~
spoiler: thunderstorm in the end
okay, so I got a recommended news by Google about... Prince Harry's wedding live streaming...
11:55 AM
Anyone know how I can find a list of Roombaed questions? Trying to figure out whether what I claim to have seen in meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/368215/… was real or whether I'm crazy.
@MarkAmery only for your own posts with a search for deleted:1 and then you still have to visit each one of them.
Let me check if I can get something from SEDE
Awesome, that's already good enough for me, @rene
I've tracked one down
Oh man, I understand now.
There's a popup when I click "undelete" that says (this time round) Vote to undelete this post? (29 votes remaining)
I clearly misinterpreted that as the number of additional votes required from other users for undeletion
yeah, you get 1 del vote every 1k after reaching 20k
when in fact it is, I think, the number of extra votes I'm allowed to cast in some time period (probably of 24 hours)
!!/coffee MarkAmery
12:00 PM
@SurajRao brews a cup of Cappuccino for @MarkAmery
you need coffee @MarkAmery
and whipped cream
hey, it's genuinely ambiguous! And I didn't know the rules for determining how many undelete votes it takes to undelete something! And the post I was originally trying to undelete had negative score, so it seemed plausible that it would require lots of undelete votes!
... albeit 30 is really a very large number
depends on 30 of what
30 waffles are quite hard to digest
at least now you know :)
> If you have the vote to delete privilege (part of the "moderator tools" privilege) (10k rep on launched sites, 2k on beta sites), you get five votes to delete per day, plus 1 vote per 1000 reputation points above 10k (up to a maximum of 30 votes per day). Votes to delete your own posts may or may not count toward the limit, depending on circumstances.

> You get as many votes to undelete as votes to delete.
(from FAQ)
12:10 PM
@hey Still stormy outside?
@πάνταῥεῖ you can always use that technique they use in competitive eating
hmm apparently a massive super-cell moved through here when I was sleeping
@MarkAmery A highly inaccurate query would look like this: data.stackexchange.com/stackoverflow/query/853698
ha! nice trick
@πάνταῥεῖ will be stormy knight...
12:23 PM
@hey but will it be a dark and stormy knight?
I'm pretty sure there wasn't a pun ;-)
12:38 PM
Interesting quote from https://meta.stackoverflow.com/a/367985/1709587, I think:

> The tools used in software development lack empathy and compassion. If you let the seemingly-endless streams of compiler/linker errors, build fails, runtime faults and spec deviations get to you mentally, the machinery and tools will drive you insane.
Seems like a favorite statement from a particular user.
Yup, got it correct before seeing the username
@MarkAmery I'd be a little concerned if the compiler tried to give me a cookie for messing up. Or did passive aggressive things when I gave it bad code "Oh... so you think it's OK to not initialize an identifier... FAR BE IT FROM ME to tell you how to code!"
Sure. But one of the pet hypotheses that I've had for a while (which I guess Martin shares) is that much of programmer culture is shaped by the fact that programming is a profession in which your routine activities consist of being told over and over again by an uncaring machine that you are wrong and that you have not done your job correctly. Perhaps that selects for - and cultivates - a sort of character that's robust against receiving a constant stream of negativity.
12:44 PM
Well, working with a Delphi compiler isn't really something I'd call fun, when entering into the syntax weirdness land.
@MarkAmery without a proper sociological study with proper P values I couldn't say. I would say the same thing I say about performance issues though: "Don't ever assume"
That said... a few friends of mine did make the "Zap" programming language in college where all the compiler errors were Zap Brannigan quotes
Sounds quite military s**t for me.
Most of Zaps quotes are just silly stupid
Yes, military as I mentioned
It's a unicorn's look at tech or any other job, that it always should be warm, cosy and welcoming.
I kind of want to make a language with @Mgetz's "passive aggressive compiler" now
"No, no, don't worry about defining foo before you use it, I'll just pull a value out of my ass."
12:51 PM
If I did something bluntly wrong, I just want to know that instantly with the most informative feedback. But I am not everyone it seems.
@MarkAmery I can't respond to this without making stereotype jokes despite being jewish... and knowing people that fit the stereotype
@MarkAmery "Oh you didn't initialize foo here let me initialize it for you... how about I just remove it instead. Does that work for you?"
"Looks like you forgot to initialize foo... want me to initialize it for you?"
[Yes] [Yes] [Help]
That's what an IDE's job should be.
Not the compiler's.
Straw poll (don't answer if you already know the particular reason I'm asking, or if you've seen the term used in the last few days). If you read that a law enforcement agency had an "embedded informant" within an organisation, what would you take that to mean?
12:57 PM
@MarkAmery That there was an ongoing investigation into that organization long before the informant.
I'd ask Google what "embedded informant" is :(
also potentially counter intelligence
@hey Unfortunately all the Google results for the term turn out to be from the quote you're trying to interpret
I'd suspect it's someone who blows a very small and directed whistle.
In particular, would you infer that an "embedded informant" was someone who had been planted within the organisation by the law enforcement agency, or would you infer that it was an existing member of the organisation who had decided to whistleblow, or would you be unsure and consider the term ambiguous between the two?
12:59 PM
Generally speaking embedded informants usually indicate there was significant and probable cause to indicate the organization was involved in RICO or FISA activities
Or domestic terror
@Mgetz Hmm, I'm just trying to figure out what you'd parse "embedded informant" to mean - sounds like you've taken some meaning as given and skipped to what surrounding circumstances you'd infer
@MarkAmery See "Donnie Brasco"
so you'd naturally take it that the "embedded informant" was an undercover law enforcement agent?
@MarkAmery no, that's level 3 on the scale. EI is level 2. EI is someone who has agreed to join law enforcement to be a CI (Level 1)
@Mgetz so would you infer from the term that the informant had been planted within the organisation by the law enforcement agency, or would you consider the term equally compatible with somebody within the organisation deciding of their own volition to provide law enforcement with information?
1:06 PM
Basically let's say you have multiple CIs telling you something completely nuts, so you get someone who's friendly that you trust but so will the group you want to monitor to become an EI. You only use ULEO if it's a long term persistent threat
@MarkAmery The former, but it's highly regulated. You can't just ask someone to become an EI because a group is interesting.
You have to have probable cause first in most cases
@Mgetz Not in bavaria it seems so :-/
if you later find out there is a UCLEO that's usually a really really bad sign
@πάνταῥεῖ I can't speak to German procedures
interesting. Well, thanks - between the three of you you've completely failed to help me resolve the question I was unsure about, since I've got a vote from Mgetz for "EI must be planted", a vote from πάντα ῥεῖ for "I'd assume they were just a whistleblower" and a vote from hey for "no idea, I'd Google".
(For the motivating context, see skeptics.meta.stackexchange.com/q/4178/15961)
@MarkAmery it's complicated, EIs generally follow CIs which are the original whistleblowers
usually you would use an EI to confirm something a CI said that doesn't seem plausible
Just thrown in, because I am quite concerned about the recently installed police duty laws here.
1:09 PM
The issue is that CIs often have their own agendas
Oh yeah the trump issue... they are trying to rally their base for the election ignoring the fact that it was legit based on the existing counter intelligence investigation already ongoing
If I was them I wouldn't use watergate as a comparison, I'd use COINTELPRO
From someone who has never heard about that idea in their country, yeah, sorry... can't help.
@hey you would call them police informers I believe
but it's a slightly different concept here in the US because there are regulations after what happened with COINTELPRO
Hmm... I'm not sure myself, but still never heard those being put in a company. Usually they're undercover agent instead... for government asset corruption-related
@hey IIRC you have secret police do you not?
Every country's got one. No matter what it's officially named.
1:17 PM
@πάνταῥεῖ Someone has to do counter intelligence
I am working on it.
Kopkamtib... doesn't seem so...
> dismantled by the government of the Reform era.
Come on every one: Join the WAU (world anarchists union)
hmm, I guess BIN counts
@hey yeah was going to say... in most countries it's not an LEO agency per say. MI5 is still technically military in the UK for example
The US is one of the few exceptions where the FBI has that role
1:25 PM
Governments implant agents into closed groups (of conspiracy) and even vice versa. That's an ubiquitous thing in secret gathering of information. Nothing new or special.
I guess I'll see if the Skeptics community are willing to accept this clarification: skeptics.stackexchange.com/review/suggested-edits/30663
@MarkAmery already rejected ;p
they like smelling their own farts
I really, really hate the Skeptics community.
Every time I click through to them from the Hot Network Questions tab, it's like this
Any right-wing claim gets interpreted as some crazy extreme version of what was said and labelled as false, other possible interpretations be damned
1:27 PM
@MarkAmery what did you expect? Actual skeptics, no that SE attracts the Tin-foil hat types
Let's be respectful of other communities, yeah?
@MarkAmery tbf in this case the original post is correct insofar as the released information shows
I am the one who invented the chem-trail fake to drill them all up :3
@ArtOfCode I'm not particularly inclined to respect partisanship from people who've in the last few hours accused me of dishonesty, confusion, and wilful mental gymnastics for trying to get an ambiguity clarified while refusing to implement the clarification. Let them show a little respect first.
tbh if you want to really put on your tinfoil hat... start looking into some of the crazy that is counter intelligence
that is the only place where a tinfoil hat is not only necessary but required headgear
1:33 PM
have to be skeptical to any posts in Skeptic.SE
@hey Just straight-up lying about what a source says isn't beneath them, either: skeptics.stackexchange.com/questions/15609/…
It's depressing how bad the entire community is
@MarkAmery actually that one is true, they donated excessively to the congress-people to get that passed
I'm pretty sure they've flat out given interviews on it actually
but I'd have to check
the issue isn't with whether the NRA lobbied for the laws in question but with what those laws say
I also wouldn't say the NRA arranged for passage of any legislation, I would say they donated and lobbied heavily for it.
arranged would imply corruption
1:40 PM
The NRA doesn't "lobby", but shoots immediately :-P
@πάνταῥεῖ that's a completely different discussion and issue.
the answer claims that they arranged for the passage of legislation to prevent the Centre for Disease control spending any money at all on research into firearms death and injury" but that's a misrepresentation of the characterisation of the Dickey Amendment in the article being quoted, which claims that it only "prevents the Centre for Disease Control spending any money at all on research "that might advocate or promote gun control"
And that in turn is a misrepresentation of the text of the Dickey Amendment, which doesn't include the "might" but merely says that CDC funds may not be "used to advocate or promote gun control"
huh, actually looks like the answer got cleaned up to remove the false claims?!
@MarkAmery The practical effect is pretty much the same, any research into gun deaths is basically prohibited and congress gets really agitated if they start on anything
(or at least to limit it to the false claims in the partisan source being used to support the answer, rather than false claims made up completely by the answerer)
@Mgetz that may be, but I'll only believe it if I see evidence
the answer doesn't try to make that case
@MarkAmery apparently it's irrelevant now, the recently passed Omnibus bill contained a provision that removes or clarifies that language
the CDC can do the research... assuming they can get congress to fund it (different issue)
no point in arguing when it's not technically an issue anymore
@MarkAmery fair enough
1:50 PM
@Mgetz interesting info - didn't know that
@MarkAmery nor did I but when I did a quick search for "CDC gun death research" it was literally the top result
Fair enough. I don't care about that issue in isolation (or any of the others I've mentioned), though - I care about the rotten culture of SSE.
@MarkAmery It's not just SSE it's tribalism in general
people reject viewpoints that come from outside their tribe as 'wrong'
@gregcons @aprilwensel Exactly that's my stance about it, yes.
Them tending to interpret claims in a way that benefits their individual politics is one thing. Outright censoring anyone querying their interpretation or pointing out different possible interpretations, and refusing to permit edits that clarify what interpretation an answer is addressing... that's another. There's no plausible way that that helps people be more accurately informed; it's purely partisan.
1:56 PM
what happens to "downvote bad answers, upvote good answers, or write an answer if there's no good answers"...
@MarkAmery May I suggest posting your own answers or voting?
I wouldn't be adding any new evidence, though, purely a different tl;dr take on the evidence already presented by other answers. That doesn't seem like it deserves its own answer.
@MarkAmery it is if the effect is different and you can explain why
TBH this is only an issue at all because Devin Nunes is allegedly party to conspiracy to commit kidnapping but that's it's own crazy insane ball of WTF
Meh; I don't know enough about the case to want to write a judgement of what did or didn't happen with my name on it
My issue is purely with the biased interpretation of claims
anyway, what I don't really like about being skeptical (in general, not SE) is, for news related to very recent event, so there's no/only few reliable information to be used as a material for answering... unless you wait 6-8 weeks later when the clear info is now available, but then the question is.... well, moot.
2:01 PM
@MarkAmery I just walk away sometimes, it's easier and less stress
Considering that I've exhausted all remedies available to me, I have no choice but to do that
Welp, there's a reason why I avoid Religion.SE
But it sucks to walk away from it. Their community is actively misleading people while presenting itself as a truth-seeking community. I don't like tolerating dishonesty and deception, but I'm outnumbered on SSE by dishonest partisans so I can't win the fight.
@MarkAmery truth is what you make it to be
and usually what the victors write in the textbooks
or Philosophy.SE
2:04 PM
anyway, it's 3pm and I haven't had lunch
so, see you all
Have fun, I'm off to play games
cya o/
@hey The edit from o\ to o/ was a nice effect seen live ;)
2:43 PM
... perhaps this is weird... but I feel like having an ant therapy now... 1 small ant wandering around my body and it tickles...
it's entertaining enough to see this wandering ant being confused...
3:15 PM
@hey 'perhaps'?
1 hour later…
4:40 PM
This is what we get for having sites other than Stack Overflow.
@MarkAmery you gotta admit, making a tl;dr longer isn't a great edit.
it's supposed to be a summary of the rest of the post, not ... the whole post
I kinda wish the Net had stuck with the term "executive summary" for these things. "Lies we tell to bosses"
5:05 PM
I've seen some posts where the tl;dr was just more information and actually not really shorter then the whole thing
Yeah, I've seen those posts too. I've edited some of those posts.
[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Bad pattern in URL answer: Are Adobe Typekit fonts "free" to use? by alx1xla on graphicdesign.SE
sd why
sd poof
I can't even keep up with all the SD reasons anymore
luncheon meat in body, himalayan salt in body, toxic answer....
maybe too much toxicity about inclusion
5:30 PM
[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Link following arrow in body: Trying to add physics to leather strap on thors hammer by Zach Willson on blender.SE
5:42 PM
@Shog9 I got "too many requests" again, and I contacted the team yesterday about the same thing. Would you mind taking a look, please?
[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Bad keyword with email in answer, pattern-matching email in answer: What does “m/f” or “m/w” mean in German job postings? by gonzale enersto on german.SE
@SmokeDetector tpu-
@SmokeDetector tpu-
6:45 PM
@SonictheInclusiveHedgehog Are you making too many requests? There are some extensions which add a ton.
@user1114 No extensions
It's good etiquette not to bother mods with work in chat anyways.

Shog's 9 Rules of Pinging

Feb 4 at 19:49, 8 minutes total – 11 messages, 1 user, 9 stars

Bookmarked Mar 29 at 0:57 by Sonic the Inclusive Hedgehog

Otherwise, he's fine with being pinged
@Catija Tell Andy that Sonic said happy birthday!
Feb 4 at 19:53, by Shog9
5. If it's the weekend / evening and I'm drunk, all bets are off: see #4 above.
@πάνταῥεῖ He posted a message just a few messages before my ping, so it's unlikely he's drunk
6:52 PM
But it's weekend
@πάνταῥεῖ and I'm drunk
Not or
7:11 PM
Boolean logic rarely works well with social empathy.
@πάνταῥεῖ I don't believe rule 9 applies here either
Do note that I was a much more frivolous pinger back then than I am now.
7:34 PM
@Shog9 didn't find it, it found me...
@SonictheInclusiveHedgehog are you drunk?
May 5 at 8:12, by Sonic the Inclusive Hedgehog
I don't drink.
@SonictheInclusiveHedgehog why?
Below the legal drinking age in my country + I'm in a family of teetotalers
@SmokeDetector fp-
@SonictheInclusiveHedgehog oh
Can a Meta Stack Exchange mod redact the first revision on this (deleted) question? I am not willing to undelete it until this happens.
7:42 PM
@bwDraco why not just re-post it?
@ShadowWizard 10k+ users can see it.
@SonictheInclusiveHedgehog they can now since he linked it here...
Anyway, @Shog9 please handle their request
But the reasoning he gave is "not willing to undelete it until this happens", that's why I replied. He can leave it deleted and post new question without the sensitive info.
@bwDraco Does it have PII?
7:49 PM
First comment:
> Probably a situation better handled with a custom mod flag, or by using the contact us link at the bottom of the page. This kind of public exposure is probably the opposite of what someone who's struggling needs, please delete this. – apaul yesterday
All links that identify the specific user were removed in a subsequent edit, and the question was deleted.
If I undelete it, that information would be visible in the post history.
Again, no need to bother CM/dev for this IMO.
No ordinary mods on MSE.
I suppose policy is that mods will never be elected on MSE?
...hmm. It looks like this is the case because there's been no reason thus far to elect mods for MSE:
Q: How to view the moderators here in MSE?

user280850I am able to view the Stack Overflow site moderators by clicking on this https://stackoverflow.com/users?tab=moderators But when I search the same in meta.stackexchange, it does not display the site moderators. https://meta.stackexchange.com/users?tab=moderators The below message is displaye...

8:20 PM
[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Username similar to website in answer: Question in reading the Quran and tajweed for beginner by quranteaching on islam.SE
9:29 PM
I have flags from nearly a month ago here that haven't been handled yet
9:45 PM
If you're already using jQuery, just use $(location).attr('href',url);. window.location.href seems to have inconstant behavior in some browsers, in fact, it flat out doesn't work in my version of Firefox. I've heard tell of setting window.location directly not working in versions of IE. — Noz Jan 28 '15 at 22:34
10:26 PM
Nov 12 '15 at 15:46, by Shog9
Avg handling time is 7-8 hours
IMO, don't bother to flag if you need quick response, because usually it's taking several weeks, even for something like adding a red tag.
1 hour later…
11:32 PM
@bwDraco never say never, but I am pretty sure it will not be done, the private chat rooms here surely contain tons of super sensitive stuff that only SE employees can/should see. Solution would be to block "ordinary" moderator from seeing those rooms, but it will probably require non trivial development time, which is better spent elsewhere.
11:56 PM
[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Pattern-matching website in answer: The Product Rule of Square Roots with Negative Numbers by Paul on math.SE

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