Tavern on the Meta - 2021-04-02

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4:46 AM

stackoverflow.blog/2021/04/02/…

2 hours later…

6:18 AM

@Feeds what does being "oneboxed" even mean these days?

1 hour later…

7:37 AM

→ 19 messages moved to Chimney

→ 102 messages moved to Chimney

8:35 AM

I doubt the dupe is right here: meta.stackexchange.com/questions/362091/…

because I can't imagine that dupe fully explains the issue. Also because this meta.stackexchange.com/questions/362827 would be another dupe of that question.

9:22 AM

@rene I agree, that duplicate is "what is happening?" but the question is "why does SE do it"; which is a completely different question, requiring a "why does SE have this happen" type answer.

The link in your following comment seems a duplicate of the first question, also not answered by the chosen banner duplicates.

9:35 AM

Thanks for confirming

1 hour later…

10:41 AM

@Feeds stackoverflow.com/a/19767485/3648282 hackmd.io/@alexhkurz/rJ5wS-0f8

3 hours later…

1:27 PM

@JNat cross site spammer: stackexchange.com/users/17276237/marie-robert?tab=accounts

1:58 PM

@Feeds ok..... nice idea but while I can SEND morse messages, no way I can listen and interpreter the replies.

explainxkcd.com/wiki/index.php/Main_Page

→ 15 messages moved to Chimney

2:22 PM

^ uh, new user? Why?

Just to be clear, I'm aware that they made a second user account. I just wonder why they think it would do anything. The previous answer there is still visible. Somehow they think the mods would not notice re-posting the same thing?

@VLAZ there's a troll targeting Russian/Ukrainian politics.

Oh! Maybe they bought The Key and by paying not only do you get unlimited copy/pastes but also mod immunity.

@MetaAndrewT. I figured as much. I just wonder how they think making a new account and reposting would help. The previous answer was allowed to stay (after editing). I suspect all this action would do is force the mods to bring out the bigger guns.

o-r m-a-y-b-e m-o-d-s d-o-n't s-e-e t-h-e d-a-s-h-e-s?

Oh no! Dashes! Mods' fatal weakness!

@Mithical talking about the dog? That's not their weakness.

on other hand......

Journeyman Geek

@SPArcheon oh uh

2:30 PM

uh oh

Journeyman Geek

Ash passed away 2 weeks or so ago

𝔣𝔯𝔞𝔨𝔱𝔲𝔯 𝔦𝔰 𝔨𝔫𝔬𝔴𝔫 𝔱𝔬 𝔟𝔢 𝔖𝔲𝔭𝔢𝔯-𝔈𝔣𝔣𝔢𝔠𝔱𝔦𝔳𝔢 𝔞𝔤𝔞𝔦𝔫𝔰𝔱 𝔡𝔬𝔤 𝔱𝔶𝔭𝔢 𝔪𝔬𝔡𝔰.

Journeyman Geek

So there's no dog. Only me :(

I was going to send a puppy picture but (re-)found this one, maybe you'd appreciate it:

user image

It's Santa Maus

2:54 PM

@JourneymanGeek uhh... :(

Anyone know - I can't find anything on meta in a quick search - can a question with an open bounty be deleted by a non-moderator? I know that they can't be closed.

Journeyman Geek

No

How do you know?

Journeyman Geek

Mods can't delete them without undoing the bounty either, if memory serves

Cause I'm pretty sure I've tried :D

I ask because someone deleted their question when it was in the grace period and that ended up refunding the bounty - which seems like something we need to prevent.

2:58 PM

@Catija I don't think other users can even delete a question if it's not closed.

Journeyman Geek

that definitely seems wrong

(for context:)

It's a super abusable thing - "I don't like any answers (or I didn't get any), so I'll just delete my question for 2 minutes and get the bounty refunded.

6

Q: Why was my bounty returned after I deleted the question?

I had asked this question about a week ago, (which apparently, wasn't well-received, but that's another story) and had started a bounty of fifty of my Rep. After the question remained unanswered, and just kept on receiving Downvotes, I deleted the question. However, I found that after I deleted t...

bug status-review specific-question reputation bounty

From what Geek says, it sounds it shouldn't be possible.

Journeyman Geek

2:58 PM

@Catija deffo a bug

but AFAIK, no one can close and delete bountied questions

even mods have to refund it first before closing... right?

But this was in the grace period. :)

So the bounty wasn't "active" so much, just not yet "awarded".

and it was the owner, so they could delete it without it being closed

Journeyman Geek

Still shouldn't be refunded

Grace period of?

2:59 PM

you get 24 hours to award the bounty after the bounty period ends.

Ah, right.

Journeyman Geek

@VLAZ you get a day after the 'formal' 7 day bounty period to award it

I thought the grace period was shortly after posting the question.

different grace period

There's a 48 hour cooldown before you can bounty the question, yeah.

3:00 PM

Didn't know it's also what the bounty extension was called.

Hmmm, so then we need to review what we should do during the grace period WRT closing and deleting. Or just stop refunding the bounty if the question is deleted during the grace period.

The latter might be better. Not sure what's easier to build, though.

i'd say just keep all the same restrictions during the grace period as during the bounty

can't be closed/deleted

But there's this

192

Q: Allow bountied questions to be closed by regular users

I know there are a lot of questions asking the same thing and I know the proper way to close such question is to follow this: How can I close a question that has an active bounty? You flag it for moderator attention with the 'in need of moderator intervention' flag. Something along the lines of:...

discussion feature-request status-deferred scope bounty

though... would it be bad to instead make it possible to, yea that

question still remains what to do about the bounty, it's... somewhat problematic to allow anyone with a close privilage to close a question with a bounty on it, thus effectively deleting the rep of the OP

if it gets refunded... that's also abuseable, though not easily

Makes sense that bounty restrictions should apply until the bounty is awarded. Rather than having a different set of restrictions for part of that period.

3:20 PM

welp, I just did a bounty science on my question...

1. mods can't even close bountied question before removing the bounty (getting the "open bounty" error)
2. mods *can* delete bountied question before removing it, and the rep seems to be refunded automatically

Journeyman Geek

3:36 PM

@Catija Practically there should be no reason to automatically refund a bounty IMO

3:50 PM

Probably, yeah

Waiting my 15 minute observation period after my second vaccine.

Scary ?

Please keep talking so we can observe you still make sense ...

Journeyman Geek

@Catija thought it's 30

4:10 PM

stackoverflow.blog/2021/04/02/…

@JourneymanGeek just 15 here (Pfizer).

I'm done! Still (mostly) coherent!

Good!

Journeyman Geek

So was ours 😁

4:37 PM

@Catija At least I assume your country isn't one of the stupid ones that is trying to claim VIPIT is not real. Good for you

I kinda envy that.

I don't even know what VIPIT is.

@SPArcheon Isn't VIPIT something that happens days later, not minutes?

@Catija A side-effect from the AstraZeneca one, as far as I know.

@Tinkeringbell depends. But that is not the point. Catija said Pfizer - and since she works for Stack I doubt she is also a nurse or a police member or anything similar.

and since here in EU the mob gets Astra....

They stopped it over here again (for <60s) today... because it's totally safe.

no mater your age, nor you health... Astra for all

@Tinkeringbell We are in the bunch of morrons that uses it for anything.

4:41 PM

I see, I read your original message wrong XD.

4:53 PM

I read a follow-up that there is indication that the blood clots happen in women over 40(?) but that they're treatable if caught and still occur less frequently than in the general population... which doesn't make too much sense but... whatever. I don't think the US is getting much of the AZ. Pfizer and Moderna and J&J mostly

@Tinkeringbell Strike two.

I think no-one is really sure about anything yet.... I've heard 25 was the youngest age reported here so far, 1 person died, it's more frequently than in the general population (5 on 400k over here, but not all 400k were women under 60), and the vaccine is totally safe. Be glad the US didn't get into AZ :)

@Ollie Isn't that three or is it zero-based?

@VLAZ Nope, it's 2

I count by the number of posts.

It's the third post I've seen by the same user.

4:58 PM

There was a third similar one, but not by the same user. This one only had two and is now warned for question repetition.

@Tinkeringbell Thanks. What happens on strike 3, suspension?

Prolly

Prolly?

user image

Which strike involves locking them in the flaming clown spiders room?

4:59 PM

Ahh

@VLAZ 5, in MS.

@VLAZ Oh, that could be any strike, totally depending on a mods mood

OK, thanks. Just wanted to check.

@Catija It's been renamed Vaxzevria.

@Catija One of the reasons blood clots are more frequent in the general population (women in particular) is the contraceptive pill.

Resist Resist Resist Resist... nope, failed.

@Tinkeringbell Prolly wanna cracker?

5:11 PM

Just had dinner, I'm fine for now. Thanks for offering though!

Ehy, I at least deserve a star for having set a new low standard for puns in the Tavern.

5

I don't remember anything as bad recently.

@DavidPostill I've been taking those since my third period. If I'm getting a blood clot days after a vaccine, it's gotta be the vaccine or at least a combination XD

AstraZeneca There have been 30 reports of blood clots across five million people in Europe (0.000006)

The FDA estimates that the risk of birth control users developing a serious blood clot is three to nine women out of 10,000, every year. (.0003 to .0009)

Yep. That's the 'the vaccine is totally safe' part everyone keeps repeating. So we just put on an age-restriction because the vaccine is totally safe. Oh, and did I mention the time it was totally safe, so we kept vaccinating, then it was totally safe but we stopped vaccinating, and then it was still totally safe but we picked up vaccinating again? That was about a week and a half ago.

It's... whoever is making a mess is making a mess, and me suspicious.

@Tinkeringbell yep, that basically sums that up.

Still my point is not the fear of a hopefully rare side effect.

The part that worries me is the ones pretending that does not exist.

To be clearer:

5:25 PM

aren't nanobots supposed to fix those kinds of problems

Canada for example has established a specific procedure to handle VIPIT.

gov.nl.ca/covid-19/vaccine/astrazeneca-covishield-information

@user400654 Yeah, but you need the firmware update from the second dose.

Ah, a day one patch

or... day 14?

here... EMA says that there is no proof of causality. Despite like.. more than 10 independent research group pointing at the same thing.

@user400654 Depends on your country's vaccination strategy. Over here, it can be 6 weeks before you get a patch. Or, none at all if you had covid in the past 6 months.

5:28 PM

Also, apparently.. Ema had a close-door meeting about the issue last monday - 29 March.... but will post a public update on the 6 April.....

a week later.... Because Ester holidays I assume.

Yep, Lancet confirms: thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(21)00762-5/… bit i know what i want forbes.com/sites/williamhaseltine/2021/03/16/…

@Tinkeringbell Anyway here they want to use chemist's shops / drugstores to deliver vaccine shots.

Doesn't sound like too bad of an idea if you ask me.

The public procedure they published specifies that in case of a reaction to Astrazenca the pharmacist should call an ambulance....

and deliver an intramuscular adrenaline injection while they wait.....

I mean, that should probably be for all vaccines... XD

That sounds more like dealing with serious allergic reactions than the rare side effect :P

5:33 PM

yep, but I don't think Average Joe can deliver adrenaline shots....

seems a little dangerous.

Epipens?

They're pretty simple: Take off cap, press on leg, hear it 'click', then wait a bit before removing. I'm sure a pharmacist can administer those :)

I mean... better than a supermarket clerk trying to do the same, yet I am not sure the average pharmacy worker has the same training as an hospital one.

I'm not sure... I'm willing to believe the ones over here could do it. :)

I mean, if they send you home with certain medicines they have to able to explain how to use them. So it'd be strange for them to not know how to administer something like an epipen

You could be right, yet doesn't seem that optimal. Space problems too - where do you deliver the shots? the magazine rooms in the back?

Do you keep the shop closed on days you are serving vaccine shots duties?

I'd assume they'd use the rooms they use to explain the meds?

5:40 PM

Rooms to explains the meds?

Our pharmacies look like a Pokecenter. The one in the games.

Ah... mine has rooms, and if you're picking up new meds, you get invited into a room so the entire shop doesn't get to listen to what the lady at the counter is explaining to you.

a large room with various shelves and a desk where you pay and ask for the drugs that require a recipe.

That's it.

"If you take these antibiotics, your contraceptives might be less effective" is news better delivered in private :P

@Tinkeringbell not so lucky

@SPArcheon Then yeah, you have a problem. Perhaps a tent pitched outside? :D

5:43 PM

@Tinkeringbell usually here they just give you the stuff the doctor gave you a recipe for.

And they assume that the doctor told you what to do....

Oh no, there's a mandatory (by law) duty to explain your medicines to you over here. The fun fact is that they can then also charge for explaining your medicines.

If you repeatedly get the same thing though, they just put it in a locker and you get an e-mail with a code whenever it's ready to pick up.

Eeeeek, the pharmacy near where I live actually gave me the wrong drug multiple time....

So, quite sure that someone would get Insulin instead of Adrenaline

Yikes XD

That would also solve the problem, just not the right way

5:56 PM

@Tinkeringbell yep. That is precisely why I am extremely wary of a system that is underselling the safety of a vaccine and pretending that its side effect are not related.

I am the first to claim that the vaccine is important right now, but it has to be handles seriously and with proper training on how to react to issues that may arrise

The constant "yes-nope-yes but over 60-yes but UNDER 60-nope-yes for all" switching made people extremely suspicious and the name change added to the mix

(NOTE before someone nitpicks - I know that it was not a name change but only a name registration and that Astrazenca is just the brand. Yet... no one calls Pfizer with its real name Tozinameran, so why should Astra be the exception???)

so, @Tinkeringbell now my country gets about a 15% / day of people that were in list for vaccination and refuse to get Astrazeneca out of fear.

And government react with a big F....... Now, if you refuse the vaccine you are black listed and can't be vaccinated until everyone else is... so... by the current growth rate... that should be about 2025.....

Yet wonder what, politicians are vaccinated with Pfitzer because they are in the same list as medical staff and get the better protections vaccines.

meh

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