Tavern on the Meta

1:51 AM

@Tinkeringbell I wouldn't exactly want to season physical things with electronics

@JourneymanGeek I agree with the trickling edits (I had only edited two questions and was planning to only edit two at a time), but I don't think we needed an explicit request in this case. The tag had already been clearly defined in its wiki to refer to the 5-minute editing grace period, but people were misusing it for the bounty grace period, and another tag already existed for that concept.

tl;dr: it wasn't a burnination, but a retag, so a burninate request would be improper :)

Journeyman Geek

2:04 AM

@SonictheK-DayHedgehog we always need a explicit request :D

also... burnination permit is funnier ._.

the reasoning is that we don't really want people, even mods, unilaterally deciding a tag is not ok, or needs to be

we want a paper trail, metaphorically speaking, we can point at for the reasoning, and objections, or lackthereof, including a reasonable but not onerous waiting period

Pandya

@JourneymanGeek need to lock meta.stackexchange.com/posts/355809/revisions or ban OP

Journeyman Geek

@Pandya next time, flags are good :D

Its settled

Pandya

Ok. Thanks

Journeyman Geek

4:43 AM

That looks almost like someone trying to use meta as a pastebin ._.

Feeds

stackoverflow.blog/2020/10/27/…

Sonic the K-Day Hedgehog

5:14 AM

@Feeds Huh, seems like Nicolas Chabanovsky's IP address was blocked on SO before being hired as an employee

By the way, it's finally winter in San Diego after what appeared to be an eternal summer

Journeyman Geek

Apparently from that podcast, I should be emailing Prasanth every week until they hire me, or send me a restraining order. Gotcha.

Luuklag

@JourneymanGeek well it were only 10, that still leaves 40 other questions at the front page. Seeing the current activity thats still about 2 days of regular questions present.

Journeyman Geek

5:49 AM

Lol. I once spent 6 months trickling edits on a tag 😁

I did like 8 edits a day on SU spread over 4 hours

Meta Andrew T.

@Feeds imagining a localized site "Stack Overflow in Chinese", but blocked in China...

Sonic the K-Day Hedgehog

6:27 AM

@MetaAndrewT. Intended for Hong Kong/Macau/Taiwan users and overseas users

The SARs of China don't have internet censorship...yet

Journeyman Geek

@SonictheK-DayHedgehog I think he's thinking about the irony

Sonic the K-Day Hedgehog

I thought so too

rene

I find this comment from Adam extremely funny: meta.stackexchange.com/questions/355805/…

That is a good start of my day.

Sonic the K-Day Hedgehog

By the way, let me define "winter in San Diego": the days become colder, with literally no other change in anything else (rain/snow/precipitation, humidity, etc.) Only in most years it's a gradual transition. However, this year, it was a sudden transition, with yesterday becoming suddenly cold and sustaining today, with the previous week being as hot as summer.

@JourneymanGeek Based on your proximity to the Equator, I assume that's how winters are like in Singapore too

Sonic the K-Day Hedgehog

7:28 AM

Just two days ago we were running the air conditioner. Today, though, we're running the furnace.

!!/watch looglebiz\.com

SmokeDetector

@SonictheK-DayHedgehog You don't have blacklist manager privileges, but I've created PR#5092 for you.

Sonic the K-Day Hedgehog

@JNat Cross-site spammer: stackexchange.com/users/19799361/bloglooglebiz

rene

sdc approve 5092

Sonic the K-Day Hedgehog

7:45 AM

Huh, was wondering why it didn't alert me to it here

Knight

Just want to confirm, is my recent question really deleted?

Tinkeringbell

Yes.

Knight

Was it flagged or you people were online by yourselves?

By the way, thanks for confirmation

Tinkeringbell

Does it matter?

Knight

Yeah

Tinkeringbell

7:49 AM

I understand people are upset moderators are having their diamonds revoked for not accepting the new agreement, but those moderators weren't 'fired' and they knew the consequences of their actions.

Knight

Yeah

Can I ask one more question?

Tinkeringbell

sure :)

Knight

Why discussion of that topic is prohibited by those who agree to the new agreements?

Tinkeringbell

just a sec, work call

Sonic the K-Day Hedgehog

@Knight If I may add, another thing about the new moderator agreement:

@AndrewLeach The relationship between SE and moderators has always been "do what we tell you; if you don't, you may not be a moderator." Moderators have been and always will be "at will", even more than employees. What the new moderator agreement did in that regard was A) make it more clear that was so; B) make it clearer what moderators could not be dismissed for; and C) made it such that any such requirements have to be public, rather than previously permitted private requirements. Overall, the new mod agreement is much better for moderators. It's only the perception that's worse. — Makyen Oct 18 at 1:24

Also, the previous agreement forbade discussion of private info to anyone, so one could theoretically be removed simply for discussing private info with other mods. The new agreement removes that hole.

Finally, at least one mod who resigned over the new agreement stated that they did so not because they disagreed with some provision written in it, but because they disagreed that they had to sign a new agreement (regardless of what provisions it actually contained).

Knight

8:00 AM

@SonictheK-DayHedgehog huh? Just because they have to sign once again?

Sonic the K-Day Hedgehog

@Knight Quoting from their resignation "letter":

> I can't see how a new agreement on my part is going to improve SE's performance, therefore I will not be accepting it.

John Dvorak

even then those who resigned over what was written in it serve a more interesting data point than those who resigned just because there's a new one, don't they.

Knight

@SonictheK-DayHedgehog Well, a lot of different interpretations can be made on that. But let’s not discuss it. Tell me, how are you?

Journeyman Geek

@Knight uh, I read your post, and it seems... overwrought.

Knight

@JourneymanGeek you read it? Overwrought, how?

Journeyman Geek

8:05 AM

At the end of the day, being a moderator is both voluntary and there's some responsibilities attached.

Basically - we have a new mod agreement, that while not perfect addresses many of the changes that have occured in the decade or so since the last one

Agreeing to the mod agreement is and always has been a precondition of moderating.

John Dvorak

and yet it causes mods to leave - and we don't want mods to leave

Journeyman Geek

Its not a situation where someone was uncermoniously dumped for wrongdoing

John Dvorak

true

Journeyman Geek

@JohnDvorak eh, lots of other contributing factors that I feel are more important

Knight

Can a mod be removed for not signing an agreement? Yes. But can a mod be removed for asking my private part’s size?

Journeyman Geek

8:07 AM

Also yes

Knight

Then let me paste it here.

Journeyman Geek

you should probably escalate that via contact us, with evidence

and let the CMs handle it though

This isn't really the place for it

Knight

in English Language & Usage: Multi-Layered Discourse Room on The Stack Exchange Network Chat, 11 hours ago, by RegDwigнt

@Knight I'm curious, how could you believe something that stupid?

Journeyman Geek

Well, how could you?

Knight

I experienced it.

It works fine.

Journeyman Geek

8:09 AM

and in context, it was a poor joke but hardly harassment

If someone did ask an impertinant question with "i'm curious..."

I'd invoke vegas rules here. What happens there stays there. If you have an issue with a mod please escalate it via the contact us link

Knight

@JourneymanGeek okay, but you hardly reply.

Sonic the K-Day Hedgehog

There's an explicit option in the contact form for reporting Code of Conduct violations

Journeyman Geek

I'm curious to why you're want to drag an issue across chat servers, but not that curious.

and full context is important.

I'm curious why you're not mention that you started with

in English Language & Usage: Multi-Layered Discourse Room on The Stack Exchange Network Chat, 17 hours ago, by Knight

Today I learned, writing "I'm curious" before a personal question makes it polite :)

Knight

I said it to Cowper

Journeyman Geek

I mean, its entirely useful context in deciding what's happening

Knight

8:11 AM

Because I asked him a personal question “how did you know that word?”

Journeyman Geek

and I'm also curious to how you'd not expect something said in a public chatroom to have people respond.

Knight

I’m curious, why other public forums don’t respond explicitly?

Even here every one is formal

Journeyman Geek

well, often we just tend to act like that. Its quite lovely and civil.

and its a chatroom, its explicitly designed to be our one social space

Knight

In a nutshell, whatever Reg said was quite nice and should be encouraged.

Journeyman Geek

more that you may not want to drag that issue in here, and address him, directly and let him know you found that part of it offensive.

Or if you felt harassed, well, yeah

but none of this has to do with mods quitting

Knight

8:17 AM

Answer this one and I will leave

24 mins ago, by Knight

Why discussion of that topic is prohibited by those who agree to the new agreements?

Journeyman Geek

There is no prohibition

However, tone is pretty important

49

Q: The new moderator agreement is now live for moderators to accept across the network

Today, we’re announcing that the new moderator agreement is live and the existing moderators are being asked to accept it. This has been a great collaboration to get from a draft in November 2019 to the final agreement in July 2020. It’s gone through several phases of review internally, including...

you will find much discussion

If you have issues with SPECIFIC ASPECTS of the mod agreement, while its late, you could bring it up, as a mod or otherwise

Knight

@JourneymanGeek yeah, I got that.

It’s nice line. “Tone is important”

Journeyman Geek

@JohnDvorak in addition to the elephant in the room, lets see...

SE's generally cut network support to the bone over time. They've repeated mistakes they made before. Some mods don't feel safe, and quit....

4

a few feel burnt out, or loose interest or...

I know a few ragequit to codidact and that's fine, other than ragequitting.

all this, well, can be fixed

but its no one thing, and unless you have a specific beef with some part of the agreement, it is almost never just the new mod agreement.

also, SE has a lot of work to do to do right by their volunteers. Its easy to curse the dark - and just rage rage against the night. But sometimes, its good to shine a light, and understand the whole situation

Tinkeringbell

8:34 AM

@Knight Discussion implies there's something to discuss. If you have questions about the new agreement or something that's fine, but if you just want to rant that you find it unfair someone else didn't agree and faced the well-known consequences, that's not a discussion.