Tavern on the Meta

2:14 AM

@JourneymanGeek one of co-workers actually has that type of pup and his wife brought it into work today - so freaking adorable

Journeyman Geek

2:25 AM

@LinkBerest ya but super rare

LinkBerest

that's why it was so awesome to get to pet one today :)

and all because I mentioned having a chat about terriers the night before (last night)

202324

5:42 AM

!!/coffee

SmokeDetector

@202324 brews a cup of Macchiato for @202324

Magisch

6:22 AM

morning

Journeyman Geek

@LinkBerest soft or rough fur? 😀

BelovedFool

@Magisch @JourneymanGeek You around? This need flagging

Magisch

@LinkBerest Our office has a havanese dog in it, a coworker adopted him and brings him to work regularly to socialize him since his previous owners didn't look after him much and yelled at him a lot

Journeyman Geek

@BelovedFool not really. Will take a look when I can :/

BelovedFool

:/ Thanks anyway

Magisch

6:26 AM

@BelovedFool I put one on it

will be some time until someone gets to it though

Journeyman Geek

So sorry. Having a dumpster fire at work

BelovedFool

@Magisch Yeah, I know :/ I was hoping that we could remove it before the person it's addressed to read it

@JourneymanGeek Arf, those are never fun...

I guess that, at least, you are paid to handle them, though

Magisch

@BelovedFool :/

Journeyman Geek

Its not too bad. But after the way this week has been, I think I am reverting to a few bad habit :/

Magisch

the notification is still there and shows a preview of the comment, even if it's gotten rid of

user351483

6:29 AM

!!/tea @JourneymanGeek

Journeyman Geek

(I've had fizzy drinks all three days I worked this week)

BelovedFool

@Magisch Yeah, but it's the last sentence who bugs me the most, so this won't be visible

Journeyman Geek

Stuff isn't really good for me

BelovedFool

@JourneymanGeek :/ Sending love to your way <3

@JourneymanGeek Also, have some cute dogs:

Journeyman Geek

At least I got a full night's sleep

@BelovedFool hah. I lack sleep cause my geriatric terrier is too proud to go in paper ;p

BelovedFool

6:33 AM

@JourneymanGeek So, not a good idea to post dogs picture? ^^'

user310756

@BelovedFool that kind of attack needs to stop.

user310756

@Tinkeringbell are you back in the trenches?

Journeyman Geek

@BelovedFool naw he is fine 😄

user310756

@JourneymanGeek would you consider stepping back up to moderate mse?

BelovedFool

@YvetteColomb Yeah, and the upvotes makes me sick :/

user351483

6:35 AM

@JourneymanGeek Yeah. Our Labrador has had an upset stomach over last weekend. The mess stank like hell, but I cleaned it all up with love. It's rough when things like this happen, you only want your pets to be happy and healthy.

user310756

@BelovedFool someone needs to start warning and suspending people

BelovedFool

@YvetteColomb You are preaching an already convinced ^^

@YvetteColomb But yeah, I don't wonder how many more "rude" flags it will take to actually kick out all those "not nice" people

user351483

MSE is a wold of hurt and stress. JMG needs and deserves a break, not more of it.

user310756

@Snow it was a question to JMG - he can always say no.

Cerbrus

Iirc, comment flags don't have any permanent effect on the affected accounts, do they?

user310756

6:39 AM

@BelovedFool is Tinkeringbell back?

Journeyman Geek

@YvetteColomb eh. I'm open to coming back if needed.

user351483

@YvetteColomb I just care for my friend.

user310756

too many helpful rude /unkind comment flags raises an auto flag, but it requires a moderator to action it

BelovedFool

@YvetteColomb I don't want to talk for her

Also, the comment is gone \o/

Journeyman Geek

I've asked but I am neither pressing for not do I want anyone to press for an answer

Magisch

6:40 AM

@JourneymanGeek Thats terrierble

user310756

@Snow ofc! and so do I. It's an unhappy situation for all concerned, that's for sure :(

Journeyman Geek

I can do nearly enough good as a plebian as a patrician 😄

user310756

@JourneymanGeek You asked the Team to return you mean?

Journeyman Geek

Yup

user310756

I asked also fwiw

user310756

6:41 AM

they said to wait until they've rolled out the new mod reinstatement process

user310756

we can use a contact form and ask that way

user310756

CMs will review it and say yay or nay

user351483

@JourneymanGeek you'll need to ping @Catija about this. It should only take two CMs to reinstate a mod.

user310756

I think the lack of response is being snowed under

Journeyman Geek

At the same time I realize it's messy and really should give the community team their space

user351483

6:42 AM

The resquest might have been buried somewhere.

user310756

@JourneymanGeek ikr! it's hard. I've been emailing Tim and feel dreadful guilt. But I've been honestly offering to take some of the load.

user310756

@Snow yep. That's what I reckon is happening all over the place - and then people feel hurt for not hearing back when it's really not personal this time

Journeyman Geek

@YvetteColomb well true but I mostly don't want to add to the stress

user351483

Too many emails of good intent can also end up being a bad thing...

user310756

fwiw @JourneymanGeek I'd like to see you back.

user351483

6:43 AM

And I imagine the team have a TON of emails to process.

user310756

@Snow ofc

user310756

@JourneymanGeek the site really needs to be cleaned up with a strict hand. What do you think?

user310756

@BelovedFool ?

Journeyman Geek

@YvetteColomb not really strict

Its not just about beating up the bad guys

Its also about giving folks something they can trust

Cerbrus

Set a good example, be consistent in moderation, be strict but fair...

In other words, not a "crusade"

Journeyman Geek

6:45 AM

^

The hard parts about things like this is folks who have bad intent want an overreaction

user310756

@JourneymanGeek not really strict, just clear message of what is allowed and what is not. Like this chat room has been managed

user310756

@JourneymanGeek oh there's plenty of stirrers enjoying this - for sure

Journeyman Geek

@YvetteColomb I've done a terrible job on that. Its mostly been mags and rene

BelovedFool

@YvetteColomb I'm definitively not against that. I would love is the policy on MSE was as strict as it is on IPS (interpersonnal skills). On IPS, arguing on comment is strickly forbiden. Comments are only for asking clarification or suggest improvement. If you disagree with an answer, you write your own and that's it (and answers are also very strickly moderated)

Journeyman Geek

they've been great

@BelovedFool informally there is

user310756

6:47 AM

the humiliating thing is - we look like idiots to the outside world. You know what I mean?

Journeyman Geek

Especially on announcements

Magisch

ideally a mod convinces the bad guys its not worth it and drags people with good intentions and bad actions back to not making bad actions

Journeyman Geek

@YvetteColomb We didn't set the fire ;)

user310756

@BelovedFool yeh that's a good idea

Cerbrus

@BelovedFool That seems a little too... "totalitarian" to me.

Magisch

6:47 AM

@BelovedFool MSE is different from that. MSE has lots of discussion

Journeyman Geek

@Magisch honestly? The trick is to make the good folks feel safe

Cerbrus

Meta sites are basically discussion central.

Journeyman Geek

and the bad guys bored.

they'll move on to the next place

Cerbrus

The tag [discussion] exists there for a reason

BelovedFool

@Cerbrus That's how you create a safe space. But I understand how/why people could scream at this idea ^^

Magisch

6:48 AM

its a discussion platform, not really a normal SE site. Of course people are going to discuss in comments. Usually this works out semi-fine but if the volume is increased tenfold as is right now that ceases to work

Journeyman Geek

THe terrible thing is after a while you see trouble everywhere

Cerbrus

@BelovedFool Safe for who?

Journeyman Geek

@Magisch the sheer volume is the problem

BelovedFool

@Cerbrus For everyone

user310756

@JourneymanGeek oh it's the users who are burning the place down. People can disagree, but people still need to be held accountable for the pile on. There's only so much pointing the finger at the network that can excuse or justify the mess that is on the site tbh

Journeyman Geek

6:49 AM

@YvetteColomb uhm. I disagree

Cerbrus

@BelovedFool I don't agree

BelovedFool

@Cerbrus I know

Magisch

tbh I partly stopped participating on IPS because I haven't the faintest clue how I can participate there atm with all the rules for answers and comments

Cerbrus

@YvetteColomb SE staff had a big hand in this mess...

Journeyman Geek

@YvetteColomb most of these users weren't active a few months ago

user310756

6:49 AM

@JourneymanGeek that 100 times that! It should be part of the CoC

Magisch

I could probably learn them again but i don't have the energy for it

user310756

@JourneymanGeek ofc you do, most of the active meta userbase diagrees :)

Journeyman Geek

@YvetteColomb I don't really believe in COCs

Cerbrus

@YvetteColomb "make the good folks feel safe"? How do you make a rule out of that?

Journeyman Geek

they're feel good garbage that is written by well meaning folks.

BelovedFool

6:50 AM

@Magisch The trick is: "do not comment" and "backup (with personal experience or external sources) everything you say"

Journeyman Geek

You build culture by setting an example

2

user310756

agree, but in a site so big - it needs to be in black and white

Cerbrus

Nope

user310756

it's hard managing a site so nbig

Cerbrus

Gray area is how a community thrives

Black & white is basically how coorporate management works. You're either with us, or against us.

No, I disagree

So you're against us

user310756

6:52 AM

black and white - as in ink on paper

Cerbrus

Ooow

That's something different xD

Magisch

you can't go with extremes either way if you have a really diverse community (as we do)

user310756

@BelovedFool part of the problem is pile on.

Magisch

there are people from so many different cultures here the standards of polite discourse are in part completly incompatible so a middle ground has to be created somewhere.

user310756

@Magisch it's impossible to keep everyone happy, even in a smaller more collected group - let alone a global site like this

Cerbrus

6:53 AM

In that regard, I think the more rules you write, the more opportunity you're creating for loopholes. It's really simple. "Be nice", and trust moderators to enforce that.

@YvetteColomb That's something I can agree on

Journeyman Geek

@YvetteColomb that's kinda got us in this mess

BelovedFool

@YvetteColomb That's why we delete answers who basically say the same thing. It had been said one, no need to said it more, just use your upvote

user310756

@Cerbrus feints lol

Journeyman Geek

Consider Jeff's first rule

"Don't be a dick"

user310756

@BelovedFool agree

Journeyman Geek

6:54 AM

That became be nice.

Cerbrus

@JourneymanGeek Kinda sexist, if you ask me ;-)

Journeyman Geek

Jeff could hardly be accused of subtility ;p

user310756

hehe no he couldn't

user310756

I like Jeff - he's authentic

user310756

what you see is what you get type of authentic

Magisch

6:55 AM

jeff's primary advantage was he never came across as corporate in any way

user310756

exactly!

Magisch

it seemed as if jeff was one of us who coincidentally happened to run the site

Cerbrus

It's just... The more you tell people how to write, the less free people feel to express (valid?) concerns in fear of being reprimanded for writing it the wring way.

Magisch

so we overlooked a lot of imperfections

user310756

I have to do some work. I'll pop in later. good to chat folks

BelovedFool

6:59 AM

@YvetteColomb See you :)

rene

→ 57 messages moved to Chimney

Cerbrus

Hm, if I were to say: "See you later, guys!", would that still be okay? The new CoC doesn't really mention a case like that

Magisch

sure why not

Cerbrus

guys -> guy -> male

Magisch

you're not mandated to always be gender neutral, it's just encouraged

you can even without going against the coc use default he for everyone, but the CMs would rather you didn't

BelovedFool

7:02 AM

@Cerbrus I personally don't really like it. It as if you were saying goodbye to everyone but me, but I understand people use it in a gender neutral way (even if it isn't). So, I prefer "folks" more

Cerbrus

Just to be clear, I'm not trying to troll, it's just that it's confusing

Magisch

the only actual mandate is when corrected follow that for the time being

StephanS

@Magisch I don't think you can call it encouraged if there's consequences for not doing it

Magisch

there isn't

read the FAQ again. The only thing there's consequences for is continuing to not respect pronouns after someone asked you to directly

Cerbrus

@BelovedFool But what if I were to tell you that that greeting applied to -everyone- in the room? That I truly don't care what someone is / identifies as? Could you accept that I have no ill intentions when using that sentence?

Not to single you out, but it helps to get an opinion

BelovedFool

7:06 AM

@Cerbrus A part of my brain could, but my feeling wouldn't. So I would still feel like you are saying goodbye to everyone but me, even if I know it's not your intent

Cerbrus

Ooh, I hadn't really thought about it that way yet

Knowing and feeling are separate things...

BelovedFool

Glad I could help you realize that :)

Cerbrus

Well shit, now I have to reconsider all my opinions

BelovedFool

Haha x)

Magisch

Better then being stuck holding them forever :)

Cerbrus

7:08 AM

The funny thing is, that line clicked with me because I know what that's like...

I've had a period where I'd consistently fall off a specific horse at a specific type of hurdle, when jumping. One time, I nearly poked my eye out with a steel beam...

Suffice to say, I was shitting bricks when going for that type of hurdle, every time...

StephanS

@Magisch I read through it again, if you look at Q5 it says it starts with a warning, I think a warning is still a consequence since it's an av into more severe repercussions

Cerbrus

While I knew the horse and I could do it... You still doubt yourself

BelovedFool

@Cerbrus That's very understandable

I have anxiety issues. So, I really often feel stuff that are definitively false (no, you won't die by just coming out of your apartment)

Cerbrus

@BelovedFool are you at those moments aware that those feelings are (possibly) related to the anxiety issues?

BelovedFool

@Cerbrus Most of the time, I'm definitively aware. Some times, I also have anxiety and have no idea what I'm afraid of

Cerbrus

7:14 AM

That must be frustrating as hell

BelovedFool

Yeah, thankfully taking medication helps a lot

Cerbrus

Good :-)

user310756

yep understanding something on an intellectual level is different from the emotional reactions we may get. I can understand on an intellectual level why people get upset with some of my posts and comments. I can see why they're upset and feel like I'm dismissing them or dictating to them. At the same time I feel hurt at times by the things people say, even though I know they are also defending the site for similar reasons to me. We have different perspectives. 1/2

Cerbrus

Mental issues are weird... And imo hard to relate to

user310756

So having the logic is one thing, also having the basic emotional need to belong socially is another. We all have the basic animal need to belong and be a part of the community. Our primitive brains require this to survive. So when people are met with a load of downvotes or comments disagreeing - a part of the brain can go "boing" "I'm being shut out of the group. I'm vulnerable. a sabre tooth tiger is gonna eat me. help" That's what we're struggling with. 2/2

BelovedFool

7:17 AM

@Cerbrus Definitively true. I would have no idea what it's actually is to have depression or anxiety if I didn't have those both. I would think of them as just "feeling low" or "being a little stressed" (I use to think that, I was definitively wrong)

user310756

and one more bit :)

Cerbrus

@YvetteColomb "We all have the basic animal need to belong and be a part of the community." Some people more than others though.

user310756

so while we have big fat frontal lobes that we can use to reason, we all have emotional baggage - it's impossible not to. We all have pasts. We all have different cultures. we are taught that being professional is being "unemotional and all logic" But we are still animals with base emotions, instincts and needs and these need to be acknowledged on some level so we can then use our frontal lobes - otherwise we're left dealing with the emotions. Obviously it's more complex than 3 chat comments

Cerbrus

@YvetteColomb we are taught that being professional is being "unemotional and all logic" That differs a lot per culture

user310756

@Cerbrus yes and know. It's still deep down in every person's primitive self. It's just people don't always acknowledge it and it's more obvious when it's threatened. So by taking unpopular stances for eg puts an individual at odds with the wider community and threatens that position more. Taking a popular stance reinforces that belonging. So the underlying primitive need - being met - is not as obvious.

user310756

7:22 AM

@Cerbrus ofc - it's hard to provide a summary in 3 comments, it's an idea

user310756

yeh some cultures if you don't use please thank you and salutations you're rude

BelovedFool

@Cerbrus Oh, do you know a culture where it's not the case? I know the level of "unemotional" vary, but I always thought that every culture had this idea

user310756

others it's like - you're wasting my time and being insincere

Journeyman Geek

ah damnit. I missed a good chunk of an interesting conversation ;p

Cerbrus

@BelovedFool Well, in my experience, in Dutch culture, some level of emotion is fine if you are very excited or absolutely hate an idea

user310756

7:24 AM

so it's really difficult to navigate - cultural differences , religious differences, gender differences, position within the family, the actual family culture, disabilities, emotional issues, past trauma the list is endless

Cerbrus

As long as you back it up with some facts

Journeyman Geek

@YvetteColomb so, at the risk of ... very broad generalisations

Cerbrus

@BelovedFool So, we basically agree there.

user310756

@JourneymanGeek well ofc - it's impossible to discuss without some generalisations

user310756

The things I like about the "Dutch" (generalisation) is they are direct - but at times it can feel brutal lmao!

Journeyman Geek

7:25 AM

the 'western' - well I suppose anglo saxon, and even french way of dealing with conflict, and the chinese way or indian way of dealing with conflict can be very different

Cerbrus

@YvetteColomb It's a blessing and a curse

BelovedFool

@Cerbrus Oh yeah, I live in France and I was once schooled for not showing enough emotion... (I'm on the autism spectrum, displaying correctly my emotion isn't really my strong suit)

Cerbrus

We don't trust people who sugarcoat what they're trying to say.

Journeyman Geek

@Cerbrus I don't sugar coat stuff

Magisch

dutch culture is a bit like german culture except more direct

user310756

7:26 AM

I worked with a Dutch girl, she'd married an Aussie guy with Dutch parents. She was so blunt to a point she was considered rude. I knew her welll enough to talk to her about it and she said - "yeh my husband tells me the same thing"

Cerbrus

@Magisch German culture is way more strict in hierarchy

Magisch

that is changing

Journeyman Geek

but since my community is tiny and knows everyone else, we tend to consider what we say. Also the drama can get brutal.

user310756

@JourneymanGeek yep please elaborate - this is interesting

Magisch

or rather has changed for the younger generation

user310756

7:27 AM

@Cerbrus interestingly I was born more into a culture like that - which is why I'm a bit agist - expect the youth to respect the elders.

Journeyman Geek

@YvetteColomb for chinese - generally there's a concept of giving and showing face

Magisch

our elders would like to say we no longer respect any authority but it's mostly manifested in preference for flat leadership structures

Journeyman Geek

Mutual respect is really important

Cerbrus

The funny thing, calling a Dutch person rude for their directness can be considered as very offensive

BelovedFool

@JourneymanGeek I once saw a graphic about that, it was very interesting but I really don't think I will be able to find it back again

user310756

7:27 AM

@JourneymanGeek what do you mean by giving and showing face?

Journeyman Geek

Ah

Cerbrus

We're proud of how "to the point" we are

Magisch

I personally found you get along best with everybody with a bit of code switching

Journeyman Geek

You don't make the other person embarassed

Cerbrus

@YvetteColomb Never argue in public, always smile,

user310756

7:28 AM

@Cerbrus no wonder we've been clashing. Wow. This is good to know. I've been offending you

Journeyman Geek

or feel like they are put down

at any close

Cerbrus

@YvetteColomb No shit

Journeyman Geek

THink of it as full contact politelness

At the razor's edge of conflict

user310756

@Cerbrus lol I didn't know what I was doing that was the biggest cause of upset - aside from complaining ofc

Journeyman Geek

Not all chinese are like that though

Cerbrus

7:29 AM

@YvetteColomb There are other aspects as well, but let's not get into that.

Journeyman Geek

and practically they can be informal, and rude too ;p

Magisch

I feel dealing with american culture is hardest for me

Journeyman Geek

My own culture is... well

user310756

@JourneymanGeek so even in an extremely heated scene the people will be super polite? Nod, acknowledge each other etc?

Magisch

I'm utterly incapable of sounding bubbly and happy in person

user310756

7:29 AM

@Cerbrus one aspect per day is good

Cerbrus

@Magisch They feel so fake...

Journeyman Geek

@YvetteColomb it never gets heated

user310756

digestible

user310756

@JourneymanGeek yep! I get it

user310756

@Magisch oh I relate best to theUS and British cultures - our culture was based on those

Magisch

7:30 AM

I can do professional, I can do direct, I can do reserved/respectful, I can't really do happy when I'm not

user310756

@JourneymanGeek ok so now for anglo saxon, french and Indian please

Journeyman Geek

Indian - well I'm speaking for my own

user310756

so if you get emotional with a Chinese person (disclaimer generalistaion) it's like causing a scene and really bad

Journeyman Geek

We're a tiny community where everyone knows eash other

Cerbrus

@YvetteColomb In public, yea

Journeyman Geek

7:32 AM

and we're a mix of nice people and complete sociopaths

Cerbrus

In private... dunno

Magisch

from the few times I had direct interaction with chinese people that seems to be generally correct

even in an open confrontation the worst you'll see is staring daggers while still being unflinchingly polite

user310756

hm it's interesting

Journeyman Geek

Te term we use is "We slip needles in bananas". We're subtle to a fault, and sometimes a little confusingly wierd.

Cerbrus

@YvetteColomb en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Face_(sociological_concept)

Journeyman Geek

7:32 AM

The nice ones are super nice. THe bad ones are bad

user310756

@Magisch is sarcasm allowed?

Magisch

I wouldn't have dared

user310756

@JourneymanGeek so it's hard to get to the heart of the issue? there's a lot of niceness icing around the cake of the problem

Journeyman Geek

@YvetteColomb well yes

we have layers

Also we're small and insular and sometimes oblivious

we never make a scene thoughh

Cerbrus

Just how rude must the Dutch then seem, as we basically discarded all our layers to reveal the perfectly imperfect core... :P

Journeyman Geek

7:35 AM

(we will totally arrange for you to have an accident however)

user310756

@JourneymanGeek hm

Magisch

I really like dutch people because there's usually no extra effort I have to put in to understand social cues

user310756

scenes are not uncommon here - within limits though

Journeyman Geek

@YvetteColomb ah, but see

Americans can be confrontational

as can the french

Magisch

if you're being annoying they'll tell you directly

Tinkeringbell

7:36 AM

@Magisch Yay! :D

@Magisch And that get's people in trouble a lot ;)

user310756

@JourneymanGeek yeh so are we - but there's got to be disclaimers to them- like parameters

user310756

@Tinkeringbell are you actively moderating? we heard you were on a break

Journeyman Geek

@YvetteColomb and the whole grand guestures and shock and awe thing?

Magisch

Specifically because I have to put in substantial emotional energy to understand social cues usually, via trial and error, because I have no intuition about them at all

Cerbrus

@Tinkeringbell Oi, nederlander :D

user310756

7:38 AM

@JourneymanGeek your community likes that? So the romantic display or gift of generosity or as a host

Tinkeringbell

@Cerbrus Môgge!

Journeyman Geek

@YvetteColomb we don't do that

BelovedFool

@YvetteColomb Sshhh, don't shy the parrot away :p

user310756

@JourneymanGeek "and the whole grand guestures and shock and awe thing" what are you refering to there?

Journeyman Geek

@YvetteColomb oh in terms of how americans do things ;p

it seems

(YES I AM GROSSLY GENERALISING!)

user310756

7:39 AM

@BelovedFool I want to know if the parrot is moderating and the parrot needs to answer me - as anyone else asking

user310756

@JourneymanGeek ofc - but there's also truths in these.

Journeyman Geek

@YvetteColomb eh, she dosen't need to answer anyone

@YvetteColomb its not about what its said, its about how its said

and how long a game you play

Magisch

my social mannerisms probably come across as quite stilted which is because my actual thought process is way too direct and incongrous to be just spelled out

user310756

@JourneymanGeek in American culture?

Journeyman Geek

@YvetteColomb yup

and sometimes people seem so... impatient ;p

user310756

7:40 AM

that's a good observation

BelovedFool

I just found this about conflict and cultural differences : twitter.com/barakkassar/status/730352778141302784/photo/…

user310756

same over here. People pull rank on experience

Journeyman Geek

ah

I can't do that on SE. I'm surrounded by smarter and braver people

and there's that too

Cerbrus

I've had one guy telling me he's been building CMS-es for 20 years so he knows best how the UI should work.

Journeyman Geek

most Indians put a lot of store on uhm

user310756

7:41 AM

@BelovedFool that's fantastic

Journeyman Geek

what you studied, where you work...

Cerbrus

Meanwhile, he's a back-ender and doesn't know TypeScript or LESS...

Journeyman Geek

I don't but I'm a disgrace :D

I BRING DISHONOUR UPON MY COW. maybe THE COW.

user310756

I found this and it's very interesting and highlights how damaging it is to ignore people.

user310756

82

Q: Dealing with somebody who's ignoring my very existence

Background I have a group of friends, and we've known each other for about 7 years now. We once all were colleagues. One of these friends, Alice, has an autism spectrum disorder. This friend got fired from our workplace. During the period when she was in between jobs and had limited money availa...

Cerbrus

7:43 AM

In programming, the first 3/4th of your experience is only relevant for processes, not for implementations :P

BelovedFool

@YvetteColomb That also explains why most people of the network find me rude ^^' (but I'm working on that, it's not for nothing that my favorite site is "interpersonal skills")

user310756

@BelovedFool yep

Journeyman Geek

@YvetteColomb on the other had, eh.

Magisch

@YvetteColomb Thats one of my personal weaknesses

user310756

@Magisch what is?

user310756

7:43 AM

@JourneymanGeek que?

Magisch

I low key absolutely hate being ignored. It makes me way sadder and madder then it should

Journeyman Geek

MSE's kind of a stressful thing now

user310756

same

Journeyman Geek

Its worth respecting folks space

(cause that literally looks like you're calling out tink, and that's not really fair to her)

Magisch

I have to keep telling myself it's unintentional most of the time and to keep calm but it does a number on my anxiety

Journeyman Geek

7:45 AM

@Magisch I'm used to being invisible.

StephanS

@Cerbrus I get so stuck up on UI I try the KISS method to design but it's always ugly to me

user310756

I'm actually saying I hate being ignored, particularly when it's by someone I need to communicate with. It's destructive and in it's own way pushes me out of the room and off the site. There's only two mods on the site and this is the first time I've seen one in here for a long while. So being ignored by that mod is not ok

user310756

it's not like ignoring @Shadow.. :D

Journeyman Geek

@YvetteColomb you also have a bit of a history with her - so... eh, leave her alone please

She totally has the right to come here , and well hang out without getting pestered about actual work that she might not be ready to handle yet

BelovedFool

Alright, I need to go. You people are way too distracting :p

Cerbrus

7:48 AM

Oh look! A plane!

user310756

11 mins ago, by Yvette Colomb

@Tinkeringbell are you actively moderating? we heard you were on a break

user310756

that is a reasonable question.

user310756

yeh I g2g too

Cerbrus

Maybe she wants to decide when she talks about that.

Journeyman Geek

Yup. I totally have to insist on giving MSE mods some space

user58

7:51 AM

!!/tea

SmokeDetector

@user58 brews a cup of chamomile tea for @user58

user58

*sips tea* ....looks like another day of tea and rice cakes for me, whee.

Cerbrus

user310756

@JourneymanGeek erm the only exception I have with that - is everyone is entitled to the same respect and space. The lack of moderation of the site is causing people to be piled on and people are not respecting their space. And all hell breaks out when I've asked for my space - both on the site and in chat. So there needs to be some honest two way respect there.

user58

Oh, and toast. Mustn't forget the toast.

user310756

7:52 AM

also you keep answering for another person.

StephanS

chamomile tea, bleh, Yorkshire tea gold is where it's at

Cerbrus

@YvetteColomb Maybe that other person doesn't want to have that discussion...

Journeyman Geek

I might not have completely made myself clear ._.

user58

I've actually been sticking with lemon ginger for the most part.

StephanS

oh lemon ginger is good

Cerbrus

7:53 AM

Oh, back to the tea puns. This is the perfect opportuni-tea

StephanS

so is chai with heavy cream and honey

user58

Oh, no. Last time was tearable.

Cerbrus

@Trasiva ^ I'm learning, sensei

user310756

is this comment ok

user310756

Now that's nice. All our comments were removed and people are already drawing conclusions without context. Of course, Yvette (who was there and remembers the deleted comments) gets to spin that her way, with only Robert left here as the voice of reason. What a mess. — Frédéric Hamidi 10 hours ago

user310756

7:54 AM

also why was I banned?

user58

@StephanS Anything dairy is still off-limits, unfortunately. On the mend, but.... oof.

user310756

@user58 why was I just banned from the room?

user58

@YvetteColomb Seems NC.

user310756

@user58 NC?

Journeyman Geek

@YvetteColomb you were kicked - and I really must insist you drop the topic

Cerbrus

7:55 AM

2 mins ago, by Journeyman Geek

I might not have completely made myself clear ._.

StephanS

you don't do dairy?

user58

@YvetteColomb Probably for not dropping a topic that it had been made clear to you that should be dropped.

@StephanS I've had a stomach bug for half a week by now, I'm trying to avoid eating stuff that'll make it worse.

@YvetteColomb Not Constructive

SPArchaeologist-様

morning. Dropping in for a quick question. As anyone here tried to use the Azure Bastion service yet?

user310756

@JourneymanGeek hm interesting

user310756

so much abuse on the site and you talk about not being too strict

Journeyman Geek

7:56 AM

@SPArchaeologist-様 oddly enough, not heard about it from my usual sources

user310756

it seems selective on who the person is tbh

SPArchaeologist-様

@JourneymanGeek it is a new service that allows VM remote connection via browser (HTML5) so that you don't have to have an exposed public IP

user310756

well clearly there's no support to be had for me on this site. Shame

StephanS

@user58 I'm sorry to hear that. You're right to stick with lemon ginger, it's probably best for right now

Journeyman Geek

@YvetteColomb Chat's different though - and sometimes we ask some topics are dropped. I'd assure you I'd do the same if anyone else did.

@SPArchaeologist-様 ... that sounds shiny

user310756

7:58 AM

@JourneymanGeek nope it reminds me of TL and everything I can't handle about the site

Cerbrus

@YvetteColomb again, this isn't about you.

user310756

it's ok for the people who are in with the group

SPArchaeologist-様

@JourneymanGeek Still in preview, works decently so far. But it has a BIG issue that is borderline ridiculous.

user310756

the protection only extends to some people

Journeyman Geek

@YvetteColomb I have one very simplerule for chat. Folks watch out for each other. I let folks know what I expect, remind them, and well...

user310756

7:59 AM

don't worry. I'm going

Cerbrus

Please, Yvette, take a moment. You're going down the bad path again.

user310756

@Cerbrus it is about me

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