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8:00 AM
The trolls, the drama vultures...
 
@JourneymanGeek doesn't matter, all contributions have been backed up and are ready to be migrated to a community without trolls
 
There's a lovely concept called a "loyal opposition"
 
I've never actually had to write the word "freest" before, it kinda looks wrong
 
this copy can do whatever it wants with itself
 
@user1306322 go ahead and do it then
 
8:00 AM
I'll take a short vacation of about a year and see what the exodus comes up with
I'm sure top tier developers and professionals are much better than me at designing architecture for such a project
 
@user1306322 If you want change you don't wait.
You do it;
 
as time goes on the chance of it appearing nears 100%
 
so... we have online casinos advertisement now?
 
still I'd be loving to see an alternative platform
 
@SPArchaeologist-様 already reported no?
 
8:02 AM
because I sadly don't understand chinese
 
@SPArchaeologist-様 who knows its not like anyone can stop google ads dumping whatever they want onto SE now
 
if nothing happens, 2 years from now I'll open-source my closed-source self-hosted SE clone :p
 
Do y'all remember the good old days?
 
I am really tempted to craft a "Stack Exchange Bad Ads Bingo" card.
 
When google did text only ads, and only text only ads?
 
8:03 AM
no, I have had an adblocker installed from 2007 so I don't remember any days with ads in them
 
I'm tempted to semi-automate posting new Qs on MSE about bad ads, and then going on a safari
 
@user1306322 I don't know if there's a concrete effort, but I'd be in if there was
 
@SébastienRenauld we have to let people rest for a while
 
@Magisch also....
 
since that's the way to flag them
 
8:03 AM
As I said on Meta
 
@Magisch image recognition toolkit + RNN + puppeteer to the rescue, yes?
 
wait Segmentfault is a clone of SE and they're open-source, If you trust that code
 
> And since we are at it, a little side notice...
If I understand correctly, you are using the Google Ads platform. Guess what? I see that platform used in many "for kids" smartphone games... and 99% of the time those don't get ads for fake medicines, questionable sites, online casinos and such. Why should WE get them???

I have skimmed the online available documentation for the Google Ads platform and I see that it provides a lot of filter options, both for target users age, type of content shown (for example, it provides a filter to block suggestive content) and so on. Please enable them
 
I'm sure the payout range is different for those options
 
@SPArchaeologist-様 SE has a loose content association and that's it
 
8:04 AM
I am not buying that there is no way to at least enable some basic filters.
 
@SPArchaeologist-様 I'd upvote that
 
and yes, since google ads work by highest bidder and dubious adds always try to pay more than "legit" businesses due to their business model, if you don't tighten your checks you'll get them
 
@StephanS is it open source?!
 
@JourneymanGeek 300 million, if crowdfunded, will be the second in the list of highest-funded projects en.wikipedia.org/wiki/…
 
@SPArchaeologist-様 probably is, but probably also makes the ad space less valueable
 
8:05 AM
@202324 I just saw they had an account, sorry I should have looked into it
 
and you know, we're only "scratching the surface of profitability"
 
wikimedia foundation's net assets value is in the range of 100~ million wikimediafoundation.org/about/financial-reports
 
To be fair the first day I bought by first Android phone, I already was told I had a virus, my battery was dying and I desperately needed a new phone.
 
@SPArchaeologist-様 look, if we're just 0.0015% or whatever, if everyone on meta enabled adblock, they wouldn't even notice, and this is not being said in jest.
 
@Magisch that I could buy. Then, let me translate it: It is fine to have 13years old users get casino and dating sites ads because it would be less profitable to filter?
 
8:07 AM
@SPArchaeologist-様 you should ask staff that, I'm only guessing
 
I don't think SE is the only one with really bad Google ads
 
@SPArchaeologist-様 Not filtering ads is a 20-25% net gain for an advertisee
that's personal experience, BTW
 
IMO every user should be educated about ads on the internet by their parent or legal guardians, it is not our responsibility to pre-emptively care for SE users' exposure to such stuff, it's their parents'
 
:7977276 I just know they had an account, sorry I should have looked into it
 
@SébastienRenauld holy cr...
 
8:08 AM
same as the birds and the bees, there are protection measures (in this case it's ad blockers)
 
As I said - ad providers work on a bidding model, not on a "fixed" rate
 
@JohnDvorak No, that I am sure. But I also know that there are plenty of "for kids" smartphones games that I know that don't show you casinos ads.
 
and scam ads have an incentive to catch as many people in the net as possible as fast as possible, so they'll naturally try to outbid
 
But, preteens aren't SE's target audience...
 
and before you ask - I didn't submit a real, unwilling audience to unfiltered ads. I A/B tested on two willing cohorts
 
8:09 AM
there's not much we can do to improve user experience if it goes against the interests of the powers that be
 
If SE ads were set to target preteens, instead of naked males and females we'd be getting plastic toys in bright colors and singing bears.
 
@JohnDvorak You sure about that? I'm almost tempted to generate an ad block for you that's tailored to that. You'll find... other things.
 
@JohnDvorak yeah but nudity filters aren't that hard to make
 
how about fake antivirus filters, dangerous-to-epileptics filters, casino filters...
to be fair, an online card game is probably the least dangerous thing you can learn about through an ad...
 
preteens are being targeted by MTX heavy mobile games these days
particularly simulated gambling and other psychological hooks
 
8:13 AM
ouch
 
@SPArchaeologist-様 better than semi nude women which were two days ago.
 
So, we'd be getting casino ads ... in brighter colors?
 
@JohnDvorak toys can also be PG18 you know. :/
 
Has anyone noticed how dishonest game app ads are........
 
@Magisch Spot on, my friend. Generated an ad block to test, I got pay-to-win games and, funnily enough, hearthstone
 
8:14 AM
@SébastienRenauld I have some exposure to the industry :p
 
Same :-)
I expected MtG instead of hearthstone though
 
Hearthstone is proto pay to win
 
same as I expected Paladins/Smite but only got shitty bloatware unity game ads
 
I mean, hearthstone at this point is pure p2w
 
8:15 AM
No idea about game ads, but the screen shots in Google Play essentially never show any of the actual gameplay in case of the bigger games
 
small kids see a deck they want to play and pester their parents to buy them enough packs to afford it
 
don't have all the new cards in the meta? sucks to be you
I honestly still think the mtx model of league is still the "fairest" of sorts
 
The technique of marketing fear of loss, gambling, reinforced addictive behavior loops, and in techniques to children is a multibillion dollar industry at this time
there are books and talks and workshops that teach you how to best monetize each age group
 
I don't think it's good for any game to involve money transactions at all beyond the initial purchase at the store, and that is yet another thing for parents to educate their kids about
gambling addiction is no joke
 
@user1306322 Agree and disagree. If the microtransaction adds a p2w element I completely agree
on the other hand if it's pure cosmetic the way Riot does it I'm okay with it
(provided the initial game is free)
 
8:18 AM
@Magisch my kids are 9 and 6, they get tons of ads in the free games they play and learned to ignore them all, never asked for us to buy them anything. :)
 
ye thankfully most kids aren't dumb
they realize very quickly that the game is actually not fun
 
The latest hot game is online multi player snake game.
 
@user1306322 If I'm not mistaken online gambling is illegal in a good amount of places (ask for citation if you're interested)
 
There is an amazing talk by the CEO of tribeflame describing some of the techniques they use to make mobile games profitable and addictive
and by amazing I of course mean headache and vomit inducing, but still
 
@Shadow I mean, nintendo made a killing with 100-player tetris
 
8:20 AM
Fortnite's model is bloody genius. You wouldn't pay $10k for a videogame. $10k for virtual boxes with 1% of containing your favorite new skin? No-brainer.
 
@Magisch I've seen that, it's crazy
 
@SébastienRenauld nice, the snake game is quite similar, it has more players though.
 
@JohnDvorak Riot works the same way, except that you can also straight up buy the skin
 
@JohnDvorak excuse me I paid like 3k for path of exile and never bought a single loot box :p
 
@JohnDvorak also annual sports games appear to bring in motherlodes of cash to EA and such, despite the worst ratings every single time
 
8:21 AM
FIFA wants a word
invented loot boxes, sorry, I mean, surprise mechanics
 
It gets fun when you realize how tightly designed it is
no element is left to chance, it's all made to maximize profits to a degree you wouldn't believe possible
everything the game gives you or shows you is intended to maximize mtx revenue
 
This includes welcome-back boxes if you've been away for a while with unnaturally high chance of cool shit in it just to get you back into the loop if you dropped out
because, after all, if you get one on your first go you might as well go for more, yeah?
 
@SébastienRenauld Don't say that too loud, EA eyes are everywhere. You don't want the next FIFA to have "footballers loot boxes"
 
it's like a casino except the slots are rigged to pay out a little bit just as you lose patience
kinda brilliant. Evil and should be illegal, but kinda brilliant
 
Remember back when it was considered immoral to redirect you to the play star if you like the game, and to a feedback form if you don't?
 
8:24 AM
Excuse me. Next loot box item reduces the size of your goal by up to 50%, with diminishing returns on size. Want a bigger reduction? Buy the more expensive boxes
 
@Magisch are you saying that regular slots don't do that?
 
I'm saying that, my riot account probably has a k or two worth of skins and all I play is ADC
 
@JohnDvorak not with that amount of sophistication
 
hmm maybe I should research more about lootboxes to improve the enjoyment of my non-mtx mechanics...
 
@StephanS You are not. I know they removed Animal Crossing Pocket Camp from the stores in Belgium because the premium currency cookies in game were considered gambling.
 
8:25 AM
also, kids 3 and over aren't allowed to play regular slots
 
@JohnDvorak regular slots aren't customized to the individual, no
well, physical slots aren't
 
But that's only because a physical casino isn't allowed to keep a profile of their players!
 
@user1306322 Next, on SE - Winter Bash Hat lootboxes.
 
this extends further into dynamic pricing on special offers
 
@SPArchaeologist-様 At this point I would honestly not even be surprised
 
8:27 AM
this is where the software makes an educated guess what you would pay, and charges you exactly that
 
tattered hat: spend $5 on paid SE features
 
using all the data about you it can buy from places like google or facebook
 
Better ads lootboxes? Get your answer faster in a lootbox?
 
pirate hat: spend $1000 on paid SE features
 
One-use dupehammer, random drop from SE boxes
 
8:28 AM
@JohnDvorak no, pirate hat is a free css script off gist
 
Free pass question reopen, also random drop
special twinkly gold badge, also random drop
because, you know, gotta cater to the collectionists
 
Downvote protection for 24h, also in lootboxes :p
 
bounty extensions. Don't forget bounty extensions.
 
I find it unreasonable that casinos can kick you out if you win too much
 
stop you are giving them ideas
 
8:29 AM
I remember times when people mentioned other players' hats in TF2, it's been 6 years since last mention :p
 
@StephanS So can online games
 
And, of course the classic - straight up reputation for cash.
 
I've actually had this happen to me on one
(no money was spent, BTW)
 
another cool system is to reward you additionally when you buy mtx by matching you into easier to win games
and harder to win games when you don't buy
 
^ that is exactly what ended up happening
 
8:30 AM
so you learn to associate having bought mtx with a winstreak in the actual game
 
one of EA's games got famous for this
 
Qban bypass for 10$
 
some crappier mobile games just ban you outright if they can't milk you, citing "exploitation"
 
It's called the art of controlled frustration
 
@JohnDvorak No, no, you have a 0.005% drop rate in 1$ boxes, much better!
 
8:31 AM
just frustrated enough so you don't quit, but are perfectly primed to buy your way out of the frustration temporarily
 
@SébastienRenauld oh dear
I wish I could believe that.
 
@Autar no, no, you gotta offer them both. Boosts the purchase rate of $1 boxes because they seem much fairer. Nobody ever buys the 10$ guaranteed win because it' sooo expensive.
 
@202324 it's not that far-fetched, when you think about it. Suppose you have a cohort of players and you're not tiering them into paying/non-paying the way EA did. You really do not want somebody in there that's virtually impossible to beat no matter how much money you throw at it
the obvious answer is to tier mmr based on recent mtx, but crappier games don't necessarily have the player count to do this and not have gigantic queues
 
we're talking about all this as if it's not pretty much evil incarnate
 
I mean, it is, but you can describe something without placing a value judgement
 
8:36 AM
@Magisch Business is business.
 
(and reserve the value judgement for other people to make while providing the full context to do so)
 
@Magisch is just a gaem y u hef 2 b mad
I have no patience for any kind of entertainment that makes me genuinely mad, it means it's bad and not fun, just don't do it and write a review to that effect if possible
 
@user1306322 Try league; particularly as an ADC
 
yea how about no lol :D
 
8:39 AM
(accidental double entendre)
my suggestion is try disabling text and voice chat
improves my experience every time
 
@SébastienRenauld sure, you can also talk about the mechanics of increasing formula sale by giving out just enough free formula to make mothers stop breastfeeding so they have to buy more to avoid their babies starving
(which is something nestle likes to do in developing countries)
 
That's nasty
 
definitely stops playing games
 
Here they give baby formula for free in the hospital, but not beyond.
 
@202324 yes, thank you
 
8:41 AM
@Magisch Didn't they pull a similar trick with bottled water somewhere in the US? (no, not Flint)
 
read some books or manga or illustrated novels, watch movies or tv shows or anime or cartoons, listen to music of various genres, and these are just the things you can do at home!
watch other people play games and relive their experiences but don't spend any money of your own, as an alternative
 
I observe that "it's just a" is almost never a valid argument
 
lots of things to do in life other than things that make you mad
 
I'd rather boot Hearthstone than get a manga book.
 
@JohnDvorak its just programming Q&A community y u hef 2 b mad
 
8:44 AM
haha
 
@SébastienRenauld nah, thats a different trick
 
it works where you don't have anything to lose by not participating in it
 
the trick with the formula is that if mothers don't breastfeed, they lose the ability to. The way nestle does it is marketing it as safer then breastmilk and better for babies, and then giving just enough supply for free to make it so the mothers can't anymore
 
Not a big deal, bro. You still have one arm left.
 
most games can be ignored, but global initiatives such as SE...
 
8:45 AM
...Can also be ignored
 
and because the water is not exactly clean and breastmilk is, that is also blatantly false. So they're profiting of thousands of babies dying of preventable disease by their own hand.
 
You can consume SO perfectly well without being signed up unless you're working on the cutting edge of a language
 
technically anything can be ignored but the potential losses are different
 
@SébastienRenauld and countless do, BTW.
 
environment can be ignored, crimes against humanity, etc
 
8:46 AM
Ignorance is a Bliss
 
@user1306322 Pay enough to the right people and a large-scale crime becomes a large-scale experiment
 
I'd actually say mostly do.
 
@Shadow [citation needed]
 
@SébastienRenauld this is one of the problems with the world, people want money for some reason, insane amounts of it
 
8:47 AM
also the trick of buying water rights and then siphoning it so much local aquifiers dry up
and selling the bottled water back to the affected communities
 
@Shadow this guy doesn't know the first thing about flying around and warping bullets out of people's bodies, I wouldn't listen to him
doesn't even know kung-fu lol
2
 
@Magisch That's what I was referring to; didn't they do this somewhere near CA?
 
@user1306322 he just wants to live his fake life
 
yea
fun isn't it?
 
@SébastienRenauld true story: great programmer gets registered at SO because users of the programming language s/he invented invited them to. Was just leeching and spending their time in stuff adding value to them.
 
8:49 AM
@Shadow VR tech is coming big time!
 
Orbital weaponry? Disney villains have so little imagination.
 
that's an interesting topic btw
 
@user1306322 long years before it's Matrix
 
I imagine most billionaires also "just want to live their fake lives"...
 
Descartes wants a word, claims all lives are fake
;-)
 
8:50 AM
@user1306322 actually, no. I think they work hard to get more money they don't need at all, just for sake of having the money.
 
what if we put all evil people who ruin everyone else's lives into their own personal matrices where they can fulfill their heart's desires while shielding others from suffering they'd otherwise inflict on them? hmm…
 
@user1306322 who will decide who's evil?
 
that's the thing -- put everyone in their own personal matrix and let them live their ideal lives!
 
@user1306322 it's called videogames and it works pretty well
 
@Shadow a Stack Exchange QnA duh
 
8:52 AM
it's not how Matrix movies worked but it's similar :p
 
@Shadow See, that's the wrong question. People shouldn't worry about the person they put in first; they should worry about how the succession happens
that's typically where a good movement turns into a total clownfiesta
 
Matrix 3: I've always thought this world isn't real… (gets out, sees it's worse out there) oh... guess I'll go back! [the end]
kind of a Jerry daycare
 
@user1306322 I don't have a high enough IQ to understand that
 
I suppose I meant to say Matrix 4 coz there already are 3 movies
 
In Matrix, it's "third time I scream" case.
 
8:54 AM
btw imdb.com/title/tt10838180 2022 seems to be the year for 4
 
I thought that was going to be a reboot.
 
continuation it seems
we'll finally find out what happens outside and if it's actually worth it
those nokia phones were so much simpler
 
I wish they made another take on equilibrium instead
:-(
 
I've seen that movie several times and the plot eludes me every time
 
@user1306322 I bet they'll have Trump there, in a way. e.g. "It's all the result of USA president actions".
 
8:57 AM
there's no salvage for that future Earth
 
Of equilibrium @user1306322 ?
 
yea
 
the movie doesn't do the plot justice
there's a "similar" kind of film called the giver, telling almost the same story from a different PoV
 
that's... a peculiar statement
 
I wouldn't recommend equilibrium itself for the movie; it's for the plot, and you need to take out all the fancy gun-kata stuff and the petty rivalry. The giver, on the other hand, focuses on all the worthwhile plot elements re: feeling removal
 
9:02 AM
another movie where production is insane but the result is sub-par is Jupiter Ascending
it's gonna be interesting how Keanu re-imagines himself as a modern incarnation of Neo after the 3 recent John Wick movies
 
How on earth do you spend $200M on that
 
I don't want it to be a Johnny Depp level of sameness of characters in all his movies
 
I loved the john wick movies
the choreography is excellent
 
the latest movie was kinda surreal in a sense that they're basically playing a gungame straight outta video games
in other news, how bout dem Starlink internet sats? I'm looking forward to most of the planet having decent internet speed at affordable prices
should make a lot of huge internet telecoms dissolve and return the money to the governments and people for better uses across all industries
 
@user1306322 The question I have for you is - do you care about latency/occasional SSH connection breaks?
(the second part is mitigated by tmux in a "stable" place)
 
9:12 AM
I think latency is gonna be in the range of 30-80ms, no idea about breaks, probably same as 3g mobile internet
for games it should be tolerable
if alternative cost several times more, I might consider how important FPS games are to me
some of my friends live in interesting places where due to various reasons normal wired internet is not available (or costs as much as corporate connection plans) so they've been using some kind of 4G LTE and gaming with them is rather frustrating
we don't let them host the servers, let's say
 
@SébastienRenauld or mosh
 
it remains to be seen what the real connection parameters will be, for now we can only speculate based on sats positioned in entirely different orbit ranges
but the fact that availability will improve dramatically is obvious
does smoke bot delete its messages if it sees the post deleted in that 2 minute window?
 
@user1306322 yes
 
cool
 
9:32 AM
Warm
 
humid
 
tropical
 
Island 🏝
 
apocalyptic
 
post-apocalyptic
 
9:34 AM
Chaos
 
you must first master all 5 elements before you can use chaos arcana
 
5?
Oh. Metal.
 
@JohnDvorak Earth, water, fire, air, and java
 
coffee is just water + energy
 
wrong type of java
 
9:38 AM
@JohnDvorak there was an old flash game that had you mix elements to create new elements. I think that they actually did that, if my memory serves.
 
@SPArchaeologist-様 pocket God?
no wrong game but I know what you're talking about
 
Doodle god
 
The only game you need to combine elements in is Magicka
it also teaches you to embrace full co-op and play it like you play monopoly
 
@JohnDvorak yeah that's it
 
(For those not in the know, magicka is co-op with friendly fire on ghostbusters, where you really don't want to cross the streams)
 
9:43 AM
@StephanS Yep, just checked, that is the one I was remembering.
and.. I checked
> Combine energy and seeds to create coffee.
sadly it was seeds, not water
 
@user1306322 yes
 
@LinkBerest before I forget again. Should you ever see Lum The Forever, this is a somehow good analysis of the movie plot.
@SébastienRenauld I only know Puella Magica.
 
10:28 AM
@Pandya hey did you try what I suggested in the comment?
(in case you missed the comment, don't want to litter the question with another comment)
 
10:58 AM
[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Bad keyword in body, body starts with title and ends in url, potentially bad keyword in body, potentially bad keyword in username (196): the methods of preparation and proportions vary greatly by tristan2ch on wordpress.SE
 
@Shadow Existing credential isn't working on private tab
 

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