@GetAnswerWizard But do you know why the question is downvoted? It's not a feature request in any sense, it's not unclear or unhelpful 😕

@ShadowWizard that... just makes sense

is there any Light Wizard?

@Ooker Its really hypothetical

and not very clear

@Ooker I didn't downvote, but I had trouble understanding what it means.

@Blue Regarding Blue's request for a Bot to keep a room from freezing, Generic Bot has such a feature.

@JourneymanGeek hmm, do you need me to provide the link? I didn't do so because I think it will be mistaken as belonging to the specific site. I want to keep it general and network-wide

@SonictheWizardWerehog if possible, can you point out the part that you feel lost? Perhaps the second paragraph?

@Ooker I think the important part here is - well your question can be interpreted in a few ways. Not all good.

Other possible downvote reasons: 1) it's not useful since the distinction between answer on main & meta is clear, 2) some might think you're gonna to use meta to ask reasons/improvements for all wrong answers, and that's usually not going well

also if stuff is happening in comments, why not deal with it in comments?

Oh, and morning...

Does visiting a link in HNQ contribute to its hotness?

Ah goodie

snort

I just got the moderators bronze tag badge ;p

lol

→ 18 messages moved to Chimney

@Ooker not yet! The role is available if you wish to take it. ;)

@JourneymanGeek snorting dog?! :D

@AskQuestionWizard why don't you use Smokey to report spam?

That site mods appear to ignore/not be aware of the spam flag queue, it's sitting there for 12 hours.

So Smokey is the only way to remove spam from such sites. :/

(or CM, but it's an overkill.)

@Get go get this spammer! ;)

Well, four boxes of swag showed up this morning :P

Two for me, two for a sibling ;)

I had three e-mails from DHL, but they were all just phishing :(

I do hope that if mine turn up eventually, it won't be today, tomorrow or the day after as no-one is home :(

They don't call you before delivery?

@Mithrandir I don't think so.

I haven't even had tracking info yet

Usually they just leave the package with a neighbour though ;)

But enough about the packages, I want to know what's in yours :)

Huh. Interesting.

List coming in a minute... have to get to the laptop

Nice!

My brother got most of the same stuff, except a SO shirt instead of SFF, CR duck + SO mug instead of the sweatshirt, Mi Yodeya sticker instead of SFF, and a black SE shirt as well.

Cool :) Sounds like those boxes are filled up very well :)

Yep. :D

@GetAnswerWizard hmm, but I thought if we want to improve a post, it's perfectly fine to ask on meta?

@JourneymanGeek what interpretations it can have?

it's hard to deal in the comment, because perhaps I have a serious misunderstanding them, and it will tax their energy to point it out for me. So they will drop the conversations

I just realize my answer is a frame challenge. So it may be the issue here. I didn't know that concept

@Ooker "Improve a post" is broadly defined. If you're 'improving' posts so an otherwise valid answer in subject X is more inline with site policies, which would be doing stuff like grammar edits, then asking how to do so would be OK on meta, because it relates to how the site functions.

But if it's related to subject X only, then the only appropriate place would be X.SE. Of course, that is in case the question abides by the other rules of the site

I didn't vote on the post because it was more like a +1/-1 for me. If I'd downvoted, it would have been because the distinction should be clear to a long-time user like you

And that is at least how some of the downvoters felt I bet

(self-note: I just jumped in in the conversation, and it would be pretty awkward if it wasn't about Ooker's recent meta)

meta.stackexchange.com/questions/325637/… I believe it's about that one.

Score of -2? Get out of town

This guy is being self-contradictory which makes me believe they just wanna be argumentative

Also doing cheap shots such as side-tracking

Which really just discourages me from commenting further

@M.A.R.TheChemicalWizard true, that person just want to prove their point and it's obvious they won't bother to even try and listen to what others say. It's useless to talk with such people. I just downvote those and move on.

I move on and upvote instead.

Same goes for most "boo hoo! modz clozed my questions!" rants, though I admit some do listen.

Heh, now I look like @Tink lol

(and no, that's totally not on purpose :))

@ShadowWizard SOCKS!!1!

nah her socks are more colorful :P

@ShadowWizard I knew it! You've been jealous of my good looks! :P

Cute kid :D

Thanks! Since both other children got their share as my avatar (solo), thought it's time she will get some too. :)

@rene "lose" not "loose". (you keep saying that in comments, so looks like it's not just random typo?)

"loose" is also a word, but with a totally different meaning.... ;)

Oh, you can still edit your latest comment

...and can't anymore.

OMG... this led me to this search, thinking to fix some trivial typo in some posts. But there are just too many.... :P

Funny, first result is to have that corrected in bulk XD

@Tinkeringbell nah, there are some legit loose words there, e.g.

;)

I lose my loose rope.

You lose in the loose pun contest! :D

Anyway.... I almost pinged Tinkeringbell for your meta answer on "real name", Shadow...

Apparently people in the 21st century loose other things than digested food

superuser.com/search?q=loosing+data

@GetAnswerWizard Why? What do I have to do with that?

Because of the avatar :)

@Tinkeringbell similar avatars I can't see

Ohhh. Well, I was a red parrot first! :P So if there is going to be confusion I'll just reset @Shadow's avatar ;)

At least it's still different, not a duplicated avatar like "bring polyglot back" or "graduate Writing now"...

@ShadowWizard I loose a lot ...

@Tinkeringbell weren't you just yourself for a long time at first, and then a field of tulips?

Hmm... 🤔

unclear what that's asking.

@Tinkeringbell It's basically a call to ban uncritical discussion of communism from SE

drawing the analogue that SE does ban uncritical discussion of nazism

I still don't get it. Are they seeing a question title in HNQ that they don't like? Otherwise, what does Python have to do with it?

@Tinkeringbell There were / are questions asking for the pros and cons of communism in the HNQ by politics.SE. The latest question the user takes umbrage with is not on the HNQ (yet) however

Woah woah woah woah. You're what, @balpha?!

Looks like there are many side points to be discussed in addition to the core question... like users can now hide HNQ sidebar...

@Mithrandir I shouldn't have said that profile picture made him look old :P

@Tinkeringbell YOU INSENSITIVE MONSTER

??? is actually parrot though

@Magisch Yeah, I was just repeating what others told me!

:P

For those wondering what we're talking about here :P

now I have a mental image of a parrot going "tinker wants a flag!" in usual parrot tone

cookie. Tinker wants a cookie, preferably chocolate chip! :P

Ohh man :/

I get the need for change but that's a lot of it at once 😞

Yeah, a lot of people are suddenly done, it seems.

Yeah

I mean, last year was pretty corrosive to the community at large too

And folks who have been here for...ages

@Magisch I hope it's unrelated

The huge ball of hate periodically lashing out as anything that can be identified as staff probably didn't help

Doesn't sound like it here though

And eh. It's a work in progress fixing that

9 years is a lifetime in tech after all. Even for folks utterly kickass

certainly not a sole factor, that much is sure. But it might be one of the things that makes finally leaving less painful. Can't really know for sure

9 years is surely a dedication. I'm not even into 2 years and I'm already thinking of finding new job...

Hah. Likewise. Thought I kinda consider this job very transitional

yeah for programmers, 9 years is glacial

usually you expect to shift every 2-3 years

@Tinkeringbell it's okay, I only blame 27% of it on you ;)

When feeling old, you can always fall back on the full name

@Magisch his full name is looong

@balpha Only 27%? I'm sure I can do better! Enjoy your new job! :D

thanks :)

p_p

Or q_q, can't decide

q_Q

@JourneymanGeek Wait... balpha = @Loong? Plot twist!

Oh dang

Mwahahahaha

@GetAnswerWizard So many question marks. High quality rant for a change

@JourneymanGeek I know, I have twitter

Thats how i know too

twitter didn't even allow me to put my full name until their much-ridiculed change to allow 50 chars

I appreciated it :)

I always had to abbreviate

Isn't gathering knowledge on what possibly makes humans inclined to Nazism or Communism or any other -ism part of how to counter the movements?

I'm mildly curious, is that name a nobility title @balpha?

It sounds like a double name where one half is a nobility title

@balpha Before SE I thought I really had a long name

well my last name was just "Dumke" until this day

I took my wife's name because it's way cooler

yeah, it's kind of a nobility thing, but with unclear roots (not it means anything these days anyway)

it is a cool name though

funny thing, "von der ehe" translates to "of the marriage"

so it's amazingly self-referential, too

I imagine the wedding was hilarious

@Tinkeringbell my daughter will punch you for that, and her punches are strong... she learned well from her brother and sister. :P

@M.A.R.TheChemicalWizard so your confusion is that it should be clear that I know where to post which question? But as I said in the question, the question suitable for the main site can be interpreted as a question for the meta site. So anyone answering it will inadvertently answer it as if it's a question for the meta site

@rene soory to here! :D

@ShadowWizard in physics a particle will go with an antiparticle. So the opposite of Shadow Wizard would be Anti Shadow Wizard 😈

Not sure I follow, lol

Who is the opposite of me?

anyone can make you disappeared

Wizard Shadow didn't arrive yet.... ;)

oh wait

@Ooker you mean pɹɐzᴉM ʍopɐɥS?

BTW flipping names is as easy as asking a bot to do it:

come close. You need to use the image in the mirror too?

:D

>>flip Shadow Wizard

lol

not here, in Den

Tavern is too crowded for bots, except Smokey

...and @Glorfindel.

lol

lol

lol

what's it about the Wizard trend?

Wow, this SU sweatshirt is huge.

There's no Wizard trend.

I'd need to grow another three feet for this to fit properly :p

but it's still nice

Lol

Or just wear it comically oversized

Yep. That's what I'll be doing :P

@Mithrandir XXL?

@ShadowWizard XL

@Ooker blame @M.A.R.

@Mithrandir doesn't sound that big.... unless your size is M?

I don't think the hoodie had sizes? Or I misremember

I was M until I got 30 or so lol

@JourneymanGeek The tag says XL at any rate

@ShadowWizard Yeah, I'm around an M

(I am... not a big person.)

@Mithrandir so you're easy to ... mith

Choosing shirt size is hard, let's go shopping...

no. Shopping is awful.

@Magisch you joke, but I often do get overlooked (literally) if I'm in a crowd

I dislike shopping so much I'll prep beforehand to reduce the shopping time

@Mithrandir See, I have the opposite problem. People just...recognize me. I don't know why. I often have people come up to me, we shoot the breeze for a bit, they walk off, and the wife asks who that was. And all I can say is, "I have no idea" most of the time.

@fbueckert I'm curious as to your first name now

@Magisch Find my chat profile on Arqade.

Or, heck, just my profile.

that's so much work. Everyone just pick their favorite Aqade user and pretend fbue is them.

@Shog9 Then that will never be me.

I'm nobody's favorite.

Hah.

Oh, don't be so hard on yourself, 'Slice - we love you. It's just tough love.

@Shog9 twitch

@fbueckert ahh, too bad. If it was another name with F our full names would only differ by a single character

@Magisch Heh.

Can't say I've run into someone with the same last name that wasn't in my area.

@Ooker No, I'm not confused. I thought you were as to why your post received some backlash.

And as I said, the only possible venue for questions about subject X should be X.SE. Meta is for when it has at least something to do with the site itself

@fbueckert where's that? It's not the same last name (one char differs in the last name) but curious anyways

@Magisch Manitoba

iirc one of those small Caribbean territories

@M.A.R.TheChemicalWizard ah I get it. It's just that I want to check again and ask for guideline to avoid potential misunderstanding when asking such question. Seem like the downvoters thought that it should be clear to me to know where to ask, while what I ask is not where to ask, but how to ask. Does that answer you?

@AskQuestionWizard errrr... That is an odd thing to say, in context

Plus, I like to think on complicated problems like this, so I want to wrap it up in words

Corporate guilt is sort of a trendy thing, with folks at Google and Microsoft jumping to take responsibility for all the people their cyborg creations would presumably kill. But i feel like it misses the whole point of having a corporation yo begin with: diffusion of responsibility.

Although, between too empathic developers and developers without empathy, I'd pick the former 10/10

Yeah, but that's not a real choice is it?

@Magisch thought... It's not just developers

And empathy not guilt ;)

idk, given what some companies are doing (e.g facebook et al) it does sound like people with less then ideal amounts of empathy tend there

although handwringing about the consequences of your actions when you're google is hypocritical too, since that is basically the largest and most betentacled data monopoly to ever exist

So, a slightly more realistic choice: work for Facebook or work for Dupont?

(or... Let's throw sweatshops at problems we allowed to fester)

I'd take either ;)

I'd take neither

I dislike big corps

work for SE instead

SE hires senior developers. I have under 4 years of professional dev experience

@Magisch it's a thought experiment, albeit one based on real, plausible employers

20 year old company responsible for some advancements in how we communicate but also for being careless with information and community building, or 200 year old company responsible for countless inventions and innovations that we all use every day, but also for the deaths and injuries of more people than you can rightly comprehend...

Definitely not Facebook. The application portal at Dupont is down, so I can't check if I would want to work there.

@Shog9 well practically I applied to one of them....

@Tinkeringbell don't forget to mark your calendar on April 1!

Oh, and it seems DuPont is now part of Dow, so... Lots more deaths.

@Shog9 well technically as a dev these days... You probably could kill lots more people

Honestly, DuPont then

I find something uniquely gross and dystopian about facebook and its practices

But in an ideal world - it's also a certain amount of empathy towards the people who work there and the community

You could try, but DowDupont has a big head start

I would rather write predator drone software then work for facebook

@GetAnswerWizard Heh. I'm not going to switch jobs, so I don't need to...

I mean - the small picture? I want interesting work, appreciation and a paycheck. I'm ok with 1 out if 3 it seems.

@Magisch I applied their data center side I think

fortunately, small and inconsequential companies exist. Right now i'm designing and building an ERP system that runs the operations of a company auditing semiconductors

Also applied to Google.

Also I currently work for the very sorta company (s) I complain about a lot sooooo ;p

Whoever hires me and pays more than what I get now? I'm all yours ;p

If the work is interesting, even better

I mean if it was that or starve sure I wouldn't be above it

I'd just avoid it if at all possible which thankfully is

But I don't think I have the luxury of being picky over the ethics of my employer, as long as what I do is legal

@Magisch was unemployed for a bit and have had poor luck with jobs.... So...

There's always going freelance. But that means you need a steady enough clientbase to ensure you can still pay the bills.

going to buy 20 rolls

@fbueckert not a dev though.

i used to do desktop support.now i do L1 application support and monitoring

@JourneymanGeek Fair. I guess that falls more into the devops territory than anything else?

I call myself a dev, although my primary job is to maintain Access applications.

@fbueckert Seventh Circle Custodial Services? My sympathies...

Was balpha ever elected as a moderator anywhere prior to his employment at SE?

@canon Yeah, more or less.

@SonictheWizardWerehog no

But as jobs go...it could be worse.

@balpha I guess this means that the NaRQ game will not be fixed?

well I built that before I worked here so who knows 😜

But, but, but... who's going to post unicorns from planet unicornify when you're gone?

SO CUTE!!!

@balpha Out of curiosity, were you active in moderating any SE site using your staff rights?

@fbueckert eh. not dev. some ops

@SonictheWizardWerehog only for the most blatantly obvious stuff (like deleting spam posts if I come across them); stuff beyond that I would usually leave to the people who are actually familiar with the community

I hope the role Senior Software Engineer is based on your experience, not on age @balpha ... Best of luck, sad to see you go.

:D

I would totally qualify for that

@AskQuestionWizard I so want to remake that with the new rendering engine, but I'd have port the movie code including the animation framework from Python to Go 😕

@rene Thanks :) I'll make sure to yell at the cloud a lot in order to justify my old man title

Wait a min, balpha's leaving??

Yep

Nooooooooo

I'll never forget the Winter Bash memes or the unicorns

And I haven't even been on here for 6 months yet

Huh, Woodworking's election ended after nomination without enough candidates

huh

To me that looks like an EcmaScript critique, although I disagree with it.

Wait, balpha left too?

What is happening!?

hitchhiker's guide reference, IIRC

From a technical perspective... The V8 engine heavily leverages the prototype in order to compose object graphs and avoid dictionary mode which does provide for a lot of performance in memory management versus not having that available.

That aside, why are highly valued employees leaving? Creepy

far outside of / long before V8 was a thing, judicious use of prototypes could give you a nice speed bump that was hard to get any other way

it's a very efficient system, really

Agree

just a wee bit hard to wrap your head around if you've spent too much time with Java

It is the script version of Java

:P

I had a really long conversation with Ben once about query efficiency in SQL and he seemed so knowledgeable. I think Ben and Sam worked a lot on making the chat system as well, which (as I used it now) seems like it turned out well.

@TravisJ I expect everyone has their own reason

Well I don't want to speculate or cause problems, so perhaps its best if my question is just left to hyperbole or rhetoric

but in general, the longer you spend somewhere the more reasons you have to not be there anymore. Either there's some incredibly strong reason to stay that trumps all of them, or... eventually you move on.

Yeah, that is true. Maybe its just that I have been around too long and these damn kids wont get off my lawn.

I get sentimental about things. Drives my wife crazy.

Also depends if it is your 1st job or your tenth ...

I wish it had R, C#, JavaScript

Stuff at the bottom was asserted to be "for beginners", although I think all that graph really shows is the speed at which users who ask questions at Stack Overflow learn to answer questions in their relevant technologies. As far as PostsAgeinSOYears goes, to me that could be effected by so many things (tech released after SO #Go, changing jobs, changing tech stacks, changing schools) that it is relatively hard to defend the claim that higher years correlate to harder or more advanced tech.

Go's popularity saw a rapid rise in mid 2016, for example, which would have been 8 years after SO was started, and 7 years after Go was first released. This delay is going to strongly skew its data, and is just one data point of many being examined.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

because it went undetected by me, because it went undetected in my own source of data

Bah. Poked, but language-specific sites are as ever a special case, so it doesn't work yet

@AskQuestionWizard So many candidates with low candidate scores...