Tavern on the Meta

radp

11:00 PM

@MichaelMyers You devs don't usually do things normal users can do.

drachenstern

@JonathanLeffler my advice is to poke people by talking, they'll usually sense activity

Tim Stone

@TheNeedsMoarJqueryException Yeah, but her old job seemed so not awesome that everything better would have been awesome ;)

Michael Myers

Self-restraint, that's what we call it. (And then laugh behind closed doors.)

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

@TimStone This is true

@radp I vote that the most frequent user of this room should be made into a co-owner

radp

@TheNeedsMoarJqueryException No objections from me.

Michael Myers

11:01 PM

@JonathanLeffler This is true. Are you thinking of C primarily?

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

@radp \o/

Jonathan Leffler

OK - but it isn't clear that when I see 'no activity for 9 hours' that the last person in the room will be paying attention still. There are only a limited number of mugs like me who are found around most hours of the day. And I blame having to work with a team in India for that.

radp

I get enough owner action on the Bridge :P

Jonathan Leffler

Yes - I'm still primarily a C person - with database and Unix/Linux stuff as strong seconds. And Perl.

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

5

Q: Individual Status field for chat

I absolutely love chat and want to extend a huge thanks and token of appreciation, respect and awe-of-coding skill to Balpha, Marc Gravell, and the rest of the team who built it (sorry I don't know the names of everyone who was involved!!) I look forward to seeing chat launch on StackOverflow, a...

@JonathanLeffler That's partly why I asked that question

drachenstern

11:02 PM

@JonathanLeffler not that the last person will be there, but that any person will be there

we tend to lurk in enough rooms to make it worthwhile

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

To differentiate between, "I am here and quiet, say something to wake me up!" and "I went AFK and didn't close chat"

Jonathan Leffler

There's the C++ room, and I have a nice C++ badge, but if you looked at the answers, they don't show detailed knowledge of modern C++; just the generic 'common to C and C++' stuff.

drachenstern

@JonathanLeffler like students would have?

Tim Stone

Well, and to be fair, some of the SO topic-specific rooms could use more love. It's just hard to get enough of the right people in there the same time to get a consistent level of conversation going.

2

Michael Myers

When I looked into the C++ room, it seemed to be people with low skill levels pestering those with high.

Jonathan Leffler

11:04 PM

@Tim: absolutely...

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

@TimStone Yeah, I hope when I have more time this year I'll be able to chat on SO more

Michael Mrozek

@MichaelMyers You've just described all programming-related rooms in existence

Jonathan Leffler

There are, what, 3 pages of rooms.

radp

CAN HAS TEH CODEZ?

Michael Myers

@MichaelMrozek But that's not what they're for.

drachenstern

11:04 PM

@TimStone and @NickCraver has a new job now too, so I guess he'll be spending less time in there ;)

Michael Myers

They're supposed to be more like... well, this, I suppose.

Minus starring "oy" every time it appears.

4

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

@MichaelMyers Wait you're suggesting the other rooms should be more like this one???

drachenstern

@MichaelMyers and the SO Tavern is like this, sometimes

Tim Stone

@drachenstern Everyone's jumping ship to the dark side these days. :P

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

@MichaelMyers Ok. Thanks for clarifying

drachenstern

11:05 PM

@TimStone oh I would if they even contemplated offering me a job ;)

Michael Mrozek

@MichaelMyers In theory, but I don't think it'll ever actually be that way :). That's why I don't hang out in those rooms

radp

@MichaelMyers Well, SO users should hang around on MSO chat because, um, that's what metas are for! :)

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

@radp SO users should hang out in MSO chat because all the cool kids are on meta!

radp

chat.SO sounds more like chat about actual coding topics, given that you also have chat.meta.SO

Jonathan Leffler

Or, it may be that the Chat page gives a misleading impression; it says (the copy I opened before I drifted over here) that there are "4 users active, 8 rooms active", and says that the Tavern has "1 hour ago, Tom".

Tim Stone

11:07 PM

@TheNeedsMoarJqueryException Yeah, but if everyone hung out here I'd have to follow the conversation more closely, which would have an even greater impact on my productivity...

Jonathan Leffler

Maybe I don't know how to interpret those numbers, but it sure looks like as far as the Chat page is concerned, none of us in here have been doing anything for an hour.

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

@JonathanLeffler For me it says "1s ago - Jonathan Leffler"

Michael Myers

@JonathanLeffler You're looking at the SO chat?

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

@TimStone True. Plus we might run out of beer. That would be awful

Jonathan Leffler

Yup: http://chat.stackoverflow.com/?tab=all&sort=active&page=1

Michael Myers

11:08 PM

Yeah, that's chat.stackoverflow.com, not chat.meta.stackoverflow.com.

radp

Anyway, I'm kind of annoyed that SE has to reeducate SO users on poor "best practices" from the past.

2

Q: What happened to "One 'object' per answer?"

I recently asked this question and I got downvoted and hated and closed into oblivion. I dident even use the 'B' word! I simply asked for people to give one recommendation per answer so people could upvote and talk about each recommendation easier. What gives? An update: I am more confused the...

discussion

Jonathan Leffler

URL got truncated...of course.

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

@JonathanLeffler chat.meta.stackoverflow.com

Tim Stone

Actually chat.SO does seem pretty quiet today.

Not sure what's up with that.

I'll blame Monday and the holiday, or something.

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

I am too slow today

Jonathan Leffler

11:10 PM

There are so many places to go - it is confusing...hmmm...I just went to the Chat link from an SO home page...

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

Serves me right for trying to work and chat at the same time. quits Netbeans

2

Jonathan Leffler

It's almost as bad as working out where to ask the question.

Tim Stone

@TheNeedsMoarJqueryException The clear solution.

Dan Grossman

:facepalm:

Jonathan Leffler

And then there are the people who insist that shell programming isn't programming...

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

11:11 PM

@JonathanLeffler I typically try the room for the language first. If nobody's active there I go to one of the taverns

Dan Grossman

Modern Marvels episode: "90's Tech"... "EMAIL"

no, e-mail is not 90s tech :(

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

HAHAHA

Michael Myers

@JonathanLeffler Don't forget chat.stackexchange.com, which is different yet!

Jonathan Leffler

Roughly what happened to me now.

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

Well, to be fair, I'm always in here so I normally give these guys first dibbs anyway

Jonathan Leffler

11:12 PM

That is, I ended up in a tavern to see who it that Hell hath no Fury like...

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

Or, read another way, these guys are the first to hear me whine when my code doesn't work right ;-)

drachenstern

@TheNeedsMoarJqueryException I was thinking the same thing :(

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

LOL!

drachenstern

@DanGrossman welcome

radp

@MichaelMyers chat.SE is great against tab overload.

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

11:13 PM

@drachenstern Oh, it was for the NetBeans comment. I thought it was the whining comment. Still funny.

radp

One tab, chat from 30 sites.

drachenstern

@TheNeedsMoarJqueryException indeed sir

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

Yeah, welcome @Dan, happy new year

Dan Grossman

"In 2007, over 170 billion email messages were sent per day. That's 2 every second. 70% of them were spam or viruses."

thanks, same to you :)

drachenstern

@DanGrossman I'm sure you just need to see this -> meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/73816/…

radp

11:14 PM

I don't see what's wrong with that question.

MSO being the "capital" does color all discussion in the SO perspective.

Dan Grossman

I just wish there wasn't separate MSO and SO taverns.

radp

That could be good (a solution has to work on SO's scale to be considered) and bad (what works for SO may not work on other sites.)

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

@DanGrossman Same here

drachenstern

@radp I didn't tinge the conversation before he got there ;) ~ Letting him form his own opinion

Michael Myers

@JonathanLeffler So in other words (@TheNeedsMoarJqueryException), the description worked.

Michael Mrozek

11:16 PM

@radp His issue wasn't that, it was not being able to use his SO rep on MSO

drachenstern

@DanGrossman hahaha, now there's a trick

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

@MichaelMyers Point taken.

Jonathan Leffler

Going to c.m.so.com, I see that there are 11 rooms, 7 of which have activities in the days ago, one about 7 hours ago, a couple with 1-2 hours, and this one with seconds...oh well - I'll periodically poke my nose in to even the inactive rooms and see what's up. But I can't generally afford the time. Though, having said that, maybe there are occasions when I should encourage someone to go into a chat room - any chat room - to talk over a question. A stream of 40-odd comments (roughly 50:50 in each direction) on a single question over a couple of days is tedious - chat might be more effect…

radp

@MichaelMrozek If he had his way, his SO rep would only be good for SO-only discussions.

drachenstern

@JonathanLeffler I often encourage people by way of link on a question to come to the chat, so why not?

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

11:17 PM

@JonathanLeffler Thanks, you reminded me to keep my room active :-)

Michael Mrozek

On an unrelated note, wow I'm way over the meta rep cap today

I'm almost at double the cap

drachenstern

Additionally, I wouldn't recommend going to Every room, just the ones you like.

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

@drachenstern Likewise, same here

@MichaelMrozek Congrats. I don't think I ever hit the meta rep cap

drachenstern

@MichaelMrozek bleed some my way ;)

Michael Mrozek

@TheNeedsMoarJqueryException I have twice before, and both just barely; I'm not sure what happened today

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

11:18 PM

Yes, I did hit the meta rep cap... once. On April Fools. LOL

@MichaelMrozek Must be some striking new insight you have this year!

radp

I hit the rep cap on MSO on 2010-10-09. I posted a bounty in the hope to get my rep from upvotes back. I didn't.

(net result for the day: +4)

After that I stopped caring about hitting the rep cap and started caring about not hitting it.

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

ouch

Jonathan Leffler

@drachenstern: If I get involved in another question that looks like it might drag out like that one did, I'll try to head the problem off at the pass.

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

I stopped caring about rep once chat was started :-)

radp

I have 7k rep on Gaming and not one point was lost to the cap. I'm happy.

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

11:20 PM

@radp nice

Jonathan Leffler

@drachenstern: it was a homework question - so the one benefit of dragging it out was that the guy did actually do some of the thinking (because I made him do it).

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

I am shocked I have 466 rep on gaming -- I know none of the answers, LOL

Dan Grossman

"The NSA banned employees from bringing Furbies into its buildings in 1999. They feared the toy would repeat things it heard."

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

Your tax dollars at work...

mootinator

@DanGrossman /facepalm

Jonathan Leffler

11:26 PM

@Drachenstern: there are enough chat rooms where I know I'd be useless. I don't speak or read Farsi, for example.

Dan Grossman

Oy, Mom. Called me "the mouse on the laptop doesn't move anymore. I think it broke" -- "Press the button above the track pad mom."

:)

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

LOL

Jonathan Leffler

@Dan: 170 billion emails per day / 86400 seconds per day is more than 2 per second; it is a couple of million per second.

Michael Myers

@TheNeedsMoarJqueryException Does that line work when they're banning things inside their own building?

Michael Mrozek

@DanGrossman I wish my family had tech support questions like that. There's are more like "the computer stopped working. any idea what's wrong?"

"What's wrong with it?"

"It just isn't working right"

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

11:29 PM

@MichaelMyers I guess what I meant is, they took the time to have meetings and determine a policy and then spent time and resources enforcing that policy. But really I couldn't come up with any clever quip and didn't want @DanGrossman to feel bad that nobody commented on his anecdote...

Dan Grossman

Yeah. I get e-mails like that from customers sometimes.

Michael Mrozek

0

Q: Multiple Stackoverflow Profiles

I just saw this, I have two Stackoverflow profiles, one tied to Facebook & one tied to Gmail. Is there a way to merge?

support stackoverflow merge-accounts

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

I set a company policy that we won't try to answer questions from customers like that

Michael Mrozek

This is the third question about merging accounts today

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

We respond with a stock email that asks for a clear description of the problem with steps to reproduce

@MichaelMrozek Search must be broken ;-)

Dan Grossman

11:31 PM

Full support ticket: "website keeps giving me an error message when i try to order"

no other tickets, other people completing orders without problem at the same time, no response when I ask for more details :/

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

Yeah, happens to us too. If they don't respond in 48 hours with details we send them an automatic notice that their ticket will be closed out due to inactivity in another 24 hours

drachenstern

@JonathanLeffler I think that was per year

Dan Grossman

I'm the only person that answers tickets, I just gave up on using statuses entirely.

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

What ticketing system do you use @Dan, and are you happy with it?

We're looking for a better one

Jonathan Leffler

I'd say 170 B per day worldwide was plausible...I only get about half of them.

Dan Grossman

11:35 PM

It's zendesk.com and I have no complaints. I use the forum feature with stickied posts as a knowledge base.

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

Cool. I think I sent that to our CEO for review

drachenstern

[Load Test] -> Call is made to the ** for Delete**Order, Close**Order and Modify**Order 600 times for a total of 1800 transactions. <-- that's the entire description. I think someone on my team doesn't understand a) load test, b) the power of modern servers. This code is from the past six months.

Dan Grossman

A lot of startups (Twitter, Groupon, Rackspace Cloud) seem to use it, and it's cheap enough.

@drachenstern Transactions run sequentually, right? :p

drachenstern

@DanGrossman in this case, not so much. It's really like "write to database", "update database", "update database" so so long as "write" occurred before "update" it's fine.

But one would like to think so.

Dan Grossman

hpl.hp.com/research/linux/httperf

> -bash: talk: command not found

:(

drachenstern

11:43 PM

@DanGrossman well in this case it's meant to prove that the application can handle forwarding requests, as this particular system is supposed to be a store-n-forward

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

@DanGrossman Try apachebench: ab

drachenstern

I really don't think the guy on the other end of this code groks webservers, so store-n-forward I really expect to get trussed :(

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

httpd.apache.org/docs/2.0/programs/ab.html

Dan Grossman

@TheNeedsMoarJqueryException I liked httperf more, you can create more realistic workloads

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

I'll have to check it out

I was thinking maybe ab would be available since httperf wasn't

Dan Grossman

11:45 PM

I was trying to run talk

Talk (software)

talk was a program originally used for live text communication between different users of a single multi-user computer running the Unix operating system. In 1983, a new version of talk was introduced as a Unix command with BSD v4.2, and would also accommodate electronic conversations between users on different machines. Follow-ons to talk included ntalk and ytalk. ytalk was the first to allow conversations between more than two users. All of these programs split the interface into different sections for each participant. The interfaces did not convey the order in which statements typ...

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

Oh. Sorry. I was confused :-)

Hey @Shog9, how goes?

Dan Grossman

ooh I need to get to redbox before 9 to return this dvd

drachenstern

@DanGrossman see ya later ;)

Shog9

@TheNeedsMoarJqueryException Slowly... Trying to get the hang of working again after holiday vacation.

Anything new here?

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

@Shog9 I know that feeling

drachenstern

11:48 PM

@Shog9 not really

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

@Shog9 You know this place well. it's about the same as always :-)

drachenstern

we're bashing on MSO posters and apparently creating a voting ring ...

Shog9

Well, it's about time.

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

Some of us have new jobs...

drachenstern

I believe you have seen that particular comment ;)

Shog9

11:49 PM

Probably; the one where Jeff edited the title of the MSO post?

Congrats, Josh

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

LOL, not I :-)

Shog9

Well then, sucks to be you!

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

Well, I love my job, so I'm happy :-)

drachenstern

@Shog9 yes, that was it ;)

Tim Stone

@Shog9 @RebeccaChernoff upgraded her job similar to the Careers ad:

Only the arrow is supposed to be pointing at Stack Overflow.

mootinator

11:52 PM

Twitter is down. I just need somewhere to complain about it. That's usually what Twitter is for.

Shog9

@TimStone Ah... That explains her bump in activity

Rebecca Chernoff

@TimStone hahaha

Shog9

(off-Chat, I mean)

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

@mootinator /what Twitter is for/what The Tavern is for/

Rebecca Chernoff

I've had a bump in activity?

Shog9

11:52 PM

well, congrats Rebecca

drachenstern

@mootinator lmao

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

@Shog9 I was going to say, she's consistently the #1 chat user, LOL

@RebeccaChernoff Your meta rep has soared

Shog9

@RebeccaChernoff - seemed like it, although the name change may have contributed to that. I remember thinking just a few days ago, "Who's this rebecca cat, & why's she suddenly all over the place?"

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

LOL

radp

@Shog9 Sounds like you're one of those who doesn't get the obsessive compulsive necessity to star "oy" messages. Tsk.

3

Rebecca Chernoff

11:56 PM

I'm not sure tsk is what I'd use to describe that behavior. (;

Shog9

@radp: I think the word you're looking for is "Oy."

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

@Shog9 I was just typing that!

Rebecca Chernoff

That's almost like a recursive oy. I like.

7

Tim Stone

@Shog9 Now she's able to answer with the unyielding [status-bydesign] authority that only Jeff can inspire.

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

@RebeccaChernoff I starred that, but not for the Oy, for the recursion

So I am not breaking my New Year's resolution to not star Oy messages

Dan Grossman

11:57 PM

Doom 4

Doom 4 is the upcoming multi-platform installment of the Doom series by id Software. The game is neither a sequel to Doom 3 nor a reboot of the franchise. It will use the company’s new id Tech 5 engine and was announced as in production on May 7, 2008, following speculation by John Carmack at QuakeCon on August 3, 2007. There are suggestions that, like Doom 2, it will take place on Earth, and will feature gameplay more akin to the original Doom games rather than the horror styled gameplay of Doom 3. Development On August 1, 2008, John Carmack, the co-founder and technical director of id ...

Shog9

Mmmm... Doom...

I stopped gaming years ago, but still keep a copy of Doom around. Some addictions you just can't ever quite let go of.

Pollyanna

Doom was more a force of nature than a mere game.

3

The NeedsMoarJquery Exception

@Pollyanna Have a star

Pollyanna

I shall love it and cherish it and name it george.

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