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12:00 AM
but yes, indeed, I am looking at a closed question, which is why I wasn't seeing the flag option!
@FélixGagnon-Grenier I don't mind it, but the same doesn't necessarily apply to others.
@Shog9 Could you please look into meta.stackexchange.com/questions/308633/…?
12:47 AM
@FélixGagnon-Grenier flag>should be closed>unclear
1:06 AM
@Catija Thanks! In the meantime I realized the question had been closed, and the flag options differ a bit in that case.
2:00 AM
And I already forgot about the new CoC
Is that good or bad?
Good for my (mind) health :/
2:18 AM
I don't really know why people get so worked up over it :(
Unless you're like
"Its my fundamental right to be not nice to people for silly reasons"
I expected a spiderman meme jumping from the window
or should I say... why is it bad for your mental health?
@FélixGagnon-Grenier naw, I mostly post dog pictures.
2:49 AM
Well, browsing meta needs more mental preparation again
I'm a simple man dog. I see posts I can answer, I answer ;)
1 hour later…
4:00 AM
@Catija edited. Yeh that wasn't expressed in how I intended it. It was more" I've noticed the change on SO -> is there a change network wide?
Welcome to Meta! I'm not sure which search brought you here but the problem you describe will not be answered on this specific site. To get an answer from users that have the expertise about the topic of your question you'll have to find and then re-post on the proper site. Check How do I ask a good question and What is on topic on the target site to make sure your post is in good shape. Your question is definitely off-topic on Meta and is better deleted here. — Robert Cartaino ♦ 4 hours ago
@rene Looks like staff are using your canned comment...
@Shadow Out of curiosity, why did you delete your Twitter account?
@YvetteColomb Ah. :) Cool. I figured it wasn't since you're not exactly shy about asking questions on MSO.
@Catija :)
4:17 AM
@Catija The 404 graphic on non-designed sites (cdn.sstatic.net/Sites/skins/sketchymeta/img/sketchy-404.png) is itself giving a 404 error...can you please look into it?
@SonictheInclusiveHedgehog Did you post a bug report? I have no clue how to look into that sort of stuff.
1 hour later…
5:47 AM
@MarkAmery I guess that makes the mods 'conflict diamonds'?
6:12 AM
@MartinJames boooooooo
6:33 AM
@SonictheInclusiveHedgehog a vote, if any. While I think an up vote to support that synonym is appreciated, I'm fine if you think it is not. Synonym voting is so hard to find or get involved in.
@rene I don't have the required answer score of 5 in the tag to be able to vote on the synonym.
@SonictheInclusiveHedgehog Oh, I missed that, sorry. I saw your name popup in the top-user. My brain-cells stopped processing after that.
10 hours ago, by Sonic the Inclusive Hedgehog
Votes on questions don't count.
@SonictheInclusiveHedgehog I think I flag it for being unwelcome ;)
@SonictheInclusiveHedgehog yeah, I picked that up. Thanks.
@rene Is mine more welcoming?
> Welcome to Meta Stack Exchange! This site is for questions about the Stack Exchange network of Q&A sites; unfortunately, we have to mark this question as "off-topic" for this site. Please post your question on the correct site, and check to make sure your question is on-topic for the site you've chosen.
6:36 AM
none of them are
it still says Go Away! but in a friendly way
For every user that post a question their expectation is to get an answer. Anything that is not that, is a disappointment.
> This looks like a question intended for another site in the Stack Exchange network. This site, Meta Stack Exchange, is for questions about these sites: bug reports, feature requests, etc. If a site exists on which this question would be on-topic, you can ask your question there, but we have to mark this as "off-topic" for this Meta site. Sorry for the confusion.
@rene How do you prefer this version? It's modeled after the Area 51 Discussions close reason for people who post questions intended for proposed sites.
Based on how big the disappointment you either get desperate pleas in comments, lash-outs on meta, posts on reddit and Quora how awful SE is, twitter storms, blogposts ... you name it.
@SonictheInclusiveHedgehog I think it is good to have a few versions so you make it look like they are tailored a bit .
@rene If people post links to their off-topic posts, they'll get a lot of people who disagree with their post and who think they're lying, because they posted on meta and their question was closed as "not about the SE network".
@rene I generally use the top version; I only use the bottom version if something tells me otherwise.
Yeah, I sometimes leave an extra comment with specific guidance.
based on gut feeling.
@rene or write them on the spot ;)
But I'm clearly a dinosaur
7:02 AM
@JourneymanGeek Am I still on ignore? (If I don't get a response in five minutes, I'll take that as a yes.)
@rene when something gets big enough, people all want a slice of how its run. Sometimes without actually wanting to use it. I still like/hope the concept of holding the high moral ground matters... but ehhhhhh
8:15 AM
@ShadowWizard worldbuilding.stackexchange.com/questions/47415/…. I think it's already asked... a world is basically a habitable planet after all (and it looks like that one didn't reach HNQ).
8:44 AM
grumble grumble muscle memory grumble
remind me NLN flag is the 3rd option now, thanks.
9:01 AM
@SomewhatMemorableName they will keep changing it
Which is we can't have nice things such as bots flagging comments
@ShadowWizard difficult to answer, but I'm primarily involved with the tech we create for full body VR experiences. All the crazy ideas we think up and research to improve the tech can somehow get my involvement. Given that I'm equally at home in research as in pure dev, I'm kind of a middleman between the other pure researchers and the dev team.
@Bart sounds obscure but guess that's the best I can get.... :)
"full body VR experiences" sounds.... interesting. :D
NDAs are in place to stop me from saying more :D
@Bart of course... ;)
Kind of like when we ask CM or mod why [put name here] has been suspended.... :D
9:13 AM
This is an old video of what we do, to give you an idea (youtube.com/watch?v=kxW5H4xj1kA)
@Tinkeringbell huh! TL;DR for the answers there? ;)
@Bart nice!
Fun fact: I'm the narrator ...
9:39 AM
As in... Narrow? ;-)
@TimPost, looks like it's not ended yet. Can you contact DHL from your side and ask what happened?
They charged me 1000 when receiving the package. So, I mailed them for the reason and this is what they replied.
Paying INR 1860 ($27.10) to receive a swag is insane
@TimPost, just fyi, In the invoice they sent me previously, the amount to be paid is 859.70, when receiving the package, they charged 1000. I asked them why there's an extra charge and they want me to pay 859.70 again
@ShadowWizard Smallest was 1/7th the mass of earth, so calling someone a 'world' isn't nice :P
9:59 AM
Yet another reason to not live in India
@JohnDvorak no issues while receiving things via postal. but Tim said when sending things via usps, it'll never reach destination
The opposite problem here in Czechia. DHL's fine, but if you send something through Czech Post, it's 50/50 whether the postman rings at your door or just stays at office and merely delivers you a notice to visit their office.
Not much different here in CH. Often they can't be bothered to go up to the 3rd floor, so I get a note. But even worse, they have left expensive packages which needed a signature in front of my door when I was absent.
@JohnDvorak That's what DHL did. They kept it in the bangalore office for more than 3 months, few days ago, called me and asked me visit their office, which is 11KM far from my place
ah, the nearest Czech Post office to my place is ~ 1km
and we have a functional public transport :P
10:06 AM
the nearest post office is a sub office and my aunt is the post master. When there something for me, she'll bring it. When a package reaches the head post office ( <2Km), postman come to home, want me to sign it and then give me a notice to collect it from office
He'll never bring the package when coming to get signature
What ... exactly are you signing then? That you know it exists?
Here, signature means "I got the package"
The same.
But you didn't get it
When signed it, he will give a letter (not a notice). If we give the letter to the staff at post office, they'll give the package
yeah. but certain things are different here. If you want the package, you've to sign it before
So.. you have to sign paperwork saying you got the package ... and then not get the package?
10:17 AM
Afaik, none of us here had such an experience.
not yet
Au contraire. All of you do.
Relevant to the interests of this room's members: news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17715193
@MarkAmery Meh. I already stepped into one to many hornets nests about the CoC today. And that one's about a picture used, not even the CoC itself :/ ... I'll pass ;)
@MarkAmery I've bailed out about 1.5 paragraphs before the end of the main post
10:36 AM
@MarkAmery This is formatted like a reddit thread
@Tinkeringbell I legit can't understand that one btw. It's already a wireframe cartoon instead of a real cartoon. I can't even make out the ethnicity of any of the people in ther
For most I can barely tell what is skin and what's clothing
But plants represent though :p
@Magisch Hahaha yeah, they gave you a pretty prominent space :P
@Magisch Yeah. Honestly, I'm tempted to edit in a little rant about the 'first glance' bit... I'll wait, maybe I'll come up with a way to say it nicely. But my first glance only notices skin color if my first glance is meant to look at that...
In general I understand representation concerns especially when it's an image associated with users first experiences with the site
But for the wireframe I can't even imagine what you could change to make it more inclusive. More brown wireframes? I couldn't tell them from the black or purple ones without zooming in
@Magisch I can, but I have sharp eyes for things I'm looking at up close, and I'm used to seeing minute differences in color pretty easily now from years of working with yarn that may have had different paint baths ;)
10:56 AM
@Tinkeringbell Hmm? I don't see the comments about a picture that y'all are talking about.
@MarkAmery I wrote an answer about that picture, to a post on meta: meta.stackexchange.com/a/313902/369802
ooooh sorry, got it
It got some very fierce comments from the asker, to the point that I'm now kinda regretting sticking my hand in there and putting my thoughts up for scrutiny
(some of those are already deleted again)
[Adds "line drawings" to lengthy mental list of things that may get me accused of oppressing non-white people.]
@Tinkeringbell oh well... so... Hello Bell!
11:10 AM
@ShadowWizard Hi!
@rene Lekker! :P
I'm going to run and get some Ola icecream before it starts raining again. ;)
buh MSE spam wave...
11:20 AM
I checked meta.stackexchange.com/a/160292/222298 but I still don't understand. What privilage makes me see the contents of the deleted Sci Fi chatroom BEWARE TOMATO BLIGHT DO NOT READ room number 198 on SE chat?
@b_jonas I think you need 10K on SE sites, I can see that room
You don't want to see that room .
Is that mos?
@Magisch Was.
11:47 AM
12:03 PM
@rene yup, need 10k to appear in the se chat profile
(so it's SO+MSE+(all the rest))
@b_jonas where you saw that name? The actual name is "Poisoned room; it is defunct.".
oh and it's frozen not deleted so anyone can enter the room, just not post in there.
huh? Well, I see 404 for logged out and my sock, weird.
oh, small bug: the message is "This room is frozen; new messages cannot be added." even when room is deleted, not frozen. meh
@JourneymanGeek care to explain why? What's so horrible there? Last message is:
in Poisoned room; it is defunct. on The Stack Exchange Network Chat, May 12 '17 at 2:43, by Politank-Z
Point 1: We're not DBAs. So we've got that going for us. Which is nice.
Is this poison??
and before that:
I never bothered to look into that room and still didn't dig deep, but on the surface I can't see anything wrong.
Are those the few curse words used there? Tavern has much more.
12:20 PM
The colors are inverted!
Invert them back
But then the avatars are inverted
So? It still looks nice.
@b_jonas why you ask? You want to look for something specific in the room? heh, can't search in a deleted room so it's not relevant anyway. :/
Still lacks per-user colors
12:36 PM
@JNat cross site spammer, e.g. MSE spam example. Not sure about the other site, likely same spam posted there on some random post.
@ShadowWizard No. I want to learn about how the chat privilages work.
@ShadowWizard I was here when it was active.
@b_jonas oh, so why use that room as example? Plenty of other deleted rooms, no?
Q: How come our main chat, Mos Eisley, got frozen this time?

MöozMos Eisley is currently frozen#, apparently indefinitely. I assume it has something to do with the users mentioned in @Shog9's banner, but is it possible that we be told - at least in concept - what happened in our room to make it get frozen again? If the rest of you want to create a new room...

12:45 PM
But yeah, chat privileges aren't fully or well documented.
@ShadowWizard That's the only room deleted by moderators I know I see, rather than deleted after some time automatically because of very little activity, or visible only to diamond mods in first place, or whatever. I don't know a better example, and I don't know an easy way to search for other deleted rooms.
Plus it came out in chat.
@ShadowWizard Yes, that's why after I checked meta.stackexchange.com/questions/58587/… , I asked here, because this chatroom is knowledgable.
You guys can divine winter bash hat rules quickly from very few examples. You might know the rule here.
That's true.
And even on just Meta SE, you see all sorts of random people give answers to questions that look like you could only answer if you read the source codes that implement SE. Not by developers, but by normal Meta SE users.
This room is competent. The problem is that I asked too early in the day.
Sometimes it's just a guess though.
So the assumption that one needs 10k rep (total) to see deleted rooms is also a guess, but one with very high chance of being correct. :)
We just had some discussion about how useful it is to post funny images in chat in the Sci Fi main room, and I mentioned the blighted room with its crazy taco images, and chat privilages.
@ShadowWizard It's more complicated. Some deleted rooms are hidden even then. Chat mods can hide deleted rooms from all non-mods. I think for some time Shog hid the room that much, but after a few weeks the mods decided to go back a little bit and show it to high rep users, still locked read-only obviously.
Even active rooms can be hidden to all but mods, mods use that to discuss sensitive details that even 20000 rep users of the same site like me can't see. So it's clear they can do that to a deleted room too.
@ShadowWizard Yup.
12:54 PM
@b_jonas that's a private room, not a deleted room.
Private room can be accessed only by mods, or user who get explicit access from a mod.
@ShadowWizard Yes. But there are also readable rooms writable only for room mods.
It's complicated.
Chat has like a ton of rules.
e.g. SE staff have lots of private rooms here on MSE chat domain.
There's superping, and there's inviting low-rep users, both powers of diamond mods.
@b_jonas yeah, I think super ping also auto invites the user, no?
Diamond mods have a lot of powers you can only occasionally here about, both on main sites and in chat. On main sites, they get notified if someone deletes a lot of their own comments in the same time. There's a lot of crazy stuff like this in the source code nobody knows about.
@ShadowWizard I've no idea.
I'm not a diamond.
12:56 PM
@JourneymanGeek does a super ping also auto invites the pinged user to the room?
(I wonder if there's anyone who puts a diamond character in his visible username for a main site. It wouldn't look exactly the same, because the real diamond has some font size thing on it, but confusing.)
@b_jonas the real diamond is a diamond character.
(it's not an image)
@ShadowWizard don't think so
@b_jonas That's technically impossible - it gets stripped.
@Mithrandir try on me... ;)
Q: Is making yourself appear (at first glance) to be a moderator acceptable behaviour?

Kate GregoryNote: I have read What are the rules governing display names and avatars? which was entirely focused on pretending to be a specific real-life person. On a site I use regularly, a user has a profile picture that looks like part of an autogenerated gravatar with an orange diamond in the rightmost ...

@b_jonas Heck, most mods don't know about all of those... ;)
@ShadowWizard done
1:01 PM
@Mithrandir nope.
> Oops! There was a problem updating your profile:
> Display Name can only contain letters, digits, spaces, apostrophes or hyphens and must start with a letter or digit
If you find a letter looking like a diamond, it will be saved.
@ShadowWizard Yes, but with a font size directive so it's bigger or smaller or something.
@Mithrandir no inbox message... :(
@ShadowWizard Ah.
So mod has to manually invite the user?
@b_jonas true
@ShadowWizard ...huh, that sounds like a bug
1:11 PM
@ShadowWizard I don't remember
So it just behaves like any other ping... except it pings even when the user was never in the room. :)
Not super useful if you need the user for something urgent.
@JourneymanGeek well... see above. ;)
I got a "real" super ping once from @JonEricson, to a private room. Wonder if that one also waited the 15 minutes before turning into inbox message.
1:56 PM
@ShadowWizard more or less
2:10 PM
I suppose for really urgent cases, the mod could temporarily change the user's chat profile preference to opt-in to Quicker Notifications.
2:31 PM
> No timeline yet, but it's on the radar
I guess that is beyond the 6 to 8 weeks mark?
2:51 PM
@PaulWhite umm... no? Much more simple would be to manually Invite the user which cause instant notification.
@rene in the past I'd say "6-8 nevers" but recently they actually start to do things, so.... 6-8 months isn't a dream anymore. ;)
Anything related to being more welcome, that is. Everything else is not relevant.
@ShadowWizard I thought you were specifically asking about a case that avoids that though. Not that it matters, I was just trying to be helpful in a general sense.
@MarkAmery I just read it completely. Surprisingly, I didn't feel anything. It's still mild compared to some of the first meta posts after the final CoC
@ShadowWizard I'm pretty sure that superpings are immediate...
@Catija the test with @Mithrandir proved otherwise. :)
It turned into inbox notification only after 15 minutes.
Maybe if done by SE staff it's instant, dunno.
@PaulWhite sorry, not getting you.. what case you thought I'm asking about? And thanks for trying to help! :)
3:00 PM
hmm indeed.
2 hours ago, by Shadow Wizard
So mod has to manually invite the user?
I can't think of another way to get an 'instant' notification without changing the chat preferences to enable that.
Perhaps we need a super-super-ping.
@PaulWhite sure there is a way, want me to send you such instant notification?
It just requires extra step, that's all. :)
Huh, I thought it pings you before the superping is sent...
3:04 PM
I already have Quicker Notifcations enabled though.
@PaulWhite not relevant. OK, ready?
@Paul you got it?
yes that worked
I know. :)
So I thought super ping is doing that step by itself, but turns out it's not.
3:05 PM
So what did you do differently?
@PaulWhite anyone with 100 rep can invite any user with 20 rep to any room.
This send the notification you saw.
Ah but I already had a chat.meta account
Guess it's part of the complicated chat privileges @b_jonas was talking about as well. :)
@PaulWhite chat account is created on the fly on the first visit to it.
Visit a chat profile of someone who doesn't have one, and you'll see it created in the same instant.
So... anything interesting on SE while I was watching The Meg?
@ShadowWizard Hm. How can one visit a profile that does not exist?
3:09 PM
I sent you a superping btw.
@PaulWhite huh, you're mod too! hides
everyone's a mod these days
(but no inbox notification yet. :))
they let anyone in
3:10 PM
I guess no then... shrug
@SomewhatMemorableName yes
@ShadowWizard Mind if I try it again with Quicker Notifcations enabled?
@ShadowWizard no
@PaulWhite sure, go ahead!
@SomewhatMemorableName maybe
@ShadowWizard sure
3:11 PM
@ShadowWizard Done
moving WAG chain to Den
@PaulWhite still no notification
hm so my idea did not work then 😢
still 5 minute window, I believe...
otoh I was on a different chat server so you might have to open a tab on an SE site
goodness me chat can be confusing
3:13 PM
@PaulWhite no, you didn't actually change it:
Guess it's borked. Bug report?
@ShadowWizard I changed it back 😉
oh lol
@PaulWhite that's true, I keep finding new rules and stuff about chat with years of being super active in it.
love the smiley lol :)
yeah friendly devs obviously
3:15 PM
or maybe it's a CoC-driven enhancement
nah, been like that forever
@Mithrandir flagged for spoiling my 'joke'
flagging the flag
3:24 PM
weird. there's this new line on the left side of SO, and it's misaligned with the header
Errgh, I saw a user who posted a thorough meta answer about how to get to CoC other than the banner... and is now on 3-day suspension???
guessing it's offset enough for the hamburger icon?
oh, all the navbars were just made wider
line looks out of place over there on it's own with no content on the left and no bg
3:45 PM
@SomewhatMemorableName yes, be careful what you ask for ...
3:59 PM
Anyway, new unified themes are live on Apple, Ubuntu, Tex, SU, SF, U&L and Maths
4:41 PM
Rain rocks
lots of houses, roads, bridges, vehicles, etc are destroyed because of rain
22 people died today
Govt. raised 1 shutter of a dam by 50 cm and the water flows through it is 50K litters/ second
Meanwhile, it's drought here...
I really hate the message banner when you flag a comment
A site shouldn't apologize for the action of 1
@SterlingArcher facebook do. When you block someone, they'll say "we're sorry that you had this experience"
I don't use facebook
you got a life
4:47 PM
No I just play video games and drink :P
@SterlingArcher I apologize ...
still... better than facebook
@rene that's a good Five Finger Death Punch song
still no luck on facebook
I tried to stop using whatsapp and facebook last year. Succeed on whatsapp
Enough daily dose of network-meta stalking...
4:51 PM
@SomewhatMemorableName nice find on that Quora stock/stack question. I did land on that profile but didn't check all posts, I gave up after 2.
network profile's activity tab could help :)
Top tip from me: A road is not a levee (or Dyke which sounds more like the Dutch word Dijk)
5:26 PM
except when it is
my gf said their well sank in water and there's no water to drink. Her family is planning to move to one of their relatives house by tomorrow. I invited her to my house and told her we can share my room. But she denied :-(
@Shog9 Can you please consider removing the vertical line on the left of the page (with the top bar collapsed)?
@SonictheInclusiveHedgehog he can't. He's a cm. only devs can
@OptimusPrime He's an occasional dev too...
5:52 PM
Just now, the shape of tags on MSE changed from a sharp rectangle to having curved corners.
Every time I get to my box, something has changed.
@Shog9 What should be done with this FAQ? It's about the old "not a real question" close reason.
6:19 PM
it does have a note, and is still providing good advice.
@KevinB Usually I'd close vote them, but Shog has complained about people closing FAQs.
> Note:
This close reason is old and only applies to old questions that were closed prior to the closing overhaul. This has been replaced by the reasons "unclear what you're asking" for unclear questions and "too broad" for overly broad questions. **Older questions that have been closed as "not a real question" will remain closed under this reason, so this question is left here for reference**.
@KevinB It made sense back when the close reasons were being changed; now you're extremely unlikely to come across a question closed for that reason. It was mostly intended for users whose own questions were closed for that reason.
@Shog9 Another IE-related bug that will probably get stuck in the mud due to opinionated downvotes: meta.stackexchange.com/questions/313933/…
@SonictheInclusiveHedgehog it seems to be off to the left in chrome as well but only by a couple of pixels, not as dramatic as it is in IE11
7:27 PM
@SonictheInclusiveHedgehog here, have an opinionated downvote. -clickity-
I must apologize for my unruly cat. -1
@JohnDvorak that reads like a mnemonic device...
i keep getting notifications for things i've already seen... First sonic's ping at me here, now a comment that i replied to...
7:42 PM
Wasn't there a bug report earlier about a queue that was stuck for the notifications?
Maybe it is catching up ... again ...
1 hour later…
8:47 PM
@ShadowWizard No no no you can't. There's no link from anywhere on userpages on a non-chat site to the chat accounts. You can only guess the chat accounts, and verify backwards, because there are links from the chat account to a user account, then from the user account to the SE account, then from the SE account to all non-chat acccounts except for the chat and per-site meta and area51 accounts. Then there's a link from any of the ordinary sites to its meta site.
Users can hide the link from their SE account page to any particular site account, which also hides it from any other site account that lists the top 5 other sites, but if you find the hidden site account you can verify it, and you can find hidden accounts systematically from the database dump or SEDE unless it's new.
But chat sites aren't in the dumps or SEDE, so you can't find chat accounts either.
At least this is how I saw so far.
Chat accounts might be created automatically if the logged in user himself visits chat, I don't know, I created the three of mine ages ago.
chat.stackexchange.com/accounts/<NetworkID> will go to the chat profile.
And per-site meta accounts are shared with the main site account (same number even), but show different info in the user profile, same user blurb/bio and rep but only main or meta posts and badges.
So will chat.<site>.stackexchange.com/accounts/<siteID>
@Mithrandir Oh! I didn't know that. The chat account id is the network ID?
I'm stupid to not notice that.
@b_jonas No, it's not.
But it'll get you to the right place.
8:51 PM
Let me check. Is that true for all three chats?
Note that it's /accounts/, not /users/.
@Mithrandir So that's why I didn't find the feature. It's completely hidden.
@b_jonas well, chat.meta and chat.SO are the same ID as on the main site - just prepend chat. to the URL. Chat.SE is a bit trickier.

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