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Sonic the Inclusive Hedgehog

12:49 AM

cv-pls meta.stackexchange.com/questions/313350/…

heather

3:11 AM

^if anyone is on electronics.SE, needs a rollback

user blanked question.

Magisch

4:42 AM

→ 3 messages moved to Chimney - housekeeping

Somewhat Memorable Name

5:01 AM

I forgot this Chrome at office is version 68, and thus, no dots on pinned tabs (this story again!?)

Oh yeah.. last alternative: enable desktop notification then turn sound notification to "all my rooms"...

Magisch

6:08 AM

morning

Somewhat Memorable Name

Apparently it didn't help, oh well :)

morning too~

Magisch

Nothing like strolling into the 31C warm office at 8am

gonna be a fun day

John Dvorak

I'm going to spend 5.5 hours of today sitting in a closed metal box on a pair of really long metal rods with no human settlements anywhere close to where I'll be, for the sole purpose of exiting it at a different place than where I entered it.

rene

Someone around for MSO deletion: meta.stackoverflow.com/a/371732/578411

Magisch

@JohnDvorak train rides are fun

John Dvorak

6:21 AM

Yup.

I'll hit Bratislava at 16 o'clock, expecting 32C at 40% humidity and not a cloud in sight

rene

sounds awesome.

Bratislava that is

John Dvorak

It's just a layover. Heading for Podhajska ultimately.

rene

Is that a holiday destination? Or do you need to work there?

John Dvorak

Holiday

I'm actually scheduled to stay in Bratislava for just ten minutes before heading off.

rene

That doesn't look unpleasant

John Dvorak

6:30 AM

They aren't cheap though

rene

@JohnDvorak if you want to do cheap then you need to go backpacking and camp in the wild, hunt for your own food

Magisch

hunting often needs an expensive permit

John Dvorak

And even more expensive healthcare :P

rene

If you're bound to shoot in your foot you better go to a Spa/wellness resort, yes ...

Magisch

@JohnDvorak hah, jokes on you, going to the hospital is free here

rene

6:36 AM

delv-pls 20K exact meta.stackexchange.com/questions/313350/… /cc @Bart @Glorfindel @ShadowWizard @TravisJ

Shadow Wizard

7:23 AM

@rene exect and kaboom

Shadow Wizard

7:51 AM

Found new coins!

JNat

8:24 AM

@ShadowWizard needs to go site by site. Still: gone ;)

Shadow Wizard

@JNat thanks!! Remind me again, you also need to manually delete the network profile itself, or does it get deleted all by itself when all accounts nuked?

(think you told me once, but it's not consistent)

Magisch

@JNat you're Just a Natural at this, :P

JNat

@ShadowWizard the former. I was told once that the latter would be the future, but not sure it is yet

Shadow Wizard

@JNat oh, so I'm pretty sure they are not auto deleted.

@rene not sure that was your intention, but author of that is now suspended. :)

Derpy

@ShadowWizard is their value tied to the price of a McDonald's Big Mac?

Shadow Wizard

8:41 AM

@Derpy hehe, so you heard about it too! Yup, their actual value if half the price of Big Mac. Here in Israel, 17 NIS. :)

(around $5)

Magisch

'was gonna go on a tangent of how 5$ for a bigmac is pretty expensive but then I remembered that thing has calories for half a day

Shadow Wizard

Not a big fan of Big Mac, it's too small for me. (the meat loaf itself)

@Magisch $5 is half its price

It costs 34 NIS which are around $10

Only with the coin it will cost 17. :)

Magisch

now that's pretty expensive

Shadow Wizard

And you get one coin when you buy at full price.

@Magisch yeah, Israel isn't cheap, in general.

Magisch

I bought produce and eggs to cook and some chicken to freeze today for a total of 12 eur

will last 4-5 days

Shadow Wizard

8:44 AM

e.g. cars cost here at least double than USA, many times triple and much more.

You can't find a decent car here (fitting for family, not a mini car) in less than 30k USD

Magisch

Good thing I'm using a bicycle then

Shadow Wizard

@Magisch here that's the price of 1kg chicken meat.

Eggs cost around 1 NIS for one egg.

Magisch

whot

Do you also earn comparably more?

What's your rent like?

Shadow Wizard

@Magisch not really, average salary in Israel is around 8k NIS

Magisch

8k a year?

or month?

Shadow Wizard

8:47 AM

@Magisch sky high, and always in the rise... these days decent house fitting for family with kids is at least 5k NIS per month

Magisch

it's month right?

Shadow Wizard

@Magisch oh, month, yeah.

Magisch

I have a small apartment which is dirt cheap

Shadow Wizard

So 70% of the salary is already burned on rent...

Magisch

dirt cheap even for the local market and this is a cheap region to begin with

Shadow Wizard

8:48 AM

but you're alone so it's easy.

Magisch

rent is I think 12% of my salary right now

Shadow Wizard

That's pretty good.

Magisch

though turns out I don't really have expensive hobbies so I can save quite a bit

Food is cheap (the food I like anyways) and so are games on steam

Shadow Wizard

At least you pay for games, others only download pirated copies. :)

rene

@ShadowWizard not my intent but works for me

Shadow Wizard

8:52 AM

@rene good! :D

Magisch

@ShadowWizard I'm a creature of convenience

Shadow Wizard

@Magisch meaning?

Magisch

Pirating stuff a) rarely works for online games and b) is more work then buying it most of the time

especially when I can buy high quality games for under 10$ a pop on a sale

Shadow Wizard

@Magisch nice

Derpy

9:32 AM

@Magisch to be fair, I moved to consoles because buying stuff on pc was becoming increasingly harder, to the point that pirated software usually would have less drawbacks than the original DRM filled version. And since I didn't want to support piracy... here I am now

Magisch

@Derpy We play different kinds of games then

Derpy

> Sorry, now Diablo is online only because ~~we need to push the real money marketplace~~ ensure no one cheats and ruin your offline experience. Also, to improve your experience we will include this DRM that mess your dvd player drivers and blocks dvd burning apps. But it doesn't end here: as a special bonus we are also including a free limited number of activations that totally has nothing to do with stopping you from reselling the game as used when you finish it or get bored of it.

Game Market 101.

Not completely different on consoles, but at least they haven't access to some of the most irritating features. YET

Journeyman Geek

ehh

Derpy

So far, I didn't had to "activate" any console game.

some time they try to trick me into buying things with Day-One-DLC-That-Is-Not-On-The-Disk-But-Instead-Requires-A-Single-Use-Code-That-‌You-Can-Not-Resell but that's it mostly.

Shadow Wizard

10:16 AM

How come it wasn't detected??? ^

Two links, ending with a link, key words... is Smokey borked?

Somewhat Memorable Name

Smokey caught it by 9 reasons, but he(it?) was too lazy to push it here, compared to a brown fox...

Shadow Wizard

@SomewhatMemorableName no, the spam was live for 12 minutes.

No way Smokey reported it automatically.

Mithrandir

in Charcoal HQ on The Stack Exchange Network Chat, 7 mins ago, by SmokeDetector

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Bad ns for domain in body, bad keyword in body, bad keyword in title, blacklisted website in body, link at end of body, +4 more: best weights for weight loss by terrywhite on meta.SE

Derpy

10:34 AM

in the meantime, somewhere else...

Just discovered that the Kotobukiya made MLP action figure is now three separate action figures.

Shadow Wizard

10:48 AM

@Mithrandir huh? Omg.... think I saw 12 seconds ago and thought it's 12 minutes ago. :/

My bad!

Magisch

11:31 AM

@Derpy The bottom line is publishers want all game sales to be new game sales

If that is guaranteed (e.g no used games) then they're willing to go a lot lower in price, too

It's the reason why you can grab 60+ $ games for under 10 a year after release in a steam sale

Cause from a used game sale, they see 0$

Somewhat Memorable Name

11:46 AM

looked up NieR:Automata's price.... hmm, nope!

oh, yeah, it also depends on the country...

Shadow Wizard

whoa expensive

Derpy

@Magisch to be fair, Amazon drops prices on console games too.

Magisch

@Derpy I wanted to buy Horizon: Zero Dawn the other day

and it was still 55$

Derpy

GameStop, on the other hand......

Magisch

If that was a steam game the GotY edition would have been out & 15 bucks max on a sale

Shadow Wizard

11:54 AM

Last game I bought: amazon.com/Ni-Kuni-II-Revenant-Kingdom-PlayStation/dp/… ($30)

Derpy

@Magisch 29€ around here, Complete Edition.

Derpy

12:21 PM

@ShadowWizard king edition.

Derpy

12:46 PM

ok, this is too good not to share.

probably more fitting for Anime, but...

Anne Daunted

What about the prickles?

Derpy

1:00 PM

@AnneDaunted those are needed to keep him angry and thus more powerful (because in anime anger=strength)

Catija

Particularly when it comes to Vegeta.

Magisch

insert over 9000 joke

Anne Daunted

Thanks for the explanation! I'm totally clueless about anime.

Derpy

Magisch

→ 15 messages moved to Chimney

Derpy

1:02 PM

@Catija The seasoning? Ah, nope, you must be talking about the other one.

Somewhat Memorable Name

1:14 PM

@Derpy Super Saiyan Rose... literally...

> "Huh? Pink? Why is it pink?" — Goku confused about the transformation's appearance.

Optimus Prime

1:36 PM

When I write a post on my blog, on that day it gets 1K+ views. Rest of the days, it is <50. Here's a pyramid from ad earnings report.

didn't wrote a post after 24th

Shadow Wizard

@Derpy what's that? I didn't really look into it to be honest.

Derpy

This is the king edition

this is the collector edition instead

there is also a limited edition that has less bonus content (only the artbook and the metal game case I think)

as you can see, they made a very weird decision there.

Shadow Wizard

1:51 PM

@Derpy oh, meaning it arrives with swag? Nice, but not for me... I'm only into the game itself. :)

Derpy

The collector and the king edition both have exclusive content

like, the collector has the "music box" you can see in the middle (which spins and plays the game theme)

the collector has the mini-figures.

Shadow Wizard

@Derpy could be really cool if the box was connected to the game somehow, detect what songs you collected, and play only those. Or let you play it via the game. :D

Somewhat Memorable Name

Lego Dimension???

Derpy

Shadow Wizard

@SomewhatMemorableName hmm? What?

How is lego related to any of this? puzzled

Derpy

1:55 PM

@ShadowWizard ^ the first game had the physical version of the Wizard Companion book.

@ShadowWizard lego Dimension

Shadow Wizard

@Derpy what is it? Where did you see it?

Derpy

Shadow Wizard

@Derpy and how is it related to what we talked about before?

Derpy

^ this is lego dimension. It is a videogame. You see the portal in the figure? They sell special lego figures than can be placed on the portal.

Doing so "summons" the figure in the game.

Shadow Wizard

Oh, so @Some gave it as example to what I said about swag connecting to the game?

Pretty hard to make that leap without knowing the game.... :P

Derpy

1:57 PM

basically yes

it is the same as Disney Infinity, Skylanders, the Nintendo amiibo figures and so on

Shadow Wizard

I know exactly 0 of the above ^

:)

To be honest... my knowledge of games is very limited, never considered myself a true gamer.

When I play a "full scale" game on PC/PS I try to do all side quests, but that's about it: I don't play the game again, I don't buy related items, and not even downloading any DLC.

Somewhat Memorable Name

Me neither... more of a watcher than a player though...

Shadow Wizard

Can say I'm a.... Vanila Gamer, perhaps?

@SomewhatMemorableName Watcher can't really play... unless you mean you actually watch others play? :)

Somewhat Memorable Name

Like, have been watching 3 full playthroughs of Life is Strange and countless of Undertale

Shadow Wizard

@SomewhatMemorableName watching where? YouTube or IRL friends?

Somewhat Memorable Name

2:04 PM

both, but mostly YouTube

Shadow Wizard

heh. I played Undertale for a while but... stopped. Something didn't "connect" for me.

It's not a bad game, just... not my taste.

(got it for free from a friend as a gift)

Anne Daunted

@Catija Since you are a CM now, does it make sense to still list you among room owners?

Shadow Wizard

I reached pretty far (I think) but when the puzzles became harder I just didn't find myself wanting to complete them.

Somewhat Memorable Name

Maybe it's kind of a... cult game? Like Yume Nikki, or Stanley's Parable

(the latter is not really cult, but... 4th wall breaker)

Shadow Wizard

maybe, yeah...

So you didn't play anything all by yourself? @Some

Somewhat Memorable Name

2:08 PM

All mentioned above? No...

I did buy Undertale... only for the OST though...

Mithrandir

@Derpy To be clear: That is not me.

Somewhat Memorable Name

I played FF13, Ori, Borderlands 1 & 2 (trying to finish Pre-Sequel now), and~ Crash Bandicoot Trilogy

And, oh.. Portal 1 & 2, Talos, and... add Antichamber to the list for fun...

Shadow Wizard

That's not so bad!

So you're not just a Watcher. :D

Derpy

@SomewhatMemorableName yume nikki.... you mean the original right? Not the "remake" I hope.

Somewhat Memorable Name

@Derpy yep.

Ao Oni is fine too

and... SCP - Containment Breach. I guess the only 2 games that still scare me...

Derpy

2:20 PM

have fun with Yomawari then.

or maybe Fragile. But the later is more "I will sadden you deeply" than something scary.

Somewhat Memorable Name

Hmm.. interesting...

Derpy

Warning: red level disclaimer. Fragile is VERY sad.

And by "sad" I mean something like "Grave of the Fireflies" level of sad.

Kevin B

3:13 PM

hi

Feeds

3:31 PM

The heat index is calculated via looking up the "effective temperature" in a table of air temperature and humidity values, and then adding a bunch more degrees because it feels WAY hotter than that.

Somewhat Memorable Name

Reminds me of high-school science report: does the measurement look too good to be true? → redo the measurement

Martin James

'Does it look hot enough?' No? Change the units and move the axes.

Summer sounds better in Kelvin.

Somewhat Memorable Name

change from linear to logarithmic

Martin James

@SomewhatMemorableName lol, we should be pollsters:)

rene

3:49 PM

→ 32 messages moved to Chimney

rene

4:04 PM

> you're going to find yourself on the wrong side of Stack Overflow

Never knew a Stack Overflow had 2 sides

Martin James

@rene It has two ends and, some might say, two faces.

'Please read the help pages, take the SO tour, read about how to ask good questions, and learn how to create a Minimal, Complete, and Verifiable Example.' [meh, another no-effort, POS homework dump. Why do they bother? Do they think we are too stupid to notice?]

Tim Post

4:27 PM

@TravisJ Do you have any ideas on how we could get tag wikis more exposure? Going back on meta and notes and stuff we've tried at least a dozen linking strategies because they are useful, but tend to get the same visibility as the back page of the business section of a printed newspaper that only retired people read (to put it bluntly).

With new nav options and stuff I've been keeping a 'nose' out for placing them better and integrating them more, but nothing has really jumped out as inspiring yet.

That's always been the problem, making them more discoverable. I'm even open to a badge for discovering them and doing a few things once you had (that wouldn't cause annoyance in the review queues)

heather

@TimPost ...stupid idea of the day: when you ask your first question in a tag, you get to review the tag wiki to make sure you know how to use the tag if you're below a certain rep level?

as in question ask screen -> press "ask question" -> tag wiki screen pops up for a tag -> confirm use of tag button pressed -> question asked.

that would make them "matter" and get them more exposure...though probably not the kind you're looking for.

Tim Post

Could do some more deliberate stuff to at least show the excerpt of the info page if it exists in the new wizard interface, hmmm.

rene

run tag ads

Or offer a slot in the hot meta posts for a tag needs love slot

Tim Post

4:53 PM

Adopt-a-tag, not a bad idea.

rene

But don't let those C++ followers near the PHP tag ...

πάντα ῥεῖ

That would probably result in a middle size catastrophy :3

Catija

5:10 PM

@TimPost I think that the excerpt gets a ton of visibility and I wonder if that's not harming the wiki itself. I've been really surprised at how huge and detailed some of the wikis are on Cooking and I've never even thought to look at them. By the same token, many of them are empty or useless, so we don't give users a reliable experience when looking at them.

πάντα ῥεῖ

5:26 PM

Maybe we should rigorously burninate all tags without a tag wiki description?

rene

meh

@πάνταῥεῖ I would rather address this: meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/313486/…

Maybe you should call it documentation in the left-nav bar and then just link to tags

Travis J

6:36 PM

@TimPost Starting simple... At present, it seems to be more hidden than it used to be. The tag hover element doesn't include a link anymore to the tag wiki, making it impossible to even get there from the tags page without clicking through and finding a second link. That also closes the door on getting there with one click from anywhere else the tags occur. Thus, the only entrance is when you click on the tag to see the list of questions and then find the "learn more..." link (oddly named imo).

Just from this angle, it would make far more sense for the "learn more..." link to actually occurr at the end of the abstract in both the hover menu and when on the page in the questions tagged page. Beyond that, another option would be to offer the most prominent tag as the hovered tag menu in the sidebar on questions, just above hot questions. These would be very simple first steps towards trying to get more exposure to the tag wikis.

In an even broader sense, since I think the tag wikis are an extremely good place for information, making an actual wiki interface page that you can search in, and expanding the tag wikis to have linkable sub sections with insertable examples from documentation would make an awesome place for simple information. Something like that.

clarification: occur inline at the end of the abstract (as in on the same line as the end of the text similar to how some paragraphs have a more... expansion).

heather

..maybe on SO documentation can even someday be redone in the tag wikis.

it's too bad documentation was sunsetted, i really liked it, even though there was a lot that could've been improved.

Travis J

@heather yeah, I really think there is an opportunity there

πάντα ῥεῖ

The rep system was quite a weirdo thing.

Travis J

agree

Kevin B

yeah but without rep being involved only things like java and javascript would get the proper attention

Travis J

6:40 PM

Creating a place for that type of information was amazing though. That information needed somewhere to live and it was getting generated to some degree.

heather

@KevinB eh...i wrote a bunch of LaTeX documentation even though I got no rep for it.

Travis J

I think tag wikis could be a good place for the examples to live.

heather

if that was incorporated into tag wikis? that would be awesome.

and it would mean documentation is auto-rolled out to every site in the network.

Kevin B

I'm not saying no one would do it without rep, just that without it, you still have the same problem

Travis J

@heather Yeah :D

Kevin B

6:42 PM

the things that need it the most are the ones least likely to get it

heather

@KevinB +2 for tag wiki edits. Not really a lot, and easily abused by making a ton of small edits, but.

Travis J

I don't think tag wiki edits get abused that much.

heather

you'd have to get a better handle on the plagiarism deal as @Catija said

πάντα ῥεῖ

@TravisJ Me too

Travis J

Tag wikis, or examples in them, wouldn't need rep to generate content or interest.

heather

6:43 PM

@TravisJ not currently, b/c nobody really knows about them =P

Kevin B

With rep rewards people were at least incentivized to add new documentation, but there was so much just regurgitated documentation

Travis J

@heather har har :P

heather

anyway, there's people who copy-paste wikipedia ledes into tag wikis and expect rep (and sometimes get it), so.

@KevinB some of it was kinda crap, yeah. The voting system was screwed up imho.

Kevin B

there was little to no reason for javascript to be documented with SO documentation

Travis J

On Stack Overflow there is a good amount of users keeping an eye on wikipedia plagiarism in tag wikis.

Kevin B

6:44 PM

or jquery

heather

so it was hard to separate out the wheat from the chaff.

Kevin B

or any number of other popular and well documented languages

πάντα ῥεῖ

But tag wikis might be a too narrow entry point for real documentation wikis. We'll never be able to beat cppreference.com for eaxample. And we probably shouldn't even try so.

Travis J

@Kevin - You are getting off topic though.

Kevin B

how?

heather

6:45 PM

what's the problem with JS documentation?

Travis J

This isn't a discussion about Documentation in its entirety. Was literally just to take the example feature and include it into the tag wikis.

πάντα ῥεῖ

On the other hand Delphi (Emba) docs are soo poor, that this could be a starting point.

heather

or could you imagine the fabulousness of documentation on, say, math.SE? or physics.SE?

Kevin B

Won't that have the same problem/

Tim Post

I agree that Documentation ended up looking like what Tag Wikis should have been closer to when we launched (as in a part of them), but tag wikis also list quirks intrinsic with questions in that tag.

heather

6:47 PM

learning by example about calculus for free would be kinda amazing.

Kevin B

Which examples should be shown? or do you mean, using the examples tool as more of a way to show example questions that can be asked, or questions to avoid?

heather

@TimPost most of the ones i've seen leave the quirks for the usage guidance, and then the wiki is effectively a...wikipedia article that's better.

Travis J

It would extremely limit the scope of the examples. Sure, in broad tags there may be excessive data, but in a tag wiki, is having too much info really a downside?

Tim Post

What keeps hitting me is, on most screens, we have a ton of real-estate in the left nav when viewing any major tag search. And we want to play more with tag-specific CTA's (like if [foobar] is being proposed for deprecation, anyone that asked / answered a question with it might want to know, and probably would never see the discussion).

heather

@TravisJ in a broad tag you link to the smaller tag's tag wiki - sort of like wikipedia's outlines.

Travis J

6:49 PM

@TimPost The meta inclusions could remain there, the idea for examples was just to be as additions, not to replace the current structure. Although, it would be nice to be able to include subpage links some how in the tag wikis.

Tim Post

Maybe house ads for tags might be a good start for visibility and a better system to get more folks alerted to janitorial needs.

Travis J

@heather True

heather

@TimPost i've always kinda thought tag search is more difficult than it needs to be - there's a question on SO meta I wrote a while ago about documentation in finding specific language documentation, let me find it...

Travis J

@KevinB I just meant that perhaps the format of examples would allow the tag wiki layout to become more structured, with linkable sections, perhaps collapsible?, no voting on them though, just to make it slightly more parceled.

@TimPost I don't think it needs to replace any adspace though, if it went right before the hot network questions list (since that is pretty low priority space anyway) that would still be good enough.

heather

ah this thing (my drawings look even more terrible looking back at them...)

but the sort of web-to-find-tags idea is one i like.

Kevin B

7:02 PM

So, collapsible sections

heather

basically, yeah - sorting the tags by overall topic.

probably never going to be implemented, but while we're discussing this thought i'd bring it up.

Tim Post

@TravisJ As an object, it would technically be an ad, and have access to all the wiring that ads do, but in practice it wouldn't be advertising anything other than functionality that might have eluded someone. So even though it's technically an ad, putting it somewhere new (and exclusive only to it) wouldn't mean creating a new ad space.

But yeah, above the HNQ on big screens might work, or even left-side on tag related partials, under the nav. I'll play around with a spec.

JonSG

7:25 PM

Is anyone here a moderator or senior member? With the new code of conduct I am considering flagging a comment, but the poster is a very senior member of the community. Can anyone give me some guidance?

πάντα ῥεῖ

Can you link your example and what you intend to flag?

Especially some seniors sometimes tend to get rude.

Travis J

@TimPost Cool!

JonSG

The comment is in response to a low point total member answer. The poster with a VERY high point count says "oh, nice, preventing paste... (not!)" This comment has also been upvoted twice. It seems "less than welcoming to me". Later in the exchange, the very high level poster offers a much more helpful comment that would have been a better opening

Travis J

Flag it as no longer needed.

Doesn't really seem to be contributing anything meaningful.

Catija

@JonSG Don't let reputation cloud your judgement when it comes to that sort of thing. It's much better for the mods to be aware of it and choose to act or not, than to not be aware at all. When it comes to comments, there's no penalty for declined flags.

JonSG

7:30 PM

I feel like this is something that SO is attempting to address via the new code of conduct, but given the upvotes and the reputation of the user I am worried that I am going to end up with the wrist

Catija

Is it here on MSE or one of the actual sites?

JonSG

is is on SO proper

πάντα ῥεῖ

I won't consider that rude or unwelcoming, unnecessary though.

Travis J

I flagged it.

Now you can stop worrying :P

JonSG

I can give you a link

I'm curious why you would not consider this type of post unwelcoming? If the attempt was to be funny, the new CoC clearly calls that out. To me it seems nothing but snarky

Thanks Travis.

πάντα ῥεῖ

7:36 PM

I don't consider that snarky, more like a Hmmmm, interesting ...

Catija

Sometimes it depends on context. I could imagine that being an actual joke but I'm not looking at the post itself. I do agree that it's not actually adding anything (even without context). The last revision of the CoC draft (2nd) mentions being cautious with jokes as they can be misinterpreted easily but that's not an outright prohibition.

Travis J

I don't really consider it to fall in the rude category, but it certainly could have had more information in it. What specifically prevented paste that the user observed? Later on, once pressed, they do seem to get back into the reasons, so removing the first comment with nothing in it seems to make sense to me there.

Anyway, its gone now, it was marked helpful.

JonSG

Many thanks for your input friends, and for your assistance Travis

Travis J

:D

Kevin B

it's clearly sarcastic, and imo would certainly be valid criticism.

but it could have been better expressed

πάντα ῥεῖ

7:57 PM

@KevinB Then there's still in question if that was really "excessively sarcastic"

Shadow Wizard

What did I miss?

πάντα ῥεῖ

Nothing important probably

Shadow Wizard

Nothing is important

Kevin B

At least it was made obvious that it was sarcasm

Shadow Wizard

So weird, with bare walls and no furniture, the keyboard has a weird echo noise.

@KevinB oh, unwelcoming sarcasm? Guess that's going to become more and more common, or at least more and more flagged.

Is the sarcastic user suspended?

rene

8:04 PM

Leave me to it

Kevin B

i disagree that sarcasm is unwelcoming... but whatever

hate to see good criticism being removed due to feelings.

πάντα ῥεῖ

sarcasm != criticism (inherently) != feelings (inherently)

sarcasm sometimes makes feel others dumb themselves, since they noticed. If they don't notice they are a bit lost, what it means and don't find that useful in 1st place.
But the latter is mostly the fraction who just look for a free, low efforts solution of their problem.

At least we could consider some degree of sarcasm being helpful and welcoming, because we just appeal to the intelligence of the questioner, and don't imply any bad intentions from their side.

sarcasm is innocent and friendly in a way, even if the addressed person is left with a bit of bitter feeling.

Not that I'm avoiding it lotta hell myself since the CoC changed :P

Martin James

8:22 PM

@KevinB It wouldn't be so bad if the trash questions could be removed due to my feelings. Most of the questions asked on Sundays on the C tag are unwelcome and rude. It seems that my feelings don't matter.

Travis J

Sarcasm is the lowest form of humor.

Martin James

It's an art form. Like good software design.

πάντα ῥεῖ

sarcasm is one way to shield people from their own feelings and deal with offensiveness in managing bad statements brought up to them.

The humor level is quite low, yes.

How funny is truth at all?

Travis J

In the sense that anyone can be sarcastic just as anyone can produce art, perhaps it is a form of art. However, it is certainly not like good software design.

The truth is hilarious. It just requires proper timing and explanation. Almost all famous standup comedians use truth in their comedy, and almost none of them use sarcasm aside from very sparingly.

Martin James

@TravisJ Neither is a Bugatti Chiron. Sadly, I can only manage two out of three of those art forms.

@TravisJ Truth is not allowed by the CoC.

πάντα ῥεῖ

8:30 PM

@TravisJ "It just requires proper timing and explanation." Good point!

@MartinJames Nonsense!

Martin James

@πάνταῥεῖ You consider that "Your question is a mutiple-duplicate that is covered by the tag FAQ, 'Programming for Dummies' and any 'Computers 101' course. Refer either one" would be considered acceptable?

Travis J

This suit is black not.

@MartinJames As long as you link to one. I mean, are you commenting because you are upset with them, or because you are trying to help? If the former, why bother? If the latter, then at least show the duplicate or book, or whichever holds the information.

πάντα ῥεῖ

A question like "Why can't I use foobar() @ exit; in brimble_bla" and an answer given "Because the brimble_bla language designers didn't consider that useful syntax yet" is a perfectly fine answer.

@TravisJ I am trying to keep up balance with both aspects.

I'm to cool to get upset anymore :P

Travis J

:P

πάντα ῥεῖ

@MartinJames CV as dupe then, and propose more dupes.

@TravisJ Isn't that this guy who was wearing that incredible neon green bathing suit?

I've got another example (of an XY-problem):
Q: "How can I prevent my fridge gathering data about my food consumption behavior?"
A: "Just pull its plug!"

Well, TBH sarcasm is a grey field regarding welcomeness and usefulness, and as mentioned I'm avoiding it as hell meanwhille.

It totally depends on a mindset coherence of the questioner and answerer which can't be presumed in general.

@TravisJ I am cool as a fridge ;-)

Travis J

9:05 PM

At least answers have downvotes.

You would probably be surprised at how many people would downvote all these junk comments, but instead we only see how many people upvote them.

-100, +2 comment looks like someone agreed with it.

πάντα ῥεῖ

9:18 PM

I didn't say I encourage these kinda comments, you noticed that?

If they got -100 flags and no mod agreed with these, they'll still survive though.

Travis J

"You would be surprised" is mostly an expression used for a broader "you", meaning most people. I should have used a better expression, I know you wouldn't be surprised.

That said, I often wish there were comment downvotes.

πάντα ῥεῖ

As an hobbyist actor, I well know how bad sarcasm is achieved in the broader public (auditorium). It's as you mentioned a matter of good timing and self explanatory nature.

Travis J

:)

Sonic the Inclusive Hedgehog

10:51 PM

chaos-emerald-pls meta.stackexchange.com/questions/169727/… (@Shadow)

Sonic the Inclusive Hedgehog

11:59 PM

🎂🎂🎂🎂🎂 Happy 10th birthday Stack Exchange! 🎂🎂🎂🎂🎂

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