Tavern on the Meta

Elias

2:20 AM

morning...

rene

5:41 AM

@Elias sorry, I was asleep. Good Morning!

→ 11 messages moved to Chimney

user202362

6:19 AM

urgent question: where to spot bear in yellowstone national park??

rene

Try near the honey pot ...

user202362

that will attract the bees, bees down south act pretty much like flies

Journeyman Geek

6:58 AM

@Michelle heh, usually folks tend to do it quietlike

Xavier Combelle

@JourneymanGeek ok, but it is one more strange rules that apply only to meta. And moreover this question doesn't intend to ask for agreement or disagreement on the consequences of the fact, but the reality of the fact. I understand that most of people prefer to be wrong than to feel in danger

SmokeDetector

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Offensive title detected: My Disk Utility looks like this. I fucked up something by Eli Cash on apple.SE

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Bad NS for domain in answer, link at end of answer: Is Coca Cola bad for Nightshades and curcubits? by Andy Butler on gardening.SE

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] URL in title: mumybear.com/sex-during-and-after-pregnancy/ by Morales Szofran on astronomy.SE

Journeyman Geek

7:27 AM

@XavierCombelle Meta has a bit of an odd history - and nearly anything on meta is up for discussion.

And really, its partially the timing and partially the tone. And well, I suppose it also antagnises a few.

And heh, danger would be an understatement if it was valid.

And I think the question I was asking myself when I read the question is "What is he trying to achieve?"

rene

delv-pls 20K second q in a row from same OP this morning meta.stackexchange.com/questions/300934/… /cc @Bart @ShaWizDowArd @TravisJ

Journeyman Geek

heh, that guy

rene

yeah, your attempt was nice. I opted for the blunt option

Journeyman Geek

7:43 AM

;p

I almost went [help] [tour] READ!

rene

LOL

Sha Wiz Dow Ard

@rene yeah probably q banned on SO, those are usually desperate.

Journeyman Geek

yup

Sha Wiz Dow Ard

Worth flagging the question, they better be suspended to stop the flood as they won't just stop posting off topic questions by themselves. @Oded usually do this, as far as I know. :)

rene

@ShaWizDowArd I'm also desperate to keep the precious MSE free of that stuff

Sha Wiz Dow Ard

7:47 AM

@rene and you got The Power

Elias

8:14 AM

darn... fell asleep >_<

rene

@Elias please don't ...

Journeyman Geek

and he does it again

darn it

meta.stackexchange.com/questions/300938/… kill with fire kthx.

whoo self deleted

Elias

!!/report anime.stackexchange.com/a/42349

SmokeDetector

8:31 AM

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Blacklisted website in answer: Estes Courier Tracking Link by vanessanie on magento.SE

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Manually reported answer: When was the first usage of 'white light' censorship in anime? by user35659 on anime.SE

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Manually reported answer: Visio 2013 - Easily Mask an Image by Dhiman Chakma on superuser.com

Sha Wiz Dow Ard

9:12 AM

!!/wake @Elias

Elias

9:24 AM

@ShaWizDowArd Did I miss something?

SmokeDetector

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Blacklisted website in answer: Merge PDF annotations from two files by Thomas on askubuntu.com

Elias

@SmokeDetector locked! halp!

Xavier Combelle

@JourneymanGeek What I want to achive ? simply have control on my contributions. basically I had no choice but contribute on this site if I wanted to answer question about computer and I disagree that it massively advertise, and I was aware that it massively advertise long after I contribute

and it is not me who had chose the rules, it is stack overflow, the less that one can ask it respect its own rules

Journeyman Geek

> basically I had no choice but contribute on this site if I wanted to answer question about computer

While I do admit SO's the 800 pound gorilla in the room, there's other ways to share knowledge.

> I disagree that it massively advertise

I assume you mean jobs? You do realise that SE needs a revenue source right?

Xavier Combelle

9:41 AM

not jobs, disable your adblocker and see. On a small screen, it occupy half of the screen

I realize it needs a revenue source, but I have zero control on how this revenue is spent

Journeyman Geek

@XavierCombelle "disable your adblocker"

Xavier Combelle

in particular, the main part of their revenue is used to do things like jobs to gather more revenue

Journeyman Geek

(I'd point out SE has a VERY enlightned approach to those)

Xavier Combelle

like jobs precisely

I would bet that now, stack overflow by itself would need very little revenue to keep alive

Journeyman Geek

@XavierCombelle so, if you look at SE's "internal" hiring listings...

Xavier Combelle

9:44 AM

@JourneymanGeek the problem is that the main of the users of stackoverflow simply don't have an adblocker otherwise they would be zero point to make ad, from revenue standpoint

Journeyman Geek

@XavierCombelle assuming they don't. I'm pretty sure a lot of 'techie' folks arn't

Xavier Combelle

I don't get why one would need ~400 persons to run a QA and answer site

Journeyman Geek

@XavierCombelle ever run one?

Xavier Combelle

according to stackoverflow.com/company/team

especially when basically all the functionnallity are here

Journeyman Geek

oh until things break.

and there's a LOT of behind the scenes work going on - lots of tweaking and performance improvement

(nick carver's twitter is fairly educational, suprisingly despite the terse format..)

Xavier Combelle

9:51 AM

Journeyman: indexerror.net is a qa, run by two men on they additional time

Journeyman Geek

@XavierCombelle running Q2A

which I must say, looks a lot better than it did before.

Will it scale? ;)

Xavier Combelle

I agree it is not on the same scale, but definitly it doesn't need four hundreds persons to run such a site as big as it is, especially when the main funcionnality is here.

Journeyman Geek

@XavierCombelle work dosen't scale linearly though. And any change is complex

and if you see a good chunk of current hires and jobs hiring at SE arn't technical at all.

Xavier Combelle

I would say that 50 persons should be largely enough to run stackoverflow that it scales especially that now the scale up is done (50 is conservative, I would say that 20 is largely enough). If you looks on the jobs title, few are operationals, and among the operational, a lot is used for jobs and other side revenues

Journeyman Geek

@XavierCombelle "other side revenues"

Xavier Combelle

9:54 AM

I don't care about the hiring stackoverflow.com/company/team

I care about the current staff

Journeyman Geek

@XavierCombelle hiring reflects where people are needed, and direction of the company

Xavier Combelle

direction of the company I have no way to see, just way to guess

Journeyman Geek

of course

Xavier Combelle

and a huge part of company revenue, is simply to give money back to investors, not salaries

it is not a startup for nothing

Journeyman Geek

@XavierCombelle well, investors invest for a reason...

Xavier Combelle

9:56 AM

investors invest for the reasons, that they have free work from contributors

Journeyman Geek

but if you think about it, every current hire has to add value to the company, otherwise, the investors would be unhappy.

@XavierCombelle or that they believe in future, it would be profitable

Xavier Combelle

I don't care about adding value to company

I care about adding value to users

for sure advertising add value to the company

especially advertising for microsoft on a linux site

Journeyman Geek

hah.

MS does linux now

Also, this whole network runs on (mostly) windows

other than load balancing.

Xavier Combelle

it is the whole point

Sha Wiz Dow Ard

@Elias yeah a site mod decided it's not spam so locked it to protect it from being deleted again.

Journeyman Geek

10:02 AM

also, advertising MS on a linux site is silly since a good chunk of linux users are not going to get swayed.

Elias

Heh. And yet SO doesn't have mobile dev team.

More revenue to pay them, please...

Journeyman Geek

@Elias oh yeah

Sha Wiz Dow Ard

@Elias they have for mobile web, not apps

Xavier Combelle

you can't say something wrong about microsoft offensive attitude toward linux if you just don't want a member of the staff saying things like " boy, unsubstantiated conspiracy theories. I can see why some people are looking for popcorn. " proof framapic.org/T4bwzvu9rvQz/G1eG6CT471oE.png

Elias

déjà vu

Sha Wiz Dow Ard

10:08 AM

hehe he'll keep using this even in 10 years

Journeyman Geek

@XavierCombelle Reading through that... dude, you need to get off that high horse before you hurt yourself ;)

Sha Wiz Dow Ard

Unless that site will get closed until then (the image host I mean ;))

Xavier Combelle

Journeyman just ask me what was my problem with stackoverflow I answered

Sha Wiz Dow Ard

@XavierCombelle if you hate Microsoft so much, any anyone who don't hate them like you, why you stick around? Really? You can find lots of Anti Microsoft communities out there, where you'll be welcome and can freely discuss those things.

Xavier Combelle

I don't hate Microsoft, I hate what they do

Sha Wiz Dow Ard

10:10 AM

same

They won't stop doing it

Journeyman Geek

@XavierCombelle Actually, I asked what you were trying to achieve by asking if the licence was void. I typically try to influence policy, or people when asking these questions.

Xavier Combelle

and I don't want to discuss, it is just someone who send me a message, so I came here to answer

@JourneymanGeek I want to have some money for my free work

it is my main intent

Elias

ha.

Journeyman Geek

...

Sha Wiz Dow Ard

@XavierCombelle conflict

Journeyman Geek

10:11 AM

"free work"

Sha Wiz Dow Ard

free work means.......... no money.

Elias

Create your Q&A site/blog, and put some ads

Xavier Combelle

on a side way I want they remove their abusive terms

Journeyman Geek

rene

that will be a lonely battle

Xavier Combelle

10:12 AM

it is because their terms was abusive that I can actually ask gor money

Journeyman Geek

@XavierCombelle I suggest you read the TOS too.

Xavier Combelle

I read the TOS especially

Journeyman Geek

and maybe consider finding a place where they pay you to answer questions...

Elias

Sure, contact them/their lawyer, no need to tell us...

Xavier Combelle

it is you who contacted me

and I contacted their lawyer

Journeyman Geek

10:13 AM

(I had something like that, I called it my job)

rene

@JourneymanGeek free work?

Xavier Combelle

I wait for the answer of the lawer

free as in gratis

not as in freedom

because they breach the freedom terms

see you

hope nobody will mention me, otherwise I will come back and asked to go away

fell asleep again

lol

have a nice day

10:14 AM

have a nice day

Journeyman Geek

I've been mucking around with this rediculously tiny phone

rene

@JourneymanGeek an iPad?

Journeyman Geek

jelly.

rene

@JourneymanGeek this: nydailynews.com/entertainment/…?

Journeyman Geek

@rene oddly enough, almost

2.45 inch screen...

also stuck a prepaid sim in. Actually would make sense for me to switch if everything wasn't linked to my postpaid number T T

rene

10:19 AM

Can you touch anything on the screen?

Did you get the pro?

Journeyman Geek

@rene yeah, actually works alright tho typing is a slight pain cause I got fairly big hands

No didn't get the pro

Actually fairly usable

Pretty sure it would be easier with the right keyboard

rene

So you end up with a small phone and a huge keyboard ....

Journeyman Geek

lol

half the screen is the keyboard, yes

SmokeDetector

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Link at end of answer: Does fireplace screen work as Faraday Shield? by Robert F. Crocker on physics.SE

rene

what is the use of a dual nano sim card?

Journeyman Geek

10:25 AM

In some countries folk have different telcos for voice and mobile

or switch

or have different sim cards for travelling

rene

Ah

Journeyman Geek

that said, the second sim is 2g only, which is going to be pretty useless in a few years

Trying gboard

Yeah, its much easier with something like gboard or swype to type

I think this feels like the phone equivilent of that tiny gun movie cops have in their socks ;p

Elias

@rene some countries (e.g. here) also have benefits of free call/SMS to same telco, so using 2 of them means more free call/SMS, regardless of mobile data

rene

I guess I'm old fashioned. I haven't switched providers for years and have a cheap bundle with voice/data/sms that I never use to their capacity

But I'm still using an N900 so ....

What is this?

Elias

10:41 AM

An Essay.

rene

Awesome

Elias

> Tips for traveling with hearing loss- There are many tips for traveling with hearing loss: [...] Keep ‘em clean Finder’s keepers Assist future travelers

???

rene

I'm sure it is copied content

Journeyman Geek

@rene more or less what I do, but I do switch phones every 2-3 years

@rene smells like a spam seed

rene

@JourneymanGeek yeah, found the source, flagged for plagiarism

I assume Oded or JNat will get to it

Oded won ...

rene

11:11 AM

nvm

Oded

??? I acted 'cause of your ping.

rene

Oh, sorry I thought we did cast enough spam/abusive flags

Oded

:P

Journeyman Geek

Ping? What Ping? ;p

@rene Its more common in india and china I suppose...

user315433

12:54 PM

Worldbuilding is 3 years old today. So many worlds built... the most visited question of the year was asked just recently, and is, surprisingly, about the already-built world we live in: Can a casino system prove my (divine) luck as cheating?.

NVZ

@Shog9 hello shog. you said 4 downvotes is all it takes to push a question off the front page. Doesn't work, apparently. I posted a nonquestion to test it (sorry for abusing the system). it's got -7 score, yet it is on the newest and active feeds.

Also, please clear if any "rude or abusive" flags exit on it. It was me, no abuse intended. interpersonal.stackexchange.com/q/4044/345

I won't repeat this experiment again. Kinda regretted my decision immediately.

@Michelle Hello, Michelle. Sometimes I see users mention he pronouns for you. Are you by chance really a man? (don't answer if I'm out of line)

Elias

@NVZ newest & active feeds? unless I misunderstood something, all questions will be there regardless of the score

it should push off from the front page (not /question page) though

NVZ

11

A: What if senior users could put on hold "proofreading" questions single-handedly?

I've often thought that a "weak" close would be useful - a way for folks with some knowledge in a given area to quickly take a new question off the table so that it could be discussed, edited, etc. One way to prevent abuse would be to make the question re-open instantly if it was edited. Anothe...

@Elias aha! it's out of the basic homepage, i see.

I've actually never been to such a homepage much in my 4 years.

Elias

Me neither... the homepage is only useful for new users who arrived at that page for the first time...

user315433

@NVZ -4 on main sites, -8 on meta sites

NVZ

1:12 PM

@Michelle also is it not possible for unregistered users to delete their question? I tried and couldn't see any such option.

user315433

Unfortunately, you're right. They can't.

user315433

It's a silly restriction from prehistoric times with no good reason to keep it.

NVZ

I tried all I can. Finally gave up, and announced myself.

yeah. this is me. please don't flag as spam. — NVZ 3 hours ago

Journeyman Geek

@NVZ They just change names a lot

NVZ

@JourneymanGeek Who they?

Michelle has other names?

Okay.

user315433

1:19 PM

132

A: Let's Plan the Second Iteration of the Stack Exchange Quality Project!

Two more minor requests: Allow unregistered accounts to delete their own posts: this one should be fairly obvious. This occurs a lot when some unregistered user finds out that they can't delete their own post, and decides to just vandalize it. This is a restriction for no good reason ("Cookie-ba...

NVZ

Is this the mainest of the main chat rooms where the most of the mods of the network hangout? I mean other than mod-only rooms?

user315433

As said in the question, "The quality project isn't one that we plan to ever finish, it's perennial and kicks in every 18 months". That was 11 months ago, so we are about 7 months away from SEQP 3. Exciting!

Journeyman Geek

@NVZ actually, not that many network mods here

Elias

unless it's Town Hall...

NVZ

@Michelle yeah, I see a blue upvote in there, so I've voted that up long time ago. Why isn't it implemented yet! I'm a regular on the network since 4 years, and today I tried the shoes of a new unregistered user. It was extremely frustrating for me being unable to delete the question myself. Wonder how it would be for actual newbies!

So... where can I ask a quick question to a mod in a chat?

I suppose this is it?

Oded

1:24 PM

What do you want to know?

NVZ

@Oded hello, nothing in particular today. But it would come handy later maybe. Thanks for showing up. :)

@oded Btw, please delete my unregistered question here: interpersonal.stackexchange.com/questions/4044

Thanks. It was a mistake, I regretted immediately.

I was testing how being a new user felt like.

Oded

Should do what a new user would do - and ask a proper question (or give a proper answer).

For what's it worth - I did that recently, started a completely new user on SO.

NVZ

@Oded yeah, but I didn't expect being unable to delete it myself.

Journeyman Geek

I did it on SU... er... 2 answers were fine. The third HNQed

Was a registered user tho, with a gmail +foo address

NVZ

My plan was to test if some captcha would pop up. And then delete my question then itself.

Oded

1:34 PM

@NVZ most users register, you left an unregistered account. Had you registered it, you could have deleted yourself. Again - shouldn't have posted a test.

NVZ

@Oded The test was for unregistered users.

Again, I immediately regretted doing so.

Journeyman Geek

@NVZ also, nice to ask on meta...

Oded

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Journeyman Geek

cause yanno, there's people who actually write these things hanging around....

(for some reason)

NVZ

lol, yea, I do ask metas. Today was a bad day.

rene

1:57 PM

@Oded And? Did I close vote, down vote and delete vote your question leading to a question ban?

Oded

Sorry to disappoint, but you didn't

rene

I must have had an off-day ...

Oded

Ha.

rene

That went pretty well ... ;)

Oded

It was a in company experiment, a bunch of us were trying to get completely new accounts to go over 1k, we kept records of our experience and our UX researcher went over that and came out with recommendations.

rene

2:00 PM

Oh cool. Did you make it to 1K?

Oded

Aye. We had 2 months to do it in.

Forgot how much junk we get on SO.

rene

Ha!

Oded

She had some interesting conclusions/recommendations. Though some are not things we would pursue.

Like - requiring explaining a downvote :D

rene

LOL

Oded

I may be paraphrasing slightly, but it wasn't far off from that.

rene

2:02 PM

I guess the research report is classified and for that reason alone will stay that way ...

During the experiment did anyone of you got caught by SOCVR, SOBotics or a mishap in Review?

Oded

I don't know.

rene

Something that you might want to switch roles and start yelling at people

Oded

???

Journeyman Geek

@Oded which is never ever happening...

right?

Oded

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

rene

2:08 PM

@Oded I mean when your new account would get mistreated somehow and that you decide to contact the mod directly and then reveal the true identity of your new account.

Oded

Well... we have developers, CMs etc with full access, so no need to talk to mods :)

Journeyman Geek

@rene in theory any of the powers that be can do anything we can do :)

rene

Breaking: SE Dev fixes serial down voting during experiment

Oded

And the idea was more to see what it felt like, what the new user experience is (frankly, a bunch of people who seem to only hang in around MSE/MSO could try that and consider how we can make the experience better).

rene

It is for sure an interesting experiment. You do forget how it is to be at 1 rep.

Oded

2:14 PM

Aye. Frustration about commenting everywhere.

Journeyman Geek

@Oded >_>

@rene Even being a new user won't help me. I've been in all of one community where people have even tried to be mean to me as newbie ;p

user315433

Jon Ericson has a blog series about that experiment: one, two, three

Oded

Making SO/SE more inclusive and guiding people to the pit of success.

Journeyman Geek

0_0 The signup process is a lot more complex than I remember...

(might be an SO thing ? Its been a while since even aibobot)

user315433

FR: add Jon's posts to stackoverflow.blog stream in some way. Not in a network-featured kind of way, but something more discoverable.

Oded

2:22 PM

Probably - got a few extra things for SO, @JourneymanGeek

Journeyman Geek

@Michelle if it's got an rss feed...

user315433

Because of the Profile / DevStory / Jobs trinity, with all the profile fields they contain.

user315433

@JourneymanGeek Yeah, but the RSS feed doesn't help if you don't know about the blog in the first place.

Journeyman Geek

@Michelle eh.. could add it into a chat room, or... my feed client ;p

looks like no obvious one tho

user315433

Or Jon could post those on meta and tag them announcement.

Journeyman Geek

2:34 PM

oh, like that would go well ;)

.... ok NOW I feel dumb...

"No obvious way" -> sees link at bottom for RSS ._.

user315433

0

A: How to reduce creepy crawly insects in the house?

Centipede is coming to house how to avoid problem

user315433

I like to think this is about one particular centipede entering the house right now, obviously with ill intentions.

Journeyman Geek

:( INDIA Y U DO THIS OLD COUNTRY!

user202362

4:04 PM

@Shog9 you could hire me & keep yourselves out of trouble, I am available 2-3 days out of every week!

user202362

that is provided that I don't die driving on the snow today

user202362

driving in the mountains next to a cliff I have done before

user202362

but driving in the mountains next to a cliff on the snow, that I have not attempted ...

user202362

and occasional deer running across the road ...

rene

4:41 PM

@Telkitty don't drive and chat then ...

user202362

about to go out in 15 mins

user202362

still at accommodation

rene

drive carefully then ...

user0042

@Telkitty ^^ Please Do!

user202362

I will have to ...

user0042

4:48 PM

@Telkitty It's no shame to stop at an appropriate place and wait until he storm is over.

@telkitty youtube.com/watch?v=3X31FWlCyr4

user315433

5:24 PM

I was a new user too many times to even count... don't remember anyone being mean to me.

Elias

5:49 PM

You're on elite new user club though

Also known as: New Game+

user315433

6:08 PM

So it's try-open-a-door-with-the-face users who have bad experience.

user315433

When a sign on the door says "pull"

user0042

@Michelle "Bad experience" seems to be reziprocal to teh OP's intelligence :-P

user315433

4 hours ago, by Oded

Like - requiring explaining a downvote :D

user315433

I sort of expected that...

user315433

Jul 27 at 18:12, by Alex

The conclusion is that it's great to have a UX researcher who doesn't use SO.

user315433

6:53 PM

Best of Mickey Rourke

►

user315433

65 years today

user315433

I remember when 9 1/2 weeks was a big deal in Soviet Union... at the beginning of perestroika, when it became possible to say that yes, in fact there is sex in USSR too...

user0042

@Michelle Try 6-8 weeks :-P ...

user315433

8:42 PM

@LangLangC Not really. However, only the second has meaningful views. That suggests it was seen by outside users and the others mostly weren't. I had to lower the anonymous feedback threshold to just one vote in order to get 5 questions. — Jon Ericson ♦ 2 hours ago

user315433

That's a kind of site evaluation right there...

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