Tavern on the Meta - 2016-09-19

« first day (2238 days earlier) ← previous day next day → last day (2775 days later) »

12:01 AM

> Absence of access controls IS NOT authorization for access!

o_0

Asamblea en Invernalia | Juego de Tronos 6x10 Español HD

This one is more interesting, easier to understand/follow, and treats with very recent matters about the current casting calls in Spain.

12:25 AM

that answer makes very little sense

1 hour later…

1:44 AM

What's with all this early spam?

Somebody changed out of summer time too early?

Bloody Spring encourages new spam to grow

→ 9 messages moved to Sandbox

1 hour later…

3:07 AM

in SO Close Vote Reviewers on Stack Overflow Chat, 1 hour ago, by Shog9

something worth keeping in mind... This was supposed to be fun. I mean, you don't set up a site with a high-score table, badges with fanciful names, etc... If you don't want folks to have fun using it. But nothing is fun all the time.

I've thought about this recently. mSO makes you wonder sometimes the usefulness of it all. But then the content on SO (and especially the content on beta sites/etc) reminds you why you're here.

Wow, the people from my internship have totally created a soap opera.

A highlight:

> me: So what you're doing is blatantly illegal.
> one of them: Ok, so is that it? Do you have any other problems with it?

It's like everything's exploded to the point where I don't understand how humans can be behind all the decisions they're doing.

It's amazing how everybody's wearing masks.

So yay corporate?

2 hours later…

5:01 AM

sd k

5:52 AM

are close votes not in sede?

→ 14 messages moved to Chimney

Hello guys, I'd like to ask, if you already have edit privilege, can you still suggest edits rather than directly edit it?

@busukxuan No; you can leave a comment, that's as close as you can get.

@JasonC Okay, thanks :-)

Hm... What does the smoke detector do?

It looks like an announcement chat bot

It detect steaming piles of brown stuff

@JanDvorak lol, which would be?

6:04 AM

AKA spam and abusive

@JanDvorak Wow, cool. I didn't know SE has bot users!

How do we know you're not a bot?

I answer with a delay

@JanDvorak arguably a bot can be written to imitate human delays

@JanDvorak So you're a bot on a crappy computer?

6:10 AM

@JasonC How do we know you're not a bot? #Transcendence

I know. I'm running him.

How do we know you're not a bot?

OMG I fail as a human. I actually failed the Turing test T.T

How do we know you're not a bot?

that was quick

6:11 AM

null

This is a lie.

Is it a cake?

How do we know you're not a bot?

BRB, rebooting

How do we know you're not a bot?

6:13 AM

I wonder... Am I a bot?

Probably

@SmokeDetector How do we know that you're not human?

Note to self: don't make chat bots multithreaded. It's not worth it.

@JanDvorak You can make it async :P

Heh

6:15 AM

Note to self: don't make chat bots multithreaded. It's not worth it.

This whole time smokey's just been @ProgramFOX pasting spam links and fooling us into thinking he wrote a bot.

Note to self: multithreaded. It's not worth don't make chat bots it.

Note to chat bots: don't make self multithreaded. It's not worth it.

@JasonC Smokey's doing a good job indeed, even ignored me...

@hichris123 I made chat.meta.stackexchange.com/rooms/1037/chimney and made you an RO; if you're gonna move smokey posts should probably move it there, the sandbox is for formatting tests, it's not really a garbage dump.

I love the same

6:21 AM

@JanDvorak Same

rofl

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Link at end of answer: Is there a Linux-compatible R/C simulator that works with real radios? by mroussel on superuser.com

^ 3 years later...

He's got super-human delays

Obviously smokey is not a bot.

@SmokeDetector fp

@JasonC Registered answer as false positive.

6:35 AM

Can new users see the number of close votes their questions have?

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Pattern-matching website in answer: What kind of mower should I get for a ¾-acre lawn? by Rashedul Islam on gardening.stackexchange.com

7:28 AM

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Link at end of answer, pattern-matching website in answer: Does the same determinant make two matrices equal to each other? by assignmenthelp1992 on math.stackexchange.com

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Link at end of answer, pattern-matching website in answer: What is the best set-up to quickly switch a domain to another server if needed? by assignmenthelp1992 on serverfault.com

sd 3k

8:21 AM

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Bad keyword in answer, blacklisted website in answer, pattern-matching website in answer: Rails guestbook with new, index, and Kaminari pagination in the same method by Rickey Tieman on codereview.stackexchange.com

sd 3k

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Shortened URL in body: Tackling The Riemann Hypothesis by DieFrage on mathoverflow.net

8:40 AM

@balpha - Hi. Just a small question if you happen to be here. I would like to know the point of view of the staff on the issue. About this, would remarking again that RO aren't supposed to apply their own "point of view" in tolerating thing but instead apply the network policies be wrong? Thanks.

that's not really a small question :) -- looks like I need to do a lot of reading to understand the context here before I can reply

user335633

8:57 AM

hi all!

@JasonC shall we take that discussion here?

or in a different room if people get annoyed here

@JasonC no, that is a privilege 250 rep: meta.stackexchange.com/help/privileges/view-close-votes

9:11 AM

@balpha don't worry - take your time. You can even comment on the answer/question I linked - or even add your own answer if you wish. I feel this is the usual problem "a room can decide its culture and what level of politeness it will tolerate".

As I have stated, I do think that there is no decision for the user since we are consuming a service you offer, and even if one do get "Room Owner" powers he is still bound to act as the greater Be Nice rules define. But since this once again become a discussion point, I would like if some of you staff member could give his/her point of view.

@rene Oh yeah. Probably.

Too late, lol.

:)

Anyways yeah I dunno. The ReviewTasks table, I was messing with it for a while before, and I just saw way too many things that didn't reflect the actual state of the question.

Plus the columns confused me

And of course, it 0's out the time.

yeah, that bit makes it kind of useless for what you're after

@JasonC it does reflect what is on the timeline

Yeah

That it does

But it's almost impossible to distinguish between failed close (due to "leave open") and actual closure.

Same with reopen + leave closed, I'd imagine.

user335633

9:20 AM

so, having fun?

In a weird way, yes

user335633

epic!

I should be asleep. I was sleeping, then I shot awake for some reason, and did that involuntary sit-straight-up-wide-eyed thing that I thought only happened in movies. The moment I woke up I distinctly heard my cell phone ring. But it didn't actually ring in real life. I have no idea what happened. It was a weird experience.

So I naturally decided to just binge watch Bleach and mess around on SE metas instead of sleeping.

@JasonC well, that sounds like fun , anyway if you look at the second resultset here there isn't much extra info.

Yeah, you'd have to implement all the close/leave open logic in the query itself to determine which data to discard.

It'd be a bitch.

9:36 AM

I might revisit this tonight, strangely enough I need to pay some attention to things in real-life, like work.

user335633

work is a 4 letter word, ending in 'k'

9:54 AM

@rene real life? What's that?

@Tropiks life is 4 letter word, ending in 'e'

user335633

@ShadowWizard so true!

user335633

hmmm i have 3 0-voted answers

user335633

I sense the banning-machine watching me with its beady eyes

lol

If they will be accepted though, you might get badges, even gold! ;-)

user335633

it's watching, cackling in its obscene manner

9:58 AM

One of my first badges on SO was Unsung Hero.

user335633

@ShadowWizard 1 is accepted

Good!

user335633

i picture the banning-machine as Monty Burns, rubbing his gnarled hands together, saying 'excellent'... just waiting to release the hounds

Whatever sails your imagination.... ;-)

user335633

oh my imagination is very disturbing

10:14 AM

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Blacklisted website in answer: How to restore factory settings in Vaio laptops? by Cyril Brian on superuser.com

10:40 AM

@JasonC Heh, I suppose we should've had a Trashcan room anyway but since the Sandbox was there and capable of having messages sent its way...

@hichris123 I once used sending all the broken dishes, empty tea cup and all the rest of the trash we get from serving cupcakes to the Den - we even had a pipe just for that.

Maybe you could try that too?

Sounds complicated...

user335633

nothing is truly complicated

12:06 PM

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Mostly non-Latin answer: Convert single unicode character to png image by Subbu on apple.stackexchange.com

1 hour later…

1:18 PM

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Link at end of answer: Logging Error Reporting for Multiple Platforms and Multiple Layers by Mustafa Yılmaz on softwarerecs.stackexchange.com

1:57 PM

Final delete vote needed here @rene @Bart

@Tropiks I can imagine! :P

@Derpy he can try, question is what will be the final result.... ;)

@ShadowWizard you will get free (used) tea cups?

some broken dish too if you are lucky?

2:15 PM

@ShadowWizard yeah, saw it, now deleted

needs flags: meta.stackexchange.com/a/284724/158100

2:47 PM

@Derpy well, I can turn them to more useful things... so yeah, might just work.

@rene yup, looks like OP cast undelete vote? lol

@rene yeah, troll deleted it himself this time

3:32 PM

@JasonC Oh, how did you find out?

3:48 PM

@ShadowWizard Handled in the meantime, it looks like :P

4:03 PM

@ShadowWizard OK, we're good then

1 hour later…

5:03 PM

Hi all, any Meta.SE mods want to slap a status-bydesign on this question? Thanks.

@JAL you flag it as well with a custom reason

@rene I didn't realize that was an acceptable reason to use a custom flag

On MSE it is a bit different I guess, Not all employees go over the transcript so they might miss it. flag handle rate is not high on MSE but at least it doesn't go unnoticed in that case.

Great chance animuson will handle it and otherwise JNAT

Ok I will flag

If this flag gets declined I blame you rene

:)

hides

5:16 PM

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Bad keyword in body: I made circumcision but I have got skin again by Stanislao on judaism.stackexchange.com

sd f

5:32 PM

@JNat yup, turns out you're not the only one fighting trolls and spammers.... :D

:P

good!

@SmokeDetector face palm

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Few unique characters in answer, no whitespace in answer, blacklisted user: If I have to cross an icy, flowing river, what are some ways I can cross safely? by rick kipness on outdoors.stackexchange.com

6:33 PM

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Link at end of body: Why is LED lid when pin is set low? by Carlton Banks on arduino.stackexchange.com

2 hours later…

8:34 PM

@JasonC you might want to see if this is also live on other sites.

and if so, may be the aging parameters to push out of review need to be lowered

or A single vote or flag on a question will send it into /review. should be come a parameter so you can set it to 2 ...

But that would be a FR with 6 to 8 weeks of dev time

9:22 PM

@rene Oh maybe.

The quest for more info about CVs on SEDE seems to be a losing battle.

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Shortened URL in answer: iPad 4 not charging solution with usb 3.0 dual ports Y adapter by kalieaire on apple.stackexchange.com

@JasonC Apparently Mechanics.SE is full of drama? ;)

@Shog9 So you've got BobCross making ridiculously irresponsible posts like meta.mechanics.stackexchange.com/a/1642/9884, and you've got Rory who just needs to submit a headshot to have his photo placed in the dictionary next to "nonconstructive" and "hypocrite", moderating on a site he's not even involved in. Got some real winners with diamonds over there. :P

@hichris123 Dude, I don't even know... it's so confusing. All my attempts at being helpful are met with stupidity. I tried my best. I even took one for the team and made an MSE feature request for something I totally don't agree with, and in the midst of getting a bunch of praise for it over there all of a sudden apparently my post turned into some passive-aggressive, awful thing that deserved nothing but criticism.

Whatever.

Well, making a meta post in support of a viewpoint you don't support (probably) intending for that viewpoint to be disagreed with does seem a little passive aggressive...

Rory has this habit of busting out the ad hominem, deleting comments, kicking users, and placing chat bans on folks that call him out on anything. Because that diamond is apparently a free pass to say to people "You're completely wrong because X" then hammer them with site mechanics when they say "Hey wait, X didn't happen..."

9:32 PM

@JasonC you, uh, seem to have gotten a rather heated discussion going over something quite benign.

I believe you have a Talent.

@hichris123 Yeah I acknowledged that. I acknowledged it virtually immediately. That's the thing. I even said right off the bat that I tried to be unbiased and really wanted some input.

Then I even asked Rory for input, took it to heart, and edited the post with no complaints.

@Shog9 Heh, sigh. A "curse", more accurately.

@rene trivial to enable elsewhere, but haven't needed it outside of SO thus far.

Be sure to read that carefully though: it doesn't require multiple flags to enter review, merely to keep a question there past the cut-off.

(Which quickly becomes irrelevant if the flags age away, but can help to focus reviewers)

@JasonC I suppose, but are you honestly telling me that you didn't make the meta post intending for people to shoot it down? I find that a little hard to believe...

Can you not make bookmarks when you've got a chat ban?

...In any case, I rather wonder if this isn't "a technical solution to a social problem"

9:35 PM

@hichris123 No I really didn't. I suspected it would get shot down, but I thought it wouldn't be a problem since I'm the one who would publicly take the heat for it.

@Shog9 It is exactly a technical solution to a social problem. I really don't stand by that feature request or any of the philosophies there.

I was pleasantly surprised by your post that it was already implemented, though.

Yeah, almost like we saw this same problem immediately after the close queue rolled out and just fixed it without telling anyone...

Lol

FWIW, I've played with increasing it before. Doesn't seem to accomplish much. If folks are determined to close things instead of editing, the solution is to get more people editing... Closing them more slowly just means less chance anything gets reopened.

But... It is possible that this might differ for a given audience.

Someone made the point that it can take a bit longer to, say, go out and snap a photo of your engine or whatever.

I'd guess the same might apply for pets or gardening or astronomy

That site seems unique. I am slowly submitting to the fact that I can't really understand it, though, and should probably just keep quiet unless there's an immediate problem.

They're very anti close-vote there. I don't like it, but I don't like it for all these weird overarching systemic and philosophical reasons, the kind that I can never get anybody to understand.

keep in mind, it was a very small site for a very long time... It's had a very slow burn, so to speak.

9:41 PM

Like e.g. if a person's first experience with SE is MVM&R, and they're inducted to believe that close votes are rude, that kind of sucks, because it's a problem for that user if they discover the other sites. I like consistency.

Even though it may not be a problem on MVM&R itself.

Or the whole "let's not use a well-established site mechanic, created after years of experience, tweaking, and observation of what works on other sites, because we're different" mentality. Can't put my finger on it; couldn't give a concrete argument; but that attitude esp. in [future] mods doesn't sit well with me.

Yeah. I ran the numbers. It was the 8th longest beta.

statistically, most folks' first experience with SE will be SO. Some number of those will end up actually using other sites more though, which tends to lead to small but significant cultural differences.

I'm really happy that it graduated.

There's... One of those cutesy sociology terms for that. But I don't remember it.

so instead, someone post that XKCD comic about twisty straws.

Oh oh oh

hi!

9:44 PM

user image

thank you.

user image

So yeah. We divvy up these sites by topic, but the open secret has always been that the real divisions are cultural: not what interests do you have, but what group(s) do you claim membership in.

Yeah. Actually it'd be really interesting to do a bit of a sociological analysis on the sites and try to identify key cultural differences and group them that way.

Well whatever, I've doomed myself to never have a constructive conversation again in the Pitstop. And Rory's on the top of my online hate-list at the moment, with Bob at a close second, so nothing good can come of that.

don't take it so seriously

...I say, after Jason has already spent untold hours taking this seriously, up to and including writing a meta post arguing for the option he's against.

9:48 PM

Yeah, now you tell me...

ikr

Lol. Anyways... I think it's lunch time. Peace.

So what ever happened to Shogs 1-8?

Abilene paradox

In an Abilene paradox a group of people collectively decide on a course of action that is counter to the preferences of many (or all) of the individuals in the group. It involves a common breakdown of group communication in which each member mistakenly believes that their own preferences are counter to the group's and, therefore, does not raise objections. A common phrase relating to the Abilene Paradox is a desire not to "rock the boat." This differs from groupthink in that the Abilene paradox is characterized by an inability to manage agreement. == Explanation == The term was introduced...

^ My big takeaway is to never suggest doing something I don't want to do - just in case everyone else is dysfunctional enough to want to do it.

And it says a lot about you that when your friends jump off a bridge en masse, your first thought is apparently 'my friends are all foolish and I won't be like them' and not 'are my friends ok?'.

ok, well if you see me jumping off a bridge, you better darn well follow me.

10:11 PM

not unless everyone else is doing it

"Shog9 heroically waited for everyone else to jump first - and didn't make it... unfortunately, that was the last of his lives."

"if only he'd stopped eating cookies long enough to notice the fire"

I'm going home now. Saludos!

Depending on the cookies, I may choose those cookies + a fiery death over no cookies + survival.

10:57 PM

@rene You little db wizard, you. Question: You know how you can have multiple result sets on sede? Is there a way to set up some temporary table that is visible to multiple statements? For example, this does not work:

WITH x AS (...)
SELECT ... FROM x;
SELECT ... FROM x;

Because x is only part of the first statement, and goes away for the second.

Nevermind, nailed it:

SELECT ... INTO #x;
SELECT ... FROM #x;
SELECT ... FROM #x;

yup.

Don't even need to declare a schema for #x. Cool.

can also create a temp table explicitly if you do want to declare a schema

y'know, if you haven't quite got all that masochism out of yourself on meta yet today

It's almost like you know exactly why I'm creating database queries. Am I so transparent?

I really ought to do something productive.

temp tables are great for performance if you have some slow-to-gather data that you need repeatedly, even if you are gonna end up with a single set of results at the end. CTEs don't seem to be optimized very well.

11:03 PM

I'm excited, I recently found out chronicprocrastination.org is a thing. In all seriousness, there's hope. I should probably follow some of the advice. Also please do not cite this comment if I ever apply for a job at SE.

I will make sure your entire chat history makes it into Greenhouse

Oh jesus.

Just blacklist me now.

Reasons to hire:
- can probably keep Pete company with woodworking talk
Reasons to not hire:
- http://chat.meta.stackexchange.com/users/230261?tab=recent

I'm laughing, but it burns.

Cookies, fire, cookies, fire...

In all seriousness I've been thinking about applying. I don't have a concrete resume though. But the freelance work has been eating away at me, even though I get to do a lot of cool stuff. I already told my biggest client that I'm dropping him to find a more stable career, so I'm kind of already committed to a workplace path.

It'll be super weird but nice to get back into a corporate structure.

And SE HQ is a single 20 minute train ride from my apartment... and I've got no other ideas if I want to stay in NYC.

You should come to Ohio. It'd double the state population.

I'd have some company, finally.

11:19 PM

Eh

Eh.

I had some small tastes of Ohio living in Pittsburgh.

The border is a really fun drive late at night though. I used to joy ride up route 11 a lot. There's a ton of open road and interesting industrial areas.

4 lanes through the mountains with no traffic and no cops. It's glorious.

@JasonC fearlessproductivity.com

This is an amazing website.

@bjb568 I ORDERED THE PDF LAST WEEK.

And weirdly it seemed to help. I was skeptical, but desperate. My life is heading down that guy's path.

But it's actually a really on-point strategy.

And surprisingly manageable, it manages to defeat the intense "procrastinate solving the procrastination" meta problem.

I've actually gotten more work done in the past 7 days than I have in the past 6 months, and feel legit good about it.

It comes down to training, I realized. The tool I've always been missing is the ability to focus on long term rewards, and hyperfocusing on the short term. I didn't realize how severe that was or how it was related.

So I'm working on it, very consciously. With slow but steady success.

Not there yet though. It'll take time.

Well, then, get out of here and keep working.

11:40 PM

Today I'm legit taking a day off, guilt-free.

Which never happens.

« first day (2238 days earlier) ← previous day next day → last day (2775 days later) »

Transcript for

Sep '1619

Tavern on the Meta

MY GOD, IT'S FULL OF STARS AND BACKLOG! General friendly chit-...

bug crickets discussion excuses support waffles

join this room
about this room

00:00

06:00

12:00

18:00

all times are UTC

site design / logo © 2024 Stack Exchange Inc; legal

mobile