Tavern on the Meta

@S.L.Barth there's definitely a learning curve, even compared to smaller sites, but it's not too bad. It's a lot of work, but it hasn't changed my total time on the site each day that much.

Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ.

@EdCottrell Good to know. I should run in chem.SE's next mod election.

Ed Cottrell

sorry; in and out today with daddy duties

S.L. Barth

@EdCottrell Glad to see that, even despite the most important duties, you still managed to spend some time in the Tavern!

cybermonkey

@bjb568 pretty sure 'don't polish a turd' isn't a valid reason to reject an edit

S.L. Barth

8:53 PM

@cybermonkey I usually skip them, because most editors don't seem to read Reject reasons anyway.

...assuming they even know these things exist... :-S

cybermonkey

@S.L.Barth most editors in my experience only bother fixing one part of the post instead of all of it

S.L. Barth

So I leave it to the robots to approve them... and the editors will find out that they wasted their time when the post gets deleted and they suddenly lose 2 reps.

@cybermonkey True, but that is always bad. Some people are just not very good in English.

I've seen a few edits from users who severely over-estimated their grasp of the English language....

cybermonkey

Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ.

@S.L.Barth Example is me.

S.L. Barth

@Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ. Yeah sure.

Anyway, the point I want to make is: if you're not good at English, then edit only what you're confident about.

user259867

8:58 PM

> I originally included another reason, "polishes excrement" - but dropped it after realizing that it asked reviewers to determine the value not of the edit but of the post being edited. While I do believe these edits should be rejected in many cases, the reason for declining them resists a generic description - therefore if it does not fall into one of the other categories listed...

user259867

> ... my hope is that folks utilize the "causes harm" field to indicate why such an edit would be counter-productive. meta.stackexchange.com/a/239950

cybermonkey

@NormalHuman true, but my edit makes it clear what is being asked (I picked apart the question), thus fixing the reason why it was closed in the first place (unclear)

user259867

That is a different thing then; I replied to your message, not to the specific edit.

SmokeDetector

[ SmokeDetector ] Bad keyword in title: Outlook^customers Phone Number !888(500)3568 Outlook tech support Number us 1*^8885°°^3568 by Cameron Meuin on webapps.stackexchange.com

hichris123

@SmokeDetector tpu-

user259867

9:01 PM

Look at that [successful] phone number obfuscation...

cybermonkey

there should really be a filter for the keyword * customer service at the beginning of posts, most spam seems to begin with that.

user259867

The one that we have now (thanks to tchrist) should detect these reliably. Now I wonder if these data points can be used to improve phone number detection.

S.L. Barth

@NormalHuman I've used the custom Reject resaon so often - telling editors "Please don't put product names in code markdown". They just don't read it.

Braiam

@S.L.Barth is darker just before the sunrise

user259867

@S.L.Barth I generally don't review my suggestions for rejections... (1) they hardly ever get rejected; (2) I suggest edits on dozens of sites, and there is no network-wide UI for that thing.

cybermonkey

9:07 PM

edit was approved.. now it's just POB (ironically, lol)

Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ.

@NormalHuman One reason stackexchange.com itself is useless is it gives pretty useless info for the account you own.

Braiam

@NormalHuman the nearest approach (if you remember all your edits) stackexchange.com/users/current?tab=activity

Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ.

@Braiam Yeah, that's a messy approach.

user259867

Hi @quid you're not around often. How's Math Educator site growing?

S.L. Barth

@Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ. , @Braiam Hm.... I suppose that could be solved with a userscript. But it would be better to have this built-in.

quid

9:10 PM

Hi @NormalHuman Very slowly. But it grows.

Braiam

api request for all the sites you have account for, loop through and ask for suggested edits? I don't think the edits suggestions are exposed

user259867

Are rejected edits even shown on activity tab?

Braiam

@NormalHuman yes

bjb568

@cybermonkey It certainly is.

cybermonkey

@NormalHuman yes

Braiam

9:13 PM

suggestions route ?tab=activity&sort=suggestions

user259867

@Braiam I'm talking about the network profile... don't see suggestions there.

Braiam

ah, no, not there. We were discussing about the possibility of using a userscript to offer that functionality

SmokeDetector

[ SmokeDetector ] All-caps title: VGA CONTROLLER USING VHDL EXAMPLE by Anatoly Melichov on stackoverflow.com

Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ.

@Braiam What about adding an FR about it?

Braiam

I don't particularly bother with that stuff

S.L. Barth

9:31 PM

Ok... so editors are told if their edits are rejected. meta.stackexchange.com/a/137334/168333

(I think the post is from before the MSO/MSE split though, so maybe it only applies to SO).

....I wonder if this is also shown if something is rejected with "Reject & Edit" ?

Braiam

is network wide

S.L. Barth

Good. Although I think the Bad Editor problem mostly affects SO.

user259867

Ah yes, it's network wide. And R&E is like other rejections, it's just attributed to community.

S.L. Barth

Ok. Only drawback is that R&E just gives a default reason:

> This edit did not correct critical issues with the post - view the revision history to see what should have been changed.

I keep trying to use the custom reject reason to help the editors improve - a little personalized guidance.

Of course, the real problem is and remains the robo-approvers.

Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ.

I approve.

bjb568

9:38 PM

DD will solve this!

S.L. Barth

@bjb568 How?

bjb568

We will totally whack editors into shape!

Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ.

@bjb568 Weight loss spam!

bjb568

@S.L.Barth Review bans, better guidance, just being a smaller site.

@Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ. There is no spam in the utopia of DevDoodle.

S.L. Barth

@bjb568 Of these three reasons, I only see "being a smaller site" as something SO isn't doing.

bjb568

9:40 PM

(except the two questions that I deleted and that was before I put together more countermeasures)

Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ.

@bjb568 And no halpful flagz? What kinda utopia is this?

bjb568

@S.L.Barth Meh, edit review guidance still sucks on SE.

@Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ. one with good content

Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ.

Boo

No flagz, no cigar.

S.L. Barth

@bjb568 No offense, bjb, but I doubt you can do better on your own than SE with it's entire company and community.

hichris123

@bjb568 Except the 2nd question was spam....

SmokeDetector

9:42 PM

[ SmokeDetector ] Shortened url in answer: Why use rem instead px when it's the same anyway? by Mk Kashiyama on stackoverflow.com

hichris123

@SmokeDetector tpu-

user259867

Also posted somewhere on DBA, according to Google analytics: goo.gl/#analytics/goo.gl/RCKH3z/all_time

user259867

But I don't find it with URL search, so must have been deleted already.

user259867

It's kind of interesting to add + to the goo.gl links and see what goes on behind the scenes.

user259867

Hi @xkcdBot have you seen AstroCB recently?

S.L. Barth

9:48 PM

@bjb568 BTW, the real problem isn't even guidance; it's getting people to follow the guidance.

bjb568

@hichris123 nah, just abuse

@S.L.Barth i.e. good guidance, and just in time UI

S.L. Barth

@bjb568 And both positive and negative reinforcement. AKA carrots and sticks.

But, did you read the answer I linked? SE decided to give warnings about rejected edits when a user tries to make a new edit, because that's when it is relevant.

That is the moment that an editor can improve.

bjb568

Yup, DD will do that, and similar things to the reviewers.

Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ.

@S.L.Barth Don't underestimate cats though. They can fall from a two-story and still land on their feet safe and sound.

xkcdBot

@NormalHuman AstroCB has been quite busy with college applications and so has taken an indefinite leave of absence from SE.

S.L. Barth

9:54 PM

@Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ. Nobody on the internet underestimates cats.

2

user259867

@xkcdBot Good luck with those!

SmokeDetector

[ SmokeDetector ] Shortened url in answer: Is there any difference between Rem and -- comments for SQL*Plus? by Mk Kashiyama on dba.stackexchange.com (@Unihedron)

user259867

@SmokeDetector tpu- again this guy

xkcdBot

@NormalHuman He says thank you. [Speaking in the third person is more disconcerting than I would have expected.]

Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ.

Bots are smart. Humans are screwed.

hichris123

9:55 PM

@NormalHuman lol there's your DBA post

user259867

Time-traveling spam? :o

S.L. Barth

Posted 9m ago, the discusson here was 13m ago. The spammer is just trying to hit dba.SE again.

Typical. I've tried to say a number of insightful things today, and what gets starred? A comment about cats.

user259867

This question must be a duplicate, but on what site? Layered randomization by TheMagzuz on math.stackexchange.com

user259867

@S.L.Barth Those aren't really stars, they are more like likes/hearts. We <3 cats.

S.L. Barth

@NormalHuman Yeah... well, I may have sounded a bit grumpy, but the star is still appreciated!

@NormalHuman Cross Validated, perhaps?

It may have been asked on Security.SE or Cryptography.SE, but I somehow doubt it.

Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ.

10:05 PM

> No insightful stuff from People whose username starts with S and ends in h will be starred.

user259867

I think it's too algorithm-minded for that. I was thinking Computer Science

S.L. Barth

@Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ. Not even if there's a Bart hidden between these characters?

Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ.

@S.L.Barth No.

L. Bart = Long Bart

S.L. Barth

LOL!

Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ.

It would have if it was Short Bart.

S.L. Barth

10:07 PM

Short Long Bart h . Hm, why not?

Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ.

That equals Bart and would mean you're his sock.

S.L. Barth

I'll settle for that. There are worse things than being Bart's sock puppet. Where do I apply?

SmokeDetector

[ SmokeDetector ] Email in body: ways to reconcile with your spouse by Robert Vanessa on christianity.stackexchange.com

user259867

@SmokeDetector tpu-

Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ.

@S.L.Barth I'll arrange a meeting between you and this:

everydaylife.globalpost.com/DM-Resize/photos.demandstudios.com/…

i.e. Bart's secretary.

S.L. Barth

10:12 PM

A pair of glasses and a sock. One day we shall have a complete Bart, with head, nose, trousers and so on.

Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ.

Argh stupid image.

S.L. Barth

Don't worry, I saw it. Visted the link.

Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ.

@S.L.Barth I don't think @Bart will humiliate himself enough that he become an entity with head, nose, trousers and so on.

bjb568

9

Q: A simple JavaScript Utility Library

I have developed a simple and easy to use JavaScript library called, Omega for practice. I would highly appreciate if you can point out all sorts of flaws in the code such as violations of best practices, conventions and even would highly prefer optimization tips or other better ways of achieving...

javascript

user259867

From looking around, I guess Cryptography is the best choice for that random-seed-of-RNG question; they discuss the pro and cons of RNGs frequently.

bjb568

10:16 PM

^^ lel, this HNQ copy of jQuery inherits many jQuery bad practices

user259867

Code Review question shouldn't really be in HNQ.

Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ.

Since it's not a question.

S.L. Barth

Whether something should be on HNQ, depends on what the purpose of HNQ is.

bjb568

Nobody knows.

S.L. Barth

If Code Review questions shouldn't be there... should WorldBuilding.SE or SoftwareRecs.SE questions be there?

Even identification requests make it to the HNQ... even after they're already answered.

bjb568

10:20 PM

Meh, I think it's fine. If any group of sites should be banned from HNQ, I'd say it should be religion sites — they just put out an extraordinary level of crap.

S.L. Barth

But they also serve a valid purpose. Isn't this more a problem of moderation?

Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ.

@bjb568 Religion is crap in your opinion. You need to prove that controversial statement you made up there.

hichris123

@SmokeDetector is now the #2 most active user on chat.stackexchange: chat.stackexchange.com/users?tab=all&sort=activity. Quite chatty.

Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ.

Nevertheless, I do feel that SE provides an innate atmosphere of secularity somehow, and that works against religion sites.

FWIW, I never have asked or plan to ask a question on Islam/Christianity SE.

user259867

Most active users appear to be those from language sites. Not surprisingly.

tchrist

10:27 PM

@NormalHuman Hooda thunk?

Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ.

@NormalHuman I don't count as a user from a language site tho'.

S.L. Barth

@Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ. Strictly speaking, he said that these sites put out a lot of crap. He did not denounce religion itself - at least not here.

Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ.

Even though my top second account is English Language Learners.

user259867

25 edits suggested, 25 edits approved: I'm ready for mod election on Signal Processing

Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ.

@S.L.Barth HNQs are upvoted heavily by the communities, hence, the community believed that the question had enough merit. Now someone inactive in the site makes such claim. What would you think?

user259867

10:30 PM

@Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ. Don't get me started... HNQ is fed by several answers posted quickly, and also quickly upvotes. This is not necessarily what "merit" means, unless we think of it "entertainment merit",

Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ.

@NormalHuman I meant "enough merit that they want the question to be the representative of their sites".

Braiam

@Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ. on slow days, anything with a single upvote makes it to the HNQ

user259867

This is rather a different interpretation of votes.

S.L. Barth

@Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ. Hm, do they? It's not like SE asks us, "do you want this to be in the HNQ"?

Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ.

Well, I do know that upvotes are handed out for a million reasons, only one of which is the post's quality.

S.L. Barth

10:32 PM

IIRC it's based on some secret formula that assigns "arbitrary hotness points".

user259867

Someone starring a remark about cats doesn't mean saying "we want cat jokes to be representatives of this chatroom". It means they liked it, because OMG how cute.

2

Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ.

Chatrooms aren't supposed to hold to the site standards though.

Braiam

@S.L.Barth nope

43

A: How do the "arbitrary hotness points" work on the new Stack Exchange home page?

Basically what's documented here: What formula should be used to determine "hot" questions? We have a few tweaks: Succeeding questions from the same site are penalized by increasing amounts. So, the first question from SO in the list gets multiplied by 1.0, the second by 0.98, the third ...

Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ.

@NormalHuman But what about the 'mod congratulation'?

S.L. Barth

@Braiam Thanks!

Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ.

10:36 PM

Though all of this might be worthless to discuss.

We really dunno what bikeshedding looks like in a religion SE.

Braiam

I think that there should be a cutoff for the question entering the list

something like: 4 upvotes on the question

Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ.

The only "religion" questions I've seen are smokey reports basically stating "pls can i watch porn?"

S.L. Barth

I hope Smokey reports are not representative for the sites where they come from.

Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ.

They're representatives, but not for the sites.

Braiam

@S.L.Barth I really think that we should rename drupal to spalm

Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ.

10:38 PM

The feces aren't representatives of humans.

Braiam

exceptions withstanding!

Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ.

True that.

S.L. Barth

Exceptions are not representative by definition.

Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ.

@Braiam Those weren't humans. They were feces.

OK let's change the subject.

I need to sleep. Bye o/

Braiam

@S.L.Barth yet, for some reason, I kept tripping on them at some time

S.L. Barth

10:45 PM

@Braiam On SO, or SE in general? Just curious.

Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ.

I tripped on exceptions thrice in chem when I was the most active user.

tchrist

@Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ. Stop dividing by zero.

Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ.

BTW I always wondered, what does x/0 really mean?

Falls asleep

S.L. Barth

@Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ. Ok, fun story for the night. I once asked a maths student what 0/0 was. She said that it depended on the course you were taking.

Braiam

funny

S.L. Barth

10:50 PM

It's time for me to go to bed as well.

Braiam

in Unix and Linux on The Stack Exchange Network Chat, yesterday, by mikeserv

people vote for what they understand, and, (as i consider it) inexplicably, the less they understand, the more they vote!

^ that might be accurate

S.L. Barth

Indeed....

Before I leave, I'd like to say I'm glad to see that my more serious comments also got a few stars. (It did not go unnoticed).

tchrist

@Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ. Is x zero?

S.L. Barth

Bye, everybody!

SmokeDetector

11:04 PM

[ SmokeDetector ] Offensive answer detected: Why is "q" followed by a "u"? by user149415 on english.stackexchange.com

bjb568

@S.L.Barth yup

Nov 8 at 18:20, by bjb568

> Generally, those who practise black magic attack people using the help from Jinns.
> They may also harm people using their hairs.

tchrist

@SmokeDetector tpu-

bjb568

Tho religion is the epitome of weakness in the human brain too…

tchrist

@bjb568 Are you trying to get suspended, or is this just another “accident”? That’s an incredibly insulting thing to say about people you disagree with.

Santa Claus

We do have some new mods who would love to try out their powers on a cat wearing sunglasses...

bjb568

11:13 PM

@tchrist I have no problem with the poor blokes that get indoctrinated into organized irrationality, it's the concept itself that I dislike.

tchrist

I doubt that anybody whom you’ve offended is going to take up the gauntlet you hurled at them. I just don't understand why you would do that.

Braiam

That religion is being used to serve self interest of the people at the top, that's one thing. But I'm unsure if that's the thing you are trying to get at...

bjb568

I guess I should clarify; "weakness in the human mind" isn't an insult to those who practice religion, my point is that religion exploits vulnerabilities in the mind, proving that minds are weak and manipulable.

Braiam

well, you can say the same about markets

rene

11:30 PM

@bjb568 Hmmm, that is flagged dude ...

Braiam

that message is at least within respectful discourse

rene

Anyway, it now either needs a few more 10K-ers to get that (in)validated or we wait for SE staff to join this fruitful discussion....

@NormalHuman @InfiniteRecursion @JasonC your room is flagged, Room Owner intervention is advised...

user259867

I'm not an authority on religious issues, but I don't see that much problem in a rather unoriginal expression of teenage nihilism.

user259867

gets flagged for age-ism

rene

My pleasure

bjb568

11:39 PM

@rene Seriously? Out of the 3, only a clarification post gets flagged?

rene

Yep, that is how these things work...

bjb568

@Braiam I have, albeit in one of my English class journel entries, not the Internet :p

Humans are stupid and get manipulated in every way possible (especially if profitable).

user259867

@bjb568 That's a pity. Why don't you get a blag?

bjb568

Meh, nobody cares what I say. Not even me.

At least not enough to publish it.

SmokeDetector

[ SmokeDetector ] Bad keyword in answer, email in answer: Can I scratch off the magnetic strip off a debit card to only allow chip and PIN? by NATASHA on security.stackexchange.com

user259867

11:44 PM

@SmokeDetector tpu-

Braiam

> say goodbye to poverty, these cards are just for you

I don't think they know how the economy works...

at least under the current system

user259867

Speaking of poverty, the poor Normal Town was in press lately, as an example of How to Decimate a City

user259867

Wasn't there an Urban Planning proposal on A51 once? Probably auto-deleted by now.

SmokeDetector

[ SmokeDetector ] Manually reported answer: Movie DB - storage of Actors / actress / Tags? by Karthick on stackoverflow.com

user259867

... if there was a filter for links to .in sites in short answers, would that be discrimination?

user259867

11:50 PM

There are plenty of legitimate ones, though: like this one.

user259867

Instead of .in TLD, it may be better to focus on the lack of path.

user259867

Sending a user to the front page of any site is rarely a good idea.

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