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11:02 AM
@Flyk It's not that you're not appreciated, it's that the mod team there is really currently maxed out. Elections alone generate quite a bit of work. I left an answer.
 
@TimPost why not have obsolete flags and the like on an auto-nuke as well with sufficient flags? Is there anything particularly problematic about that?
 
@TimPost thanks for the answer, if I had actually been told to hold off in words that were not cryptic with multiple possible meanings I would have held off
 
@Bart Accuracy, for the most part. We'd love to be able to just get rid of those based on matching but ... you can't.
 
I'm not trying to create enemies, however for this mod to jump at me making accusations and for the team in general to just reject everything truly stinks.
 
@Flyk I'm walking into this a bit blind as it's erupting so bear with me :)
 
11:09 AM
You state that it's a working relationship, sure, I can understand what you're trying to say
but so far the only side of the relationship that's working is mine
I'm no mind reader!
 
Okay @TimPost. I was wondering, given that we don't put too much value into comments, and plenty of them would be easy to judge with enough votes. But I'm sure that has been thought off at some point.
 
and you know I love you for undeleting my account so I'm not trying to make your life hard
I just feel this needs a proper resolution
In all fairness, comments should be something a 20k+ user can handle without a mod
 
@Flyk I know. I think 80% of the problem is that they're rather stressed out.
 
@Flyk Perhaps just let it go for a bit. People under pressure/workload don't always use the best ways to phrase certain things. Just let it cool down a bit on both sides.
 
(which hopefully gets better at 20:00 Zulu today)
 
11:10 AM
@TimPost Well I offered them a solution to that when I nominated myself but I was rejected by the community
which is sad, since based on the numbers I'm being given for mods handling flags, I handle as many flags as two of the mods on Arqade on a monthly basis
 
@Flyk I think you jumped in that just too soon, to be honest.
 
@TimPost it's all good, I don't intend to put myself through it again
 
The take away here is .. you should in no way feel bad, or be made to feel bad for just trying to do what we encourage users to do. On the flip side, it is a working relationship, they're stretched too thin, so let the new mods come in later today, give the team some time to gel, and then we're probably looking at a whole new situation.
 
not on Arqade anyway, I am actively looking for another site on the network to dedicate my time to, preferably one with the mods and community aren't biased against me
 
I think most of the problem here can just be summed up as frustration.
 
11:13 AM
It's still unacceptable to mass decline valid flags
If they don't have time, then they shouldn't do anything.
 
not to mention, I'm being told by other moderators that it's actually easier to deal with the flags than to decline them
so this entire situation is rather pathetic and comes across as a personal attack
 
@Flyk I can't describe to you how hard that would be. This whole situation has, unfortunately, ended up much worse than it should have been.
 
yeah it's amazing what clearly stating "would you mind waiting a couple of weeks" would have done for the situation
instead of cryptic crap and insults
 
Humans sometimes aren't the best communicators when they're stressed.
 
11:18 AM
I have had ZERO communication from Arqade's mod team, the cryptic comment was from Grace
I do not view myself at fault in any way here
I'm sure many will disagree with me
especially once all of the mod candidates wake up in a few hours
while the answers on this positively voted question are currently negative, once the sheep wake up they'll blindly vote without reading any of what has gone on
and then some random like jmfsg will turn up and say "looks like community consensus disagrees with you", like normal
It's things like this that led up to my account deletion last time
(no I'm not deleting my account again)
 
@Flyk I will hunt you down and throw pickled onions at you if you do :P
 
@TimPost I have too much respect for the time spent to undelete me to do it again
I wish you had managed to recover my flag and review history though
;)
it turned out to be not a huge deal though, since I'm so active in those regards that I'm pretty much back where I was when I submitted the deletion
only took six months
and... why pickled onions?
 
@Flyk I looked around for something about the size to be used for ammo and I saw a jar of pickled onions. Almost went with capers instead.
 
@Flyk Grace did state that the mod team was discussing it at the time
Maybe .. you could have waited?
 
@Manishearth I wasn't asked to wait, and I did clearly state "well I'm going to do some more" and nobody said ANYTHING to indicate it would be a problem
I did all the communicating
All it would have taken was "just wait for a bit"
and that never happened
 
11:25 AM
It's very easy to lose a comment on the site and in chat quite easily during hustle and bustle
 
I don't do cryptic, if you be cryptic at me and then expect me to take that as a warning then the problem is yours not mine
This isn't the first time badp has used a cryptic comment to state I've been warned
the last time he moved some messages from the bridge to android hell without saying a thing and apparently that was a warning
 
Sometimes folks don't realize they'll be misunderstood, and sometimes folks are trying not to say too much in the public view about past events.
 
which he then used to suspend me for hours on the grounds I had been warned "multiple times"
and then I got suspended for complaining about the way it had been handled
 
Okay, okay, nobody's perfect - news at 11. Let's make something better out of this instead.
 
I mean, seriously
 
11:28 AM
Wait what? Surely "Nobody's perfect" is breaking news! I'm not waiting until 11.
 
Thinking back, your account actually uncovered a bug in the tool that helps us put them back together. It hadn't been run on one that had so many posts before.
 
woo, I was helpful
 
the explosion was ... glorious
 
I'm not completely sure on what the general opinion of my presence is here on SE, but I like to think I'm helpful and my time spent here is actually useful overall
sometimes I'm not so sure though
 
Well, your presence here makes the bar on the left very pink ... not sure how I feel about that ...
 
11:39 AM
well it's either that or ponies
 
@Flyk I think you've found a generally good reception on sites where you've participated, and your contributions are obviously valued. Don't read too much into what has turned out to be a big ball of frustration for all.
 
@Flyk Make it pink ponies and we have a deal.
 
@Bart rainbow dash > pinkie pie, sorry
@TimPost This isn't the first time something like this has happened though, and I really doubt it will be the last
 
@TimPost woooooo. That's fast
Once Undo finishes Cinder (and possibly if we hook it up with SmokeDetector) then I think spam response time will become much faster
 
Since you're pink, if your name was Floyd instead of Flyk, I'd be worried about that. But since it's not I think everything will be fine.
 
11:49 AM
-.-
 
@JanDvorak Nice work on SmokeDetector.
 
Yeah!
Time to add more regexes (like money regexes, etc, which we couldn't add before due to false positives)
 
pull accepted, I guess? Thanks!
I've tried pushing directly, but I've got 403
 
@Manishearth If you or @Jan get to it before I get home from school... go for it. Otherwise, I'll work on it in ~7 hours.
 
@hichris123 I guess my script will serve as a dry run for regexes I suggest?
 
11:55 AM
I plan to add argparse to ws.py so that I can dryrun things and output spam links
 
or, you could add two levels of results? One for "sure spam" and one for "possible spam"
I'm happy with my notifications showing "possible spam"
 
Huh. I don't know...
I mean, isn't it kinda the same regexes right now?
 
I have several other regexes that @Manishearth stripped out.
 
Oh, okay. I only took a quick look at the pull request....
I don't know.
Cya people!
 
bye
also, I've got a good training using multiple remotes on Git
 
12:01 PM
... and with this I think I have found the new logo for SharePoint SE
(rats- whole room must have gone in a suicide streak after that one image)
 
That happens at an alarming frequency.
 
too broad? ^
 
I went with "unclear what you're asking"
there's no question there
 
12:38 PM
or that
 
@TimPost the mod team on Arqade are firing personal attacks at me for trying to get a concise answer
I'm sorry for lumbering you with it, but I'm going AFK because I don't see that as acceptable behaviour from anybody, let alone a mod, and it has genuinely upset me
 
@Flyk It's perhaps not a satisfying resolution, but reading through the post, the best thing at the moment would be to simply walk away from that post and the situation.
 
@Flyk I'm talking to Grace now. This whole thing needs to tone down about 20 notches. Hang tight.
And yeah, AFK might do some good.
 
Hmm, it looks like @Pëkka, but kind of doesn't look like Pëkka. Something is off here. Might it be one of those "genuine" Pëkkas?
 
1:01 PM
@Bart it is a new generation of Pekka. Like handbags, styles change with time.
 
New and improved then?
 
- More mature - Less cranky - 25% more cheerful - 25% more early riser.
Improved MPG!
 
@Manishearth haha that is cool, is this a thing in here now?
 
Ah yes, spam and all-caps
 
1:09 PM
The irony of this does not escape me, but I just removed a bunch of comments that are now obsolete :/ - Thanks for keeping it civil folks. — Tim Post 25 secs ago
 
@TimPost lol
Getting ready for a 1-hour walk through the slush to Uni - and I'm looking forward to it!
It's the coolest time of the day, nothing to do, podcasts to listen to
 
What podcasts do you listen to?
 
THE COOL PODCASTS, OBVIOUSLY.
 
I'm trying to get into Objective-C for app development, and listening to all manner of iOS podcasts, which is interesting. You pick up stuff that will probably come in handy later
Then there's some American Studies related stuff but so far, everything I've listened to is excruciatingly boring. Unfortunately! Because the topics are interesting
Podcast recommendations in both fields are always welcome!
Gotta go, later!
 
1:24 PM
See, that's where I go wrong @TimPost. Obvious to you maybe, but here I've been listening to episodes of "This week in belching".
cya @Pëkka
 
1:43 PM
@Bart That's a pretty deep podcast, I hear
 
1:53 PM
@Pëkka work in progress and a proof of concept for the chat wrapper, but yes
 
2:07 PM
@Tim the package has arrived, eager to go and take it from the mail office. Thanks a bunch! :-D
 
Pretty sure he said he doesn't have it yet
 
@TimPost well, I can take a pic of the package notice ;)
 
You're such a sentimental sap
That got out quick. Yay, FedEx!
 
@TimPost I know, giving him a warning :p
Wait, @ShadowWizard, you're not in the US, right?
 
2:11 PM
@Manishearth nope, far far away
beyond the ocean
 
I can expect brown box by thursday then :D
 
You too? Cool!
 
@ShadowWizard o/
we're both far far away
 
Yep and you're far far away from me as well
 
past one ocean and one sea. Or one larger ocean if you look at it the wrong way
 
2:12 PM
And I get nothing? What is this nonsense?
 
@Bart you're not special enough :P
 
People tell me I'm special all the time @ShadowWizard. Don't know why they use the air quotes when saying that though.
 
@Manishearth dupe detector in smoke detector working? It won't send more than one alert for same post again?
@Bart lol! What matters is how you feel :D
 
@ShadowWizard yeah. Unless a different piece of spam is wedged in between the edits. The detector is forgetful
 
Good for the detector!
@Bart for example ever since seeing that post couple of minutes ago I can't help it, feeling totally FatSecret
 
2:15 PM
haha
 
Love android just for those cool names
 
Would you guys say that this question belongs on Code Review?
 
No
 
@RyanCarlson I think one need to explain his code not just throw it as-is and expect a review, so no it will probably get negative feedback over there
 
And in addition the OP seems to be looking for a debugging service. i.e. find bugs in my code. That's not what the site is for.
 
2:27 PM
@Bart As Sheldon said "I am not mad. My mother had me tested"
 
:)
 
Someone actually voted the SharePoint pony? I am genuinely worried now.
 
Yep, and name him Share Pointy.
 
2:48 PM
U.R.G.H. This was really lame, @TimPost. So lamethat I loved that name, and added it so SharePoint meta post ^_^
 
You're welcome.
 
"Tim Post: Lame is his game"
 
@work...
 
btw... wondering @TimPost. Any news on the status of that SO meta branch that was posted some time ago?
ye know, splitting the board in two and such.
 
3:05 PM
We're just waiting for someone to finish up with some login related changes, and it's going to happen
 
@TimPost knew it! It's always Nick fault.
:P
 
Nope, not Nick's fault this time
 
Oh no, Manish left... so no smoke detector for us? :-(
 
@ShadowWizard wasn't it ruby based?
 
No, he automagically joins when the bot posts something.
 
3:08 PM
@Undo oh, that's cool. Hope you're right!
(tempted to post ALL CAPS somewhere to lure the bot.... but on second thought not a good idea ;))
 
3:25 PM
I need some help migrating this question
 
... does that really need migration? It doesn't belong on SO, but would't do much better on Meta.
Ah well, voted to migrate, and dupe at hand
 
@Bart better close it as a dup here?
 
I generally hesitate to do that for questions like those though @rene, since we end up saying "Hey, ask that over there" and then generally they still get voted to a crisp on Meta.
 
It has been migrated @ChrisForrence.
 
3:31 PM
Thanks
And I hadn't thought of the whole 'out of the frying pan and into the fire'
 
Yeah, doesn't necessarily have to happen, but I am cautious, especially when it's not a definite great question at the wrong place.
 
That's fair
I wonder if there's a statistic for time of day that positive/negative votes happen the most
Like, is it safer to migrate a question at 9am as opposed to 2pm
 
@ChrisForrence I can tell you when I go to sleep
 
Just check if I'm around. If not, it should be safe. ;)
Haha, two at the same time
 
"increased or deceased". I wonder if innocent typo or on purpose?
 
3:38 PM
I assume that question is now in the migration queue?
 
@rene no it's already migrated there's no queue
> Post Migrated Away to meta.stackoverflow.com by Mike W, Dmitry Bychenko, ChrisForrence, Bart, rene
 
I was looking in the new questions tab for it... aaah caching...
 
That should be 1 minute caching, weird
 
That user has not an account here yet. Are @ comments delivered in that case?
 
@rene good question, I don't think so.
The OP gets a single inbox item saying the question was migrated.
 
3:43 PM
Nope, he doesn't get pinged for those
 
Let us pray that the user understands what just happened...
Not only are we not giving rep but we also make questions disappear...
 
Although the question is still on his profile, so at least he should be able to follow it
 
@rene MUAHAHAHAHAhaha...ahem...
 
Bart for president
 
s/president/moderator/
 
3:50 PM
Careful now.
 
4:05 PM
2
Q: Migrated question of non-existing user

Zaheer AhmedI just replied to a post which was migrated from Stack Overflow: There is no user info on the question. This might be because the user does not have an account linked on Meta. So, if a question is migrated and the user does not have an account on that particular site, does the user get th...

No answer...
not even a comment
 
Hmm, confused now. The deleted answer to that question links to meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/96567/…
 
But if I understand the answer correctly @ comments ARE delivered to the inbox of the user, existing on the site or not.
 
Hence my confusion
 
It might be fixed-broken...
 
@Bart I think he means only if the author got account on the other site.
 
4:12 PM
...in a later release
 
@Undo Really? I didn't know that
 
4:32 PM
@Manishearth Yeah, chat seems to freak out when you post a message without being in here.
 
@Undo oh right, I don't join the room at all in the script. I just POST message.
poor chat server
must feel unloved.
 
@Shog9 if you remove your answer from that, I'll delete my post altogether
 
No
 
It's obvious the community aren't interested
and I can't remove it unless you remove your post
I've had enough hateful and spiteful comments thrown at me today, I'm going to find something better to do
 
Close -> delete vote
 
4:44 PM
I don't really want to go through that process
when the person stopping me from just outright removing it is sat just here
*points at @Shog9*
I have a negatively voted post and you know how allergic I am to those
 
I thought I was more than clear in this room with all of you listening as to how this should be handled. But you didn't listen, and now folks are saying we failed to communicate. So let me be clear:
I support better comment moderation. I welcome all efforts to define and develop better tooling for this purpose. But it must be a collaborative effort, done with respect for the community and those entrusted with the task of moderating it. Y'all shot yourself in the foot yesterday by not doing that, and that stinks - so you're gonna learn from it, or at least serve as a useful example for the next person to try.
8
 
I am not putting a week of my life into sorting comments into groups to keep and groups to delete when the community doesn't want me to
so let me delete my post!
 
No.
 
why?
 
See pinned message above.
 
4:46 PM
Forget about the post.
for the time being
 
You know, after the personal attacks from moderators today, I'm not convinced that deleting my account just to remove a meta post from it is outside of my list of options
especially since once again nothing seems to have been done about them
 
ಠ_ಠ
 
@Flyk I'm not aware of this, or involved in it. You know the process for handling personal remarks. My concern here is limited what I stated.
 
@Shog9 I would email team@, but last time I did that you banned me for 24 hours.
 
@Flyk I don't remember that; did it have something to do with chat arguments?
 
4:50 PM
I was reporting a troll, and got accused of feeding the trolls
So my apologies if I have very little faith in your processes
 
As I said, I don't recall the specific situation you're referring to; I can look it up, if you feel the need to rehash it now though.
 
nope, I'm just stating why I'm not going to email
you're denying my flags now?
sigh
 
@Flyk Then don't. If you see a personal/attacking comment, flag it - a number of these have already been handled/removed, and I see no reason why any that remain can't be dealt with in this fashion as well.
 
@Shog9 are you kidding? Flag it so that the moderators making the attacks can deny it?
 
@Flyk Lets take this offline
Just because you didn't see something happen doesn't mean it didn't happen
But I'm not going to talk about it in here.
 
4:55 PM
@TimPost hence ze word "seems"
 
My, the zing in your ze is quite distinctive today.
 
zat it iz
ooh la la
 
If you want to talk about it, my email is on my profile, and I'm happy to do so. This just isn't the venue really.
 
It's home time, I'm going to go drive home in my emotional state and either get home alive or wrap myself around a tree
not on purpose, I'll add
I very much want to live
but... emotions
 
Yes, living is good. Trees, bad.
Well non-threatening trees are probably okay, but you never know with trees.
2
 
4:57 PM
I recommend a cup of tea and a nice walk before driving.
 
I work in a city, walking is hazardous for my health
it's like smoking 20 cigarettes in 5 minutes
 
Then I recommend a cup of tea and a nice cigarette
 
I've done that before, and it is kinda rough.
 
I don't smoke
well, no cigarettes
dirty habit
 
Okay, now I feel good living in a country with no real cities
 
4:58 PM
WHAT DO YOU DO THEN AGGGGGGGGGGGGAAAAHHHHH
 
Then I recommend... You're not in Colorado or Washington by any chance, are you?
 
I smoke huge quantities of marijuana as a mood regulator
@Shog9 no, but I don't care what the law says
 
Then you get my recommendation.
Still, careful with the driving.
 
We're smokin' obsolete comments, man?
I miss Cheech.
 
now remove your damned answer, I can't be seen with a negatively scored post
 
4:59 PM
Why isn't the smoke detector going off?
 
goddamit
I have NO NEGATIVELY VOTED POSTS
you're ruining my existence
 
@Flyk you call that a negatively scored post? Pfft.
 
@Shog9 I'm serious.
 
Last time I checked, negative was <0
 
-15
A: Nominations: New Stack Overflow Moderator

Shog9I would like to nominate Chet A, a long-time Stack Overflow user and possibly our glorious leader's secret evil twin. He's far too modest to nominate himself, however I managed to obtain tacit approval: Reasons Chet would be a good choice He's a serious workaholic His avatar pic looks like a...

 
5:00 PM
and -3<0
 
THAT's a negatively-scored post.
 
-3 is lower than 0
-3 is negatively scored
 
within a rounding error
 
-147
Q: How to send 100,000 emails weekly?

xRobotHow can one send an email to 100,000 users on a weekly basis in PHP? This includes mail to subscribers using the following providers: AOL G-Mail Hotmail Yahoo It is important that all e-mail actually be delivered, to the extent that it is possible. Obviously, just sending the mail conventiona...

 
yesss
 
5:01 PM
you're going to make me cry
 
Positive score is >0±5
 
@Shog9 I'm a little hesitant to bring this up, but aren't you being a little rough with us? I respect you and everything you've done for SE. Quite frankly, you're awesome. But we're trying to help. We messed up. Saying that "you're gonna learn from it, or at least serve as a useful example for the next person to try" is kinda discouraging to us and the next person to try, which isn't what you want. Right?
 
@Undo in the grand scheme of things, nothing shog has said has discouraged me
those downvotes however, really upsetting
 
Yes, but it's kinda discouraging to me.
@Flyk Ugh, downvotes.
 
LPMF suddenly deciding to side with the community rather than act like he normally does, incredibly upsetting
 
5:03 PM
@Undo I don't want to discourage you. But I absolutely do want you to listen. I've offered my assistance in the past, and I'm sure others would be happy to do so as well - but you gotta be willing to work with them. If you're doing something that creates a problem for others and they tell you this, stop!
 
I'm almost tempted to change my vote.
@Shog9 unless they're super cryptic, in which case, continue until somebody actually says stop.
because cryptic is just wrong
 
Yes, I kinda didn't get a "STOP" message until about half an hour ago.
 
also, @Undo, sorry, I think it's my fault manish is in a bad mood
 
...no, this would be a bad time to play ignorant. If you aren't clear on what someone who is obviously upset with you means, ask them to clarify.
 
I also think he has me on ignore
 
5:04 PM
 
Yeah, we killed it.
 
@Manishearth cool
 
@Shog9 It's not a case of playing ignorant, you lose a lot of language by chatting in text and if something needs to stop then say "stop" not "I think it would be better if you didn't do 100 at once"
 
Exactly.
 
I read the latter as "fine, I'll do 50"
and then EXPLOSIONS
 
5:06 PM
I really don't want to cause drama, BTW.
 
If somebody had said lastnight "Stop for a bit while we discuss this"
 
I think it's a case of cultural differences in communication..
 
I would have stopped, there and then
No questions asked
 
In Finland, we'd say "for **** sakes stop it" basically
 
My advice for now is: find someone on a mod team who is willing to help you, and get them to help sanity-check your tooling when you have something you think is workable. Solicit feedback, and react to it. When you have something you think is generally useful, announce it publicly - and respond to feedback there as well.
 
5:06 PM
but what actually happened was I got a cryptic thing from Grace, I got a "I'm too busy to talk about this" from badp, and then I got 50+ declines and raised a meta post, which caused explosions
 
sounds good.
 
nothing that I've done in the last 48 hours was ever supposed to cause this much drama
my meta post was looking for a "we're currently under a heavy load, just chill out for a week"
not a "you've been warned three times, prepare for a ban"
anyway, I've stayed at work an extra 8 minutes to clarify these things
you should feel special and loved
no I can't be bothered to look up a unicode heart for you, you know how to use google
o/
 
...oh, uniCODE
 
@Shog9 Just a quick thing, you're post isn't quite accurate. The tool is designed with the idea in mind of people consciously looking at context (heck, we have a context button). We're not quite relying on simple pattern matching.
 
@Undo Good. But none of that is expressed in the question - it should be!
 
5:12 PM
In fact, it supports flagging the context too. Because usually obsolete comments are surrounded by many more
 
Yes, but me haz 150 rep on Arqade. So me can't even suggest edits on meta ;(
 
Lest you think this is paranoia, there's a rather long history of folks doing simple keyword searches and flagging the results blindly. It is a GIGANTIC waste of time, and the meta post makes it sound like that's what is being proposed.
@Undo how about MSO?
 
It's not.
@Shog9 Oh, me can do that. Should I make a new post?
 
@Undo Start a post, document the goals of your project, what you have so far, etc.
 
Sounds great.
 
5:13 PM
Let folks review it, chime in, submit pull requests, etc.
 
Sounds great.
We'll probably wait until we have hichris here, then start working on it.
 
take your time, do it right
 
We will. Thanks :D
 
5:43 PM
Ooh ooh, @Undo, tell me when you post it so I can downvote.
 
@Bart Really?
 
Sure. Just for the fun of it though
 
sigh
 
Haha
@Shog9 feel free to say "none of your business" but am I missing something with the OP of this question? Are there deleted comments/questions that ended up being not constructive?
 
@Bart no
 
5:47 PM
Hmm, okay. Thanks
 

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