Tavern on the Meta

Anonymous

6:00 PM

Are deleted questions ever bumped, from the perspective of users who can see them?

Anonymous

Hmm... they're probably not listed so that's not a meaningful question.

Shog9

uh, right

Tim Stone

@JeremyBanks Well, inadvertently by the realtime updates (for the moment)

Anonymous

@TimStone Ah, interesting.

moguzalp

why does the moderator not have diamond on chat?

Tim Stone

6:06 PM

Wha?

Shog9

@moguzalp @balpha hates diamonds. He'd rather be blue

►

mootinator

Never liked Eiffel (as a programming language)

moguzalp

It seems everybody is equal here as nobody has no diamond :)

Steven Jeuris

@mootinator What about Eiffel? (as in tower)

jadarnel27

@Shog9 So...you really had that link easily accessible, huh?

Shog9

6:08 PM

Of course everyone is equal here. Some of us are just more equal*

balpha

@moguzalp And I am the most equal of all!

Shog9

@jadarnel27 If I don't link to it often enough, @RebeccaChernoff gets sad

jadarnel27

Haha, fair enough.

moguzalp

You moderator guys, is it possible you share your screen shot of SO screen

I wonder what it looks like?

mootinator

@StevenJeuris Never been there.

Shog9

6:09 PM

@moguzalp We see all the really good questions

Steven Jeuris

@mootinator Do you like stairs? If you do you should really go there!

mootinator

@StevenJeuris Stairs are considered romantic, I hear.

moguzalp

a lot of control buttons everywhere, ban this guy, delete this post, "destroy the world" :)

The Unicorn Whisperer

@moguzalp It looks pretty much exactly like yours.

Steven Jeuris

@mootinator Yeah, ... take the stairway to heaven for example.

The Unicorn Whisperer

6:10 PM

Except they have a link to the mod tools.

moguzalp

"god tools" :)

Steven Jeuris

@TheUnicornWhisperer I'd imagine it has a lot more incoming 'blame the mods' comments though.

moguzalp

@Shog9 Can you see draft questions?

Rebecca Chernoff

6:29 PM

@Shog9 I hate you ):

Steven Jeuris

How do I get this timeline thingy to work on questions?

Shog9

@jadarnel27 SEE! I haven't been linking to it enough! HER FURY WILL DESTROY US ALL!

Steven Jeuris

"/questions/xxxx/timeline" doesn't seem to work

Shog9

@moguzalp No

Anonymous

@StevenJeuris /posts/

Steven Jeuris

6:31 PM

@JeremyBanks Thanks!

I won't be able to read your comments this evening. Perhaps tonight when I get home. (hopefully a bit drunk)

Unless you are nearly finished?

Anonymous

Steven Jeuris

Ah mockups! good idea, SE loves those!

So what does it represent?

Anonymous

Low-granularity voting is fine for Stack Overflow proper, but for meta where we're having long discussions people need to express approval or disapproval in a much more nuanced way, and the current voting system doesn't do a very good job.

2

Anonymous

People are forced to express it in comments, which is incredibly inefficient and not obvious to somebody glancing over the thread.

Anonymous

I appreciate the technical and UX issues in doing something like this, but I really feel like this is one of the larger problems contributing to the "mob-like" mentality, to whatever extent it exists.

Steven Jeuris

6:34 PM

Additionally, might I add that that post as far as I know is becoming one of the posts with the most positive outcome to 'the bigger picture'. It could end up being allowed to be interpreted of being proof we should be discussing this here.

Anonymous

It may or may not be worth the cost to implement, but consider the idea, folks.

Steven Jeuris

If you want to add extra argumentations to the cause, that might be a good place to add them. I don't mind one bit. I will roll back if I don't agree with the edits.

meta.stackoverflow.com/posts/124643/timeline

@JeremyBanks I still don't fully understand what the colors mean. Care to expand a bit on that?

Anonymous

@StevenJeuris Displaying the actual vote counts beside paragraphs (at least by default) would be way too much noise. Orange = neutral, red = downvoted, green = upvoted.

Anonymous

I'm not sure how best to normalize/scale the values, I just generated random ones there.

Steven Jeuris

@JeremyBanks Oh! So you can vote per paragraph? That would be pretty neat! Unfortunately not many people structure their text in clear separated paragraphs.

Anonymous

6:40 PM

What I currently have in mind is that you hover the right hand column beside a paragraph and you would have paragraph-specific voting controls.

Anonymous

@StevenJeuris Yeah, I know... paragraphs aren't optimal, but they're the only remotely-practical choice that occurs to me.

Steven Jeuris

From a developers viewpoint, I feel this suggestion would be easier to implement than my pro/contra suggestion. That's a pro argument! :)

Contra would be you still have only one comment thread to discuss all those issues, as you have raised is a problem: chat.meta.stackoverflow.com/transcript/message/896101#896101

In general I find it a really great idea, and it's these kinds of discussions we should be able to be having without people constantly intervening they don't want change.

Anonymous

@StevenJeuris I will post this there later.

CodeInChaos

Why does SO use the IP for gravatar(in the absence of an email address), instead of say the user ID? This has almost no upsides, and serious privacy concerns, since the IPv4 space is easily brute-forcible.

Steven Jeuris

@JeremyBanks Hmmm, I want to keep a clear separation between 'the problem', and 'the solution'.

Voting is difficult enough, adding both a problem and a solution makes this even more so.

The granularity concept might be a good thing to go into detail there, yes.

Anonymous

6:46 PM

@StevenJeuris Sure. You meant into your "Question" post?

Steven Jeuris

I can't immediately recall whether I mentioned something of the like.

Anonymous

Complications: what do you do when a post is edited? Urg.

Steven Jeuris

The post which is attracting up votes. If you edit it it gets bumped, and it has a chance of receiving even more up votes. That's what's been happening the last few times it got bumped.

Anonymous

Challenging.

Steven Jeuris

@JeremyBanks What do you mean?

Anonymous

6:49 PM

If votes are per-paragraph, the paragraphs might change when the post is edited.

Anonymous

Maintaining the vote association might be impossible.

Steven Jeuris

@JeremyBanks Simple solution, when a post is edited I would clear all votes on the edited paragraph.

And as to address the commenting issue I believe I might have an idea.

Just as referring to previous posts in chat works. We could use a similar system for paragraphs. You refer to a paragraph, clicking it takes you to it.

Then I no longer have to constantly quote myself, which is something which I have been doing a lot lately. :)

... Either way, if you end up posting something on Meta, and it gets down voted to shreds. Just come back here. I really feel that might be the most valuable feedback we have gotten from Meta.

Even better, link to here.

I'm leaving now. Talk to you later!

Anonymous

I'll be sure to make a post or edit later, I also am busy now. Bye!

jadarnel27

7:23 PM

A.I.!

...what's the "A" stand for again?

CodeInChaos

Does editing community wiki answers bump the question?

jadarnel27

Yup.

CodeInChaos

Strange. I've edited an old CW answer of mine 15 mins ago, and it hasn't been bumped.

Rebecca Chernoff

on meta?

jadarnel27

On meta?

@RebeccaChernoff JINX!

Tim Stone

7:34 PM

She beat you by a second, I'm afraid. NINJA!

CodeInChaos

on meta

jadarnel27

@TimStone But I said jinx first. Which means @Rebecca can't talk again until her name is said 3 times.

Rebecca Chernoff

@CodeInChaos link to post please?

jadarnel27

Hey!

Tim Stone

4

A: Is Gravatar a privacy risk?

One problem with gravatar isn't solved by blocking the server. The website you use publishes the hash of your email address. At minimum this makes it possible to find other websites where you used the same email address. Looking at the Jan 2011 SE data dump: 105k unique gravatar hashes 10k ar...

Rebecca Chernoff

7:36 PM

...n/m >_<

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