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8:01 PM
@ChrisF What's with that nonsense? They should've written about SO!
@PopularDemand FWIW: this is (roughly) the recipe I used, but with reduced flour due to the already-juiced carrot pulp. You could probably reduce the sugar significantly as well, especially if you're not juicing the carrots first.
@Moshe I'm posting a comment :)
@ChrisF - Please do, perhaps we should all do so.
@Pekka 'k, still working my way through the backlog.
@ChrisF Next up: "the most popular restaurant no one visits", followed shortly by "the American Idol winner no one voted for"
@Shog9 I don't know that aiming for the air handler on a 16 story building works out so well, but ok, I'm game.
8:04 PM
@Shog9 Thank you!
@drachenstern sure it will - bigger target
I meant for it to find me versus just become building potpourri
@drachenstern they usually have access doors - just walk up there and open the one downstream from the gaping hole in the sheetmetal
@Moshe Poeple did hear about SO.
8:05 PM
Comment added
Well, the intended audience has.
@radp - fair enough
@radp ...and a fair population outside of the intended audience (hence SE)...
I wonder how many people use both SE and Quora.
Someone just "followed" my account on Quora a couple days ago
8:08 PM
@PopularDemand a lot
@Shog9 - commented as well, short and sweet.
AFAIK, there are only two questions, and they're both about food
And I'm willing to bet there are one or two alot using Quora as well
I haven't checked Quora in ages.
> Steve Case, the co-founder and former chief executive of AOL, is among those asking and answering questions – any question you like – on the site.

"How can I hamstring a major media conglomerate by using my overvalued stock to leverage a merger?"
8:11 PM
However, the fact that now typing in my email address discloses my name and surname to anybody in the world pisses me off.
@radp How's that?!
@Shog9 log out and log back in.
> Notification: Leif Walsh voted up your answer. Jun 8, 2010
> Don't use 'password' for your password
oh wow thanks for telling me!
8:13 PM
@PopularDemand I believe you mean "use password for your password" but I could see where the extra word would creep in
Am I the only one without a Quora account?
@radp ok... I still don't get what you're saying.
@Shog9 When you typed in your email address weren't your full name and surname and avatar shown to you?
@drachenstern You rang?
(sorry, I am totally swamped today)
@radp oooh...
@TheNeedsMoarJqueryException well your next comment says what I wanted to :: "what are you doing here? Shouldn't you be working!" :p
8:14 PM
You use your real name and a recognizable photo on Facebook, don't you...
@drachenstern Clearly not, or else I wouldn't be seeing Quora's account creation widget tell me not to use 'password' as my password.
I seen you ghosting after checking my E.SE question for no new answers :p
@Shog9 I don't have facebook and I haven't yet put my face online, but I used real details for this one service, since it was behind closed doors. No more.
@PopularDemand but in about 2 minutes you will have rectified that misalignment
@radp yeah... Don't do that.
8:15 PM
@Shog9 and on my twitter, but not everywhere.
meh, no one reads twitter
@Shog9 exactly!
You'ld be surprised the number of people that can't figure out my /. or twitter ids ... or not if you've met more than three "people"
You'll be forever archived in The Library of Congress, but no one reads that either
Wow, this is... certainly not like SE.
@PopularDemand I keep picturing it like some sort of ... bazaar ... and we're in some sort of ...
what's the word I'm looking for here ...
8:18 PM
I'm kinda baffled, how is "http://www.quora.com/Have-I-fallen-in-love-with-Python-because-she-is-beautiful/answer/Vaibhav-Mallya" supposed to be a valid permalink?
Can you trust a service you can't permalink to?
well it took me there
I presume it works
How did you derive the permalink? from the timestamp?
> She's experimenting with new platforms and compilation techniques all the time.
@Shog9 Sure; I'll get to that as soon as I'm done with porting Farmville to work on SO.
What goes on in this channel anyway?
I am going to give you all pneumonia.
8:25 PM
@balpha wait, you're still not done with that? STOP PLAYING IT! Never dip into your own supply...
@FiveGoldenRings I am going to give you carrot cake
it will clog your lungs and smother the pneumonia
In exchange for carrot cake I will give you even more pneumonia because I don't like carrot cake.
@FiveGoldenRings I wouldn't ask that unless you're very brave
I am very brave.
@FiveGoldenRings you will be too busy trying to breath carrots
At least braver than someone who is scared to ask a question on the Internet.
drache, on a scale from one to ten, how much of a coward are you?
8:27 PM
@FiveGoldenRings I'm pretty sure about a 7.3 at least
I don't, however, tend to put myself in a position where I need to learn the true answer to that question
@drachenstern Would you say you're too scared to answer the question? Because I think that gives us the answer
But as I've gotten older my fear of heights has increased, as an example.
So you're a coward content with ignorance.
@MichaelMrozek I believe I did that with :432028
@FiveGoldenRings I suppose that's fair. I really have no desire to find out one way or the other how much of a coward I am. I do the things I must and usually stop there.
That's gross. You're gross.
8:29 PM
For reference to anyone else tasked with technical documentation: a timestamp near the beginning of the document for the most recent revision is always a good thing.
@drachenstern A system that automatically tracks revisions is a better thing.
55 mins ago, by Rebecca Chernoff
Wait. Negatory is pinned?
You just noticed that @RebeccaChernoff?
@Shog9 In this case I have deadtree and a pdf
I'd been wondering about that for days, LOL
@Shog9 but nominally I agree
@TheNeedsMoarJqueryException oh lord, I've awakened the Kraken
8:32 PM
@TheNeedsMoarJqueryException shush!
goto sleep master kraken
or work, one of the three
all these great names for rum... If only the shit wasn't so terrible to actually drink.
Ok. Back to worksleep
The top of that bottle looks like a penis.
8:34 PM
stupid fifteen second timer.
@FiveGoldenRings If that's true you might want to consult a doctor...
@FiveGoldenRings how in the hell do you figure that?
@FiveGoldenRings I believe I have come to realize you are a sockpuppet. But to whom do you belong oh sockpuppet.
If you don't see it there's something wrong with your pattern recognizer.
@FiveGoldenRings Only because it hasn't been opened. Someone needs to circumcise that bottle.
@Shog9 a good rum is never shit.
8:35 PM
And this is good rum
I'm a sock puppet. Everyone knows that I belong to Welbog.
@drachenstern so I've been told, but then, I've been told the same thing about tequilla, and so far I've only found that "better" equates to "less flavor". If vodka is the gold standard for quality in liquor, it's pretty easy to just skip ahead to the goal.
The gold, not the silver
@Shog9 well now there I have to make a distinction, as Tequila makes me vomit on the first pass everytime. I can shoot Goldschlager or Jaeger all night, and I'll drink Rum as long as it's being poured, whiskey is a great favorite of mine, and I do love my vodka. But tequila my system will not accept. damnedest thing I know
@drachenstern You shoot Goldschläger?!? I sip it!!
8:39 PM
That's why I prefer gin - the flavor that's there is the flavor that's been added, intentionally, with forethought and malice.
@TheNeedsMoarJqueryException actually I generally either mix it with a soda or put it with Jaeger together.
@Shog9 lol, nice
better, gin and tonic, cos ya know, quinine!
@drachenstern PUKE no wonder you shoot it, LOL
@TheNeedsMoarJqueryException I'm not big on cinnamon
Goldschläger is great to just sip, very palate-cleansing!
mmm... quinine...
8:40 PM
Wait. I am supposed to be working. This is one of the hazards of trying to do work while in a tavern...
Sounds like alcohol that writes itself.
@TheNeedsMoarJqueryException I told you to leave
pay your tab on the way out
Nah, @TylerChacha knows I'm good for it :-)
@FiveGoldenRings can you leave the room? only one cool gravatar is allowed here
Q: Moderator Elections on sites that are 30+ days out of beta

SureshI was given to believe that now that the moderator election software had been tested on math.SE, sites that were 30 days or more out of beta would be given the change to have moderator elections. I was wondering what the timing was on this: I'm a pro tem moderator on cstheory and am looking forwa...

Are we there yet?!
8:42 PM
Jin, yeah, and mine is cooler than yours.
Wind wind for the win.
@FiveGoldenRings a giant fart is wind wind too
Wind is way cooler than firewater.
I think we've been discussing firewater so it is appropriate for him to be here ;)
also, see SnakeEyes/StormShadow.
ninjas always have great tastes
8:44 PM
I saw a movie about ninjas once.
No wait. Twice.
American Ninja 2 and 3?
Reading this conversation, I now see how strange it is when I talk to my own sockpuppet
Hey you guys wanna see something funny?
Oh no where is it?
Give me a moment.
14 mins ago, by The NeedsMoarJquery Exception
You just noticed that @RebeccaChernoff?
replace my name with yours (:
8:46 PM
Q: Generating XSL from XML

Sarma MalladiCan I create an XSL file from existing XML file? From comments: My requirement is as follows: I have an existing xsl file which transforms XML1 to XML2. The XSL is created by a college of mine and the resource no more available. I have source and I know how the target should look l...

@RebeccaChernoff Helps me to see it from afar ;-)
This guy was my coworker from my last job, working on something I wrote.
No I know it's strange. What's even stranger is how addictive it is ;-)
@TheNeedsMoarJqueryException you should really leave :p I've been trying tho so I understand
@drachenstern I know I should. I'm trying to. maybe I need to ask @RebeccaChernoff to ban me...
8:47 PM
Read it and see if you can figure out why I quit.
@FiveGoldenRings I read it and I feel the urge to VtC as NARQ
@FiveGoldenRings I'm gonna hazard a guess, based entirely on the summary: you worked with idiots.
I kept telling you that, shog!
I kept telling you.
Now people will believe me!
I'm so glad I told him to use Stack Overflow if he had any questions.
Yes... Now you can continue helping him, but without getting paid for it!
I've tried helping him.
I think you can imagine how difficult it is.
8:52 PM
I can
There are people for whom "help" means "do the job for them and hope to God they can figure out how to merge without breaking everything"
fortunately, I don't work with any of them regularly
But only seldom do they try to go beyond the limits of computation.
@Shog9 have a star for that, that was clbuttic
Just be glad they didn't have to deal with this: thedailywtf.com/Articles/XMLd-XML.aspx
speaking of astounding idiocy... Why does Access update its datafiles every time you open them, regardless of whether or not anything changes?
Talk about making revision tracking difficult
@Shog9 Excel has a habit of asking "do you want to save your changes?", even if all you did was open and immediately close a worksheet
@drachenstern Needz Moar XML
8:55 PM
@Shog9 it's called "being helpful"
@Shog9 I think the problem is it's not enterprisey enough
Same reason Excel behaves like no other Windows application: lol Microsoft.
> Needz Moar Enterprize
@FiveGoldenRings Ah but it does. Excel 2007 behaves just like Excel 2003, which behaves just like Excel 2000, ...
@FiveGoldenRings ...wait for it...
oh lord. I think I'm gonna have to hurt a vendor. The "readme" is an xls with two columns in use: "filename" and "description". The documentation is 70+ pages of well laid out [and large margins :( ] explanations of what and why. The readme is a table of "filename" and "documentation". One of these things is not like the other ...
@FiveGoldenRings apparently you're still waiting.
9:00 PM
Moshe just isn't paying attention.
@drachenstern you could load that via ODBC and query for docs!
@Shog9 or I could hurt a vendor
I'm not sure I see the downside to my method, except travel
and since I only go along the green line everyday, there's not a lot of room for deviation without me getting extremely bored with the idea :|
Some people just need to be punched.
@FiveGoldenRings I concur
9:24 PM
Database Administratorsdba.stackexchange.com

Beta Q&A site for database professionals who wish to improve their database skills and learn from others in the community.

Currently in private beta.

Given that this is a site in private beta, are those numbers worrying right now or should they only start to become considered after private beta?
grrrr....and this is the reason why I hate updating Ubuntu....you just never know when the geniuses will screw something up =/
!Yatta :( sorry to hear that George
@drachenstern Worry about it once it goes public beta.
@drachenstern There's a reason it doesn't rank each category yet :)
@GeorgeMarian What happened?
9:26 PM
Those are pretty bad since sites generally have a spike at private beta launch, but two days isn't long enough to judge anything
I think everyone on the private is still scrambling for "what do we do" since most of us seem to not have done a private beta before (part of the reason I signed up! That and the whole I do databases regularly at work thing)
@TimStone Well, it's taking considerably longer for Gnome to start-up. When it does, it doesn't necessarily load the correct theme, though that seems to ahve fixed itself now.
Hrm :/
I have no window decorations and I think sound is effed-up as well.
Not to mention that it somehow enabled DHCP in my wireless router which knocked me off the Internet until I figured out that issue. ;)
(that last one's a joke, BTW...that really did happen, but I must have not noticed it was on when I futzed with it yesterday)
Q: User page is displaying "funny"

BitOffI've seen the below on the users page a few times in the last day. If I'm remembering correctly it was consistantly the top 3 or four users in the third column. It looks like the top 3 display over the next bottom 3. Although that is not consistant. I've also seen it where just one of the users w...

9:31 PM
Q: problem with user list page

Shiraz Bhaiji Possible Duplicate: User page sometimes displays two users in the same spot There appears to be a problem with the user list page. The first members in the last column are being pushed down and overlap with other members. I am using IE 8.

(the dupe is deleted)
Excellent; a bug with a broken screenshot that's closed as a duplicate of a deleted post :)
Why is the dupe deleted and this one is closed?
I'm confused ... /o\
@drachenstern Jeff said:
Ok well @balpha come over and close this one or something :p
> I strongly suspect this is a browser-specific issue (IE8?). I've never seen this.
9:33 PM
Question: Where would I post a question about Wikipedia?
@MichaelMrozek I think so too
@Moshe WA?
based on what those comments are on dba.SE
It's not a web app.
It's not?
9:34 PM
I have to agree with jeff that it looks like a really weird IE8 bug
I'll look at it tomorrow
I just want to know if Wikipedia has an RSS feed or endpoint for me to scrape some dummy data from.
but I doubt there's much to be done
@Moshe wikipedia has a full blown API
@Moshe It has an API
@Moshe I prefer to hardcode my dummy data :p
If you have a few days and a big box of Aspirin: en.wikipedia.org/w/api.php
9:37 PM
Okay, thanks then.
I didn't have any big problems with it. I'm still trying to understand Amazon's API; I pity whoever wrote the onebox for it
yeah, that was marc
I could hear him cursing all the way from england
Oy...I see Fedora in my future...
I want our IRC bot to show the product name when someone posts an Amazon URL -- I think I'm going to end up just scraping the HTML
hey @balpha does the search match on partial words
9:39 PM
usually not, it's the standard SQL Server fulltext index
Does Wikipedia have some sort of API key system?
@Moshe I think it's anonymous
Oh, ok
heading to bed -- good night all
G'night @balpha
Q: Are DB questions going to be migrated from SO?

BitOffAre DB questions going to be migrated from SO to this site? If so, how does that work? Do we have to ask for a specific question to be migrated or do they try to apply some logic based on tags?

^^^^^ mod question
@balpha - good night.
finally made it to commitment!
Dermatology and Dermatopathology

Proposed Q&A site for expert dermatologist and dermatopathologists

Currently in commitment.

we'll see how long this stage lasts; I am guessing six months to a year ?
9:53 PM
Under possible new rules, it won't...
Jeff was talking about making commitment votes expire with age
Can't look up the blog entry now though
(I think it was a blog entry)
ducks away from @drachenstern
lol, I'm in the same boat Josh :p
I don't remember if it was a blog or a MSO post. Where's @TimStone he can find it
he can find everything
@TimStone and @PopularDemand are the search engines of all things Meta
@TheNeedsMoarJqueryException How would that work? Would you have to recommit every so often?
I will brb
9:55 PM
@ChrisF Ok. Let me find it ;-)
it wasn't Jeff, it was Robert:
Robert Cartaino

On Monday afternoon, we unceremoniously closed down a Stack Exchange site: Artificial Intelligence.

Not that many would have noticed. It had an laggardly 83 questions in its 12 days of existence. It wasn’t so much the lack of questions that was of concern — a site can stay in beta as long as it takes — but the conspicuous lack of expert-level questions. This was also the emerging opinion amongst the users:

I committed to this proposal some time ago, hoping that this might become a site for researchers or knowledgeable academics asking serious technical questions about artificial intelligence here. It seems I was dearly mistaken … Most of the questions are those asked by the merely curious. …

@ChrisF So, I'm not sure exactly how it would work. I'd love to discuss, but I need to finish some code first ;-)
(Code that was supposed to have been working at 11am!)
I'll read the blog post again (I did see it, but skimmed that part)
Whenever I see the word help my mind starts singing..
"Help, I need somebody. Help. Not just anybody. Help, I need somebody... Help!!"
@ChrisF We're both in here often enough, we'll discuss another time :-)
> Redbox Customer Entertainment Behavior
> Redbox is conducting a survey, and your response would be appreciated.
10:02 PM
@TylerChacha Woah, that's eerie. How did you know I was trying to order a product with that printed on it right now????
> Do you have the Internet in your home?
I have "the Internet" in my home. Do you?
Argh, almost there. Looks like just one final bug to be fixed with this part of the code. Whew
I hate this particular module of our system. I'd love to drop it. Or better yet, hand it off to some other developer :-D
ah... The warm and fuzzy feeling that comes from checking in a file after a fix, and noticing that it's half the size of the previous revision.
@Shog9 nice
@Shog9 Best sort of edit - where you remove code. If there's less code less can go wrong!
10:20 PM
yes... And when it does, it tends to be more obvious! (and often catastrophic, but that's just an unfriendly word for "really obvious")
and you're right, removing code and leaving something in a better state does give you a warm and fuzzy feeling.
I'm jealous @Shog9
Instead, here I am thinking I was almost done and found a bug in the core of this new module
So, I am not done, as I hoped I was! >:o
Really? A star for that? I am confused
I'll bet that was @Tyler
in The Comms Room on The Stack Exchange Network Chat, 34 secs ago, by Zoredache
@Chacha102, being social is good and such, but do you really need to say hello, every time you show up in the room? The channel would get really noisy if everyone did that all the time.
@TheNeedsMoarJqueryException I did say nice. I did not star it. I am responding re: the wrong star
@TheNeedsMoarJqueryException I did not star this. I can if you would like
@drachenstern I meant my comment, but good point, the overstarer clearly starred your post too
@drachenstern I would never ask for a star. @RebeccaChernoff has told me that begging for stars is lame.
10:29 PM
@TheNeedsMoarJqueryException and yet she's a Gal in Blue so go figure ;)
@TylerChacha I believe we pointed that out to you some time ago as well
Quick, which MySQL hash would I have used to encode my password if it's stored as a varchar(40)?
They used to kick people who did that in #freenode. Those were the days
@Moshe that's impossible to answer without more info
@Moshe Don't use MySQL hashes at all. use sha1
10:30 PM
@drachenstern - dunno, that's what I asked.
@TheNeedsMoarJqueryException - I must've done that. You designed this db.
reset it in phpmyadmin
Generally a SHA1 hash results in a 40 character result
ok, I think it was sha1
Q: Is it possible to convert a 40-character SHA1 hash to a 20-character SHA1 hash?

ewitchMy problem is a bit hairy, and I may be asking the wrong questions, so please bear with me... I have a legacy MySQL database which stores the user passwords & salts for a membership system. Both of these values have been hashed using the Ruby framework - roughly like this: hashedsalt = ...

^^^^^^^^^^^ That's doing it wrong
@Moshe What, are you trying to hack my servers?
@TheNeedsMoarJqueryException - No, no, no.
10:32 PM
Last time I checked I didn't grant you access to any databases I designed ;-)
I asked for help with PHP.
A while ago.
Oh. I helped you with the design then :-)
And you helped design a db, if I remeber correctly.
Yeah, I remember now
By the way, you might want to use sha2 if you can, it's better than sha1
In cryptography, SHA-2 is a set of cryptographic hash functions (SHA-224, SHA-256, SHA-384, SHA-512) designed by the National Security Agency (NSA) and published in 2001 by the NIST as a U.S. Federal Information Processing Standard. SHA stands for Secure Hash Algorithm. SHA-2 includes a significant number of changes from its predecessor, SHA-1. SHA-2 consists of a set of four hash functions with digests that are 224, 256, 384 or 512 bits. In 2005, security flaws were identified in SHA-1, namely that a mathematical weakness might exist, indicating that a stronger hash function would be de...
> In 2005, security flaws were identified in SHA-1, namely that a mathematical weakness might exist, indicating that a stronger hash function would be desirable.[2] Although SHA-2 bears some similarity to the SHA-1 algorithm, these attacks have not been successfully extended to SHA-2.
Q: Why is a SHA-1 Hash 40 characters long if it is only 160 bit ?

AGrunewaldThe title of the question says it all. I have been researching SHA-1 and most places I see it being 40 Hex Characters long which to me is 640bit. Could it not be represented just as well with only 10 hex characters 160bit = 20byte. And one hex character can represent 2 byte right? Why is it twice...

^^^^^^^^^^^ Answer deserves more upvotes
10:36 PM
@MichaelMrozek I need your expertise!
WOW! I followed that link and was very pleasantly surprised to see:
> You've earned the "Famous Question" badge for Cross Domain ExternalInterface “Error calling method on NPObject”. See your profile.
@radp Wha?
I never expected that badge!
/exec -out echo -n "/topic " && toilet --font term --irc --gay BAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA is not working as expected, as the "/" is escaped.
(I have no idea what I'm saying, as usual)
10:38 PM
@radp Which part doesn't work? It seems fine to me
@TheNeedsMoarJqueryException excellent job. I expect to see that badge around November 29th, 2012
@MichaelMrozek It doesn't actually set the topic.
Oh, I didn't realize that was the goal. I don't think /exec does that, it outputs text verbatim
@TheNeedsMoarJqueryException It's the whole point of SO
Ok. Back to bugfixing. :-(
10:41 PM
Estoy aburrido..
so I read
Robert Cartaino

On Monday afternoon, we unceremoniously closed down a Stack Exchange site: Artificial Intelligence.

Not that many would have noticed. It had an laggardly 83 questions in its 12 days of existence. It wasn’t so much the lack of questions that was of concern — a site can stay in beta as long as it takes — but the conspicuous lack of expert-level questions. This was also the emerging opinion amongst the users:

I committed to this proposal some time ago, hoping that this might become a site for researchers or knowledgeable academics asking serious technical questions about artificial intelligence here. It seems I was dearly mistaken … Most of the questions are those asked by the merely curious. …

thank you for posting that
with that being said, I think the derm proposal has a lot of experts following it
Good! Encourage them to ask their friends to commit
however, some of tthe final on/off topic example don't make sense to me
are they set in stone?
Anyone else wanna help explain here?
particularly the on-topic example question: How does one match into a dermatology residency program?
10:47 PM
(I can't get into detail right now)
@user10926 No. The site can (and probably will) drift once real questions are asked and answered.
so how does one decide which threads to close?
one the site is in beta that is
Well, first look at the original questions. You want to try to keep the questions close to that set
(The ones defined)
Over time, (months), look at what people are answering
and if they are a close enough range to the topic
keep them
@user10926 by using the in-site meta
I'm going through the same growing-pains asking of questions regarding dba.SE
we're in private beta so we're having the same questions that you're asking now
The idea is that you use the beta period to suss out how the site should op when it's finally ready to roll post-beta
you have private-beta where you get some pretty open control on what you do with the site
10:50 PM
then you get to open-beta where you start to work like a real site, and you get a lot more eyeballs
then you goto (hopefully) a fully graduated site
goto .. haha... programming joke..
Since you're just in commitment I wouldn't stress too hard over what questions are appropriate
@TylerChacha non-intentional, I assure you
Wait till the site is up and running on private beta, then start to push on people to go in the direction that you want to see them in
@drachenstern Then why did you spell it without a space?
@TylerChacha I always do?
@TylerChacha at least I do it alot
10:55 PM
@TylerChacha if it's any consolation to you I'm roughly 2/3 of the usage of goto in the room

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