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9:46 PM
So anyway, as I was saying.
What does it mean to have a personality? Can a machine that is programmed to imitate intelligence be intelligent?
What does it mean to be conscious?
Do you think we'll ever figure that out and create our own artificially intelligent systems?
Or do you think we're forever doomed to never knowing the truth inside our own skulls?
 
ok, this is fine, as long as it's clean
 
Do you think that when we finally do create life it will like us? Will it think like us?
 
OMG Unicorns! I mean... cyberpunk talk!
 
are your careers searches working at all?
 
@JeffAtwood (This would be a perfect time to plug StackOverflow Careers)
 
9:49 PM
one problem we have on careers / jobs, it tends to favor the hot job markets
it's a bit tougher if you're not in one of say the 10 major metropolitan areas
I don't know if that's really fixable
 
Hey man why can't you stay on topic? I think that if a bot were to imitate Jeff it would never be able to follow a conversation.
It would be constantly trying to link to pictures of Peter Griffin.
 
I am waxing on the philosophy of jobs.stackoverflow and careers.stackoverflow, man
 
hey Jeff, that's not fixable, doesn't it depend on the job market?
 
you're not pickin' up on the track I'm layin' down, maaan
 
Well you should say that! You're just confusing my poor thinking meat.
 
9:51 PM
the harder answer is, "you should move"
 
where I live, you have like 2 "decent" companies per "state", and the rest are all in the capital city
what most developers do is just move
like I did
 
Like I plan to.
 
yeah unless you win the NBA draft and get to work on the SO team remotely, that's much more realistic
 
I've had enough of living with badgers and bears.
 
yeah, badgers will tear you to pieces
 
9:52 PM
I really hope more companies do remote work in the future, it's SO much more logical for what we do
 
Careers has nothing to do with cyberpunk, though.
 
I feel like, we're about 20 years ahead of where the job market is
in the future, going to work (by physically going to work) will seem quaint
 
Ah, let's tie that into futurism.
 
right on
 
Everyone should tap into a virtual environment where they can work.
Like in that movie Summer Wars.
And then an intelligent computer virus can destroy the planet.
 
9:54 PM
I think you should have semi-regular offsites where everyone can meet and hang out
 
Like in that movie Summer Wars.
 
but for daily work? what good is the office? it's just another distraction. I dunno, I'm a big believer in this remote stuff.
 
do you think there'll be a time where manual work will be delegated to machines? What will it be of creative minds like programmers? what will they do? Is there a limit to what we, as humans, can develop intellectually?
 
@Fernando, yes
there is a limit
however, don't ask me what it is
 
If there is a limit I don't think we'll reach it.
 
9:55 PM
and what about evolution?
won't we just evolve until we raise the bar once and again?
 
We breed smarter and smarter humans.
 
are we supposed to?
 
Each generation will never reach its limit.
And the next generation will have a higher limit than the previous.
 
Eventually we will evolve to be able to teleport to the office and back. No more distractions
 
And then we'll never need to interact with each other ever again.
 
9:56 PM
what a bunch of optimists
 
Just leave our AI assistants to do the job of interacting with others' AIAs.
No, Jeff. Humans have a basic need for interaction. Even professional interaction.
 
i guess you guys are talking about remote working as a programmer, cause working from home might not be the best option for a hostage negotiator.
 
We will never be without physical meeting spaces for professionals.
 
wrt interaction, i agree w/ weblog
after years working at home, i was surprised how much i enjoyed going to the office again
 
Of course you do. Do you have any idea how much cyberpunk I read?
 
9:58 PM
it was nice to see other people and have a dedicated workspace
 
I've so much of it. I am like the world's foremost authority on technodystopian futures.
 
@Weblog,
ooops, sorry, still getting the hand on this
 
B@man
 
anyway, @Weblog, I need some movie recommendations on the subject, but maybe this is not the right place?
 
This is the right place. It's the third place. The right place for everything.
 
Jin
10:02 PM
@weblog your gravatar is most excellent.
 
EXCEPT FOR DRAGONDUCKS, APPARENTLY
You've told me this already.
 
You're right
 
I usually am.
Anyway, what's your fancy?
 
awesome
 
Tell me things that you like and I will tell you things that I think you will like.
Alternatively you can ask Amazon.com this as well.
It uses BAYESIAN NETWORKS
That's like intelligence.
 
10:03 PM
I've seen Ghost in the shell & akira in the anime department, pretty awesome, and a few movies...
 
GitS was overrated
 
Amazon knows what I like because it has solved how "like" works.
 
i liked Akira
 
you think?
I liked it
 
So do you prefer depth in your cyberpunk or just thrills?
 
10:04 PM
yeah, although I'm willing to give it another shot
 
Or perhaps some happy medium?
 
both
 
i saw it dubbed, and i was bugged by the bad voice acting
 
depth is cool
(in this context)
 
You're looking specifically for visual media or will books work as well?
 
10:05 PM
visual media, programming books are taking all of my reading time now
I've read Neuromancer though
 
Neuromancer is pretty good. Refer to the Shog about Gibson's works.
I am pondering visual cyberpunk.
Unfortunately there is not that much of it. It's not terribly mainstream enough to earn many movies or shows yet.
Dennou Coil remains one of my favourite shows.
It is not cyberpunk per se but shares many themes with it.
Actually it might be considered cyberpunk depending on your definition.
, Coil — A Circle of Children, is a Japanese science fiction anime television series depicting a near future where semi-immersive augmented reality (AR) technology has just begun to enter the mainstream. The series takes place in the fictional city of Daikoku, a hotbed of AR development with an emerging city-wide virtual infrastructure. It follows a group of children as they use AR glasses to unravel the mysteries of the half real, half Internet city, using a variety of illegal software tools, techniques, and virtual pets to manipulate the digital landscape. Dennō Coil, in development...
It has been the victor of many awards in animation and story.
 
looks good
 
There is also the movie Summer Wars. It's more thrills than depth, though.
Also only cyberpunk for some definitions.
is a 2009 anime science fiction film. The film focuses on a timid eleventh-grade math genius who has been falsely implicated in the hacking of a virtual world and, with the aid of an upper-classman's extensive family, must prevent the real and computer-simulated worlds from colliding. It was produced by the Japanese animation studio Madhouse and directed by Mamoru Hosoda. The project was first announced without a title at the 2008 Tokyo International Anime Fair, and the first trailer of the film was released in April 2009. Audience interest was fueled primarily through word of mouth and ...
 
how do you do that wikipedia thingy?
 
I watched that with a William Gibson fan and he thought it was good.
So I suppose there is a correlation between liking Gibson and liking Summer Wars.
You simply link to a Wikipedia page.
Our friends Marc and Balpha do the rest.
 
10:10 PM
This room is too intellectual for me, I fear.
 
awesome
is a seminal Cyberpunk anime set in the year 2808 in the megalopolis of Oedo (Tokyo). It was directed by Yoshiaki Kawajiri. Plot To combat computerised crime more effectively, the Cyber Police unit of the future Japanese city of Oedo has restarted the feudal practice of hōmen (放免), employing hardened criminals with a history of hi-tech offences and other crimes such as murder as officers themselves. Three such criminals are Sengoku, Gogol and Benten who are serving their 300-or-more year sentences in an orbital penitentiary. For duty served, each criminal will receive a reduction in...
 
If you're interested, there is a Half-Life 2 modification called Neotokyo that is based loosely on Ghost in the Shell.
There is another modification called Dystopia that is loosely based on Snow Crash, Neuromancer and several other Gibson and Stephenson cyberpunk works.
 
not much into FPS
 
Ah.
Fair enough.
 
but thanks anyways
 
10:13 PM
I never finished HL2, I started it again at the weekend and it made me feel queasy.
 
I have that feeling as well.
Especially during the vehicle sections.
 
I was just on the airboat part actually
 
Fernando, I have nothing more to suggest. My cyberpunk background is primarily literature-based, not visual.
 
ok Weblog, thanks, maybe I can write down some titles if you recommend them
 
But, like I said, Dennou Coil is one of my favourite shows.
Books?
 
10:15 PM
I recently read a short cyberpunk story which was really awesome...
 
Snow Crash, Diamond Age by Neil Stephenson.
 
yeah, whatever literature you want to recommend
 
Idoru, All Tomorrow's Parties by William Gibson.
Snow Crash and Neuromancer are widely regarded as the defining cyberpunk novels.
 
have you read Neuromancer?
 
Gibson tends to be grittier than Stephenson.
Yes.
 
10:17 PM
I didn't find it as deep as I expected
 
Stephenson tends to have stories on a much grander scale, with more outlandish ideas.
Off the top of my head right now I can only seem to remember the classics.
 
which would you say goes deeper into the artifficial life/inteligence/personality subject?
 
Idoru.
Diamond Age has a special place in my heart. If anything, it is post cyberpunk: a world that came out of a technological dystopia.
It doesn't deal with the depth of intelligence but rather the reaches of human potential.
It's quite an interesting read.
 
10:33 PM
great
thanks for those titles
 
No problem. It is my job as a super cool guy to show other people cool things.
 
10:45 PM
keep up the good work
 
11:04 PM
The Chinese room is a thought experiment by John Searle which first appeared in his paper "Minds, Brains, and Programs", published in Behavioral and Brain Sciences in 1980. It addresses the question: if a machine can convincingly simulate an intelligent conversation, does it necessarily understand? In the experiment, Searle imagines himself in a room acting as a computer by manually executing a program that convincingly simulates the behavior of a native Chinese speaker. People outside the room slide Chinese characters under the door and Searle, to whom "Chinese writing is just so man...
If no one wants to get philosophical I'm going to play video games.
 

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